I was working from memory & was bound to forget somebody. Yes, perhaps Harper could replace Constantine, but he was also a brilliant fielder & late order hitter. While Sobers would be my one-day spinner.

Hooper is a possibility for 2nd XI in place of Gomez, but again, Gibbs has the role of spinner. However, hooper for Gibbs would give the 2nd XI enormous batting depth.

Vinay, there wouldn’t be much film around of Sobers keeping wicket. priceless indeed!

My alltime Aussie one day cricket XI -

Adam Gichrist (k), Victor Trumper, Don Bradman (c), Ricky Ponting, Mark Waugh, Keith Miller, Mick Bevan, Alan Davidson, Ray Lindwall, Shane Warne, Dennis Lillee/Glenn McGrath (can’t separate!). Head says McGrath, heart says Lillee.+

2nd XI – Billy Murdoch (k), Matt Hayden, Charlie Macartney, Greg Chappell, Neil Harvey, Steve Waugh, Jack Gregory, Monty Noble, Richie Benaud(c), Charles Turner, Dennis Lillee/Glenn McGrath.

Notable omissions – Arthur Morris, Bob Simpson, Clem Hill, Ian Chappell, Stan McCabe, Doug Walters, George Giffin, Ian Healy, Rod Marsh, Hugh Trumble, Tibby Cotter, Jeff Thomson, Simon O’Donnell, Craig McDermott, Bruce Reid, Fred Spofforth.

The Windies are pretty awesome!

Frank Worrell (c), Desmond Haynes, Brian Lara, Everton Weekes, Viv Richards, Gary Sobers, Clyde Walcott (k), Learie Constantine, Malcolm Marshall, Curtley Ambrose, Mike Holding,

2nd XI – Seymour Nurse, Gordon Greenidge, George Headley, Rohan Kanhai, Clive Lloyd (c), Jeff Dujon (k), Gerry Gomez, Andy Roberts, Wes Hall, Joel Garner, Lance Gibbs.

Apologies – Chris Gayle, Conrad Hunte, Jeff Stollmeyer, Shivnarine Chanderpaul, Ollie Smith, Gerry Alexander, Charlie Griffith, Courtney Walsh.

Good choice in Mushtaq Ali and Durani as extras. Yuvraj would not make any of my Test or ODI teams. Like Shane Watson he is talented but under achieves and both are injury prone. Pretty boys with brittle physiques.
Zaheer Khan is more of a Test match bowler and bowls well with the old ball when the reverse kicks in. But not entirely unacceptable.

Just digressing but haven’t the tailenders in the top four teams become all the more proficient now that Mc Grath and Walsh are not around. Even Mortaza from B’desh can bat. Interesting choice of a fast bowler as Captain(announced yesterday)
Chris martin seems the only genuine rabbit remaining.

My ODI Indian XI in bating order:

Mushtaq Ali, Sehwag, Tendulkar, CK Nayudu (capt), Yuvraj, Umrigar, Kapil Dev, Engineer (WK), Nadkarni, Kumble and Zaheer Khan.
12th man: Surti. Extras: Durani, Dhoni, Lala and Mohinder Amarnath.

Kapil and Zaheer to open the attack with Umrigar at first change. Nadkarni and Kumble to do the spinning.

You’ll have to excuse me. I can give you 3 ‘elevens’ for each of the traditional eight cricket nations without much trouble (well, Sri Lanka might bother after the 1st XI & Pakistan after the 2nd XI).

But I’m a dinosaur when it comes to one day cricket. I just don’t care so much about it. And even less for T20.

In batting order: C.K.Nayudu,Tendulkar,Mohinder Amarnath,Sardesai,Russi Surti,Abid Ali,Kapil Dev,Farookh Engineer,Bapu Nadkarni,Ramakant Desai,Kumble. with the 12th Man Polly Umrigar.

CK nayudu was a prolific six hitter and in 1926 against Gilligan’s MCC hit 153 in 116 minutes. He hit 11 sixes and it is not recorded how many balls he faced. I would think about 70. Wisden cricketer of the Year in 1932.
I have good allrounders in Surti,Abid Ali,Kapil Dev and Mohinder Amarnath. All good fielders. Nadkarni was a tight left arm spinner and once bowled 28 maiden overs in a row. I think a world record. He would have been great in Twenty/20.
Desai was only five foot nothing but he had zip and hit the right areas as they say in modern speak.

Over to you Kersi and Sheek. You have to have mobile fielders so no roly poly’s please.

Kersi,

I think we’re a pair of romantics. BTW, when I fist started following cricket (late 60s), my Aussie heroes were Ian Chappell, Doug Walters, Garth McKenzie & Brian Taber. It broke my heart when both Chappell & McKenzie had shockers against South Africa in early 1970.

