By Jesse Fink
November 20th 2009 @ 3:50am
Related coverage
Keep Guus away from the Socceroos
Chelsea's Guus Hiddink, centre gestures as he watches his team play Juventus during their Champions League round of 16 first leg soccer match at Chelsea's Stamford Bridge stadium in London, Wednesday, Feb. 25, 2009. Chelsea won the match 1-0. AP Photo/Carlo Baroncini
Now I’ve got all the time in the world for Craig Foster, a professional and personal mate. We’ve even talked about working together on a project. But he’s being unusually provocative in calling for Guus Hiddink to replace Pim Verbeek as coach of Australia at the World Cup.
While I have the utmost respect for what Hiddink has achieved as a coach and what he did for Australia in 2005 and 2006, it isVerbeek who has earned the right to lead Australia at the World Cup and it would be an outrage if he were demoted.
I say that not as someone who especially likes the way Verbeek’s teams play, because I do not, nor the players he picks, because again I do not, but he is entitled to prove to us all that his vision is the right one. He can only do that by leading us to success at South Africa 2010 without having to worry about looking over his shoulder for Hiddink or anyone.
Hiddink has failed with Russia and failed badly. His famous luck ran out this week against Slovenia but in truth it should have happened long ago. The Dutchman is a maverick, a bluffer, someone who has the uncanny knack of taking the right opportunity at the right time and demanding heavy remuneration for it. He is unquestionably good at his job and a brilliant motivator but so are many others in his game. They just don’t have his aura or his agent.
Conspiracy theorists might point out that the men who appointed Hiddink to the Socceroos in 2005, Frank Lowy and Phil Wolanski, are still running the show at Football Federation Australia and could well be tempted with a trip down memory lane. That might be the case. But Verbeek and his wife are close personal friends of Wolanski, so there is as much chance of Wolanski stabbing Verbeek in the back as there is me having dinner with Graham Arnold. It ain’t going to happen.
South Africa 2010 is Verbeek’s arrival as a coach. The moment he’s been waiting for his entire life. He’s made other people, Hiddink and Dick Advocaat among them, look good and now it’s his turn for some time in the sun.
To bring in Hiddink now over the top of Verbeek would be the biggest slight that could ever be perpetrated on the man. Foster contends, “I’d be surprised if Verbeek had a massive problem with it.” But the truth is he’d be livid.
Where I think Fozz does have it right, though, is his assessment of Hiddink’s discipline of players and man-management style as diametrically opposed to Verbeek’s, or the “polar opposite”. That is: not getting close to any of the players, making certain players know they don’t have a mortgage on their positions, not brooking any crap from anyone.
In my opinion, Australia could do with a little more of the Hiddink approach and less of Verbeek’s comparative softness. He’s given his players way too much licence.
But for me, Verbeek should stay. No questions.
If any country is to make a beeline for Hiddink’s services it should be South Africa, which must be ruing its decision to reappoint Carlos Alberto Parreira. Hiddink would have been perfect for Bafana Bafana.
Still, there’s a long time between now and June. Anything can happen. As we saw this week in Slovenia. When Hiddink says, as he did following the game in Maribor, that “the question of whether I will continue to UEFA Euro 2012 will require some time for thought” and “we’ll talk about the future at a later stage”, you just know he’s got another trick up his sleeve.
But who’s he fooling now?
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Tifosi said | November 20th 2009 @ 5:06am | Report comment
Foster contends, “I’d be surprised if Verbeek had a massive problem with it.” But the truth is he’d be livid.
Foster actually said that? What an idiot. Of course he would be livid.
SBS should replace Fos just before the World cup as the “chief football commentator” and see how he would like it.
Ive always felt Hiddink was a lucky coach and like you said Jess his luck finally ran out.
At any rate who says he wants to come back to Australia anyway?
