A new view on a Second Division in the A-league
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By jaymz, 12 Aug 2009 jaymz is a Roar Rookie
- Tagged:
- A-League, football, Second division, Socceroos, State League
I propose to amalgamate State League teams that are strong and financially viable, and in a close proximity together, and rebrand them. So for example, in Sydney you could amalgamate Marconi, Sydney United and Bankstown City Lions.
They would then be rebranded “South West United,” with new colours obviously, and there would be a large pool of quality players to build a team from (alongside a few key signings).
Combining the support from the three clubs would also enable a solid supporter base to build, as well as sponsorship deals and funding already in place in each club. So you get all the resources from the three clubs put into this one kind of “super club.”
There would always be players ready and available and the team would have three Academies for youth players (or amalgamated into one giant academy).
This is the best way to bring “Old Soccer” and “New Football” together, as well as fast-tracking the second division.
I know the rebranding is not automatically going to shed the “ethnic” vibe, but because the clubs have been amalgamated, it brings the different groups of fans together. And with some positive promotional campaigns involving the community, they really can become teams based on demography and not ethnicity.
You could get two teams each from Victoria and NSW, one from South Australia, and one from Queensland. Then the final two spots could be made up from teams who were unsuccessful in bidding for an A-league licence.
This could be implemented within five to seven years.
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Pippinu said | August 12th 2009 @ 8:11am | Report comment
I’m very much in favour of bringing the old clubs back into the fold by allowing them to bid for spots in any future 2nd tier (let bygones be bygones – we’ve all moved on now).
But – we’ve seen in the AFL and NRL that amalgamated clubs are a very, very tough proposition – not impossible – but so much emotion is attached to the concept, and almost invariably, one set of fans feels aggrieved at having given up too much.
It’s especially difficult if it’s imposed from above (or if there’s a perception that it has been imposed from above).
But of course, if it’s not imposed from above – how does it come about of its own volition?
Very, very difficult proposition.
md said | August 12th 2009 @ 8:39am | Report comment
I’m on the opposite side of the coin: I don’t see any benefit at all in rebadging merged NSL teams for inclusion in the A-league. If NSL teams wish to merge to form a single entity to bid for an A-league licence when one becomes available then, fair enough – however they should be assessed on merit along with all the other bidders for that licence. On current indications, there are no shortage of bidders for licences in Sydney or Melbourne. Even with 2 tiers, I cannot see the A-league allowing more than 3 teams for either city – otherwise the A-league once again collapses to become the NSL.
Cheers
md
Pippinu said | August 12th 2009 @ 10:01am | Report comment
md
clearly, any “old” clubs would have to compete in a bidding process against “new” clubs – that goes without saying – but I would hope that it would be a fair process, unlike the current situation, where, for example, anything remotely connected with Hellas, is immediately dismissed from the bidding process (not directly, but you and I know they have effectively been put at the bottom of the pile with barely a look).
But let us assume down the track that we do have something along the lines of the 14/8 two tiered comp we were talking about yesterday – surely, by then, we could allow clubs to progress to the 2nd tier from the state leagues (on a merit basis) – even if those clubs had CEOs who appeared to have woggy names (like yours and mine).
md said | August 12th 2009 @ 11:46am | Report comment
Hang-on – one of the KPI’s going back to the Crawford report has been the de-ethnicisation. That is still key to football having any sort of mainstream future in this country. Any bid that starts with an old ethnic club necessarily starts behind the 8-ball because they have to positively prove that they have achieved de-ethnicisation. That’s life I’m afraid.
(and yes yes, Qld Roar, but Qld Lions exported their ethnicity about as much as Queensland exports polar-bears – which cannot be said for the Olympics, Marconi’s, United’s, Croatia’s etc…).
Pippinu said | August 12th 2009 @ 11:54am | Report comment
md
1. the one example you have raised leads to charges of inconsistency and worse (racism); and
2. there must come a point, and I reckon we are almost there, where the so-called “ethnic” clubs, run by 4th generation Australians, are about as ethnic as the Oranje.
I have already mentioned being a member of Inter-Monaro back around 1985-86, ostensibly an ITalian club, but I barely would have heard a word of Italian spoken in all the time I spent in and around the club. I reckon there might have been one player with an Italian name on the roster.
