if that was the case, then it does explain the ARU’s silence on the matter, they have said they have kept quiet because of lote’s interests.

The only ones who are going to benefit from this are Lote’s SC and instructing solicitor, I cant see JON doing something reckless without knowing its a sure thing.

Two lines have opened up here. One is frought because we don’t know what Lote is supposed to have done, but we’re getting the picture of an OK sort of guy who talks to kids and puts in at training despite having missed out on team selection.

The other relates to what we expect of sportsmen.

I watch Rugby because I played Rugby and my kids play/ed rugby. I think Rugby is a life lesson. It demands commitment to the team and the coach.

People on your side of the ledger say if you get paid heaps then you have to obey the rules. Generally I think that’s got merits but who decides?

The last people you should give that right to are those in the media.

Generally in sporting teams it’s the coach first because he’s the judge of what effects the team.

If a player is judged to have brought discredit on the game, then the executive have a duty to intervene. BUT………………..

when the media starts finding dirt for their gossip sheets that in more respectful times would not have made it into print, do you dump your players for fear of your sponsors reaction or do you stand up for them like a family would?

Rugby is a game, and a great game, and I don’t want the players treating it as a job. I want them first and foremost playing for their team, their club, their state, & their country . The higher up the ladder the more I expect, but these guys are not teachers, Nird99, or business reps or politicians ……….they play body contact sport. They have short careers often punctuated by injury. some suffer later in life.

Most sane people are happy to see them as examples by their all out effort on the field and their sportsmanship in accepting the refs decision (usually) and shaking hands at the games end.

If you’re one of the people who read the gossip rags and fall for the bullshit expectations they create then I doubt you are or were a sportsman. Testosterone and physical contest are a potent mix and many a reputation suffers when, in letting off steam, you add alcohol.

It doesn’t mean you let them off. But you don’t fire them if you have other punishments available. And you don’t throw them to the wolves.

That is a very good story about Lote at the rugby camp. Good on him.

Is he playing for West Harbour this weekend?

Not a real difficult template to follow is it ?

I am a teacher and it does not matter if I am at school, at the shops or at the pub I am always a teacher. I need to conduct myself in such a way that befits the position I have been given. Like it or not I am known by literally hundreds (maybe thousands) of people know me in my local area and I cannot get away with any conduct that is poor, and would likely be sacked if I brought the school or the department into disrepute.

Kevin Rudd is the Prime Minister and not matter where he is he is the prime minister, like it or not and he also needs to conduct himself in a way that befits the position he has been given.

Any sports star is paid the money they are paid because of the public interest in them. Whether it is Lote or a Super 14 player of no real name, if they break the contract they need to be held accountible. They need not to be held to any different levels of scrutiny to any other person that holds (whether they like it or not) a position of responsibility, but they should also not be given free rein to do what they like when they like.

I am not commenting on the Lote incident specifically because i do not know the circumstances. The amount of speculation about what has happened and the amount of people taking sides with the either the ARU or Lote is alarming. We dont know what happened and we should hold our views on the issues until we know the actual issues!!!!!

You make a good response to people like myself and make me realise perhaps I’m being a bit finicky about the breach of contract. We’re beset with flawed heroes in this country, aren’t we – from the Johns brothers, Warnie, etc. – and I guess that’s your point – everybody is human. I guess it depends on what he’s done. If it’s just a foodfight, I’ll flip around and side with all those calling foul on the ARU.

PS. Did the fact that you were agreeing with Campo make you shudder a little bit? Always does with me.

If your childs music teacher was a drug fiend would that bother you?

Take another look at the paper. It is full of sex, drugs and drink – who did it, what they did then, who got hurt etc. I guess folk hope for better from their heroes, and the entertainment business tries to give it to them and the media feel compelled to make a story of every time they fail.

As to the contract (and contracts in general), they are not indentured slavery agreements or bills of sale – they are agreements withing defined bounds as outlined. If an employee breaks a condition of the contract, the employer can sack him. What neither party can do is just break the contract without cause (as in the SBW case) without penalty, so I guess Lote will have to demonstrate that the ARU had no cause.

Why are they the ones who get on the front pages when sex, drugs and drink are involved?

