Comments on: Hard-fought not bought: Manly win premiership

By: Tom

Tom — Tue, 07 Oct 2008 12:06:34 +0000

Rumma - Beaver back as test captain? Why the hell didn’t I think of that? Couldn’t think of a better choice myself. The old man showed a few of those Storm upstarts how it’s done on Sunday, there’s still life in those old legs yet.

And as for the league vs. union debate, I hear Robbie Deans has taken quite a liking to the peninsula and plans to buy around the Fairlight area, so I’m sure he loved it.

By: Cosmos Forever

Cosmos Forever — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 11:04:28 +0000

Agreed Link. And with most of them on long term contracts we are very very excited down here.

I can’t tell you guys how much it hurt to support Manly in the big one. But i thought it was a just result.

Brett Kimmorley said on Fox tonight - Melbourne are a good team, not a great one. To be a great one they should have won at least two or three of the past grand finals.

By: The Link

The Link — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 10:57:33 +0000

Temba, you’ve gotta get that chip of your shoulder. Its a shame that an Australian Rugby fan can look neither internationally or domestically and see dominance. Probably indicates where your paranoia comes from, but don’t take it out on the rest of us.

Millster, enjoying your work.

Cosmos, gotta get Alan Tongue to teach those youngsters how to hang on to the ball, but geez they’ve got some spark in them.

By: Steffy

Steffy — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 08:51:29 +0000

I got up at 7am in England to watch the game. I have no affiliation to either side (or any in the NRL) so I watched it purely as a neutral and thought it was a superb game. Of course it didn’t have the excitement of a close contest but the skills on show were wonderful. It was a great game of rugby and a very well deserved win by Manly.

By: Millster

Millster — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 08:23:03 +0000

Cosmos - sorry for getting carried away before. I realise sometimes my aggro at someone can get the better of me.

I for one loved the entertainment. Thought Noiseworks and the Living End both played really well.

By: cosmos forever

cosmos forever — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 08:15:11 +0000

And Skull - it gets so much better than that. The Noiseworks song that was chosen was written about a bloke whose girlfriend is killed in a car accident. So good to see Jonny Stevens belting it out surrounded by hot utes…

By: Skull

Skull — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 08:10:06 +0000

Love your work cosmos. As Roy & HG said the Rugby League sure showed China how an opening ceremony should be ut on. The utes and the BBQ’s what a hoot.

By: cosmos forever

cosmos forever — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 08:05:44 +0000

You guys can be real losers, seriously.

Code War aside - very exciting match. Raiders 20’s certainly take our the Most Ironic Team award by scoring the winning try from an offside player taking the chip kick. Only decision to go our way all season in any grade!

Thought the final was a one-sided score line but quite tense until the last 15 or so. A quality game all round.

Storm completely ineffectual when not allowed to lay all over the player and left it up to individual brilliance which has been lacking for weeks (Ingliss - no tired, grappled opposition to turn the magic on against this week eh).

Isreal and Crocker the only two to really show some guts.

Nice end to the season.

PS - as a result of a bet I had a butler for the whole day. Thank God the Raiders finished above the Panthers! Thanks Sammy - I appreciated that constant stream of beer and also thought you looked great in all that Raiders gear

The Priddis-Adamson Cup is yours for another year!

Now, I’m going out the back to play a NoiseWorks medley on my kettle bbq

By: Millster

Millster — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 06:15:35 +0000

Temba - I’ve looked back for a ridiculous post before yours and cannot find one. The only reference to Union before your entry was quite oblique and referred to the GF having been a try-focused game and not reliant on a rule-set and scoring system that over-weighs the kicked goal. Given that I’ve heard over the past 5 years many expert Union commentators strongly agree that too much scoring in that code comes from the boot, I didn’t think it was such an offensive or controversial comment.

But… just taking your first post… your downright hysterical responses included…

“Honestly I don’t know why you try, league will never make it to unions status as a sport.”

“No use in comparing them if u are a union supporter, league is similar to donkey racing in Mexico if you come from out side Australia.”

“checkers just seems so boring when you are use to chess.”

…and the clincher again… “Maybe its a cultural thing?”

So who was attacking who again? And are you still denying my right (even as a relative neutral in all this) to call your uppity arrogant approach towards League for the rubbish it is?

Funny thing is I bet you’re not even an old boy from one of those elitist schools Westy describes, which would be the one thing to partially excuse you. I’ll bet you’ve picked up a taste for Union, along with one for bad chardonnay and cucumber sandwiches and linen suits with boatshoes, as a late-starter wannabe. No-one truly from the elite end of society would show so little class.

