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July 1st 2009 @ 1:23am
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Socceroos sixteenth in FIFA rankings

The Socceroos are expected to be ranked sixteenth in the latest FIFA world rankings. This will be Australia’s highest FIFA world ranking ever, moving up from 29th.

The super June of World Cup Qualifying football for the Socceroos has added extra excitement to the results achieved by the national team. A draw against Qatar and wins against Bahrain and Japan not only secured top of the group standing but highest ranked team in Asia.

There will be echoes of Lucas Neill’s statement of Australia being a top ten team in the world ringing loudly in some ears around the country.

Australia has benefited greatly from the scheduling of the other Confederations’ World Cup qualifiers. In the month of June, other than the Confederations Cup, there have been few international football games played around the world.

In the same period, Australia played three World Cup Qualifiers, resulting in one draw and two wins, scoring four goals and conceding one in World Cup Qualifiers, thus enabling the national team to secure strong points toward their world ranking and the teams above not securing any at all.

Australia could have been ranked as high as fifteenth if the USA had not made the final of the Confederations Cup. However, with their runners up result, the USA should now be ranked twelfth, which pushes Australia back to sixteenth.

Brazil will be now ranked first, Spain second, Netherlands third, Italy fourth and Germany fifth.

Regardless of the many opinions on the validity of the FIFA world ranking system, based on the rankings of the top 10 teams in Asia, it will make it very difficult for Australia to make the Top 10 in world football.

It is at the least a timely announcement to the rest of the world that Australia is a football nation worthy of hosting a World Cup tournament in 2018 or 2022.

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Midfielder said | July 1st 2009 @ 7:52am | Report comment

It is very good news

Mick of Newie said | July 1st 2009 @ 7:57am | Report comment

I’d rather make the top 16 of the world cup.

Finno said | July 1st 2009 @ 8:50am | Report comment

I would really like to qualify for Asia and get into the finals before we really deserve a top 20 tag. Not taking anything away from our current efforts but im afraid of the lack of depth in the Socceroos squad. If we lost Kewell, Cahill and Neill we are not looking to good at all.

I would really like us to play the USA as they have moved in leaps and bounds and are looking better every year. They will probably reach the top 10 before us. Australia really needs another 6 world class players, 2 forward, 2 mid and 2 defenders. we seem to have a wealth of quality keepers atm.

But I would be pretty happy that we could beat any of the teams 30- 20. But we would struggle to put away any team in the 20. But the end result is playing is Asia was one of the defining moments for the Socceroos. The Kiwis will have to do the same.

1 Spain 1761 0 32
2 Netherlands 1442 1 82
3 Germany 1378 -1 16
4 Italy 1292 1 21
5 Brazil 1288 -1 7
6 England 1225 1 52
7 Argentina 1203 -1 8
8 Croatia 1200 0 49
9 Russia 1167 0 50
10 France 1067 0 -7
11 Portugal 1004 0 -9
12 Turkey 964 2 41
13 Paraguay 961 4 55
14 USA 947 1 28
15 Czech Republic 943 -3 -25
16 Switzerland 931 2 48
17 Greece 922 -4 -5
17 Uruguay 922 -1 13
19 Ukraine 891 3 59
20 Serbia 870 3 51
21 Cameroon 855 -2 -16
22 Scotland 840 2 25
23 Bulgaria 838 -3 -2
24 Denmark 836 5 46
25 Israel 827 -4 -9
26 Mexico 822 -1 19
27 Northern Ireland 820 0 25
28 Romania 790 0 -2
29 Australia

Slippery Jim said | July 1st 2009 @ 9:36am | Report comment

Midfielder, it’s not actually news yet! We still have to wait for the official rankings to be published. I’m not jumping the gun on this one until I see it on the FIFA website.

Captain Random said | July 1st 2009 @ 9:45am | Report comment

Finno -

Good points, but I can’t help thinking that there would be a lot of teams that would struggle if you took away three of their best outfield players. And TBH, most teams need another 6 world class players.

