Waratahs top of Elsom’s list, says Hickey
By Darren Walton, 4 Apr 2009 Darren Walton is a Roar Guru
- Tagged:
- Chris Hickey, Rocky Elsom, Rugby Union, Super Rugby, Waratahs
NSW coach Chris Hickey is confident star flanker Rocky Elsom will re-sign with the Waratahs when – and if – he returns to Australia following his playing stint with Leinster.
The Australian Rugby Union last year granted Elsom a release from his ARU contract, citing unspecified compassionate grounds, freeing up the 40-Test forward to take up a one-season deal with Leinster.
Although the Irish club is now desperate to retain the 26-year-old, Wallabies coach Robbie Deans and ARU bosses John O’Neill and David Nucifora remain hopeful of luring Elsom back for the 2009 Tri Nations tournament.
Deans, O’Neill and Nucifora met with Elsom this week while in London for an ELVs summit.
Should Elsom – who is intent on playing for Australia at the 2011 World Cup in New Zealand – opt to resume his Super 14 career next season, it is likely there will be a tug-of-war for his services between the states.
There was speculation last month that the Reds were eager for Elsom – a product of Brisbane’s esteemed rugby nursery Nudgee College – to return home to play for Queensland.
Hickey, though, is optimistic Elsom will reunite with the Waratahs, where he enjoyed a six-season stint from 2003-08.
“I think if Rocky comes back to Australia that the Waratahs would be top of his list,” Hickey said on Friday.
“We spoke to Rocky a couple of weeks ago and Rocky’s still working out what he wants to do.
“Rocky’s aware that we’re really interested to talk to him. It becomes a little bit more difficult because there’s a third party with the ARU involved.
“So he needs time to work through those negotiations and we’ll just stay in touch with him and see how it unfolds over the next few weeks.”
© AAP 2012Recommend this story.
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- Chris Hickey, Rocky Elsom, Rugby Union, Super Rugby, Waratahs
April 5th 2009 @ 6:00am
Knives Out said | April 5th 2009 @ 6:00am | Report comment
2nd half when the pressure was on. The most specific example I can think of was when he failed to make 10 metres from kick off. You also have to ask why he failed to take complete control of the game.
Journeymen: Ripol, Keil, Tualigi, Ormsby. I don’t think they compare with other qsuad players in the GP.
Cueto has finished well in the past few games but I still wouldn’t have him near the Lions squad. Today Stretle and Monye showed how far a good wingers influence should stretch.
April 5th 2009 @ 6:44am
pothale said | April 5th 2009 @ 6:44am | Report comment
And Munster ‘munstered’ Leinster this evening – 22-5.
Plenty of running rugby, but Leinster could only manage to breach the Munster line once. Contemponi had a shocker in overall play and kicking terms – missed four kicks that could have kept them in the game. Toulon are welcome to him at this point – maybe he’ll get refreshed in sunnier climes.
With four games to go, Munster are now 7 points clear of the Ladyboys, and 11 clear of Ospreys who have a game in hand. Munster play Connacht next in the ML at home on 18th – they’ll be targeting that as a 5 pointer. And if they win that, I reckon they’re home and hosed for the title. Ospreys may pip Leinster for second spot yet.
Perfect preparation game for Munster and their H Cup quarter-final next Sunday against Ospreys which I’m lucky enough to have got tix for – should be a good day out.
Kearney played poorly on the wing for Leinster. Although his best position is at 15, he has played in 11 before. He missed a relatively easy tackle to prevent Earls from scoring the first try. He won’t be happy with his performance. Neither will Cheika. And if McGeechan & Co are viewing these games, that’ll be a definite black mark against him, and may move Armitage up the ladder of selection.
April 5th 2009 @ 7:23am
Colin N said | April 5th 2009 @ 7:23am | Report comment
“You also have to ask why he failed to take complete control of the game.”
The pack, Leicester’s was better, despite the 14 men, simple really. The 10 metre thing, we neally scored a try from it. Poor decision from the ref, but he got away with it. It’s also a minor example of apparently succumbing to the pressure.
