By Darren Walton
November 6th 2009 @ 1:40am
Related coverage
Deans selects untried centre pairing for England clash
Australian rugby union backs Quade Cooper, Adam Ashley-Cooper, James O'Connor, Matt Giteau and Drew Mitchell remove the tape they used to prepare themselves to take on the forwards during a practice session in Sydney on Thursday, July 23, 2009. The Wallabies next match will be against South Africa in Cape Town on August 8. AAP Image/Paul Miller
Robbie Deans has made the most radical selection change of his 25-Test reign as Wallabies coach, naming a brand new centre pairing for Saturday’s Twickenham showdown with England.
Deans and fellow selectors Jim Williams and David Nucifora have opted to play the dynamic Digby Ioane at outside centre, with Quade Cooper inside him after starring in the Wallabies’s 36-5 victory over Gloucester on Tuesday night.
Ioane and Cooper have teamed in the midfield for Queensland in the Super 14 this season, but never before at Test level.
All up, the Wallabies have made three changes to the starting side from last Saturday’s 32-19 Bledisloe Cup loss to the All Blacks in Tokyo, with champion flanker George Smith recalled to the back row and David Pocock relegated to the bench.
Drew Mitchell replaces Ioane on the wing, Adam Ashley-Cooper moves from the centres to fullback in place of teenager James O’Connor, who drops to the bench, as does Ryan Cross despite his strong game at outside centre against Gloucester.
Wallabies skipper Rocky Elsom says losing to depleted England doesn’t bear thinking about as Australian rugby’s international credibility goes on the line at Twickenham.
Never mind the grand slam sweep, the Wallabies are under extraordinary pressure to deliver merely on the first leg after a dire run of six defeats from their past seven Tests.
For one reason or another, the Wallabies are the most maligned national sporting team in Australia and Elsom needs no reminding that success-starved fans simply won’t cop another second-best result – especially against a hopelessly weak England outfit.
“I certainly wouldn’t like the idea of us losing on the weekend,” Elsom said.
“Yeah, it’s a massive, massive game for us.”
Only the most fair-minded neutral acknowledges the fact that the Wallabies are the lone national side on the planet to have conquered the world champion Springboks in 2009 and that all six of Australia’s defeats this season have come at the hand’s of the top two ranked sides in the game.
Elsom, though, accepts that perception is reality and the reality is the Wallabies will be the laughing stock of world rugby if they are unable to kick off their grand slam quest with a commanding victory over an England outfit relying on Jonny Wilkinson and little else.
As it is, the British and Irish already consider it preposterous that the Wallabies are even entertaining the idea of upstaging the four home nations on successive weekends this month.
The truth is, the Wallabies publicly harbour no such grandiose expectations and Elsom, never one to pull punches, says his under-achieving side will be happy enough just to restore some order and confidence with success over the seventh-ranked English.
“It’s pretty big for us. We were absolutely stinging for a win last weekend and that didn’t come,” Elsom said, conceding the Wallabies succumbed to all-too-familiar failings in last Saturday’s 32-19 loss to the All Blacks in Tokyo.
“Coming into the game there was probably a little bit of anxiety around the fact that we hadn’t been able to notch one up against them (this year) but, really, we had been a big part of that reason by not being able to execute the way we wanted to, which probably happened again.”
Hence the Wallabies have spent this week getting their own shop sorted rather than fretting over their next opponents.
“Thinking about England probably wouldn’t be at the top of our list just because we’ve got our own issues to worry about,” Elsom said.
Wallabies: Adam Ashley-Cooper, Peter Hynes, Digby Ioane, Quade Cooper, Drew Mitchell, Matt Giteau, Will Genia, Wycliff Palu, George Smith, Rocky Elsom (capt), Mark Chisholm, James Horwill, Ben Alexander, Stephen Moore, Benn Robinson. Replacements: Tatafu Polota-Nau, Matt Dunning, Dean Mumm, David Pocock, Luke Burgess, Ryan Cross, James O’Connor.
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Matt0931 said | November 6th 2009 @ 1:56am | Report comment
I can’t help but feel Deans has made a bit of an error with this selection. I would have preferred to see Cooper take over fly-half duties and to move Giteau out to inside-centre.
I also would have liked to have seen Cross stay in Outside Centre as I think he only had a quiet game against the AB’s due to Giteau not getting the ball out to him quick enough, and Ioane should have stayed on the wing.
