By Luc
September 12th 2008 @ 12:21am
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Sonny Bill? Benji? Who cares!
With all the recent talk of Sonny Bill William’s defection to rugby union and the overtures Benji Marshall is supposedly receiving from cashed-up European rugby clubs, I am beginning to wonder if these are the same two injury-prone, 30-minute wonders that I have seen in recent years.
The Sonny Bill I know does not back up after an Anzac Test in the same way true professionals like Nathan Hindmarsh and Darren Lockyer do.
No indeed.
The Sonny Bill I know likes to take a week off to “get his knee right” and another week off to “have a rest”.
The Benji Marshall I know would be an Immortal … in touch footy. So fragile are his shoulders, he reportedly can only sleep on his back.
He can’t even get himself to front for an Anzac test, so fragile is his constitution and AC-joint.
Okay, enough sarcasm.
My point is this: what exactly is rugby league losing when two unproven and chronically injured youngsters decide to leave for greener pastures? Or is that greener dollars?
Williams, a regular starter of games for the Dogs, could never be described as a finisher of them. His appearances have been sporadic and, at times, completely uninspiring.
He has shown no leadership in a team in desperate need of it.
Benji Marshall will forever be a one-season wonder.
What has he done since 2005?
His game has devolved into that of a predictable one-dimensional old-style “stand-off”. Added to the fact that he has not played five consecutive games, probably ever, and you have to question his value to the Tigers and the NRL.
The looming departures of players of the calibre of Darren Lockyer and Steve Menzies represent significant losses. They were consistent professionals who always put their club before themselves.
Players who would front up on a Friday night after a bruising Origin encounter the previous Wednesday.
Sonny Bill Williams and “Bruiser Benji” have proven essentially nothing when their achievements are compared along side such greats.
What will we lose if they are both gone?
In real terms, precisely nothing.
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JimC said | September 12th 2008 @ 2:03am | Report comment
Well said that man.
Didn’t see Benji or Sonny when the Kiwis were facing a torrid time in GB last year. I think they are both good people but they both get some bad advice. Everyone has to face adversity at some point in their lives and someone at some point has to turn around to young footballers and say “That’s life, shit happens, let’s get on with it.”
Plenty of people in their early twenties drop out for a while and go wonder the world, but is that what Sonny has done? Or has he just swapped the financial handcuffs of people he owes a lot to for the financial handcuffs of those he owes nothing.
The Link said | September 12th 2008 @ 8:11am | Report comment
The silence on this site re SBW being injured in France has been deafening. Where are all the posters that screamed blue murder that SBW was deliberaltey undervalued in some underhanded way by the Dogs? He was busted then as he is now. Phenominal footballer but extremely injury prone.
The jury is still out on both SBW and Benji. Time is on their side as they are both young. Hopefully they both get to live up to their potential.
oikee said | September 12th 2008 @ 8:22am | Report comment
They will both be around until they are 40 in union, you only get hurt around that maul so these 2 wont ever get injured again, good players going to waste in my opinion, but who am i to judge what they do, we have more talent coming through the ranks be interesting how long before we see the next sonny or benji , Theres a couple now that look like being good, idris and laurie, we do move on because we have no choice, unlike the players.
oikee said | September 12th 2008 @ 8:24am | Report comment
Just glad we have tied up Folou and Inglis, now imagine these 2 in a union backline,? That would make the wallabies unbeatable nearly, the all blacks to win tonite at suncorp, cream rises to the top.
Justin said | September 12th 2008 @ 9:19am | Report comment
LOL oikee , you are a genius
Hoy said | September 12th 2008 @ 9:44am | Report comment
I don’t want to turn this into a League Vs Union thing AGAIN, but… Inglis, while a phenomenal player in attack is a bit frail in defence. I also think that Gasnier is a bit the same way. While Gaz is often lauded as the best centre in the world, he is often shown up by “lesser” centres when they run at him with ball in hand. Fact: Union backs defend a more than League ones. Tahu was a noted hitter in League, yet was exposed in Union. It will take him time to learn the game. I wonder if Gaz will be the attacking force in Union? I wonder if his attacking skill will be negated by his defence? Time will tell I suppose.
Benji is injury prone at the moment. I wonder if he had a year off and let his shoulders settle, would he be right then? He doens’t seem to let them heal. I am sure the clubs have doctors that say the shoulder is sound, and he seems to go away each time and bulk up to protect them, but it just doesn’t seem to work.
I am not too concerned that Sonny Bill is injured. I don’t agree with him leaving in the manner he did, but I saw the writting on the wall at the start of the year with all those interviews he did. He just didn’t look happy. He is a fantastic footballer, and again, he will have to learn how to play Union, but jeez it is good to watch him when he is fit and in full flight.