Journeymen: Keil-as already stated yes.
Ripol-top try scorer last year, has given good service to Sale, probably coming to the end of his tenure, time to give Kuadey a chance. Possibly a journeyman.
Tuilagi-he’s only 22 for christ sake’s and has improved throughout the season and made a postive impact in his first game since January. No.
Ormsby-no way. Been superb for Sale when fit. Last played in October, came here with a reputation, but was excellent in his brief stint until he got injured. No.
Any other examples?
April 5th 2009 @ 7:36am
Knives Out said | April 5th 2009 @ 7:36am | Report comment
Sale nearly scored a decision because Barnes made the wrong call. The point is that when you are in such a tight game inches count. Hodgson fluffs the restart and manages to give away a 7 pointer. All Hodgson had to do was boot into the corners. It’s not as if he didn’t have the ball at all, so to say Leicester’s pack were too strong is a manipulation of the facts.
Ripol – good finisher. Rarely seeks work and not powerful enough. With him and Cueto Sale have possibly the laziest pair of wingers in the Prem.
Tuilaigi – one trick pony. No distribution and no kicking skills.
Ormsby – he had a reputation as a mediocre NZ back 5 player. IMO a journeyman.
Dave Ward – journeyman. Literally.
Eifon Roberts – too heavy and far too inconsistent.
Stuart Turner – too old and lacks power.
Chris Bell – winger or centre? Not hugely influential in either position.
Nick MacLeoud – I wonder why Cardiff let him go?
Kuadey.. ?
Basically, what I’m saying is that Sale have one of the worst squads in the GP, and I think they will be in huge trouble next year. Compare their squads with Leicester, Gloucester, Irish, Bath and Quins.
April 5th 2009 @ 8:10am
Colin N said | April 5th 2009 @ 8:10am | Report comment
If we have one of the worst squad yet we’re 6 strange that. I’m disappointed with our season, but we don’t have one of the worst squads, especially when you consider it’s one of the smallest. Cueto-lazy, bullshit. Enough said.
Tuilagi’s distribution ain’t bad actually, but that’s not his job.
Omsby, reputation in NZ doesn’t necessarily mean the same in England. Ask New Zealanders what they thought about Flutey before he moved to England? Enough said.
Turner-coming to the end of his tenure, agreed too old, but here you’re accessing the nature of their attributes, not whether they are a journeyman, same with Bell and Roberts.
I’m a big fan of Bell and he has proven that he is a very good player. Roberts has improved immensely this since he’s been at Sale and the scrum has dominated both Bath and Leicester in the past two weeks. Ward; I don’t know why we signed him, but that’s why we have Briggs and Jones. Macloed’s an average player and this is a specific area where we need to strenghten.
Leicester and Gloucester have better squads because they have more money. Bath-I don’t think they have a great squad at all-they’re well coached and play exciting rugby, a team that should be Sale’s blueprint. London Irish have a similar sized squad to Sale and if they had the same the injuries and international call-ups that we had then they would be in a similar position to us. In fact, they had a lot of injuries last year and I assume you saw how it affected them.
“Kuadey.. ?”
What about him?
P.S. I would assume you only see Sale when they are on Sky?
April 5th 2009 @ 8:51am
Knives Out said | April 5th 2009 @ 8:51am | Report comment
I don’t need to debate you because Sale are 6th following a pretty crushing loss versus 14 men. Enough said. If you want to be overtly optimistic then fine, that’s your right as a Sale fan. My opinion is that the squad is poor and that next season will be even leaner than this. I don’t mean to be cynical or disrespectful but just because I don’t travel to Stockport every other week doesn’t mean I can’t make an accurate analysis of the squad. I happen to think that Irish and Bath certainly have superior squads.
* This year Irish lost D. and S. Armitage and Kennedy to England, Hodgson and Gerathy for a period, and Casey to injury. That is the spine of their team.
* If Cueto isn’t lazy then why is he nowhere near the top 10 for metres made? He’s a finisher, no more no less.