GazGoldCoast said | November 20th 2009 @ 6:05am | Report comment
I’d be surprised if Fozzie had a massive problem with being replaced at SBS by Jesse Fink. LOL
I’m sure Alex Ferguson wouldn’t mind handing over the reins to Guus either. And that French coach would be delighted to give someone else a turn.
Freud of Football said | November 20th 2009 @ 5:55am | Report comment
Hiddink would be an excellent assistant to Verbeek. Contrasting styles and while Hiddink may be a better man manager, as Fink said, his luck was bound to run out at some point and with Russia, it’s hardly a country where you’d want your luck to run out.
So the odds of him becoming Verbeek’s number 2 are as good as none as a man with Hiddink’s CV can more-or-less pick and choose what he wants but if the WC comes around and he isn’t involved with one team or another, don’t be surprised if he jumps on board with some country for a short spell (not necessarily as manager) to ride their coattails and line his pockets at the same time before he selects his next project.
albe said | November 20th 2009 @ 6:53am | Report comment
i love the idea of Guus being involved… but more a case of “in some capacity” rather than coach. So as assistant, advisor, consultant or whatever. He’s certainly a guy you’d love to have on your bench as part of the set-up if you’re in Verbeek’s shoes.
You’d think it would appeal to Hiddink to go to South Africa with a national team, unless he has some club gig lined up in the meantime and can’t commit to both.
agga78 said | November 20th 2009 @ 7:14am | Report comment
Foster is a nuff nuff, always has, always will be, As for Guus he should not hired again, not for this campaign anyway. Pim has qaulified the team, so he can’t be replaced even though imo any manager in the professional game could of got us their even Graham Arnold. Under Pim though Australia won’t score a goal at the World Cup Finals we have struggled to score against Asian teams, wait to we get a European, South American or African nation, it will be park the soccceroo bus in front of the goals, Pim has the team set up playing his 4-5-1 with a very lone striker usually 30 metres away from anyone else and there is no way we can progress anywhere through the tournment playing that way.
sledgeross said | November 20th 2009 @ 7:34am | Report comment
I pissed myself laughing at Fozz last night on SBS news, the way he deflected over his “clarsh” player Henrys cheating. I’ll paraphrase.
News presenters “but fozz, surely we have to mention the French handball”
Fozz “oh, yeah, he’ll regret it, it was cheating. But how ’bout those Mets?”
dasilva said | November 20th 2009 @ 8:53am | Report comment
Watch Foster and LEs talking on SBS Shootout on the SBS The wOrld Game website. He was pretty harsh on the French Team, Domenech and Henry
NEws bullitin is not the right time for a rant
David said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:46am | Report comment
the hand ball was a disgrace Frances squad is a 5 star line up and they had to cheat in front of there home fans to win.
Remember when Grosso dived it was the worst way to lose for Australia in the WC that how ireland feel cuz this was an eve more clear infringment on the rules!
Lazza said | November 20th 2009 @ 1:01pm | Report comment
Lucas went to ground in the penalty box, didn’t get the ball, interfered ever so slightly with Grosso and the Italian took full advantage of it. That’s professional sport – if it happened the other way round the Italians wouldn’t accuse us of cheating, they would just blame the defender.
When I was young, my junior coaches used to tell me that I should always stay on my feet when defending in the penalty area. If you go to ground and don’t get the ball then bad things can happen.
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 1:12pm | Report comment
bad things like diving?
youre kidding if you think he touched him at all…
grosso is a cheat but aust were appalling in the attacking third and hiddink did nothing about it…
Fisher Price said | November 20th 2009 @ 1:18pm | Report comment
On the other hand, if the ref had awarded a blatant penalty against Cahill v Japan then Australia would probably not have gone through to beat Croatia (via Kewell’s offside goal), let alone to play Italy.
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 2:13pm | Report comment
yes it was a penalty against cahill for sure but thats not the point i was making… i was talking about grosso cheating… like henry did this morning…
Robbos said | November 20th 2009 @ 2:40pm | Report comment
Cahill penalty fair enough.
