In five days time, the Lions management team, led by head coach, Ian McGeechan, will announce the squad that will travel to South Africa in late May. 35 players will be announced.
Apparently, there’s a chance that an extra player, for a squad of 36, may be added.
So here’s a little tipping comp for you all.
Rather than give a selection of players who you think will travel or would like to travel, or you absolutely insist must travel, you’ve got to step inside Geech’s mind (and by mental teleportation Edwards, Gatland et al) and say who you think they will pick.
So no personal favourites, no “if I was picking the team.” Just stick with what you believe the Geech thinks.
We can do this in two stages.
First is guess the squad, and before the first midweek team is announced, we can reprise this to make your picks for that.
Ditto the test team.
2 points are awarded for each correct name. Put in your 35, and nominate an extra one in case it’s 36. You won’t lose points if it’s only 35 players they go with, or if your 36th man is part of a 35-man squad.
A bonus five pointer if you guess the tour captain correctly, who will be announced on the same day. For clarity’s sake, I don’t mean the midweek-team captain, or leader of the pack.
So on a 35 man squad, if someone gets all names correct, and the name of the captain, the max points they’ll have after the Squad Round is 75 points (77, if it’s a 36 man squad).
The most points at the end of the competition gets bragging rights until the Tri-Nations. After that, you can shut-up and bottom-feed like the rest of us.
So for our Southern Hemisphere neighbours who mightn’t be as familiar with some of the possible names for inclusion, here’s a selection from whom the 35/36 might be picked.
But there are other names out there, so feel free to pick who you want.
Some of the players can fill a number of positions, so you just have to name the players at this point.
Gents, get your starting Geech caps on.
FBs
Lee Byrne (Wal), Delon Armitage (Eng); Rob Kearney (Irl), Geordan Murphy (Irl)
Wingers
Tommy Bowe, (Ireland), Shane Williams (Wales), Thom Evans (Scotland), Luke Fitzgerald,(Irl) Mark Cueto (Eng) Paul Sackey (Eng) Leigh Halpenny (Wal) Josh Lewsey, (Eng) Ugo Monye (Eng) David Strettle (Eng)
Centres
Brian O’Driscoll (Irl), Tom Shanklin (Wal), Riki Flutey (NZ), Jamie Roberts (Wal); Keith Earls (Irl) Jordan Turner-Hall (Eng) Gordon Darcy (Irl) Mike Tindall (Eng)
10s
Stephen Jones (Wal), Ronan O’Gara (Irl), Danny Cipriani (Eng), Toby Flood (Eng)
Scrum-halves
Dwayne Peel, (Wal) Mike Phillips (Wal), Tomas O’Leary (Irl) Mike Blair (Scot) Danny Care (Eng) Harry Ellis (Eng)
Front Rowers
Gethin Jenkins (Wal), Jerry Flannery (Irl), Rory Best (Irl), Euan Murray (Scot), John Hayes (Ire), Phil Vickery (Eng), Ross Ford (Scot), Lee Mears (Eng) A Sheridan (Eng)
Locks:
Paul O’Connell (Ireland), Nathan Hines (Scotland), Alun Wyn Jones (Wales), Donncha O’Callaghan (Irl), Simon Shaw (Eng), Nick Kennedy (Eng), Leo Cullen (Irl)
Back Rowers:
David Wallace (Irl), Martyn Williams (Wal), Robshaw (Eng) Stephen Ferris (Irl), Joe Worsley (Eng), Tom Croft (Eng), Jamie Heaslip (Irl) Ryan Jones (Wal) Ian Gough (Wal) James Haskell (Eng)
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April 17th 2009 @ 5:18pm
ohtani's jacket said | April 17th 2009 @ 5:18pm | Report comment
Let’s set the mood with some classic Telfer:
April 17th 2009 @ 9:25pm
pothale said | April 17th 2009 @ 9:25pm | Report comment
Thanks OJ. So you gonna put up your selection?
April 17th 2009 @ 11:22pm
Dublin Dave said | April 17th 2009 @ 11:22pm | Report comment
I think there will be rather more English, and in particular Wasps, players on the Lions squad than some might think. And I think McGeechan will have sound reasons for doing so. It all depends on what he considers to be the purpose of the Lions.
Is the main goal to win a test series in South Africa? Or to be a sort of All Stars gallery for players who have done well with their club, province or national side this season?
Is it a vote of confidence in each player that they can do a job for the team or a recognition of what they have done elsewhere?
Is it an endorsement of a player’s potential or a reward for services already rendered?
Perhaps this may sound strange to a Southern Hemisphere audience where there is no notion of the team having any other purpose than winning, but the Lions is a different concept. No matter how “British” three of the four constituent teams, and a significant minority of the fourth, may be, there is no doubt that in rugby terms their first and foremost loyalty is to their own individual country. The Lions concept survives as the ultimate accolade that a player can earn, elevation with his peers to a higher level in recognition of his achievements. In the individual countries, people take pride that one of their own is good enough to rank alongside or even ahead of the best in the other countries against whom he plays regularly.