That’s 24 years ago – and a club like Hellas is going to be pretty much the same today.
md said | August 12th 2009 @ 12:41pm | Report comment
No – the club I mentioned was just able to prove to FFA that they achieved de-ethnicisation, because frankly they were a de-ethnicised club. There were never any dutch ultras waving dutch flags and chanting abuse in dutch, even at the height of the NSL. Therefore, from the point of having to demonstrate to the FFA that there was no chance of ethnic ultra groups of inter-ethnic violence, they could do it easily. Inter-Monaro may well be in the same position – don’t really know. There is no way that you can say that about the other clubs I mentioned; their old ultra groups would re-form within seconds of being granted an A-league licence.
thinker said | August 12th 2009 @ 10:04am | Report comment
A joke of comp called the ARC would like to have a word with you, but can’t it’s dead
AndrewM said | August 12th 2009 @ 10:09am | Report comment
The problem with rebranding is that it is still the same club with ethnic ties, just a different name. If someday in the future there was a promotion relegation system then these teams would be promoted.. You will then see violence come back and we would be back to square one.
Unfortunately the proper way to go about things is to create new teams with no history what so ever. Just create teams in regional areas which are too small to have a vialbe HAL team.. So Coffs harbour, northern territory , sunshine coast etc etc.. This would be well supported by the locals as they currently do not have any teams as far as I know.
jaymz said | August 12th 2009 @ 1:02pm | Report comment
But because a few clubs have been merged, the ethnic ties go out the window because if an italian club merges with a croation club and greek club, where is the ethnic tie? What country would it represent? Alongside the rebranding and community engagement it could squash the issue or make it irrelevant
Pippinu said | August 12th 2009 @ 10:15am | Report comment
YOu don’t need ethnic clubs for violence – you just need Melbourne and Sydney fans to congregate in the one place!!
Davos said | August 12th 2009 @ 1:51pm | Report comment
agree
AndrewM said | August 12th 2009 @ 10:23am | Report comment
Pip clearly you do not remember the past.. The violence between sydney and melbourne fans is NOTHING compared to the old days where people were literally trying to kill each other.. Serbs vs croats etc.
Sydney vs Melbourne is nothing more than state of origin hate.
Pippinu said | August 12th 2009 @ 10:27am | Report comment
Was it that bad??
Brian said | August 12th 2009 @ 11:13am | Report comment
Would any of these second tier comps be any better than the NSWPL and VPL. I’d prefer the FFA put their money towards the HAL, I would like to know why HAL players are paid half of that of AFL & NRL players and yet ticket prices are the same?
Robbo said | August 13th 2009 @ 9:46am | Report comment
Ticket prices may well be the same – but the AFL/NRL sell a hell of a lot more of them.
Pippinu said | August 12th 2009 @ 11:50am | Report comment
Brian
the yellow brick road leads back to TV rights!!
Brian said | August 12th 2009 @ 1:39pm | Report comment
yes but while we wait for the next TV rights in 2013 or whenever the AFL get bums on seats and uses the stats to negotiate an even better TV rights deal in 2012. On current crowds how can we talk about a second tier? Regionals are great but Palmer funded GC aside their capacity is limited. First lets get Sydney, Brisbane & Perth to the level of MV. Yes there are 150,000 people in Albury or Sunshine Coast or whatever but what about the 4m who aren’t turning up in Sydney every week.
Killer_Tomatoes said | August 12th 2009 @ 12:15pm | Report comment
Good luck with this. I propose we merge Altona, Melbourne Knights and Sunshine, then merge Heidelberg, South Melbourne and Preston and while we’re at it why not also merge Sydney United and Bonyrigg. We could also merge Dandenong and Springvale. Not that any supporters would actually turn up, but if they did it would be worth it just to see a teams own fans beat the crap out of eachother on a weekly basis Paris St Germain style.
This article shows absolutely no understanding of the old NSL clubs. Can only assume the writer has had no interest in local football pre-A-League.
Pippinu said | August 12th 2009 @ 1:13pm | Report comment
Cruel, but fair.
jaymz said | August 12th 2009 @ 1:31pm | Report comment
i realise that merging certain teams would obviously cause crowd violence between the teams own fans, which is why the teams and FFA have to use a little common sense on the issue.. Also because there will be only a max 2 from each state it minimises the chance of local fans going head to head at each other
Pippinu said | August 12th 2009 @ 1:41pm | Report comment
Jay
as I said in my very first post above – even at the best if times, in the very best case scenarios, mergers are an incredibly emotional subject – that’s before we even throw in the baggage of another era.
Having said that – I would like to see “older” clubs vying for future licenses, especially if a 2nd division ever comes along – indeed – I suspect the only way we could ever have a viable 2nd tier is if some state league clubs move up to that level.