Here’s what Lucas Neil has to say about Pimbo:
“The first thing that comes out is how he man-manages the players,” Neill said. “He has had a rapport with the team from the day we met him and gave the players a lot of trust. But with that comes responsibility - he gives us the freedom but cracks down in terms of discipline.
“On the pitch he’s extremely well prepared - very calm and wants us to express ourselves. During the week we work very hard to get the formation and the tactics right, and then he trusts us to do our jobs.
“He’s methodical - he likes to work things out early, train to that end and back himself, that’s the key to success. It would have been easier in some ways to go with a bigger name, whereas he’s hungry to make himself a household name.
“In terms of preparation, with (new West Ham boss Gianfranco) Zola, Guus Hiddink and Verbeek, a lot of the work’s already done so the guys don’t need to do a lot of talking - it’s calm, it’s composed because everyone trusts the system they’ve been working with all week (and) the game plan they’ve been given.”

Nice to see Neill has faith in at least one of his managers.

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I think during Total Football interview he mention about it. He then explain about why he wanted to leave. He could have lied about it as it makes him look bad if he would have been sack.

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Millster
A lot of times people accused Craig Foster of personal attacks and a lot of times I say that is rubbish as he always criticise the competence of the person not the person character.

However with Gerrard Houllier (as well as later on with Domenach) during one of the shootouts he started indulging in personal attacks. There were discussing options for the Soccerroos manager and Houllier name came up. He said he didn’t like the style of Football that Houllier played and he accused of him of bringing a great club with history of beautiful football liverpool into a pragmatic side. He then say that according to his “French friends” (I wonder who he is referring to) that no one in France respects him and then Fozzie called him a mercenary and the only thing he is interested in is money.

I was god damn flabbagasted hearing that especially from some one who probably never met him. If he was in France he probably be sued for defamation.

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KB

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dasilva,
I sort have lost track what this discussion was all about I think it started because I said Pimbo was second rate and on the same par as GA, maybe he is slightly better GA never really had the support from above… I can’t except your rationale that Pimbo being “he was the best of the rest” I put forward the options that were available; again I think you agree with the added comment they were rejected by the FFA because their better judgement said Pimbo was the best choice ..

This is where we can argue forever.. I said there were options open and they failed to live up to their promise; that we were going to get a world class recognised top of the pile manager and we were let down… Aimet Jacquet as I understand he was wanting the manager’s job from interviews with Brenden and Fozzie on SBS but I will try to uncover some further information if I can..

In Pimbo we have a manager who has destroyed the 2006 cavalier style Socceroos we once had. Transformed to an under performing timid to go forward outfit.. But, as I have said Pimbo will get us to the 2010 world cup, however, we will only be a shadow of the 2006 squad that we all fell in love with…

I also challenge that he was offered a new contract by Sth Korea .. Yes he wrote that on his Wiki profile as we all would do .. But the truth of the matter is he lost control of his squad with players busted for getting drunk and the writing was on the wall and tendered his resignation .. If you google up Pim and Sth Korean bad player behavior there is a piece where 4 players were punished after Pim’s departure .. It is my view; this is the real reason why he resigned .. But we will never know for sure..

Just on Zola who I think would have been a fantastic choice as he was the at the time the under 23’s Italian national coach or one of them .. His experiene was on par with Pimbo… Anyways last post on this issue let’s agree to disagree.. and good luck as we will need it in Sth Africia.. After we qualify..

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KB

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Overwhelming too for me is that it makes sense for Australia to have some kind of stylistic consistency at this stage of our development. Much as they each have strong merits, to go Dutch, then Italian or French, and then keep bouncing around is to me not as sensible as determining a baseline from one footballing philosophy and sticking with it properly for a period of 5 to 10 years. So if we’re Dutch we stay Dutch, we commit to the cause rather than jump to whoever has the best face-value CV.