* Where did Ormsby get his alleged reputation from, if not from NZ? Flutey was quite an influential age group player btw so it’s not an apt comparison.
* What is Tuilagi’s job? Do centres not pass?
* Bell is a 13 who can’t cement the 13 jersey. He’s too slow to be a wing and can’t compare to any of the top centres in the GP.
* The scrum didn’t exactly dominate Leicester today. It was probably 50/50, and in any case, just because a scrum dominates that does not mean that a single player can be singled out for praise. Roberts looks seriously overweight – although I don’t claim to know more than the Sale fitness staff – and he does not contribute as heavily as he could. He is neither a Mike Ross nor a David Barnes.
* Surely the ability of a player – i.e. their attributes – is inherently linked to that player being labelled either a marquee player or a journeyman.
April 5th 2009 @ 10:18am
Colin N said | April 5th 2009 @ 10:18am | Report comment
Didn’t Ormsby play for the NZ Moari’s?
It doesn’t matter whether Flutey played well for the NZ age groups or not, he couldn’t cement a regular place for the Hurricanes. So you could argue that he didn’t transfer his early promise onto the Super 14 stage. It’s also the case to say that while a player may not do it for one team, he may be outstanding in another team. Lee Thomas is a perfect example. In that sense Ormsby has done that, so has Flutey, so to call Ormsby a journeyman is very harsh. It was you who originally comented about Ormsby’s reputation in NZ.
“He’s too slow to be a wing and can’t compare to any of the top centres in the GP.”
Of course he doesn’t compare to the top centres or else he would be a regular starter, but he’s a useful squad player, and I thought that’s what we were debating.
As I said before Tuilagi has decent distribution. If you want specific examples I will give you them.
“The scrum didn’t exactly dominate Leicester today. It was probably 50/50, and in any case, just because a scrum dominates that does not mean that a single player can be singled out for praise”
No, but he played his part. If he was a weak link then he would have been exposed by Leicester. Also had Leicester scummed properly then the dominance would have been more obvious, that’s why they were constantly penalised in the first-half.
re: London Irish, S.Armitage was only lost for one game. Sale have lost many more players this season, so I don’t see what your point is. I’d guess you’re referring to the apparent strength of Irish’s squad in comparison to Sale’s, but it’s hard when for a period of time, Sale are without 17 squad players, whether first team or back-up.
“If Cueto isn’t lazy then why is he nowhere near the top 10 for metres made?”
A tough one this. Laziness and metres made have no direct correlation. A player can touch a ball once and run a 100 metres. Does that mean he’s lazy? I would guess that to look at whether a player is lazy is to see how many times they touch the ball. Whether they have an effect on the game and make metres is another matter. Also, Cueto, due to internationals has had less game time than others. Often, for Sale and England, Cueto is used off first phase set piece ball, why? He must be doing something right. I would guess he takes good lines and has decent acceleration off the mark. He’s not the quickest (although he did out pace the Evans brothers), but he does more than just finish off moves, which is a skill in itself.
April 5th 2009 @ 9:46pm
Knives Out said | April 5th 2009 @ 9:46pm | Report comment
* Whether or not Ormsby did play for the Maori is irrelevant. He was never highly regarded. Flutey was but did not develop. You alleged that Ormsby travelled to the UK with a reputation as if that undermined any chance of him being average. I have refuted that. “It was you who originally comented about Ormsby’s reputation in NZ.” Hence, I find this statement a tad confusing because your brought it up first?
* My definition of a squad player is somebody who can fit into the first xv without any adverse affects. It is my opinion that Bell can’t do this at wing or centre, nor can the other Sale squad players.
* Ok, Colin. Give me some examples of Tuilagi’s distribution to prove that he’s not actually just a typical Tuilagi smash and grab merchant. To prove that he isn’t just a big, bumping Samoan but a highly skilled centre in the mould of Mapasua.
* My point about Roberts is this. He is neither a dominant scrummager nor a ball running prop. What is he? What is his role? If you think about most clubs in the country their front rowers have a clearly defined role.