But lets not go to the Croatia match, English ref, should have sent Suminic of after 2 yellow cards not 3.
The Aussie born Suminic actually rugby tackled Viduka in a worst penalty offence then Cahill in the Croatia match, not given. Plus I still to this day do not know why the goal we scored in the last minute did not count.
Very poor refereeing that day.
Yes very emotional after Grosso dive, still hate him immensely, but I know most professionals would have taken the same route.
Lazza said | November 20th 2009 @ 1:55pm | Report comment
If Lucas had stayed on his feet then there would of been no penalty. We were all very emotiomal that night but on reflection a lot of us have come to a different conclusion.
Even Lucas backed off on his “cheat’ remarks after the game. Let’s just get over it. The Olympics and other sports are full of drug cheats, Rugby had it’s premeditated “Bloodgate’ cheating scandal. There are a lot worse cheats in World sport than a bit of play acting to get a free kick or pen.
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 2:14pm | Report comment
people like you are the reason it continues…
Joe FC said | November 20th 2009 @ 8:21am | Report comment
You’ve said it all Jesse.
whiskeymac said | November 20th 2009 @ 8:22am | Report comment
good call Jesse. Although frustrating at times it would be an aboslute act of bastardy to replace Verbbek after what he has done, and i hope it is not countenanced by the FFA. For better or worse “Pim” was the man employed to do the job and although it hasnt always been pretty he’s done the hard yards. Who is to say Guus, or someone else, cld do any better? He got us to the 2nd round to a comp we qualified via penalties.
I assume it would also be costly with breach of contract/ unfair dismissal, a messy media, tarnishing of reputation (altho this is normally forgotten with a bag of money and a few good results) etc.
I am interested to see what happens after the WC/ Asian Cup in relation to who will be running the roos, and what will happen to Pimbo.
Ben of Phnom Penh said | November 20th 2009 @ 10:43am | Report comment
An interesting point, Whiskeymac as there isn’t much time between the World Cup and Asia Cup as it will be held in January 2011 due to the heat in Qatar. If Pim doesn’t want to continue for another 6 months then we may have to opt for the “care taker” coach and we don’t want a repeat of 2007 now do we.
whiskeymac said | November 20th 2009 @ 2:09pm | Report comment
am sure they wont fall for GA again… the hope is that maybe the FFA have lined someone up quickly. i imagine after 2010 there will be a few elligible candidates floating about. if they havent then there would be serious questions about what lessons the admin have learnt from the past.
cbowden9000 said | November 20th 2009 @ 8:33am | Report comment
Totally agree Jesse – Verbeek deserves his chance to prove to everyone what he can do. He has earnt it.
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 8:40am | Report comment
that russian team should have qualified easily… it is a very poor performance by hiddink not to get them to south africa… as for all those above moralising about how verbeek deserves to go to the world cup (including that prankster fink) it really is laughable… think about those players who have played in so many qualifiers who will undoubtedly miss out for the good of the team… it would be for the good of the team if verbeek was replaced straight away with trousier (who should of got the job in the first place)… never mind that diletante foster…
Fisher Price said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:46am | Report comment
Verbeek is too cautious to take this team anywhere. Possibly the powers that be should have realised this many months ago and replaced him. But they didn’t. Seemingly they’re content with him at the helm.
Hiddink’s non-qualification with Russia is a suitable antidote to those who think the sun shines from his Spider-selecting posterior.
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:53am | Report comment
i had a dream (nightmare) the other night that schwarzer got injured before the world cup and spider took his spot…
Midfielder said | November 20th 2009 @ 8:42am | Report comment
Agree Jes …. + 1, 000.