By: TembaVJ

TembaVJ — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 06:04:33 +0000

Very dramatic Millster, “attacking and puking” funny you dint defend anything when Ray before me spat out code vs. code stuff. Please stop being the hero… And you are calling me fraudulent?

Relax mate, enough attacking me for one day I gota go home now.

By: oikee

oikee — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 06:02:23 +0000

Can i say something, i play chess and know the game well, but i do admit its boring, i love checkers 2 and its fast exciting and all over in minutes. So my thoery is that i can admit when something is boring, Even thow i like to play the game. I am only talking about Chess and checkers by the way. As for union i have only said it has trouble at the local end. Super14 and under. And i have said before this will not change here in oz while we have the n.r.l. The big money will come for the nrl and its juniors. That under 20’s game was a ripper. Not alot of dropped ball.

I also stand by my remarks about the local games selling there products around the world, the n.r.l and super league have good products to sell.

By: Westy

Westy — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:57:57 +0000

TembaVJ…………Also understand I support go to club rugby games . My club the Two Blues is like the Penrith Emus fighting for our existence in Western sydney. NZ rugby tries to save Northland but here where we are with nearly 3 million people still facing a difficult future. I may tend to distort or exaggerate my views but sadly there are some seeds of truth.

By: Millster

Millster — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:57:45 +0000

Temba - I think most people here can go back and look at your litany of snide remarks about League and judge for themselves.

Also most people here who I speak to regularly will know that I defend any code against code-v-code stuff which I despise. Your “checkers and chess” stuff and attempt to pass off Union as more skilled and complex, combined with your fraudulent attempt to present that code as a truly international sport is what got me going.

And the “maybe its a cultural thing” line you used to end your first post was condescending enough to make me - and I suspect other reads - puke.

By: Westy

Westy — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:50:12 +0000

TembaVJ……one other point that distinguishes NZ rugby from Australian rugby is that unlike in New Zealand, rugby has never been a game of the people. There are ordinary punters who play and support rugby in Australia but the game is weak in the areas it needs to be strong. This has not always been about money. We lost a majority of amateur rugby players here to amateur league by the late 1930’s. Robbie Deans or any other New Zealander is not in a position to understand that rugby turned its back on some “people ” long before money became an issue. The best analysis is that a New Zealander could proudly debate and pick a very stong Maori AllBlack team……….The AFL can pick a strong All Australian Aboriginal Team….and League can and has selected a very powerful Indigenous team of the century captained coach by Arthur Beetson all who played for the Kangaroos or their state……..That there have been famous Indigenous players to play for the wallabies is true but 19 with their own coach …….Ah ………..we might get some ………but if you understand the difficulty get the picture…Australian Rugby is much better at picking a team of the century from one elitist private school….Joey’s …who Spiros proudly states have supplied 15% of all Wallabies. Says it all really. I support Rugby but like most of us have a league team and keep an eye on a game that appealled a little more to the ordinary punter not because it was more complicated just more welcoming across social classes.

By: TembaVJ

TembaVJ — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:46:31 +0000

Why on earth would you like to attack me Millster? Are you policing the internet searching for the wrong do’ers like myself and fight the good fight for all sports? Get over yourself, you got pissed off because I replied to a league supporters ridiculous post. I’m not even “attacking” you as you would say, just debating, its what these sites are for in the first place.

By: TembaVJ

TembaVJ — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:40:39 +0000

Westy… Good comments, it will aid me in my struggle to becoming a better “football” supporter.

Millster, please… You are not defending the right of all that is good, I think its time you get your feet back on the ground. After all the negatives you spat out about union I find it funny you now try and be open minded and on mutual ground.

I watched that game (not all of it) as I watched all the state of origin matches and I did say right in the beginning that I have seen some very talented players do amazing things. I didn’t come here to pickup arms for union but when I see ridiculous remarks as some have made here I have to reply.

By: Millster

Millster — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:30:50 +0000

Westy - thanks for that knowledgeable and balanced view.

By: Millster

Millster — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:26:42 +0000

Just for clarification Temba I am a football follower which puts all other codes in perspective. So don’t put me in with leaguies, just see me as someone who on principle though your comments were arrogant.

But I do like all the other codes (yes even union) for what they are. What I objected to was your value judgement about the game itself. However much trouble the League’s administration and structure is in, or how fragile its support base, farting on about it being intrinsically an inferior game is just crap - untrue and unhelpful. Also in most of the world you would of course realise that Union is also seen as nothing more than Mexican Donkey Racing - surely you have enough perspective to see that.