Good call on the US. I’d love to see the Socceroos play them as a point of comparison.

GeneralAshnak said | July 1st 2009 @ 9:59am | Report comment

I really find it hard to pay attention to the FIFA rankings. Still it will be nice to be in the top 20 for a few days, wont be long til we are out of them again. I echo the sentiment that I would prefer to be in the top 16 at the 2010WC.

Roger said | July 1st 2009 @ 12:13pm | Report comment

Great achievement without a doubt.

Without being too pessimistic however, I think this really shows that the FIFA ranking system needs to be reviewed. In recent years, we’ve seen that a country’s FIFA world ranking has almost no predictive value for how a country will fare in a tournament.

How a country can jump to number 16, with only 1 win against 1 real opponent, is beyond me.

Simone` said | July 1st 2009 @ 12:18pm | Report comment

With the players in our squad can’t beleieve we going to b 16th, especially as we only drew with Qatar and beat Bahrain in that Period. As much as i love to see it, i doubt we will be a top 10 country anytime soon.

Al said | July 1st 2009 @ 12:29pm | Report comment

Weren’t the US ranked as high as fourth going into the last World Cup? ‘Nuff said

Pippinu said | July 1st 2009 @ 12:36pm | Report comment

On the one hand, it is hard to believe that we have slipped into the top 16 (when it doesn’t seem all that long ago we were teetering around no. 48 or so).

But on the other hand – looking at the predictive powers (as someone has said), and everyone loves to use the US as an example (who have a knack of beating Mexico time and again), maybe we need to start giving more credit to the FIFA rankings afterall??

Isn’t it fair to say that the US’s last three games in the confed cup were nothing more than what we might expect of a team ranked where they are (and in truth, where they have been for nigh on a decade).

If Australia were to notch up another away win agaisnt a team the calibre of Holland, would we still doubt that we shouldn’t be at no. 16 (or no. 20, or whatever the hell it ends up being)?

MVDave said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:08pm | Report comment

Terrific effort to reach mid teens in FIFA Rankings…blown away the previous best. Could it be that Pim is doing a good job??

BTW The crowd at the MCG for the Japan qualifyer has been revised up by the MCC today from 69,000plus to 74,100 making it 6th highest ever football attendance at the ground…but it was freezing.

dasilva said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:10pm | Report comment

I always believed that Australia are round of 16s contenders for the 2010 world cup. So the rank of 16 isn’t that far fetch or inaccurate.

Seriously we have a good record against Mexico and we have no problems beating them. We outclassed Greece last time we played them. Uruguay and Australia are very much evenly matched sides. Remember the 2006 world cup where the Australian side were complaining that they were robbed of a semi final spot as they believed they can easily brushed aside Ukraine (I remember Lucas Neill saying that they were rubbish). Even the pre-Hiddink Australia team would face off against Scotland very very confident and I remember Australia brushed them aside the last time we played against the Scottish. Northern Ireland? I believe we will be favorites if we played against them

Sides like Switzerland, Cameroon, Serbia, Ukraine, Uruguay, Romania, Greece etc are not a class above Australia and any match between us and them would be evenly match and a good contest. If the rankings have Australia marginally in front of them then I wouldn’t necessary say that’s inaccurate

So why not Top 16. I’m quite sure we are thereabouts that mark anyway.

Janex said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:16pm | Report comment

The FIFA World ranking takes into account several criteria that each has a scoring system. The basic logic of these calculations is simple. Any team that does well in world football wins points and lays the foundations for climbing the world ranking. However, the number of points that can actually be won in a match depends on the following factors:

• All international “A” matches played in the previous four years (48 months). Similar to world tennis rankings, which the player has to protect his results from the year before at relevant tournaments, whereas football is over a four year cycle.