Ashley-Cooper to Full back is a good move as I think we’ll see a lot of aerial ping-pong from the English this weekend. Why wouldn’t they now they have one of the greatest fly-halves back in the team. AC has better hands than O’Connor to take the high ones when they come his way.
Cooper can be a bit of a shocker sometimes in defence so we might see the English picking out Ioane and Cooper. Hopefully they’ll hold their heads.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 2:39am | Report comment
‘Ashley-Cooper to Full back is a good move as I think we’ll see a lot of aerial ping-pong from the English this weekend. Why wouldn’t they now they have one of the greatest fly-halves back in the team.’
Because England has no real kicking option in the back three, Matt.
Go_the_Wannabe's said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:07am | Report comment
OMG……..is Dingo actually reading our blogs???? How long have all us Roarers been asking for 2 Dads to be moved to 15? (well, us sensible Roarers anyway). He’ll get more attacking opportunities there than 13, mark my words.
Here’s another headline……how long into the game will it be before Gits and Cooper swap at 10???? Not long, I’m tipping. At last, someone is seeing the sense in this.
And yes……another tip came true……Ioane at 13! There is too much to bear all in one test.
Well, we can’t complain now……at last some common sense selections.
Just need to stick with this basic combination now…….even if we lose.
Only thing is I don’t believe Mitchell deserves his wing spot…….really he’s done nothing all year to deserve it.
Matt0931 said | November 6th 2009 @ 3:10am | Report comment
No on the contrary, I think England do have the kicking options and I think they’ll use them to kick high and deep to put the wallaby backs under some pressure in their own half.
Johnny is a penalty kicking machine. With this in mind why wouldn’t the England team use the same game plan that SA used with Steyn?
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 3:25am | Report comment
Because SA also had Frans Steyn at 15 and Du Preez at 9, three of the best kickers in the world. England has Wilkinson and Australia has Giteau, so I fail to see how England has all the kicking options? And let’s not forget that all Australia has done since Deans took over is kick. That hasn’t been England’s tactic under Johnson.
CraigB said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:14am | Report comment
they have tactics under JOhnson???
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:15am | Report comment
Brian Smith actually. Yes.. tactics that lead to tries. Check your history, Craig. You might find it enlightening to read of these mythical things called ‘tries’.
Matt0931 said | November 6th 2009 @ 3:42am | Report comment
So you think Englands game plan on Saturday won’t come down to kicking? Perhaps Englands previous tactics haven’t involved so much kicking because Johnson didn’t have Wilkinson in the team.
Alec Swann in his latest column seems to think it will.
We’ll see.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 3:48am | Report comment
Good for Alec Swann… the ex-test rugby player. I’m not sure how that validates your argument? You suggested that England had all the kicking options. Patently they don’t. Australia is a kicking team, England hasn’t been for a while now apart from when a specific tactic was necessary – hence the inclusion of Goode all last season. It’s not as if Brian Smith chose not to pick a kicking fly half or that there were none available. I’m sure that Wilkinson will play the percentages when necessary but why kick straight down the throat of Ashley-Cooper? Why kick if you have chosen three wingers in the back three? All kicking does is bring about more kicking in return and that won’t suit England’s back line.
Matt0931 said | November 6th 2009 @ 3:58am | Report comment
ahhh I didn’t say ‘England had all the kicking options’ I said ‘England do have the kicking options’. Meaning they have more options than one.
I agree with you that with moving Monye to full back you might expect them to run the ball but this doesn’t mean they will. Besides with three quickies in the back three the kick and chase might be a good thing for them.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 4:04am | Report comment
But your implication is that they will be more willing to kick than Australia. However, excuse me if I paraphrased you incorrectly. Anyway… England has two kickers: Wilkinson and Geraghty. Australia has two kickers: Giteau and Cooper. Australia has been a kicking team over the past two seasons. England hasn’t. I think that England will kick when necessary but I very much doubt that England will kick solely. They might use the back three to chase but IMO kicking leads to return kicking and the back three is not equipped for that. Like you say, we shall see. Regardless, I’d gladly take a kick-inspired victory.