Kazama said | November 20th 2009 @ 8:59am | Report comment
Agree with you Jesse. Verbeek has already done the minimum and got us to the World Cup, so he deserves his chance to show us what we can do on the big stage.
whiskeymac is right. What happens after the World Cup will be interesting.
dasilva said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:00am | Report comment
Foster is up to la la land if he believes that Verbeek wouldn’t mind getting replace by Hiddink. The fact that Verbeek and Hiddink are closed friends immediately rules out Hiddink for the job because I’m absolutely sure that Hiddink doesn’t believe in stabbing his friend in the back and wouldn’t do it out of principle (or at least without an extremely large swab of cash). Also because of different management styles I’m quite sure Pim is actually more popular with the players then Hiddink (as Pim is more closer to the players whilst Hiddink is more stand off and keep the distance). Shafting Pim in an act of backstabbing would no doubt cause players descent.
However saying this, the whole reaction to the suggestion by Foster to not sack Pim, I think it reflects the “fair go” Australian culture more then anything else
Other countries in the world will have no hesitation in doing this
South Africa sacked Phillippe Trousier after qualifying to the world cup to be replace by a more experience manager
One of the Togo national coach who was a local was the coach to qualified Togo to the World Cup for the first time in their history. He was our version of Rale Rasic. The Togo federation sacked him for a more experience European coach
Mind you both sides completely flopped at hte world cup. So perhaps loyalty does pay.
AGO74 said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:15am | Report comment
Spot on firstly with Hiddink failing badly with Russia. He couldn’t harness the incredible talent he has to beat Slovenia. Spot on on also with the stupid idea of replacing Pim. It would would create disharmony in the team as despite all the criticism externally of Verbeek he is very well liked and respected within the squad even if at the beginning some of them had no idea who he was. On the different management styles, I don’t think that necessarily means Pim has favourites nor is it a weakness. Very few have walk up starts and none have a guaranteed 90 minutes – e.g. our number one choice outfield player Timmy Cahill was hooked after 65 mins for Carney and Pim was proved right as it turned out to be the game-changing substitution. A coach kow-towing to favourites would not have taken Cahill off. Sounds like a coach playing to win.
I also agree with the earlier comments about let’s see how Foz would like being replaced as commentator just before World Cup. See if Foz would be ok with that in the way he ludicrously suggests Pim would be ok if Guus took over. Foz is becoming increasingly irrelevant. Stick to reading the news.
David said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:32am | Report comment
Of coruse Pim would be angered at even the idea of him being replaced after a large amount of success and if Guus was to step in it would be a massive back stabe.
BUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
You all say Guus is lucky no offence if guus is lucky then Pim is a leprecon full of luck. Ive watched pretty much watched every match since 2005 that the socceroos have been in.
Im not saying we should replace Pim it wouldnt sit right if we did although i wish we could Guus was voted one of the top 5 coaches in the world last year and when it comes to the WC his got his CV were it counts.
Im going to be honest the socceroos play boring football its dreadful to watch the only game ive enjoyed watching was the Ireland match.
We’ve been Dominated by Bahrain and Oman and we drawed with Qatar last time we played them imagin when we play a spain or brazil!!!
Fozz knows as well as the rest of us we are going to get cut to bits in the WC and thats is why he wants pim to be replaced and i agree with him but i dont see it happening i dont mind pim as a manager his honest about the A-league and is critcal when need be but we will get dominated once we come against decent opposition – You heard it 1st!
Fisher Price said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:48am | Report comment
Verbeek is the man to grind out results against mid-tier West Asian teams. If that’s the kind of thing that you think you might be into.
Ben of Phnom Penh said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:00am | Report comment
and Dutch sides…. and Ghanaian….and South African….and Japanese…..and Irish. Not quite Argentinian though, but it was close.
Fisher Price said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:26am | Report comment
Japan aside, referring to some friendlies there are we?