• How important was the match (friendly match, Continental Qualifiers, WC Qualifier to FIFA World Cup match)?

• Was the match won, or did it end in a draw?

• How strong was the opponent in terms of its ranking position? Generally speaking, the biggest winners are the teams who win competitive matches, especially against high ranking opponents.

• Strength of confederation? The strength of a confederation is calculated on the basis of the number of victories by confederation at the last three FIFA World Cup competitions. Consider the ranking of Australia’s opponents’ in the AFC and results of AFC teams in World Cups over the past three years, Australia will not be a FIFA ranked top 10 team, not until there are at least 6 teams from AFC in the top 20 and more AFC teams make knockout stage or more in World Cups to come.

These factors are brought together to ascertain the total number of points and a final ranking position. Hence the great enormity of the Socceroos. The rankings are important in a World Cup year, as the top seven are seeded along with the host country into the eight groups.

dasilva said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:20pm | Report comment

Just adding to my point. I don’t necessarily believe that Australia are necessarily a top 16 and I do find the FIFA rankings to be dubious in terms of specific spots. However I do believe its very much accurate in terms of what group of teams you are.

Netherlands may not be better side then Italy or Germany or Argentina as the FIFA rankings state but they definitely in the top tier nations (top 10).

Australia may not be number 16 in reality but we are definitely in the second to third tier nation (16-24). the rankings do accurate tell you in what tier nations we are currently at. The ranking say that we are not a World Cup contenders but we should always qualify to the world cup and we should always be major contenders to go past the group stages (draw permitting).

Pippinu said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:24pm | Report comment

Wow – is it really 3 years ago since the last WC – what have I been doing with my life??!!

MVDave
that’s an interesting bit of trivia – about the 6th highest football (soccer) attendance at the MCG.

Let’s see if I can guess the top 5 (in no particular order, I really am guessing):

1. the final of the 1956 Olympics?
2. Aust vs Iran, 1997
3. Aust vs France, 2001
4. Aust vs Greece, 2005
5. Aust vs Uruguay, 2001?

Pippinu said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:29pm | Report comment

Das
I agree with the sentiment that the rankings tell us a lot in terms of “groups” of nations (top 10 vs those beyond 100, etc).

There was on small contradiction in what you said, that Australia may not be a top 16 country, but might be in the group of 16 to 24!!

MVDave said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:40pm | Report comment

Pip

from Goal magazine website;

”
AMENDED ATTENDANCE FIGURE: AUSTRALIA V JAPAN AT MCG WAS 74,100
Written by Administrator
The Melbourne Cricket Club (MCC) advises that the official attendance figure for the 2010 FIFA World Cup Asian Group Qualifier between Australia and Japan on June 17 at the Melbourne Cricket Ground (MCG) has been amended. The correct attendance figure for this event is 74,100.

An attendance of 69,238 was published on the night of the match. However, a combination of technical and human error in collating this figure has since been uncovered and the MCC immediately alerted Football Federation Australia once the discrepancy became known.

“While it is regrettable that such an error should occur, we were delighted with the significant attendance at this event,” said Trevor Dohnt, MCC general manager event operations.

The official figure of 74,100 places the match in sixth position on the highest ever MCG attendances for a soccer match.

Highest MCG attendances – Soccer

Attendance Event Date
95,103 Friendly (Australia v Greece) May 25, 2006
93,225 Olympic Games (Australia v Italy) Sep 13, 2000
85,513 World Cup Qualifier (Australia v Iran) Nov 29, 1997
84,656 World Cup Qualifier (Australia v Uruguay) Nov 20, 2001
79,795 Friendly (Australia v Brazil) Nov 17, 1999
74,100 World Cup Qualifier (Australia v Japan) June 17, 2009
71,215 Friendly (Australia v Manchester United) Jul 15, 1999
70,171 Friendly (Australia v Argentina) Sep 11, 2007″

You’re right Pip they have not included the 1956 Olympic Final which was reported to be around 100,000.
The only game from the list l missed was vs Greece.