CraigB said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:16am | Report comment
watch alot of cooper do you? His kicking is erratic at best.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:28am | Report comment
Yes, I watched all of the Reds games last season actually. He is not a great kicker but he is a kicker and plays at fly-half, much like Geraghty, neither of whom would compare to Frans Steyn, thus my initial point is confirmed. One side has one main kicker each.
tarpo said | November 6th 2009 @ 6:56pm | Report comment
KO, surely you don’t rate Gits as a kicker? he is absolutley tripe when it comes to kicking (& general 5/8 play).
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 10:20pm | Report comment
He won Australia a lot of games this time last year.
pothale said | November 6th 2009 @ 5:05am | Report comment
But that wouldn’t be the English or NH way, KO. Just because SH teams like to play a kick-n-chase inspired game, doesn’t mean England or other NH teams should follow them slavishly.
Hopefully we’ll see some running rugby against the Australians and get them to re-learn the game properly.
__________________
“As it is, the British and Irish already consider it preposterous that the Wallabies are even entertaining the idea of upstaging the four home nations on successive weekends this month.
The truth is, the Wallabies publicly harbour no such grandiose expectations and Elsom, never one to pull punches, says his under-achieving side will be happy enough just to restore some order and confidence with success over the seventh-ranked English.”
Preposterous? I think if you go back over the last few weeks of Australian media coverage, you’ll find a different story.
The Australians have grandiosely dubbed this a Grand Slam tour from many months out – they plan to win all their matches as the third-ranked team in the world. There’s no escaping that statement or its intent. John Eales went out of his way to say that it was entirely achieveable. I’d agree – Australia are a SH team and third in the world.
So far, they’ve lost one game of their tour, and won one. And they’ve another 5 to go. One loss and the bragging rights rest with the NH, as far as I’m concerned.
No pressure then.
Matt0931 said | November 6th 2009 @ 5:52am | Report comment
‘SH teams like to play a kick-n-chase inspired game, doesn’t mean England or other NH teams should follow them slavishly’
Pothale, SH teams don’t play a kick and chase game. SA play the kick and chase and the AB’s throw in the odd K&C every now and again.
And if memory serves me correctly it was the Saffas, the Argies and the English at the last world cup who were excelling with the K&C .
And as for the grand slam. Of course it is the Grand Slam tour. The wallabies are playing all the home nations to attempt to beat them all which if this did happen would be a ‘Grand Slam’. This doesn’t mean they will win them all but it will sound pretty bloody stupid to say the Wallabies are playing all the home nations but not point out that winning them all would be a ‘Grand Slam’.
Personally, I will be happy with a win over the Poms and the Welsh but of course I will be hoping the Wallabies do take ‘The Slam’ as will all other Aussies.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:08am | Report comment
Matt, Australia has been one of the most conservative teams in world rugby since 1999. The Australian running game is myth initiated by the 1984 GS tour and propogated by rugby dinosaurs like Spiro Zavos.
Pothale, stop being so bloody smart. If there’s one thing worse than a Paddy it’s a clever, well-educated, high-brow Paddy (kind of like the shark phrase – the only good shark is a dead shark?! Maybe not..).. You must confuse the pants off Viscount. Anyhow, no games for Ireland this weekend. Looking forward to the rugger? David Haye is fighting as well. It’s a big weekend.
pothale said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:47am | Report comment
Rugger at weekend? Who’s playing?
David Haye is fighting. I know he’s a boxer but that’s it. But it does trigger a memory from some months back that you must be hitting the very old age of 26/27 this week. Are happy returns due?
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:17am | Report comment
25 today, Pothale. Thank you for your offerings. I took the day off work, had a sausage sandwich and pint of Guinness for breakfast, dozed in bed for an hour whilst reading, took in ‘Fantastic Mr Fox’ at the cinema with my gf (It’s very good, btw. Very nostalgic. Tender even.), had dinner with my parents and then returned to my gf’s house for her sister’s bf’s birthday (today). An England, Spurs, David Haye and Millwall win will be a nice bonus. I’m off to Germany for the rumble. “Who do you think you are kidding, Mr Hitler?…”
pothale said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:33am | Report comment
Matt
If you can’t spot when a fella might have his tongue in cheek when he throws out a comment or two, then there’s no hope for ya.
If memory serves me correctly, SA is a SH team, and they play a kick and chase game. Ergo, SH teams play kick and chase. If the ABs do it occassionally then ditto. Australia have managed to do it an awful lot in the last 3N.