Rob said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:58am | Report comment
Jesse,
I disagree that Pim has “earned the right to lead Australia at the World Cup” . I dont believe this sort of logic applies to the modern game. Like any business he stays in the job for as long as those above him in the foodchain have confidence that he will be able to perform the task as required. Can any of us really say that his current performance gives us this confidence. Far from it, largely the same player group have gone backwards under his control.
I gaurantee that if we have a dud WC we will be reading articles (possibly even by you Jesse) about how it was all so obvious that PV couldnt cut it…how the FFA need to be made accountable for not seeing this..I told you so etc.etc etc.
Pim, as a mid level, unproven coach, always has his own reputation as his first priority. He plays for himself and not for the team. We all think we are going to SA to play the WC but he is going there to audition for his next job.
Forget the past…if we were starting again tomorrow, would Pim be the man you would choose?
If Guus is available and keen then get him onboard
whiskeymac said | November 20th 2009 @ 10:18am | Report comment
You say playing for himself is his motivator, and not playing for the team…. how so and, even if true, why are the two so distinct as to be detrimental to this World Cup? maybe he’s less interested in gambling on new players or worrying about the team after his tenure, but during his stint at the top doesnt this notion that he is audtioning for the next job mean he would therefore be results driven – what better way to line up a new job than be successful?
Whatever the motive then he will do his best as a proud professonal to get us out of the group stage. it’s not an issue that he wont try his best or do all he can. the question is whether his best is enough compared to others, and or should he be shafted to make way for someone with a resume that looks better.
why guus and not trappatoni if we are in the business of chopping and changing at the last?
Rob said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:54am | Report comment
What do I mean by playing for himself ? Coaches at the highest level have proven experience and sufficient comfort in their abilities to accept that defeat and mistakes happen..that they are a part of life. Pim, because he is still a teenager in coaching terms is still trying to prove himself… still sees his own self judgement in each game. He lacks the maturity and comfort to be wrong….contrast this with Guus/Fergie/Jose…all men very comfortable in their own skin, happy to back themselves.
Why is this detrimental to the WC? because we now have a team fashioned solely for the purpose of not losing as opposed to one that has been designed to win. As has been said before on this site….what are we going to do if we are down 2-0 at half time?
whiskeymac said | November 20th 2009 @ 12:18pm | Report comment
good points. different to what i thought you meant. although in fairness some coaches dont have the experience and and still do well – klinsmann comes to mind (although sucess is attributable to his off sider i think) and the barca coach recently. on a local scale vidmar got to the Asian finals and GVE won the comp a few seasons back. there’s more to it than just the coach. Converesley hiddink and trappatoni wld be at the WC and Bafana Bafana wld be doing more than drawing all the time at home if it came down to the age of someones resume.
I am not going to be an aoplogist for Pimbo but although he isnt in the same levels as those you mentioned at the same time he has been involved in 2 previous WCs with Korea, Asian Cups and i/c of Dutch Antilles (no laughing). He is reasonably credentialled.
am not sure Fergie and jose show much maturity when they lose though. it’s always the refs fault. or the other side. it’s one thing to be able to back yourself, but it’s another to accept you may be wrong. these guys dont seem to have much humility in them. is it charisma or arrogance?
Ben of Phnom Penh said | November 20th 2009 @ 10:36am | Report comment
Rob, the same player group has gotten a lot older under Pim’s control as well
David said | November 20th 2009 @ 3:45pm | Report comment
I agree
John said | November 20th 2009 @ 10:16am | Report comment
Bring Guus back. Pim doesnt know how to play anything resembling football.
Rob said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:30am | Report comment
True Ben …a few of them would have been happier if the WC was 18mths ago..its the structure that im really talking about
Ben of Phnom Penh said | November 20th 2009 @ 10:32am | Report comment
Pim is part of the make-up that is our 2010 campaign. That is part of the larger plan and thus far it has worked. What should be remembered is how well Pim and the FFA team have the Socceroos prepared and coddled for away games, and the World Cup is one big road show.