Koala Bear said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:42pm | Report comment

MVDave,
alas the USA are doing a far better job with two strikers… I’ll take Bradley any day of the week, over Pimbo’s preferred pragmatic style of one striker…

~~~~~~~~
KB

MVDave said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:46pm | Report comment

Come on just a little bit of praise wouldn’t go astray! l’d back Socceroos over USA in a game anyday, as long as we had our 11 best players on the park.

Pippinu said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:51pm | Report comment

MVDave – thanks for providing the answer! So I got one up on the magazine!

Most people probably wouldn’t believe that we had 100,000+ watching the gold medal play off for football in Melbourne in 1956!!!

Pippinu said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:53pm | Report comment

…all 100,000 were probably scratching their heads, turning to the person next to them and saying: I thought you told me we were going to see a football game??!!

MVDave said | July 1st 2009 @ 1:58pm | Report comment

Robbos said | July 1st 2009 @ 2:03pm | Report comment

Pip,
Now even for Melbourians, you would’ve thought the 100,000 would have been worked it out going to a ‘football’ game between USSR v Yugoslavia that something was amiss?????

Pippinu said | July 1st 2009 @ 2:04pm | Report comment

Robbos

you are giving Melburnians far too much credit there!!!!

Robbos said | July 1st 2009 @ 2:09pm | Report comment

Apologises for my poor English in the last note, never mind the Melbourians.

Janex said | July 1st 2009 @ 2:21pm | Report comment

With the exception of Italy, the teams in the top 10 all changed their position. Brazil will grab the headlines of course, as they are the new leaders in the FIFA Ranking. Spain drop to 2nd. Russia up three places to 6th.

Best movers in the top 50:

+20 – Côte d’Ivoire
+19 – Algeria
+16 – Gabon

Worst movers in the top 50:

-16 – Turkey
-12 – Bosnia-Herzegovina
-11 – Sweden

Expected July 2009 rank for top 100

1 Brazil 1672
2 Spain 1590
3 Netherlands
4 Italy
5 Germany
6 Russia
7 England
8 Argentina
9 France
10 Croatia
11 Greece
12 USA
13 Switzerland
14 Serbia
15 Denmark
16 Australia
17 Portugal
18 Côte d’Ivoire
19 Ukraine
20 Uruguay
21 Czech Republic
22 Paraguay
23 Bulgaria
24 Scotland
25 Israel
26 Romania
27 Chile
28 Turkey 80
29 Cameroon
30 Costa Rica
31 Mexico
32 Gabon
33 Northern Ireland
34 Nigeria
35 Ghana
36 Ecuador
37 Honduras
37 Republic of Ireland
39 Egypt
40 Japan
41 Poland
42 Sweden
43 Slovakia
44 Hungary
45 Bosnia-Herzegovina
46 Colombia
47 Algeria
48 Korea Republic
49 Tunisia
50 Venezuela
51 Norway
52 Burkina Faso
53 Finland
54 FYR Macedonia
55 Morocco
56 Latvia
57 Guinea
58 Iran
59 Mali
60 Lithuania
61 Saudi Arabia
62 Slovenia
63 Belgium
64 Bolivia
65 Jamaica
66 Panama
67 Bahrain
68 Austria
68 Wales
70 South Africa
71 Togo
72 Trinidad and Tobago
73 Cyprus
74 Belarus
75 Libya
75 Uganda
77 Zambia
78 Oman
79 Uzbekistan
80 Benin
80 Senegal
82 Mozambique
83 Korea DPR
84 Moldova
85 Cuba
86 Qatar
87 Peru
88 Congo
88 Grenada
90 El Salvador
91 Sudan
92 Canada
93 Iceland
94 Iraq
95 Albania
96 Syria
97 Tanzania
98 Montenegro
99 Gambia
100 New Zealand

Pippinu said | July 1st 2009 @ 2:25pm | Report comment

So Denmark is one spot above Australia – I’m still having nightmares of Denmark giving us a footballing lesson about 18 months ago, and being absolutely terrorised by their wingers and striker(s).

Emo scored a consolation goal from a free – but we were given a hiding that night.

MVDave said | July 1st 2009 @ 2:43pm | Report comment

At this stage only Brazil and Spain are stand outs. l would back the Socceroos (best 11 on the park) to do well against all the others above them. Already beat the 3rd ranked team.

FIsher Price said | July 1st 2009 @ 2:55pm | Report comment

Dasilva: Neill is the Warne of football – has an opinion on everything, humility ain’t one of his strong suits.