I can’t remember the last time either of them actually played for NZ.
Everyone says that “so and so” was the best ever, until the next one comes along and he is the best ever. There will always be good young prospects coming through I think, and if people leave the game, there will be someone who will step into their shoes.
oikee said | September 12th 2008 @ 10:02am | Report comment
Dead right hoy, different styles of game, and tahu looks lost not be able to put those hits on players, give him time to addapt and he will be good. Gasnier on the other hand will be carving them up in no time. I always rated him even though it hurt at times being a queenslander. Good luck to them, hope they bleed a few more million out of unions coffers.
True Tah said | September 12th 2008 @ 10:04am | Report comment
oikee,
the Wallabies play the All Blacks tomorrow night not tonight…also a bit rich to say Australia would be unbeatable with two backline players…I would rather have two Argentinean props than those two, as it would help us out infinitely more.
Luc,
one thing NRL will lose with Benji Marshall is a lot of support of small kids, my cousin is 7, his parents will only let him play futbol and his dad is a Souths supporter, but his favourite player by far and away is Benji Marshall…if he goes, these small kids may want to give rugby a go.
Hoy
well said about Tahu re-learning again, he got taken to school by de Villiers and Adi Jacobs at Ellis Park big time, I think he will learn from this, and he will be a fixture in future Wallaby sides.
When fit SBW will be an awesome union player…I really dont like some parts of the Sydney press who seem to take pleasure out of his injuries he gets, sour grapes, but if these journalists are men, they would say it to SBW’s face, and SBW isn’t exactly a small guy, I wouldn’t want to say it to him.
The Link said | September 12th 2008 @ 11:11am | Report comment
Drawing broader conclusions from one bad game that Tahu had is futile.
Its the equivalent of putting any union back (say Stirling Mortlock) in State of Origin after 8-9 League games. They’d get shown up just as much, but it doesn’t prove that they are bad defenders.
Hoy said | September 12th 2008 @ 11:54am | Report comment
I agree Link, but it shows that the games are more different than people initially think.
I don’t agree with the trend at the moment that seems to be that League players get ushered into the national side without learning the game properly. It is like just because they are a high profile convert and are paid large amounts to come and play provincial, they get put into the national side.
I think Tahu, on his touches of brilliance this year will be great… in time, but he was nowhere near ready for a start in the national team. Why was he picked?
The Link said | September 12th 2008 @ 12:14pm | Report comment
Hoy - i’ve never seen any evidence of the “Wallaby Clause” in converts contracts that is always quoted. I suspect the lack of depth in Australian Rugby has more to do with it, in this case with Berrick going down, Tahu was the best option.
Seemed to be good enough for Robbie Deans, who can coach a bit.
Hoy said | September 12th 2008 @ 12:47pm | Report comment
Of course it isn’t a clause in their contract. Seems a pretty good precedence though.
Forgive me if I am way off, but I understand the ARU tops up contracts. Is that correct? Is that not a little bit like a clause? Just a little? If not so much as a “you will play” clause as a bit of the ARU saying we had better select those players we are topping up or else what are we paying them for?
What about Morgan Turinui? I am not a huge fan, but he had a good second half to the season at the Reds, and by all accounts I read, was playing well on the Reds tour of the UK. Perhaps he might have been a better option than Tahu who has only played a handful of games? Again, I am not a fan of Turinui, but on form, he was a little unlucky not to be picked for the squad.
I agree we have a lack of depth, and I think we need a national competition below super 14 to combat that. Get more players exposed to top level games.
Terry Kidd said | September 12th 2008 @ 1:05pm | Report comment
Guys, Tahu’s contract was not topped up by the ARU. He signed with the Tahs for the standard S14 fee plus incentives. Tahu’s motivation wasn’t money, he really wanted to play rugby.
oikee said | September 12th 2008 @ 2:08pm | Report comment
Yeah thats right terry, unlike alot of other league players we know are only going for the money. Thats the problem, it takes so long to get these league players up to speed for union, i even seen that big loti rolling around the other day scoring that try and thought to myself, what a waste. Also they really dont have the passion like they should have, to me it is like they are there for the money, if they lose they can blame the blokes who are suppose to know better.
The opposite applies to the kiwis, they all want to be all-blacks in there union dominate country, so league has got no bearing on there players, here in oz its league that is dominate, the wallabies are a side show really, even i go for the all-blacks because i know they are so good but have never won a world cup. Bit like the under-dog tag.