I have to say one factor that I think must be repeated (someone else raised it before) is the deepening of the Socceroos team under Pim. The 2006 campaign was built largely on a set of established European players who, once they were given a disciplined system and idea of how to play (which is what Guus brought) were able to execute the game plan. There was plenty of post-tournament press about this ‘golden era’ of guys retiring and a void being left afterwards. But to my mind this has not occurred anywhere near as badly as we expected and Pim/Henk have given Australia some new options that will serve us not only in 2010 but through to 2014. I think we are a far deeper squad now than we were in 2006.

I’ve decided to have some faith and some loyalty. He has delivered on the scoreboard so-far; not perfectly but with a consistency that a decade ago would not have been expected. He has been present and interested in our domestic game and in the HAL players with potential for development. He is hooked into our Aussies abroad and seems to have good visibility of how they are going at club level and how that translates to potential national team value. His formations and team selections show that he has a game plan and fixed objectives in mind every time the Socceroos hit the field, even if we may not agree with that plan 100% of the time. And perhaps most importantly he seems to have the support and respect of the players, and they seem to want to play for him.

So to some extent I say just like Mr T in the famous Snickers ad, “stop your jibber jabber”. I’d take what we have now 100 times over compared to what we had even just 5 years ago. And I think we’re in reasonable hands.

And to close, god knows I have some perspective being French-Aussie. My two nation’s coaches are Verbeek and Domenech. I certainly know which one makes me feel more comfortable…

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I know Capello wanted to coach the soccerroos. The problem was FFA wanted Dick Advocaat and rejected Capello. By the time Dick Advocaat screwed us. Capello was already taken up by England. The issue here is should FFA chosen Capello over Dick Advocaat not Pim Verbeek. It’s unfair to compare Pim with Capello when he wasn’t competing with Capello for the job. Dick was. That’s why FFA really screwed up and should have hired Capello at the beginning as Capello is a better coach then Dick Advocaat. Nevertheless because FFA was so fixated by Dick Advocaat. By the time Dick shedded his contract all the other potential coaches already got new jobs.

You also mention Aimet Jacquet. I’m not too sure he was ever interested in the Soccerroos as he was retired. I thought the interview with Foster was that he was interested in becoming technical director not our National team coach. If i was wrong then perhaps he was an option.

You also mention Zico and Zola. Zola was inexperience at coaching and that would have been his first coaching job. Not the best scenario to get a team prepared for WCQ with short notice.

Zico - let’s just say that his legacy coaching the national team in Japan is bringing Japanese football backwards. Scott Mcintyre wrote an excellent article about how Zico refused to stay in Japan and how he was obsessed about European players and didn’t want to watch local J league and assessed their talent. Didn’t try to learn to speak Japanese. Again considering FFA wanted someone to stay in Australia and follow the a-league (unfortunately I can’t find that article so you can either take my word for it or not), I’m not too sure he is the right choice even though he was successful with fenarbache. He may be a good club coach but he did fail in Japan and if he didn’t want to stay in Australia then he’s simply isn’t an option.

Neesken- It was too late to get Neesken. He should have got the job right after World Cup 2006. Unfortunately FFA wanted a star signing coach and couldn’t guarantee the position to Neesken. So Neesken had the option of joining Barcelona or wait until FFA couldn’t find their first choice manager and then offer the job to him. Understandably he took up the job as assistant manager in Barcelona. So we were stuck with Arnold while FFA was looking for their star signing. Again by the time after the Asia cup - Neesken was unavailable as he was not going to quit Barcelona and break his contract for the Soccerroos. You can’t then compare Neesken with Pim as they weren’t directly competing with each other.

Houllier - He was too expensive. Can’t really do anything about that. (also getting houllier would piss Fozzy off)

So we had Troussier and Pim Verbeek as the left overs. The only reasonable and fair comparison
Troussier was a control freak who wanted to take over youth development like he did with Japan. If he took over Arnold would have been gone (a good thing) and so would Rob Baan as they would have conflicting views on how to handle things. I wouldn’t have mind Troussier but he didn’t want to accept the precondition of having Arnold as an assistant manager (why was that a precondition in the first place. Why is arnold so protected at FFA).