MVDave: Netherlands was a friendly, so calm down.

Slippery Jim said | July 1st 2009 @ 6:33pm | Report comment

http://www.fifa.com/worldfootball/ranking/lastranking/gender=m/fullranking.html

Our ranking is now confirmed at 16!!! We are now officially better than Portugal according to the FIFA rankings.

Japan dropped nine spots to 40 *chortle*

Well done Janex, your list is spot on.

Edgar said | July 1st 2009 @ 6:47pm | Report comment

Hey, top job – taking data from my blog (football-rankings.info) and forgetting to mention the source! Again, keep up the good work!

Peter said | July 2nd 2009 @ 12:34am | Report comment

I think all this proves is how flawed the FIFA ranking system is – two wins against lower ranked sides and a draw against a very low ranked side do not 16 places make (if that makes sense). It looks like the calculation needs give greater weight to who we beat rather than how often we win. We would not have a chance against a full strength Portugal or Denmark, hell we still struggle against Japan!

Mr said | July 2nd 2009 @ 1:07am | Report comment

Peter, it is a 4 year cycle. The matches we played in second half of 2005 (July 1 release now excludes the 3 losses in the Confed Cup under Farina) give us a higher weighting overall – it’s not purely the June matches.

We should be able to maintain the No. 1 Asian spot for some time as Japan have an slightly worse record than Australia between 2006 and 2007. I’m very surpirsed that South Korea did not reach higher in this round of rankings.

David V. said | July 2nd 2009 @ 1:21am | Report comment

What about a rankings system based purely on competitive results? If we used the Asian WC qualifiers, which have been an accurate reflection of team quality, Australia would be top anyway followed by Japan.

Greg Russell said | July 2nd 2009 @ 4:07pm | Report comment

Does anyone know if any AFC team has ever been as high as 16 in the rankings? (Japan? South Korea after the 2002 WC?)

Whatever, one should not underestimate the importance of this ranking rise in terms of AFC politics. Those in the AFC who are uncertain about whether Australia belongs in the AFC will be very happy to have an “Asian” team this high in the world rankings, because it will enable them to puff out their chests a bit more at the FIFA table.

In short, this ranking helps Australia to solidify its position in the AFC with the powerbrokers of the Confederation.

Towser said | July 2nd 2009 @ 4:12pm | Report comment

Greg

Here you are:-

http://www.thebesteleven.com/2008/11/asia-all-time-highest-fifa-ranking-list.html

Hammer said | July 2nd 2009 @ 4:16pm | Report comment

Japan got in the top 10 in the late 1990’s …

Pippinu said | July 2nd 2009 @ 4:26pm | Report comment

I think that’s right Greg.

Your average AFC delegate is hoping for an increase of 4.5 spots some day down the track (a certainty at some stage in the future I would suggest) – having a team in the top 16 and a few others top 32 on a semi-permanent basis would not do any harm at all.

Those delegates with a bit of vision will understand that.

Those delegates only concerned about their own country getting in might remain pissed off regardless.

Towser said | July 2nd 2009 @ 4:30pm | Report comment

As an aside to this,have just been discussing on the “Dutch” article with Pippinu that despite the deficiencies of football pre Lowy Australia still produced players good enough to play in the EPL,Serie A etc. Given now the greater belief, better admin leading to better coaching uniformly throughout the country in reality we can do better. If these players Kewell ,Viduka Neill,Emerton,Grella, Bresciano,Chippers etc were produced in the NSL era given the superior professional enviroment kids going through system in future will be exposed, to we should go to another level. Bit of a time lapse at the moment but that will pass.