The only reason is profile.

If it was Adam Ashley-Cooper who got got drunk on a night out bugger all people would recognise who he is and there would be no issue for him to deal with. Because it is Lote everyone knows who it is, so any misdemeanor is bought to the wider publics attention.

Why is sport held up to this high standard? Plenty of people see artists, actors, and musicians as role models, yet anything they do in regards to sex drugs and drink is seen to fuel their artistic endevours and deemed as acceptable.

Great musicians like Nick Cave have had long term drug addictions and no one has said we should ban buying his records, Do people really think rock & roll bands have not participated in group sex with their groupies? No one has said ban the Rolling Stones, nor torn up their recording contracts.

Why do we expect so much more from our athletes?

Jameswm – you ignore the overt bragging of the Rugby fraternity that the ‘game’ snatched SBW and will get League’s finest. Peter Fitzsomons does it on a regular basis, as do many bloggers here. There is no demarcation between Rugby and the ARU by Rugby’s own fans.

If I was away on a work conference and bill showed up at work for an extra cleaning bill that resulted from a food fight…. i’d be in some trouble. And rightly so! And if was at that same conference and my boss was there, and he saw drunk and out of line at the evening function… i’d be in some trouble.

Some of this stuff is basic workplace behaviour. Rugby is no longer an amateur sport where guys give up there personal time to participate. If you’re paid by the piper, you dance to his tune!

Lets face it. Lote is too ashamed of his breach to make it public. Enough said I reckon.

However, you can’t generalise in relation to an entire sport. On the one hand you are talking about Toulon rugby, and on the other the ARU. They are oceans apart.

Virgil – I love how you sit there lecturing us all when you don’t actually know what happened. And assuming the ARU used a loophole to get rid of an employee – normally they say people judge others by their own standards.

The media, like most things, respond to supply and demand. The reason the media focus on reporting something is because they know people want to know it. If a media organisation is producing news no-one cares about, it will go out of business.

If anyone (besides Lote and the ARU) is responsible for Lote being sacked (and for the general desire that sportspeople be holier than the rest of us), it’s not the media for reporting various stories, it is the people who love to read these stories… BUT I’m NOT having a go at the majority of the public who like to read these things. People are entitled to their opinions. I know the media can shape opinions as well as reflect them but it seems the majority would prefer our sportsmen not to be gangbanging, involved in assaults, boozing to the point of interfering with training or even getting involved in foodfights. So I guess the majority are “mums”, “choir boys and violin players”.

I’m well aware that things have not always been as they are. That in ages gone by players could get up to all sorts of things and no-one was the wiser. And sometimes journalists WERE aware of incidents and didn’t report them (for various reasons). But society has moved on from these times. We are now dominated by (in your words) “mums”, “choir boys and violin players”. The codes of conduct do NOT appear ridiculous to these people. And this majority rules.

I do NOT feel sorry for the players having to comply with the current codes of conduct. The players these days get paid a LOT more than they did in the by-gone era I mentioned. They are incredibly well paid relative to the rest of society but with the pay packet comes some conditions that the rest of society may not be subject to.

So I respect what Lote has done for Australian rugby. I have no personal animosity towards him at all and I wish him all the best. But if he has breached conditions imposed upon him and repeatedly infringed and has to earn perhaps a slightly lesser fortune in League or elsewhere, I’m not going to shed too many tears.

there has been no mention of alcohol or any other misbehaviour as the reason for Lote’s sacking – it may be best to wait and see what happens.

it is not fair to use SBW’s situation as an analogy in this situation, it was in a foreign country with a differant set of laws for contracts. In SBW’s situation, rugby did not “willfully disregard” contractual terms, it was the player himself.

In any event, JON is a lawyer himself, and Im pretty sure that the ARU has a pretty strong case to do what it did, the reason why it hasnt announced the reason for sacking him may be in Lote’s best interests???

What did Rogers’ issue with player behaviour? From what I can see there was something in 2004, but hardly something he had ‘difficulty’ with

He was given a pretty clear warning back in 2007 about standards of player behaviour and ARU requirements. That was something that both Sailor and Rogers had difficulty with. No matter what code you support. Grog will continue to kill careers.