Mankad running out Brown w/o warning, was way before my time. Yet….. what a very Australian thing to do!!!

Incidentally, Australia since I think 1960s does not accept Queen’s Honours. Else it could have been other bowlers, notably Arise Sir Dennis, Sir Shane, Sir Glenn …

Trumble, Spofforth, Tallon and others would give my 1st XI and your 2nd XI value for money.

How about this 4th XI with Mark Taylor, Hill, Slater, Langer, Mailey, Terror Turner, O’Neill, McKenzie, George Giffen, Noble, Kim and Merv Hughes, Redpath, Mallett, Gleeson (not in batting order)?

I am a fan of modern players but Haydo cannot replace either Trumper or Ponsford in my opinion. Perhaps I am wrong. It was a toss up between Greg Chappell and Ponting but I went for Chappell G. Same between Harvey and Border. On stats Ricky and AB would walk in , especially as AB had to face the most ferocious attack.

It’s hard being a selector!

You’re not a fan of the modern batsmen Hayden & Ponting? I think I would have them in for Ponsford & Harvey. Stats can be deceiving, of course!

Anyway, using your first XI template, the 2nd XI is pretty awesome also -

Matt Hayden, Arthur Morris, Ricky Ponting, Charlie Macartney, Allan Border, Steve Waugh, Ian Healy(k), Richie Benaud(c), Alan Davidson, Clarrie Grimmett, Glenn McGrath.

A 3rd XI?

Bob Simpson, Bill Lawry, Ian Chappell (c), Steve Waugh, Doug Walters, Warwick Armstrong, Jack Gregory, Don Tallon (k), Hugh Trumble, Jeff Thomson, Fred Spofforth.

Gee, it’s tough. Still no place for Hill, Noble, Mailey, Blackham, Turner, etc.

Sheek,
My Best Australian XI based on reputation (in batting order):
Vic Trumper Bill Ponsford, Don Bradman (capt), Greg Chappell, Neil Harvey, Keith Miller, Adam Gilchrist (WK), Ray Lindwall, Shane Warne, Dennis Lillee, Bill O’Reilly. 12th Man: Richie Benaud. Lindwall and Lillee will open the attack with Miller as first change. Warne and O’Reilly will be the spinners. I pity the opposition team!

I regret excluding Clarrie Grimmett, Ian Chappell, Alan Davidson, Ricky Ponting, Arthur Morris, Steve and Mark Waugh, Doug Walters, Glenn McGrath, Jeff Thomson, Matthew Hayden, Bert Oldfield and Rod Marsh.

Like Kersi you have given me yet another perspective on Indian cricket. The first test series I ever saw was the 1967-68 Indian tour of Australian. But I have next to no memory of the black & white TV images. It was another 12 months before I really started to follow cricket!

My father was a big fan of Engineer, he loved the way he played the game. And also Pataudi. I understand your reluctance to choose Azharuddin.

We are as one on Ian Chappell. There may have been better talented batsmen, but few gutsier. It’s interesting that when the Windies toured Australia in 1975-76, at the beginning of the series they put more value on Ian’s wicket than Greg’s. Even though Greg was a 10 points average better batsman.

Anyway, if picking my best Aussie XI of the past 40 years, Chappelli would be my captain, with brother Greg at 4 or 5. Ponting, Border & the Waugh twins can fight all they like for the remaining two middle order batting spots!!! Douggie Walters is my special 12th man.

You obviously haven’t been swayed by the helter-skelter batting of Sehwag. I am a great admirer of merchant, so I might put him back in my Indian XI! I also understand CK Nayudu was a giant of Indian cricket in its formative years. But he was already 35 when India played its first test in 1930.

I had quite forgotten Mohammad Nissar momentarily, & his opening fellow paceman, Amar Singh. Ironic that at its test dawn, India had its two fastest pacemen for a very long time.

I of course saw Viswanath play, Sonny’s brother-in-law. Very gutsy, but his test batting average is a bit low. The great Gary Sobers rated Gupte the best spinner he played, while Ian Chappell said likewise of Prasanna. You made the call on Dhoni, & fair enough.

I thank you for your input. It helps clarify my own thoughts on different players.

Merchant impressed critics with his batting when he toured England in 1936 and 1946, both abnormally wet summers. And pitches were uncovered those days. When England needed an opening partner for Hutton in 1946-47, an English writer sighed, “Wish we could paint Merchant white and take him with us to Australia.” Wisden 1947 commented, “No praise can be too high for Merchant who, on any reckoning must be counted one of the world’s greatest batsmen.”

His 128 in The Oval 1946 Test on a treacherous pitch against Alec Bedser at his best inspired EW Swanton to describe it as “a model of precision, quick sighting and easy accurate footwork.” Neville Cardus called Merchant “India’s good European.” Although his late cuts were elegant, Merchant was never an Eastern cricketer like Ranji and Duleep.