Taken on that level, there is no doubt that this Lions team should be top heavy with Irish players. Ireland have won the Grand Slam. An Irish province is the reigning European Heineken Cup champion. Another is the reigning Magners League Champion. This year, there will be one Irish province guaranteed to be in the final, where they will play either Cardiff or Leicester. The Magners League is all but mathematically decided in favour of Munster. There is a hard core of Irish players with solid experience of at least one and sometimes two Lions tours.
But would filling the Lions full of Irish players guarantee a successful tour? And if it would not, should McGeechan pick then anyway on the grounds that they deserve it because of what they’ve done this season? That is one of the key decisions that he will have to make.
Take a look at the schedule between now and the tour. The Heineken Cup semifinals take place on May 2nd and 3rd. In those two matches, 19 of the 23 Irish players who made up the national squad for at least one of the five Grand Slam tests this season will do battle: 18 of them in Croke Park where Munster take on Leinster. It is only four years since Munster memorably turned over their posher rivals at the same stage in Lansdowne Road. And Croke Park is pretty much bang on the site where in 1014, a mere 995 years ago, the hairy arsed savages from the kingdom of Thomond defeated the relatively sophisticated urban Norsemen of Leinster at the Battle of Clontarf. (plus ca change?) Oh boy, are they owed a good kicking!!!
If the winners of that match were to progress on to taking the HC in Murrayfield on May 25th it would cap the most remarkable Irish rugby season ever. But given that the Lions tour opens a mere five days later against an ominously named High Veldt XV in Rustenberg, what sort of state, mental as well as physical, would those players be in to meet that challenge?
No matter how good a player is there is only so much mental and physical capacity they have before breakdown. It happens to the best of players and sometimes a little rest does no harm at all. Compare and contrast, for example, the jaded crocked Lawrence Dallaglio that hobbled his way through the Lions tour to Australia in 2001 to the derision of the Usual Suspects in the Australian media with the Collossus who was the heartbeat of the English pack that stormed to the Grand Slam and World Cup a mere two seasons later. A year’s lay off did him a power of good.
Were McGeechan to calculate that whatever their achievements in the season so far the Irish players just may not have enough left in the tank to shoulder the lion’s (small l) share of the burden then he would be within his rights to leave many of them off. I suspect for example that the likes of Simon Shaw and Danny Cipriani, both of whom are at Wasps, will make the squad, the former for his combination of huge experience and relatively low mileage on the clock this season; and the latter as an unpolished diamond who could shine in the company of the cream of British and Irish rugby.
Regardless, it would seem that Ireland will have a good representation on this tour. But despite the howls of protest that will ensue, I think it should be a maximum of 10 players. The likes of John Hayes, David Wallace and possible even (whisper it) Brian O’Driscoll could do with a rest.
April 17th 2009 @ 11:29pm
Knives Out said | April 17th 2009 @ 11:29pm | Report comment
Dublin Dave, how far can the ‘fatigue theory’ be taken this time? The English players have played under the EPS agreement and the Welsh and Irish (although you would know to what extent) players will have been rested during the ML. How many top tier games have the Celtic players played this season?
April 18th 2009 @ 12:34am
ohtani's jacket said | April 18th 2009 @ 12:34am | Report comment
Pothale, I don’t watch enough European rugby to give you a selection, but I am interested in McGeechan’s tactics for this tour. I have no idea what sort of Lions side will show up or whether the Springboks will be any good, but I imagine they’ll look to smash each other in the forwards and the Boks will play a more traditional style of South African rugby.
We won’t know until the first Test,so I’ll reserve my judgement until then.
April 18th 2009 @ 12:36am
ohtani's jacket said | April 18th 2009 @ 12:36am | Report comment
I assume it’s being played without the free kick sanctions??
April 18th 2009 @ 3:50am
pothale said | April 18th 2009 @ 3:50am | Report comment
Yep. Only S14 and 3 Nations have the derogation on using the free-kick sanctions. It’ll be played under the Global Trial ELVs.
April 18th 2009 @ 4:05am
pothale said | April 18th 2009 @ 4:05am | Report comment
Ps – OJ – give it a go. Am surprised by the supposed lack of knowledge of the squad players from England, Ireland, Wales, Scotland. I’ve seen plenty of commentary on individual NH players by people. Do people reallly know that little about NH rugby and players? – thought people were better informed than that.
Looks like it’ll be a small tipping competition. Even Dublin Dave can’t seem to rouse himself despite an interesting take on what might inform McGeechan’s selection thinking.
April 18th 2009 @ 4:20am
Knives Out said | April 18th 2009 @ 4:20am | Report comment
Pothale, first to criticise, last to watch. Unfortunately the south lives on a staple diet of stereotypes and inflated opinion. Ohtani is willing to admit that his rugby interest/knowledge doesn’t stretch to European rugby. Other roarers are far more contrived.
What will inform McGeechan’s thinking:
i. Personality of potential tourists.
ii. SA’s weakness in the scrummage.
iii. SA’s strength in the air.
iv. What tactics SA will likely employ.
April 18th 2009 @ 5:38am
pothale said | April 18th 2009 @ 5:38am | Report comment
Harumph. Tipping competition over then, I suppose.