So we were left with Pim who after consultation with Baan and Hiddink was convinced that Arnold was a good bloke. He then accepted the job

Now you could argue that troussier was a better coach then Pim but really there isn’t much in it between them. Troussier has the CV butseems like someone who would have step on alot of shoes in FFA and Pim was dutch with high praised from Hiddink nad would have continue the same style of play.

I admit Pim isn’t world class manager. But he was the best of what was available (or at the most second best). The fact is we weren’t getting a world class manager to coach soccerroos so we had to settle for the best of the rest.

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dasilva,
Aimet Jacquet, Houllier, Zico, Alex Ferguson, Philip Solari, I am not sure why you would ask that question.?. If you mean who could have taken the place of Guus; well I think there were a number to choose from, but because Advocaat reneging at the last moment made it hard I agree..

However, there were a few still in the mix. I believe even Campello’s agent made an enquiry.. Now that would have been something.. I even remember Zola putting up his hand at one stage, Neeskens of course was there at the very beginning, and then the Frenchman Troussier, at the very last moment with Pimbo. The now Qatari manager who took Senegal on that amazing run in the France world cup or was it in Japan .. ? could have been a target for the post. The Brazilian who took the Iraqi team to win the Asian Cup was looking for the appointment .. Hmm yes there were quite a number of very good candidates out there that I would have chosen before Pimbo ..

But I do appreciate your research of where Pimbo came from and I stand corrected, but does not tell us that he has a good pedigree or track record for the money he is commanding, as a top Dutch European Manager that we were looking for.. We were told that we would have another top European manager and we didn’t get one .. On top of that he has turned a great Socceroo team that was dynamic in Germany into a very ordinary defence minded outfit.. I wish him all the best, but quite frankly I have no confidence in him at the very highest level, when we qualify for Sth Africa, which we will of course … But under Pimbo I can’t see us getting out of the group stages.. He is far too cautious and wants the players to sit back even against weak opposition…

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KB

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Dick Advocaat resigned after World Cup 2006. Pim Verbeek was the assistant and then took over from Advocaat
He then led the team to the Asia Cup and finish a respectable 3rd which is better then a lost in the quarters don’t you think?

So many factual errors KB

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Read the round ball analyst review of the Asia Cup semi final. It’s a very good analysis of the Iraq and South Korea and shows that Pim Verbeek coach very well in the tournament

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2. Pim Verbeek was offered a contract and he refused to accept it. The reason is because for him to get the right preparation for the team he had to fight tooth and nail with the board and with the clubs. one of the thing that impressed him about Australia is that FFA bend over backwards to assist him for the soccerroos.

3. south Korea actually outplayed Iraq and were unlucky to make it to the final. They completely dominated the match. Had the most chances. It was only poor finishing that prevented them from winning and they were unlucky to lose in the penalty shoot out.

4. South Korea may have played dull football in the asia cup but they were the most defensively organised team at the tournament keeping a clean sheet for 4 matches in the row. This reflects Pim Verbeek conservatism. However like the performance in Kunming there were mitigating circumstances. All of european players were injured including Park Ji sung. Most of the players that were injured were forwards. He came to Asia Cup with K-league only side. These injuries quite possible could have cost him the tournament.

5. Pim Verbeek is not as good as Guus Hiddink. But tell me who is.
Harry Kewell is not as good as C. Ronaldo.

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Very few could replace Guss……….. IMO PIM is not as bad as you make out time will tell of course but he has grown our squad to over 40 players and has stood firm on a number of issues ……. one bing Nicky who if anywhere near as good as he is made out to be would not be struggling to get on an England second division team sheet……..he would be where Timmy C, Vinney, Marko B, Kool …………… for heavens Vinney was a capitain of a seria A team, Timmy C voted last year amoung the top 50 in Europe, we are heaps strong in midfield. Other players are playing in top leagues.

However Nicky was an example not PIM ………… PIM is at every A-League match he takes A-League players to Socceroo matches lifts their game.

Do I think he is as good as Guss no, …………. name someone who is in Guss class who would coach Australia ………. when the add when out for the Soccroos caoch Aimet Jacquet could still have applied there was nothing to stop him you could even say he had inside knowledge.