Bafana Bafana made a mistake. They should have waited until the final round of qualifying to select a new coach as a number of credible names are now placing adverts in the “jobs wanted” section of the paper. Guus is just one of them
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 10:41am | Report comment
what is the larger plan ben? verbeek’s tenure has been shortsighted in the extreme and his employers are to blame for that…
Ben of Phnom Penh said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:55am | Report comment
The larger plan included the entire qualification process through Asia which we did not have to contend with before. It was a steep learning curve for us and we needed a coach we could afford that could guide us through the various obstacles on hand. I can assure you that it isn’t just a matter of turning up with the kit bag under one arm and asking where the changing rooms are.
The payment for getting through this long and arduous process unscathed is having a first time senior coach at the finals. It is time for us to pay our dues.
Fisher Price said | November 20th 2009 @ 10:49am | Report comment
Verbeek was employed to (hopefully) coach the side to the WC finals. He’s done that. He’s just counting his money now.
albatross said | November 20th 2009 @ 10:52am | Report comment
Like Napoleon, Hiddink should not have ventured into Russia.
Pim is a lucky “general” who should retained until his luck runs out.
Art Sapphire said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:08am | Report comment
Agreed, its a lot easier managing a bunch of simple, uncomplicated Aussies than a room full of self-doubting Dostoyevskeys.
If the French had half a brain they would be tapping up Guus right now.
But they haven’t. How else can anyone explain Domenech’s continued tenure for Les Bleus.
KB said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:16am | Report comment
Jesse,
Foster’s idea is outrageous, for it is far too late, but I sympathise with him… Pim has reached his limitations and can’t manage a team that needs to go out on the front foot… What happened in Muscat was a case of player’s initiative when they stormed the Oman back line to get the late winner… That was shades of Guss not Pim…
It is interesting in that article about Fozzie’s comment, which there is a clause in his Russian contract allowing him to leave to take up an offer to be involve with another national team if Russia didn’t get through to the WC… But if he were to take Pim’s post now that would be against the Australian psyche of a “fair go” policy and that would have the opposite effect to what we are all about… It could be disastrous…
I agree with you; it’s now far too late… Besides Guss doesn’t like to go back where has been and achieved a miracle… I think if an offer came in from the NZ All Whites he would seriously consider the challenge; there would be nothing for him to lose… But that is also highly unlikely, as Ricky H is a legend down there…
~~~~~~~
KB
Anthony Siokos said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:22am | Report comment
Well done, Jesse. You’ve got the gig as Verbeek’s biographer. You must have seen his interview on the ABC’s ‘Offsiders’ programme about a month back where he said he’d like to write a book about his experiences with the Socceroos. Regards, Your biggest fan.
Norm said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:26am | Report comment
I propose we launch a roarers’ protest march to parliament house and along the way we can chant:
“Let’s sack Pim and Robbie Deans
install new coaches in Aussie Teams”
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:31am | Report comment
i’m really sick of people bringing in rugby union through the back door (even though thats where it belongs)… fine with what you say about pim, although i don’t believe in the mob mentality at all, but that other character requires absolutely no mention in this forum…
Norm said | November 20th 2009 @ 11:56am | Report comment
Maybe you’d prefer this chant:
“Oh dear for Vlad the Impaler
it’s not just a rumour
he is without humour”.
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 12:54pm | Report comment
you’re a card, theres no doubting that…
Fisher Price said | November 20th 2009 @ 1:22pm | Report comment
Get a room.
SImone` said | November 20th 2009 @ 12:43pm | Report comment
I don’t think any of you have Australia’s best interests at heart. You must have a soft spot for Verbeek and feel bad, which is admirable. Of course he will be upset and he has done well and got the results (despite playing poor football) so far. But come on, best / most qualified person for the job please. And that = Hiddink. Makes the most sense, Im with Fos on this one, He will get us further and play better football. For those who don’t agree, i’ll take an apology come July 2010.
vladimir said | November 20th 2009 @ 12:53pm | Report comment
“I don’t think any of you have Australia’s best interests at heart”
thats quite an accusation missy…
whiskeymac said | November 20th 2009 @ 1:15pm | Report comment
maybe it’s in our best interests not to be so mercenary and to see through what we contracted?