A grand slam implies you beat all the other teams you’re playing. It wouldn’t be bloody stupid to say that Australia are playing Ireland, England, Scotland and Wales on tour. And that if they were to win all their games then it would be a grand slam style win. To dub it a Grand Slam Tour in advance is inviting trouble and adds a degree of pressure that Australia maybe could do without. The 6 Nations is a Championship which NH teams set out to win each year. If they’re lucky or good enough to beat all the other teams on the way, it’s a Grand Slam win. But we don’t call it the Grand Slam Championship. It’s the 6 Nations. Ditto the 3N.
Geddit?
Matt0931 said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:33am | Report comment
Oh so now it’s all about generalising is it? So Italy is a NH team and they are crap. Ergo NH teams are crap??
No that doesn’t work and neither does your logic about SH teams.
And your comment about Australia kick and chase?? Where do you get that from? AAC tried to do it but couldn’t get it right and that was about the end of it.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:38am | Report comment
All Australia does is kick, Matt.
AndyS said | November 6th 2009 @ 4:49pm | Report comment
That is more accurate. SA kick and chase, NZ kick and chase (albeit perhaps a little less), Australia kick and, umm ….
Dean Pantio said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:40am | Report comment
As has been pointed out by other posters, Australia has been the most conservative SH in terms of execution and tactics for at least the last two years (and if we’re being accurate, since a good proportion of Eddie Jone’s era). The only difference between South Africa and Australia was one team was good at executing their style of play.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:18am | Report comment
Bloody hell. I’m taken aback by such a statement. Are you being sarcastic, Dean?
Dean Pantio said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:31am | Report comment
Why would you ask KO?
Andrew B said | November 6th 2009 @ 6:21am | Report comment
England (JW) will be kicking for the corners and making another embarressing night for the Wallaby lineout. Fortunately they won’t be able to do anything with the ball once they win it!
Matt0931 said | November 6th 2009 @ 6:30am | Report comment
Except to go backwards.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:13am | Report comment
That’s what the great unknown say. Check the recent England try count and watch youtube. We have real backs who make it happen. Not your faux-league players who can only score a try if the referee is feeling ego-centric.
CraigB said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:18am | Report comment
whats you try count against SA and NZ then??? Scoring tries against Scotland and Italy may prove easier and playing them every year may skew the results somewhat.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:21am | Report comment
You mean the games against NZ and SA that came before the 6N, before Johnson had an opportunity to bed in his themes and tactics. Don’t forget the thrashing of Argentina… and the thrashing of France
Yes, I hear that tries against NZ are hard to come by. Probably more so if you’re an Australian back.
CraigB said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:09am | Report comment
ahh before Johnson, how crazy of me not to think an excuse would be in the slot ready. Go back as far as you like and I think you’ll find it a bit lower than when you tackle the might of Italy every single year.
I think you’ll find most teams have had a hard time scoring against NZ, not just the Wallaby backs.
TommyM said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:38am | Report comment
20 comments and only one that refers to the actual article!! Can’t you ladies carry on yuor bickering on MSN or something?!
I’m very excited to see what this lineup can do. Any defensive frailty should be more than made up for by the extra attack that midfield gives the Wallabies. Suspect we’ll see Cooper and Giteau swapping in the same way as Gits and Barnes did with multiple waves of attack. If we can secure any ball at all off line outs I predict a big win.
Wallabies by 20+!!!
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:41am | Report comment
That score would give you between 9-1 and 12-1 at the bookies. I say run with the wind and wager all that you can, Tommy.
Justin said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:52am | Report comment
17 points or more is 3.8 to back and 5.8 to lay on Betfair KO. Imagine it will settle somewhere around 4.8 at kick-off.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:56am | Report comment
I have noticed that the Aussie odds have shifted today. I’m avoiding all bets this weekend. Patriotism is the greatest scourge of the gambler.
CraigB said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:13am | Report comment
as you should, I mean you’ve got 195 players with injuries. In fact I heard Webb Ellis is making a run at 1/2 back.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:20am | Report comment
I think you mean that England has 24 injuries. Obviously you need to reacquiant yourself with the list I provided you. But hang on… Sharpe, Barnes and Cummins are injured, and Dunning and Kepu are just coming back from injuries. We all have injuries, Craig. Don’t forget that.