Appointed as India’s captain for the tour of Australia in 1947-48, he pulled out because of groin injury. Bradman said in 1950s, “We were denied the sight of Vijay Merchant, who must have claims to be the greatest of all Indian players.”

Yes Sheek, Merchant will certainly be in my All-time great Indian team. In batting order:

Merchant, Gavaskar, GR Viswanath, Vijay Hazare, Tendulkar, Vinoo Mankad, Kapil Dev, MS Dhoni (capt., wk), Mohammad Nissar, EAS Prasanna and Bishan Bedi. 12th man: Rahul Dravid. Nissar (Test span 1932-36) was the fastest bowler India ever produced. He will open the attack with Kapil, with Hazare coming at first change. Prasanna, Bedi and Mankad will do the spinning.

I regret leaving out CK Nayudu, SP Gupte, BS Chandrasekhar, Amar Singh, Vijay Manjrekar, Md. Azharuddin, Anil Kumble, Syed Kirmani, Farokh Engineer, Virender Sehwag and Polly Umrigar.

As an keen amateur historian, I’ve often wondered how good Vijay Merchant would have been given the opportunities of today’s players. Merchant played only 10 official tests either side of WW2.

Yet he captained India in amy unofficial tests, beginning with the 5 unofficial tests against England in 1937-38. Then he captained India against Australian Services in 1945-46 & India again in several series against the Commonwealth in the late 40s & early 50s.

Perhaps in another time & place, not only would Merchant be a contender for the all-time Indian XI, but also its captain. Fortunately, I don’t hold myself back against such conventions. Until Virender Sehwag came along, I would have had Merchant opening with Sunil Gavaskar. he would also have been my Indian captain.

May I ask you, as perhaps (former/current) Indians, who would be your all-time Indian XI?

My team – Gavaskar, Sehwag, Tendulkar, Hazare(c), Azharuddin, Vinoo Mankad, Kapil Dev, Kirmani (c), Kumble, Srinath, Bedi, Lala Amarnath (12th). I think eventually Mahendra Dhoni will replace Kirmani, but perhaps too early to be certain.

Surely you dont have to be told why batsmen nearly always get all the advantages and why the 50/50 descisions go there way.

To add to Kersi’s compromise, I think a “3 challenge system” similiar to that currently used in tennis could be used. Each bowler gets 3 mankad attempts for their 10 overs (maybe less for 20/20). If they are right, then they keep trying to run batsman out til the cows come home. If they are wrong they only have a certain amount of times they can do it.

But the LBW decision at times is so difficult that it’s more of an interpretation than a decision. Once a batsman nicks the ball which hits the pad, the umpire would have to decide about the angle of deflection due to the nick. However, an experiment in grade cricket should be interesting.

Spiro,

In a light-hearted vein: Hadlee and Botham were knighted because they could also bat (although they were better bowlers). Has a bowler who is a rabbit with the bat, ever been knighted?

As a matter of interest were slow bowlers at all aided by the old lack of a front foot rule.

Was the change of the number of balls in an over from eight to six in Australia seen as
an advantage or disadvantage to the bowler.

How would cricketers fare these days if they played on uncovered pitches ,and would
you see the advantage being with the bowlers or the batsman.

re Mankad its a professional v amature thing.In amature times a batsman caught creeping
over the line would by virtue of inaction by the bowler be shown as not playing in the spirit
of the game,gently humiliated, which is quite unsettling in that the total runs made are due
to the gracious decision of an opponent. WC Feilds would relate very well to todays game,
“never give a sucker an even break”

One rule I would like to see changed is the bat pad rule for an LBW decision.Surely if the
batsman is ‘plum’ ,but has knicked the ball onto his pads that would have uprooted the
middle stump he should be given out.No knick,hits pads ,out LBW.Knick,hits pads ,not out.
Doesn’t make sense.

An old club team-mate of mine (and not so much old as in age, but more that I’ve wished him well in retirement at the end of every season for the past 13) always says “take the pads off ‘em, that’ll even things up.” I often think he’s right, but I wait until I put him back over long-on before I tell him that.

Spiro has it on the spot. A bowler gets 24/60/unlimited opportunities (depending on which form is being played) to take a wicket, but a batsman only has to make one mistake. It’s the same reason why I’m happy to walk when obviously out, but stand my ground when doubt exists: it all evens up in the end. For every time a bowler thinks he could have run out the non-striker, he’s probably been on the fortunate end of a dubious LBW or caught behind.

The only other way to answer your question Kersi is with popular cliche: it’s a funny old game, cricket…

Batsmen are Lions of the Coliseum, bowlers the Christians!

And what Spiro said…..