So is PIM the worlds best ……… not by a long shot is he as bad as you make out same answer not by a long shot.

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I don’t expect a repeat of the 2006 World Cup under ANY coach. While Australia are improving fast and gaining depth and experience at national level we absolutely are not yet at the level of the top 16 nations in the world, and for the next couple of world cups it will be an exceptional rather than normal thing for us to join that 16-team knockout level by making it through the group stage as we did in 2006.

Just to have realistic hope of being in the 32 that go to the finals is a massive and glorious step for me, and will do for the next couple of tournaments. Remember among all the 2006 excitement that we’ve only still ever won the one single match at World Cup finals. Ever. So lets focus on getting to South Africa, which I think is a realistic goal given our standard, and then take each match as it comes once we’re in that lofty company.

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And others, i guess what i meant was Pim is good as it gets…now. That is ..we got him, we may as well learn the lessons.

Excellent points KB. You have opened my mind.

Cheers, i will get the next round.

Graciously,
The Bear

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Your point Pimbo had little time to prepare for the coming world cup qualifiers; yes so he did .. But more time than Guus for the world cup (I think) compare the two teams to date; they are miles apart; in tactics, organisation and determination. Something is missing and Pimbo is not a Guus .. However, we are stuck with him and I’m sure we will get to the 2010 WC under him.. But don’t expect a repeat performance of the 2006 WC under Pimbo; he is not that good…

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KB

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Millster, the Bear and all,
Yes it was true, he was very interested after Craig Foster and Brenden Schwab both from the Players Association at the time.. They had organised for Jacquet to conduct a series of coaching seminars for Australian local coaches over 3 weeks that were very well attended in Sydney.. It was at the same time that Houllier was approached and the on going saga, will he or won’t he commit to the job.. Meanwhile the 1998 WC winning coach was asked it he was interested by Foster and Schwab of the player’s association if he would consider the appointment and if he was an interview could be set up. However, it must be said a reluctant FFA had agreed to meet with Aimet Jacquet to discuss the position .. Remembering that Houllier was still being courted by Frank Lowy and O’Neill (?) or Ben Buckley. Lowy had his heart set upon appointing Houllier. Which would have been an exceptional appointment in my view as he had a remarkable background in the setting up the French technical department that resulted in producing players of likes of Henry and Zidane..

However, nothing came out of the meeting with Aimet Jacquet and so he returned home to France .. Pity as he was unemployed and wanted to take on an international post…

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KB

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Pim came to this job with little time to settle in the squad as well and little preparation time. Like I say the Australia vs China and Australia vs Kuwait is practically identical in terms of preparation time given and yet the performance was widely different.

I’m not a fan of Pim’s pragmatism but when I look at Australia I see a team that is well organised, adaptable to the conditions (which is the Pim’s greatest achievement) and for the most part Australia pretty much limit the opposition to only a few chances.

Look- I agree with most of your point (although North outplayed Beauchamp everytime they played together). I still don’t think anything you say proves that he is as bad as Graham Arnold which is my main annoyance with your comment. I can understand how someone is annoyed with some of his substitution (or lack of) and style of football to the degree that they don’t like the coach. To say that he is as bad as Arnold is over the top.

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Every coach is not perfect. Let’s call this, the best of a bad situation, considering the FFA does not trust the local coaches just yet. And when the FFA do, let’s hope it’s someone with a lot more nous and belief, than “the unspeakable one”.

Graciously,
The Bear

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Sledge,
not so much at the time; I felt that we still had better applicants .. But what he has achieved with the Zennit FC is quite remarkably, and if he had taken the Socceroo position and produced the same results; I would have been happy enough…

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KB

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You may think I am being brutal. But with Pimbo some of our home grown lads are up their with him. So if we are so concerned in getting a top notch European Manager.. Pimbo was not it… I can think of three Frenchman who were interested in the position; who I think would have been far better.. Especially the 1998 French world cup winning manager, who openly said he would take on the position, when he was brought out by the players association to address the local coaches in a number of coaching seminars .. Oh boy what a missed opportunity that was…

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KB

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