We chased russia/advocaat for 2million when he reneged on his contract w/o. what price wld Pim have? loss of potential earnings etc etc…. it might be more expensive to fire than to keep him.
can the FFA afford to be so disloyal? what effect on reputation?
anyway why wld Guus come back? money only… and after we paid off Pim and payrolled Guus (or whoever) how much wld the FFA have (seeing they are paying for 4 HAl teams etc).
he is also contracted to the russians until after 2010 – if they dont let him go and we approached him do we need to pay them off aswell?
Griffo said | November 20th 2009 @ 2:57pm | Report comment
Generally a big fan of Foster but the whole line he has taken this year about getting rid of Pim is almost bordering on farce. I would expect that Foster would lament the consequences of the decision by a national FA to sack a coach, a coach who has taken a team through World Cup qualification with relative ease. He would highlight any number of previous instances where such a decision has resulted in a side performing poorly in the subsequent World Cup, whether the previous coach was better or worse than the replacement. But he is suggesting such a thing for Australia, to a first time World Cup qualification coach, just as the draw is announce, in the middle of a Asia Cup qualification process. As mentioned in other posts here, the reputation of Australia would be tarnished; it is a line we should not cross. Pim may not do as well as Guus, Australia may not get out of the group stage, but that is just experience to use for the next coaching appointment. Wonder if we will see Pim on TWG anytime soon?
David said | November 20th 2009 @ 3:55pm | Report comment
Ok this is the Final Arguement! AND THE BOTTOM LINE
If you Believe that if our squad would have qulified playing uruguay (the 5th ranked South American team) then you are inclined to say stick with PIM. Everyone Knows we would have failed to qualify at the finial Hurdle again as in ages pasted if pim was coach.
If you Agree or disgree your free to comment why?
dasilva said | November 20th 2009 @ 4:51pm | Report comment
First thing, judging from that Costa rica vs Uruguay. Uruguay seems to gone backwards as well in they were one missed chance away from losing 2-1 to costa rica at home.
I admit though that under Pim, we haven’t been playing that fluently.
however lot of the reasons why we aren’t playing that fluently is unrelated to coaching ability
We have pretty much the same players but they are 4 years older. They are more slower then they were four years ago especially chipperfield, kewell, moore etc. The younger players bar Carney hasn’t stepped up and not playing regularly.
We don’t have Mark Viduka who played a critical role in the world cup and the Uruguay qualifiers in keeping possession and giving us fluency in attack (lack of mark Viduka is the main reason I believe there is a style debate under Pim Verbeek)
So yeah, there’s a lack of fluency under Pim Verbeek reign but how much is it his fault. Would Guus do any better? Possibly, however I don’t think we can blame all our problems on Pim Verbeek.
I honestly think if Guus took over the side now which is weaker then 4 years ago. He would have struggled to beat Uruguay over two legs as well.
David said | November 20th 2009 @ 5:40pm | Report comment
I disagree yes our players are slower n old but stuggling aginst Oman at home with a full squad in my opinion is not good enough and u did u even watch the match against Costa RIca Uruguay have got stronger since 06 they should have been Argentina and they dominated Costa Rica (who are better then teams like Oman and Barhain). Sorry to Pim but i cant accept the fact that he never changes Formation it makes no Tachical sence i dont mind playin boring football when need be but at times its be good to try difference formations in times when required that is why pim should be replaced in my opinion besides that his a good coach
dasilva said | November 20th 2009 @ 6:35pm | Report comment
Fair enough, I was guilty with generalisation with Uruguay (I was just watching the last 20 minutes of the Costa Rica match) so I really shouldn’t have commented on that. I apologise for that. I should know better then to comment in something I have little knowledge on.
