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October 25th 2009 @ 6:59am
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White adds to England’s front-row woes
Leicester’s Julian White became the latest England frontrower to be ruled out of next month’s Tests at Twickenham after tearing a hamstring in Saturday’s 18-12 Rugby Premiership loss away to London Irish.
After a match watched by England manager Martin Johnson, the 2003 World Cup winning captain, Leicester rugby director Richard Cockerill said: “Julian has torn [...]
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LeftArmSpinner said | October 25th 2009 @ 1:08pm | Report comment
Geez, the things that a podgy old pommie prop will do to avoid the elsom led Wallabies pack!!!! Bring it on!!!!!!!! or we could trade a prop or two for a few locks that are over 6ft.
Rugby Fan said | October 25th 2009 @ 5:18pm | Report comment
Another sign of how times have changed since 2003 when England were spoilt for choice of competent props and were obliged to leave Rowntree out of the World Cup squad.
Knives Out said | October 25th 2009 @ 8:32pm | Report comment
How many props do you need to have? England has lost 4 test Lions in the front row and two of the young EPS replacements.
Rugby Fan said | October 26th 2009 @ 3:04am | Report comment
I think it’s fair to say that top level props are a bit thin on the ground for all the home nations compared with other positions.
For England in particular, Leonard, Woodman, Vickery, Rowntree and White were all available in 2003 and the lesser pairing from that group wasn’t notably worse than the best. Certainly England have been unlucky with injuries and that’s just the rub of the green. However, even with everyone fit today, it’s hard to see any group of five from Vickery, White, Sheridan, Payne, Bell, Flatman and Wilson offering that degree of consistency. Arguably, the bigger effect for the autumn internationals might be in the line-outs where the lifting skills of the props are more important these days. At least the agreement with the clubs on the release of players will mean the props and locks will have a decent chance to train with each other beforehand.
I saw one report indicating that Bath might be in trouble if their props are called up for England duty because the squad currently has little back-up. Steve Meehan has said:
“If we lose Wilson and Bell for next week (at home to Saracens) and potentially each week into November then we need to look at our resources and what we can do,” Meehan added. “Will we be able to take the field, knowing the health and safety issues and that we have a duty of care? The next tighthead is a 17 or 18-year-old, Kane Newport, and we can’t do that at all. That’s a question for the PRL (Premier League Rugby).”
Knives Out said | October 26th 2009 @ 3:47am | Report comment
I thought that about Bath the other day. I had a sneaking suspicion that Jon Golding might have been called up with Payne covering the 3rd 3 spot, but now another 3 is necessary. I think that White’s absence will be a huge blow. The injury list is just getting laughable. In broader terms England lost another Saxons tighthead (John Brooks) to long-term injury at the end of last season. I wonder if Pat Barnad is being cosidered? Although I did notice Healy giving him a tough time last week.
Good point about the lineout.
Parisien said | October 26th 2009 @ 12:47am | Report comment
The more I hear of injured English players, the more I get nervous about England causing an upset. There is nothing like a team being written off in advance to bring out the best in them. Hopefully its also true for the Wallabies!
bob said | October 26th 2009 @ 9:41am | Report comment
I hear that Duncan Bell has been called up. This is very good news. He’s past his prime at 35, but has always been and is still, one of the worlds greatest scrummaging tightheads. A real cave troll! I have a sneaking suspicion that Parisien has hit the nail on the head… beware wounded the English.
Tricky Trindall said | October 26th 2009 @ 6:58pm | Report comment
The Poms will pull out a No 3 to fix their injury problems. While whoever get’s the jersey will be able to hold up a scrum, their real concern is finding a front rower who can also carry the ball.
Vickery is a terrific prop, but he has never been a great ball carrier. White is the same – I don’t think I have ever seen him carry the ball.
It has been a long road for the Aussie front row, but now we are looking like having a decent first-class front row. Robinson, TPN and Alexander can all scrummage and get around the park with the ball in hand.