As for the wallabies, it sort of makes me cringe to think they use these league players, its like having ferraries stuck in second gear. But back to what you have said Hoy, you need to get some depth in junior ranks, not just college boys, other wise the wallaabies will always be chasing their tales. As for Benji being a roll model for kids, haven’t you seen that player Dane Laurie for the tigers, i dont think they would miss benji for that long.
Everyone is replaceable.
chas said | September 12th 2008 @ 3:13pm | Report comment
Didn’t Dingo Deans know that Tahu had never played at inside centre in his entire League career? He was playing his first real game of Test football after ten games of Rugby and in an entirely new position. Set up for failure!!!!
I couldn’t imagine a Kangaroo group selecting a Test side comprising Sheehan (a failure at League: played mostly in second grade), Giteau (whose old man could really play), Berriick Barnes (second grader with the Broncos), Cross ( who could never crack the big-time after seven years of League ), Tuqiri ( who doesn’t need to play for his place anymore. The dollars keep rolling in ). Tahu might be considered and Mortlock would not have the skills to be considered.
oikee said | September 12th 2008 @ 4:39pm | Report comment
Tahu would not get a look in at league world cup, this i am sure, they have folou inglis and monahan to fit in, along with hodges and tate, not to mention others, lions and co. Now there is depth.
brad said | September 12th 2008 @ 9:31pm | Report comment
Chimpanzees have 98% of human genes. Chimpanzees have l2 egs 2 eyes, hearts, 5 fingers and toes, lungs…the games are the same but completely different. Off the topic why does the NRL not buy into the 5th super rugby side? it would be a good return on investment.
westy said | September 12th 2008 @ 10:16pm | Report comment
Hoy …although I agree I think you do a couple of league centres a diservice. I will claim to watch both games closely. This does not mean I am an expert but the best League defensive centres are clearly Hodges and Cooper. We buy attacking centres. For decades I defended rugby backs against some mindless comments by leaguies but I have to say if you want a defensive centre in the mould of Shaw/Hawker etc….it is Cooper and Hodges. I am uncomfortable when we compare apples with oranges. Gasnier is an ordinary league defender and often defends on the wing. Do our rugby masters not watch. Tahu has been for most of his league career an attacking winger. Newcastle would not play him in the centres despite repeated requests because he was to much “come in and hit” not enough read. This was Gidley. Rodgers was a terrible league defender and could not make 5/8 at Cronulla under Lang or Anderson.Marshall is not a good league defender. Do not complain about his defence do not our “rugby ” superiors watch how Wests Tigers have to cover him?
Rugby has been able to lay their hands on the following defensive league players Thorn/ Peter Ryan/ Barnes /Cross.
I know I know they had rugby experience but it would be churlish not to accept Barnes and Cross ‘ s own word that league did help to hone their individual tackling technique.
I get uncomfortable when we buy ordinary league defenders in the first place and then expect them to be something else. I have watched Cooper and Hodges closely you want good defensive league defenders get them . By the way their attack is not to bad either. But note one thing in their state of Origin Rodgers or Tahu never played in the centres. They did for the Wallabies. This may say more about us then them. The problem is we do not like the message sometimes.
westy said | September 12th 2008 @ 10:28pm | Report comment
Brad……the leaguies were right when they broke away we were the ones who danced to the organ grinder.We failed to get them back that was our fault. Nevertheless go the Wallabies.
The Answer said | September 13th 2008 @ 6:26am | Report comment
The Link,
Your first post was without doubt the post of the year 2008. The most succinct point made yet on this website.
Hoy said | September 13th 2008 @ 10:24am | Report comment
Westy I agree totally with you. I am sorry if it I write like I am bashing the player. I don’t agree with the powers that be that 1) chase those players, and then 2) play them when they are clearly not up to it yet.
You say Gasnier is a ordinary league defender. What makes the people that want him to play for the wallabies think he will automatically be a good player in rugby, when defence is important for a centre, whether it is at inside centre, where confrontational defence is prominant, or outside centre, where you must learn to read the game and know who to take when?
I get a bit frustrated when I see players thrust into the wallabies when they are not up to it. I can’t help but think that instead of Tahu, there must be some young centre playing somewhere that has paid his dues and would have been just as good, (hopefully better at the time).
It really irks me that Northern Hemisphere teams tour the Southern Hemisphere with second rate teams. I wonder what we are doing by playing players not up to it. Something similar I think. Devaluing the jersey a little.
Tahu could be a great player in rugby. There is no doubt he is a good athlete. But he was clearly underdone, and that really should have been obvious to better people invovled in the game than me. I hoped prior to the game that he would play well, but clearly he didn’t. It wasn’t his fault, but he must wear it.
westy said | September 14th 2008 @ 10:57pm | Report comment
Hoy we are in communion as they say on this issue.