Justin said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:18am | Report comment
That it is…
TommyM said | November 6th 2009 @ 1:03pm | Report comment
If I bet on them, you can be sure they’ll lose. :S Maybe I should bet on England!
Justin said | November 6th 2009 @ 7:40am | Report comment
Well its a bold selection so for that I give a tick. It doesnt remove Gits from 10 though so thats disappointing. Good to see Cross out and AAC out of 12 (although he is a better 13).
It should be a match played with ball in hand more than some previous Aus tests with Coopers passing game (short and long) having the ability to mix it up and find runners.
Also happy to see G Smith back at 7. The problem will still come though when Palu comes off and we revert to a small 8.
This will certainly make me stay up and watch, hit the coffee machine hard late tomorrow night!!!
Brett McKay said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:07am | Report comment
Yep, agree Justin, they’re bold selections creating a point of difference, and I like the unpredictability of the midfield. Hopefully it’s a great match..
wannabprop said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:30am | Report comment
Haven’t seen much of Ioane – what’s his defense like? From memory QLD have let in a few lately… I’d be more concerned about an inexperienced centre pairing defensively. Very happy to see Deans try something different, just not sure now (first up test against the ‘Home’ Unions) is the time to do it. Also very very happy to see O’Conner benched (don’t think he should be in the 22). Gonna be interesting innit.
reds fan said | November 6th 2009 @ 10:51am | Report comment
wannabprop. when digby hits they stick. he can put on a beauty. but his decision making can be found wanting at times. it will be another thing to keep an eye out for. i’ll be particularly interested in the defensice performance of the two centres for obvious reasons. this is a great chance for them.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:17am | Report comment
‘ahh before Johnson, how crazy of me not to think an excuse would be in the slot ready. Go back as far as you like and I think you’ll find it a bit lower than when you tackle the might of Italy every single year.
I think you’ll find most teams have had a hard time scoring against NZ, not just the Wallaby backs.’
Why would I count before Johnson? Go back as far as I like and I’ll discover an English win in NZ. That’s enough for me. Most teams might find it hard to score against NZ but then most teams don’t play them so many times each year and most teams don’t have fans proclaiming how great their backs are. I suppose most teams don’t get given free tries by the referee either, eh?!
I’m looking forward to the Australia game. Hopefully the Australian team can give the English a lesson in try scoring just like they did last year when the teams scored … 1 try apiece… and Australia kicked 7 penalties. Gee.. it seems that the Wallabies are just generally struggling to score tries. Ok .. forget last season. How about the 1 try that Australia scored against France this season? Mmm…
Jameswm said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:25am | Report comment
Guys – just because Giteau has a 10 on his back and Cooper a 12 on hs back doesn’t necessarily mean they will stay there for the whole match.
Having said that Cooper might be able to play more freely at 12 and if there’s one thing he CAN do, it’s create breaks. Ioane is an explosive runner and there’s speed to burn in the back three, so will the Aussies actually run it?
Will we at last see the famous Deans counter-attack? Attacking in numbers is the key.
Will the Aussies keep Giteau on the left and Cooper on the right for the left-right foot combination?
As usual, it will come down to how well the forwards get the ball to them.
stuff happens said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:40am | Report comment
Slightly off topic( and not for the first time) the more interesting match this weekend will be in Cardiff.
According to the wonderful BBC Gatland is convinced that Dan Carter won’t play.Will this be enough to help Wales win. Hard to say but experience tells us no.
Ah well, hope springs eternal!
Dean Pantio said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:43am | Report comment
I’d take Carter’s word over Gatland’s.
reds fan said | November 6th 2009 @ 10:53am | Report comment
Carter has been announced in the team.
BennO said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:41am | Report comment
I like this selection. The one reservation I have though is that each of Gits, Cooper and Ioane are more individual players than team players (like say Barnes), so it might backfire without any genuine link player. That being said, I am one of those Wallabies fans whose lost interest this year but with that 10/12/13 combo….that’s got the potential for some fantastic running rugby. I’ll watch the game now.
Not only will it have the potential for exciting rugby but those players have the ability to blow England off the park. Cross in the backline doesn’t do that in my opinion.
TommyM said | November 6th 2009 @ 1:08pm | Report comment
Agree that Cooper is an individual talent, but I don’t think that means he’s not a team player- his passing skills are all about creating opportunities for those around him (the fact that he also scores some phenomenal solo tries doesn’t negate this)
The Link said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:41am | Report comment
A good bold move from Robbie, however it could be turnstiles in defence between 10 12 and 13.