How the tables have turned…
Colin N said | October 27th 2009 @ 1:53am | Report comment
“Vickery is a terrific prop, but he has never been a great ball carrier.”
Actually it’s the other way round, he’s always been an erratic scrummager, his carrying game and ability to get round the park is his biggest facet.
You’re right about White though.
Ian Noble said | October 27th 2009 @ 1:32am | Report comment
I read somewhere that 9 of the top English props are out of action and the injury list across the park is concerning and has raised alot of debate about the physicality of rugby in the professional era. The only man standing is bionic Wilko.
Knives Out said | October 27th 2009 @ 2:10am | Report comment
I think it’s just a coincidence, Ian. Only England and NZ have really suffered with injuries this year. Hopefully it’s just one of those things.
pothale said | October 27th 2009 @ 1:50am | Report comment
Corbisiero has gone missing in action as well.
Was just thinking maybe this could be the first test where uncontested scrums are enforced before the kick-off whistle. It’s all part of Johnson’s master plan prior to the World Cup.
No scrums just lineouts. More mobile forwards selected since presumably anyone could pack down at the front.
This could be the start of a new development in rugby – led by the Northern Hemisphere. Wow! What innovation will England come up with next?
Ian Noble said | October 27th 2009 @ 2:11am | Report comment
Corbisiero may be back next as Quins are due to play London Irish., but is he too inexperienced for internationals?
I think Johnson will announce the revised squad today, probably the case of last man standing.
Knives Out said | October 27th 2009 @ 2:14am | Report comment
How experienced is Wilson? Not greatly, although it was interesting to see Steve Meehan suggest that his absence had impacted upon Bath. Depending upon who he selects playing Corbisiero as an injury sub could be exciting. It is unfrotunate that test games don’t abide by the 3 front row subs rule.
Rugby Fan said | October 27th 2009 @ 2:55am | Report comment
England squad:
Forwards:
Steffon Armitage (London Irish), David Barnes (Bath Rugby), Duncan Bell (Bath Rugby), Richard Blaze (Leicester Tigers), Steve Borthwick (Saracens, captain), George Chuter (Leicester Tigers), Jordan Crane (Leicester Tigers), Tom Croft (Leicester Tigers), Louis Deacon (Leicester Tigers), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints), James Haskell (Stade Francais), Ben Kay (Leicester Tigers), Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints), Lewis Moody (Leicester Tigers), Tim Payne (London Wasps), Steve Thompson (CA Brive), David Wilson (Bath Rugby), Joe Worsley (London Wasps)
Backs:
Matt Banahan (Bath Rugby), Danny Care (Harlequins), Mark Cueto (Sale Sharks), Ben Foden (Northampton Saints), Shane Geraghty (Northampton Saints), Andy Goode (CA Brive), Dan Hipkiss (Leicester Tigers), Paul Hodgson (London Irish), Ugo Monye (Harlequins), David Strettle (Harlequins), Mathew Tait (Sale Sharks), Mike Tindall (Gloucester Rugby), Richard Wigglesworth (Sale Sharks), Jonny Wilkinson (Toulon)
Ian Noble said | October 27th 2009 @ 3:16am | Report comment
Steve Meehan of Bath will not be a happy man, he has no props left. I would like to see Lawes get a game in the second row has he has come on since last years U20 RWC. As for the backs, Strettle has been playing well for Quins although Moyne has been on fire. We shall see what about a back line of
Care, Wilko, Moyne, Geraghty, Hipkiss, Strettle and Foden, probably too experimental for Johnson, but they would be exciting in open play and probably will go down with all guns blazing.
Knives Out said | October 27th 2009 @ 3:24am | Report comment
He has David Flatman left. Some horrible selections from Johnson.
Ian Noble said | October 27th 2009 @ 3:39am | Report comment
KO
Makes the scrum very lopsided! Anyway I am off to see Quins A v Bath A both teams full of exciting academy players; wonder if Meehan will be there.
Knives Out said | October 27th 2009 @ 3:54am | Report comment
True. Have a good night.