Incidentally just so you know I’m attacking you and not Union I’d defend Union the same way against biased baseless drivel from the followers of any other sport. I’m arguing on principle.

By: Westy

Westy — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:24:12 +0000

TembaVJ…..your usual sound technical analysis and knowledge of Rugby … may not help you here ….your view is predicated on the fact a game must be close to be exciting…….i thought South Africa played some excellent line/angle running rugby….that was technically very proficient…..genuinely exploiting not only Tahu but our entire lineout was pierced causing havoc to inside defensive backs…………I saw Geelong last year play very skilful AFL in flogging Port Adelaide last year ……and I also find it difficult not to appreciate the skill on show on some of Manly skills. Hasler plays an old fashioned 5/8 and some of our Rugby monsters out on the wing would have found it very difficult to finish get in low at speed to finish their sometimes exquisite passing movements. They sometimes used used their hands as well as any rugby centre …..and with Crocker shooting out of the defensive line …brave at times
Different games or not League has some positional similarities in the backs and I have not seen a current Australian rugby fullback who can match Slater/Stewart or Hunt. This does not count the injured Bowen Hodgson or Minichello. We currently have maybe one and I forgot the Reds borrowed Schicovski from league’s Raiders.
I went to see Sydney Uni play Randwick in our Sydney First Grade Grand Final… closer game TembaVJ but the skill level was to say the least ordinary.In Australian rugby we have to be careful not to have sour grapes. It is alright not to like league but I have learned like the leaguies are learning in transferring to rugby now not to underestimate the skill level of any of Australia’s 4 codes.

By: TembaVJ

TembaVJ — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:23:03 +0000

Skull (good nick by the way) you have hit the nail on the head. Complex is boring to you but to others it intriguing. Like I said Chess is more complex allowing for more tactical game play then Checkers a faster moving game. Like you said each to his own.

By: TembaVJ

TembaVJ — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:16:25 +0000

Millster I just managed to get my feet back on the ground, thanks. I am sorry if this is coming across as if I am here trying to convince someone to convert to union, fact is I could not care less. I clicked on this blog as I was curious to see if anyone else found it strange that a grand final ends in 40-0. Until I saw ray Clarke’s comments union had nothing to do with it.

It’s a choice that is your and yours alone, claiming that it has more skill is your opinion and point of view, I can guarantee you, you wont convince many.

Many think league is a dying professional sport and the fact that leagies jump to defend it so ferociously is a sign of the defeat nearing. 40-0 grand final certainly does not make for a good advertisement.

Also please don’t take me for a novice I have been in this conversation before, the leagies just love using the AFL to back up all there facts… I am glad you enjoy it but outside the 22 million people in Australia league is pretty much competing with Mexican donkey racing. So Millster you bang in with the insults and analyze every word to find fault but in the end how many people watch league and how many watch union… The figures should speak for them selves. You don’t have to agree and you don’t have to like Union, but you lads here have spat out far more negitives about union then I have about league the actual game. Read my comments again lads.

Ta.

By: Skull

Skull — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 05:03:32 +0000

Temba dont get me wrong as I like Rugby but seriously some of you guys need a reality check about the game. To quite a lot of people it is boring, as is league or soccer or NFL or any game you want to pick on. Each to their own I suppose.

By: Skull

Skull — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:53:21 +0000

Complex = boring too much time standing around waiting, league cant compete for viewers with Union? may be in South Africa, NZ and England but I ‘m not talking about those places. When was the last time a Union match outdrew a league match on TV in Australia? Not even All Black tests do that. I also think you are the one trying to tell others what to think and pick. You have taken the usual die hard Union fan attitude in looking down the nose at League as a sport and it’s followers. That is the it is a far more complex game than any other. Wht’s complex about dthrowing the ball in between two gropups of men who then attempt to push the others away from it. What is complex about kicking the thing away the first time you get it. The only compex thing about Rugby is the breakdown and that is so complex not even the referees understand it.This may entertain some people, but to a die hard leaguie like me your attitude is very condesending and is the reason why Rugby in this country is 4th out of the four football codes.

By: Millster

Millster — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:52:32 +0000

Temba - I have to call you again on your post. You mention scrums, lineouts and kicking as added complexity to your code. Do you realise that if you pop your head into neutral territory for just a second that they are nothing more than slightly bizarre idiosyncracies of your game? Nothing more skilled or complex there. In fact most football or AFL players would see the kicking standards in Union as shockingly bad in terms of accuracy and range. Each game has its own little features and ‘wierd-bits’ but please don’t be so arrogant as to think that Union is better based on these. In fact one could carry the opposite argument and say that League has stripped these out and come closer to something purer and simpler. I don’t believe this 100% but raising it just so you can see the error and silliness of your views. Bottom line is that “chess and checkers” indicates a value judgement by you that is based not at all in reality and totally in your own snooty prejudice. I also have a preferred code. But it doesn’t make me so condescending to all the others.