Dean Pantio said | November 6th 2009 @ 8:44am | Report comment
That 10-12 channel looks decidedly weak defensively.
Harry said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:11am | Report comment
Happy with this selection, particuarly Smith back at 7 and IF they can get something close to parity in the lineouts and attack the breakdown effectively we are a good chance to score some tries. However also likely that the ref (who is it?) will be blowing penalties most of the afternoon … teams are coached to do this (infringe at the breakdown) rather than let the Oppo build continuity
Agree Dean Pantio, big weakness in defence at 10/12 znd I’d suggest 13 …. Digby is a bit suspect in that very difficult defensive position, although hopefully he has cured himself of that habit of going high and spear tackling, we don’t want to be playing a man down. Not sure whether the Poms are good enough to exploit this however … no doubt we will see that most original and exciting of attacking weapons, the rolling maul, being the preferred attack weapon of a Martin Johnson coached XV (and the pommy forward coach is from the same club)
My only question is why on earth wasn’t this backline selected last week instead of the proven and known failures/positional errors of JOC at 15, AAC at 12, Cross at 13? Now we are once again playing a new combination in a test, that means more than last week’s exhibition match.
Anyway as always, it will be won up front. Time for Palu and the 2 seond-rowers to stand up! I thought Elsom looked to be returning to his best form last week and he will feel comfortable back in the British Isles where, according to the Irish captain Pothale, he was the best player in the world earlier this year (for the record I disagree with that, McCaw or Matfield would be the best in my book)
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:21am | Report comment
Harry, firstly go to Scrum.com and find out how many tries England has scored since Johnson took over, and secondly you are incorrectly referring to a Brian O’Driscoll quote where he stated that Leinster would not have won the WC without Elsom.
Harry said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:34am | Report comment
“Rocky Elsom is the best rugby player in the world,” O’Driscoll boomed when interviewed after the match (the HC final).
As to try scoring, I’d say:
- Australia have been crap for some time now at scoring tries.
- But everyone is and, very regretably, when teams do open up and try and play a more running and attacking game they invariably come 2nd against the conservative/up the jumper style. Examples are NZ in SA this yearand England v Aus last year. The very sad fact is that if you want to win big test matches, play conservatively and I reckon we’ll see more rolling maul than backline flash on the weekend from the Poms. Credit to Engalnd if we don’t.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:48am | Report comment
No he didn’t boom that. Check again.
pothale said | November 8th 2009 @ 12:38am | Report comment
Harry – your quote is incorrect. O’Driscoll – in the euphoria after the match – said that Elsom was the best player he had ever played with. Not against, in other words.
Still BO’D has played with quite a few Irish and non-Irish players across Leinster, Ireland, Lions and Barbarians over the years. So it’s a fine compliment, even if given in a rush of excitement and celebration.
Andrew B said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:19am | Report comment
What I find confusing is with all this talk of moving Git’s back to 12, why hasn’t RD taken this oppertunity to do so with the injury to Barnes? Anyway, maybe that’s why hes the coach and Im not.
stillmissit said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:23am | Report comment
I am more than a bit worried about this game. Happy with our selections particularly the forwards BUT!
Teams like this England team will go one of two ways. It will hopefully fold under in the second half with there selection weaknesses exposed or they’ll galvanise against the obvious weaknesses and drag out a huge performance to bring us down. This is what happened in the RWC game when Tuquiri winked at the camera (wanker) and the Australians looked like they were heading to the beach as nobody gave the Pommies a chance.
Compulsive viewing and the most important game of the tour.
stillmissit said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:26am | Report comment
Knives – what is the feeling like in the UK are the press giving them no chance? What do you reckon he score will be?
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:45am | Report comment
All England v Australia banter and jokes aside, stillmissit? I honestly don’t know from a personal perspective. I haven’t read the responses from the UK journos but if you want a perspective then check out the websites of The Times, The Daily Mail and The Independent. No other papers cover rugby union in any detail.