Pippinu said | July 2nd 2009 @ 4:56pm | Report comment

That’s the $64 million dollar question (the bare minimum we are probably talking about!)

You look through those names (and there are a few more you can probably add), and it does make for sobering reading.

I’m starting to sound like a broken record – but that 22 to 28 year bracked have absolutely gone missing.

A couple of points:
1. it’s a tough, competitive world – our future football millionaires may become as scarce as grand slam tennis champs – for no other reason than more and more from across the globe have the exact same idea as we do.

2. As the EPL becomes the elite of the elite comps (and the evidence is that that’s precisely what’s happening) – openings for aussies will become less and less (like aussies reaching the semis of grand slam events); but

3. that aussies aren’t making it to the EPL any more (in the future) because of additional competition, may not necessarily mean a worsening of the standard of the NT, if, for example, the bulk of the NT is scattered across the 2nd to 10th best leagues in the world (Serie A, Bundesliga, Eredivisie, Russian, Turkish and Greek leagues, etc), and most importantly, are key members of those teams.

Pippinu said | July 2nd 2009 @ 4:58pm | Report comment

…it may one day become a question of fantastic depth, but very few mega-stars (and maybe a Kewell and Cahill only come along once a decade)

Midfielder said | July 2nd 2009 @ 5:42pm | Report comment

Kwell & Bozza at there peak have been regarded in the worlds to five in their position.. One of the sad things about old soccer was it’s inability to communicate what often was the sports story of the year..

We may never again get another Harry Kwell, he was when at Leeds considered by most along with Giggs & Carlos as one of the top five left sided players in the world… for however good Tim Cahill Dukes are they where and will never be considered among the best five in the world in there positions. .. only those glimpses of Ray Bartz on old footage approach Kwell’s magic.

Towser said | July 2nd 2009 @ 6:07pm | Report comment

Remember Tim Cahill was not on the “Star footballer” radar a few years ago at Millwall(have you ever seen the Den & where it is no wonder) . So players can develop later in their career & do what Tim has done. Whos to say Nathan Burns or Dario Vidosic will not hit thgeir straps till 25 or so. A professional enviroment can improve players no end. Pim tells us so. Speaking of Tim:-

http://au.fourfourtwo.com/news/106766,new-telly-deal-for-tim-cahill.aspx

Michael C said | July 2nd 2009 @ 9:00pm | Report comment

Greg Russell -

is there not a danger in the AFC that Australia being ‘that high’ won’t be considered a fair dinkum ‘Asian’ team. Is it perhaps possible that there might be some resentment??

Pippinu said | July 3rd 2009 @ 8:55am | Report comment

the question of resentment is best understood in terms of the motivation of whatever individual we are talking about.

An AFC “visionary”, with an eye to the future (i.e. more spots for Asia), will see it as a plus (Aust being 16th and staying there).

Someone else who is only there because they’re the son of an oil sheik, and are more worried about their own tin pot country missing out time after time, may well get resentful.

Of course, the balance between the two camps in terms of power are quite finely balanced at this point.

Jameswm said | July 3rd 2009 @ 9:06am | Report comment

Only the top 21 really look strong.

You’d expect the top 16 at the WC to come from them, but you never know what group you’ll end up in and there are always surprises.

I hate to harp back but that penalty against Italy really galls. We were running all over them at the end and the quarter final game was softish. We’d have been favourites to make the semis.

Anyway – got to do it this time around. As primarily a rugby fan, I struggle a bit with the lottery of soccer results.