I think other people would vouch that I’m not a fan of Pim Verbeek and that I’m not exactly happy with our style of play of the socceroos. I’m just saying that it isn’t all Pim’s fault and he does face greater challenges then what Guus had 4 years ago.
I just don’t think Pim should get all the blame.
Would we do better with Guus? probably, but I think that if Guus was still here, people would be complaining about the performance as well.
My personal opinion is it’s too late to change
First thing: Guus and Pim are probably friends. So it’s a moot point. Guus is not going to back stab pim unless’s there a huge wab of cash involve
2nd thing: The team gives me the impression that Pim is actually popular with the players. If PIm is sacked they could be internal problems that could be resulted from it.
3rd: Cost, pay off pims contract and pay off Guus hiddink
4th: It also gives a bad message. We complain so much about Dick Advocaat. Callilng him a mercernary and a backstabber. Well we would be doing the same thing. Why would any coach in the future want to be employed by us if we have a reputation of sacking coaches for getting the results that we hired them to . No one will want that lack of job security. We do not have a lot of money to attrack big name coaches. We are only really attractive in terms of working conditions. Sacking Pim like this may restrict the option of coaches we attract in the future.
5th: I could not think of a single occassion where someone who has sacked a coach after qualifying to the world cup and getting good results working. Like I mention before, both Togo and South Africa dismally failed after doing what we are thinking about Pim Verbeek.
Really, I didn’t support Pim appointment in the beginning (I thought Troussier was a better option). I was against the Dutch obsession. We really should have chosen Fabio Capello over dick Advocaat (Fabio Capello actually approaches FFA about the job)
However we made our choice, we stick with it thick through thin.
David said | November 20th 2009 @ 8:09pm | Report comment
I agree with all the things you just said execept being against the dutch system i dont mind dutch football they produce good players for a small nation.
To be honest but in the end of the day i still think Guus is better and as much as it might be a bit uncanning to bring Guus back over Pim i think it would benefit Australias WC chances in the end of the day if Australia gets knocked out of the group stages everyone will be like “we should have tryed to get a better coach”
I know Pim will lead us to the WC but i think Guus is a better option if we had a chance to stanch him up then i would say take it.
In the end of the day my dream is to see the socceroos Win the WC in 2010 and although i think 2010/2014 are out of our reach if we get to host 2018 or 2020 i think we can do it but we need to do well in the world cup to spark interest from big leagues and big clubs around the world.
Australian players are cheap in comparason to anywhere else in the world and buying young players and training them to be good then selling them seems to be the big thing in football these days. ie Arsenal, Man U, barca all do it etc.
In turn more players going overseas will mean eventually they will come back home and lift the standard of the A-league. People dont realise the impact world Cup success has look at South Korea they have very good youth coming thought ever since Guus did his magic in 2002
its just a thought =)
gazz said | November 20th 2009 @ 5:31pm | Report comment
are we playing a game of trying to keep Pim happy or are we trying to do some damage at the World Cup?
bring back Guus!!!
burgerman said | November 20th 2009 @ 9:25pm | Report comment
absolutely right jesse, pim deserves to have his world cup. he got us there through a hard campaign
Mariska said | November 21st 2009 @ 12:38am | Report comment
“A maverick, a bluffer, someone who has the uncanny knack of taking the right opportunity at the right time and demanding heavy remuneration for it.”
Are you talking about Hiddink here or Craig Foster?
Gregor said | November 22nd 2009 @ 9:28am | Report comment
Slovenians would like to play against Guus team on WC 2010 and beat him again:) Slovenian coach Matjaz Kek is much better than Guus! I wonder if Guus would congratulate Matjaz for beating him again. In Maribor Guus was so disapointed that he didn’t shake hands with Slovenian Manager after the game.