My take is this: Australia and England both need a win. However, I feel that Australia needs one more. They’ve regressed this season and are in danger of falling off the 3N pace. England improved from a horrible start last season and showed greater direction, tactical nous and understanding during the 6N. Despite being ranked 7th they thrashed what was basically an Argentina 1st xv with their 2nd/3rd string team in the summer, and only lost by 2 points in Argentina. Thus it is a sustainable argument that England can overcome those positioned directly above it. Also, both Ireland and Wales listed England as their toughest opponents of the 6N. Therefore, I believe that SA and NZ currently exist on a separate plane and England, Argentina, Ireland, Wales and Australia are all fighting for praise. In that context the 7th place team must have more room for manouevre/failure than a 3rd place team which has just had a tough warm up game and months in camp.
As a fan I want to see the scrum go well, the pack to secure quick ball, the locks to avoid carrying, the lineout to be dominant, the kicking to be accurate, the tackling and carrying to be agressive, the passing to be accurate and the team to show confidence and no little discipline. Not much then! Beyond that I think that instead of being defensive and scared of copping a beating the absence of so many players will allow England a golden opportunity to improve their squad depth. Players like Hartley, Wilson, Croft, Care, Geraghty, Hipkiss and Monye have a great chance to stake long-term claims as necessities in the white jersey.
Ultimately I think the game will be close. Both midfields are new and potentially dynamic, but the Australian back three has a more settled look about it. This game should be close but with Wilkinson at 10 I feel that much more secure as a fan than the previous AI axis of Cipriani and Flutey, simply due to the experience of Wilkinson. With both packs having a point to prove, reliable players/ ‘legends’ at 10 and an exciting back division I repeat – this game should be close. I’m going for an England win by 5. What do you think, stillmissit?
stillmissit said | November 6th 2009 @ 10:07am | Report comment
Knives – I am worried by the fact that this team of ours seems to lack the ability/desire to up the speed of the game when it is required. We have wonderful young players but we are not seeing the skills and abilities on the field.
Mostly we seem to be stuck in 3rd gear with a turbo charged engine raring to go. The forwards look better on paper with Smith back at OS and Palu, Elsom will make for a great backrow. That is all very well but the set piece needs to be won and I have little faith in that part of our game.
Our kicking is poor to pathetic and our chasing is often non existent.
I was hoping for a big win against what I think will be our hardest game to win but maybe not our hardest opponents. With my nervous twitch kicking in I would be happy with a one point win. My real guess is Australia by 15 points but I fear your 5 points call.
OldManEmu said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:38am | Report comment
I fastidiously avoid reading Greg Growden, but had no choice on the plane this morning; it was either read the sports pages or listen to the drone next to me about the water crisis facing regional Australia (duh, we live in a desert) – Growden writes today “Cross has reason to feel miffed that he has been demoted to the reserves bench, as he did not get many attacking chances in Tokyo, and performed well against Gloucester”.
Maybe GG and the dude I was sitting next to on the plane share a brain and whoever gets up first for the day gets to use it for the next 24 hours.
It may well be said that Cross got limited opportunities with the ball in Tokyo but the bloke cannot defend at 13 at the level – nuff said.
Knives Out said | November 6th 2009 @ 9:47am | Report comment
Btw.. to all Australian fans – I may not be able to get access to a computer over the weekend so I wish you all the best of luck and hope the best team wins. Good game all.
stillmissit said | November 6th 2009 @ 10:09am | Report comment
Same to you Knives.
Stash said | November 6th 2009 @ 10:13am | Report comment
England are surely going to kick for touch in the opening stanzas to see if Aus has addressed their line-out woes.
Ioane was one of the few that shone against the ABs – (while Cross has lost his gloss). England will be looking to run at this channel with the new centre pairing.
What is the weather forecast? – if its wet, then surely England will be looking to keep it tight and battle it out with the forwards and at the breakdown where everyone perceives the Wallabies are wanting.
Mart said | November 6th 2009 @ 2:43pm | Report comment
Aha ! At the end of all the bluster / banter 2 good posts on “who will win” from KO and Stillmissit ! Great thoughts lads, agree with you. As an ex Pom and now an Aussie (with kids to boot ….er, not literally) this is always a tough one for me to view. For my money I think the fact the W’s are a team (Eng look like a collection of individuals who may, just may, gel into a team) will count and, whatever the weather, get Aus over the line comfortably in the 2nd half. Hard to see Eng starting well as a team methinks. That said, if it buckets down and the wind howls (what – in London ?) who knows if the beef of the Eng team may just do it ? As someone above said, hopefully compulsive viewing !