By: TembaVJ

TembaVJ — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:44:54 +0000

40-0 grand final… 30 seconds mike tyson fight

By: oikee

oikee — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:42:37 +0000

Can back you up on that millster, i did not see the word exciting in your blog, we all love a close game but if you are a league fan then you would enjoy the great skills and record occasion that it produced, not only for the game but also the players,

As for Union being a better game, i said it has its moments at international level, so would league if we played the game 24/7 like union does theres. I am still looking forward to this world cup because we dont have them very often. Maybe thats a good thing for league. If they keep flogging that Wallabies / all blacks i think you will never improve your local game. Not trying to put the game down but its becoming quite a slog lately. Too many internationals can spoil the broth. Somebody tell o’neil this please, while his local game suffers. Any international game of any code can attract a full house to the game, take soccer and the sellout game at suncorp next 2 weeks, so if union thinks that this is there only domain then they had better rethink.
Thats all i am saying because the other codes are moving forward fast. League is not growing here as much as it is in england, they have a well run comp there now with excellent growth. The better the local comp the more countries that are willing to buy that product, and league has got over 125 countries now on board for the rights to show there world cup, so anyone who thinks that this is a waste of time are wasting there own time.

Sport is fast becoming a world product, even a game like the aussie rules international between ireland and oz can make big money by selling it to overseas countries, and from what i have seen on the clips, it looks alright to me.

By: TembaVJ

TembaVJ — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:42:01 +0000

Skull I felt the same way when South Africa trumped Australia 53-8 a month or so ago, it feels good but this does not mean it was a good game of rugby. A good game is one that is hard fought by the best of the best.

“Union may well have status in 4 or 5 other countries” You might be slightly off target there. As for the other aspect of Union you fail to find interesting (lineout’s, scrums and kicking) its all part of a far more complex game. Like I said Checkers and Chess, take your pick, just don’t tell others what to pick.

“Dominant on the night”, ok… And you wonder why league cant compete with Union for viewers.

It reminds me of those earlier Mike Tyson fight where they would put him up against some skinny white nobody and he would knock him out in 30 seconds. I always felt sorry for the people that bought tickets to those spectacles.

By: Skull

Skull — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:41:45 +0000

Well said Millster

By: Millster

Millster — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:38:03 +0000

Temba your posts are kinda hypocritical. Yes, sure, League is an insular game. But so is Union - to some extent more so because even though it masquerades as an international sport, it has grown from the upper colonial classes of less than a half-dozen countries only and until recently has been very closed in that community. The only sport that can boast the kind of international relevence that you are trying to ascribe on Union is Football.

So once your feet are back on the ground, dont discriminate against League. If you want an important global code, follow Football. If you want a great local/semi-local game with skills and play you can enjoy, then sure Union may be your thing, but it doesn’t have much over either League or AFL to support the attitude of superiority that you have stupidly taken. In fact as a neutral observer the playing skills are more evident to me in League (and AFL) than in Union, much of which is about scrabbling around on the ground and a few badly directed kicks.

I say well done to both League yesterday and AFL last week for putting on good GFs. Neither were thrillers but both were good hard skilled games.

By: David Carling

David Carling — Mon, 06 Oct 2008 04:28:00 +0000

My Mighty Manly Sea-Eagles

We are the CHAMPIONS for 2008 totally magnificent BIG CONGRATULATIONS to our Super coah Des Hasler and to Matty Orford Great effort OX also Jamie Lyon well done maybe these so called experts can get of your backs and eat humble pie i know your worthy and wouldn’t swap you fro any number 7 in the land. As for Brent Kite please explain Mr Bellamy should have been their in origin in front of Brett White wow how did you sleep mate.

I LOVE my MIGHTY MANLY SEA-EAGLES 4 Ever 1st 4 Me
Hear the Mighty roar as the Sea-Eagles soar
Beaver Beaver Beaver as the CHAMP scores. Will be missed but never forgotten your simply the best Steve Menzies thankyou very much for all the many happy and great memories. GOOD LUCK Beaver.

MANLY 2008 and Centenary Premiers. Best Ever.

MANLY MANLY MANLY what a team