* Fine, Armitage was missing for one game, but that doesn’t include the training missed. The same applies to Paul Hodgson. If Sale were missing a spine of players then so were Irish, perhaps even more so because they rely that much more on the players that were missing, either through international selection or injury.
* Metres made tends to accumulate to involvement with the game, a willingness to work. Cueto’s apparent non-involvement may be down to the Sale tactics but I can’t recall the last time I saw him look for work off his wing in an England jersey either. In any case, What does his involvement off first phase ball indicate exactly?
April 5th 2009 @ 11:05pm
Colin N said | April 5th 2009 @ 11:05pm | Report comment
Oh I see, yes sorry my mistake, what I meant is that Ormsby came here with the reputation of being a walking yellow card, he hasn’t done that.
Tuilagi set up the try for Cueto against Bath, put O’Donnell through a gap against Worcester, the only ine break we made in that game and set up a length of the field move against Bath in the EDF by off-loading in the tackle. Those are what I would consider key passes he has made this (half) season
“hat does his involvement off first phase ball indicate exactly?”
You’ve aswered it yourself effectively, he gets involved, aka looking for work.
“Metres made tends to accumulate to involvement with the game.”
Well, most of the players who are in that list are full-backs for obvious reasons. I know Maddock and the Samoan (I’m not even going to try and spell his name) are there. But, I don’t agree metres necessarily means an involvment in a game. As I said ‘touches of the ball’ would probably sort it out, don’t you agree?
“If Sale were missing a spine of players then so were Irish, perhaps even more so because they rely that much more on the players that were missing, either through international selection or injury.”
So McAlister wasn’t a miss? Tait has not been fully fit. Peel? Chabal? Wigglesworth was also injured at the same time as Peel. Sheridan and Faure at the same time? White? Abraham? Considering we haven’t really got a replacement there. We could have (if everyone was fit) Chabal at 8 and Lobbe at 7, but that’s where we are specifically weak. Irish’s form also significantly dropped when they lost their ‘key’ players. They’ve picked up again, though, with their players back. You can’t really compare Irish’s injuries to Sale’s.
Re: Bell, he’s better than Ripol, but he’s injured atm, I think. Would you say Ryan Davis is an able replacement for Butch James? Or Mitchell is for Lewsey? Ashton for Reihana? etc, etc.
“My point about Roberts is this. He is neither a dominant scrummager nor a ball running prop. What is he? What is his role?”
It means he’s a rounded player (quite literally). Didn’t you see his run and off-load against Munster? fantastic play.
April 6th 2009 @ 1:18am
Knives Out said | April 6th 2009 @ 1:18am | Report comment
“Tuilagi set up the try for Cueto against Bath, put O’Donnell through a gap against Worcester, the only ine break we made in that game and set up a length of the field move against Bath in the EDF by off-loading in the tackle. Those are what I would consider key passes he has made this (half) season”
I don’t think two incidents reflect the hands of Campese.
You said that Cueto is used off first phase. That doesn’t suggest he has a great work rate, it suggests that his coaches place him there. I agree about touches per game but even that is debatable, because some sides use their wings more.
Irish have missed Casey, Kennedy, S. Armitage, Hodgson, Geraghty, Tagicakibau and D. Armitage. That’s comparable IMO and I would say more so because they are the stalwarts. The Irish style relies on these players, and I don’t think the players you mentioned have been consistent enough this season to be that much of a necessity. Was Tait a loss? I wouldn’t say so, simply because he hasn’t had a settled position this year. The same applies to McAlister. However, in light of losing these players Irish still managed a whole host of losing bonus points.
Davis, Mitchell and Ashton are all pretty selective. I’m sure I could do the same thing but I’m simply too weary, Colin.
Let’s agree to disagree. No disrespect – and I have no ulterior or cynical motive in saying this – but unless Sale get some serious players in I’m predicting that they won’t finish in the top 6. I’m sure we could debate the qualities, or indeed lack of, of certain players but we’d just cancel each other out. Incidentally, are you playing the Coral fantasy GP game?