Pros and cons of World Cup bid for NRL, AFL
By Billo, 11 Dec 2009 Billo is a Roar Rookie
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The bid to host football’s World Cup has given rise to a crisis in the ranks of the AFL and NRL, with both bodies having to put on a public display of supporting the bid, while trying to work out the hypothetical gains and losses the tournament.
With the Federal government reportedly spending $75 million to support the bid, the stakes are high, and the two major domestic codes face some anxious calculations in weighing the balance sheet.
The AFL has already made it clear that Etihad Stadium will not be offered to FIFA as part of the bid, although whether it can sustain that stance in the face of the Federal government will be interesting to see.
The threat of having to close down a competition for upwards of eight weeks would inevitably mean that compensation would have to be paid, and of course everything has its price.
But the longer-term issue is how well the two domestic codes would be positioned to prosper after the World Cup has come and gone.
The AFL is bigger than the NRL, and it appears to have potentially the most to lose from any upsurge in support for soccer.
The NRL will benefit from an investment around the country in rectangular stadiums, including probably a new 40,000 capacity stadium at Campbelltown suitable for the Wests Tigers.
Similar improvements would probably be made to stadiums in other NRL towns like Canberra, Wollongong Townsville and Newcastle, while improvements to stadiums in Adelaide and Perth would present the NRL with an opportunity to move into those markets after the tournament ended.
The AFL wouldn’t benefit from any of that investment, however, and I can fully understand why Andrew Demetriou is more or less making clear his opposition to the World Cup.
Even while the tournament was taking place, the NRL, with its suburban Sydney venues, would be able to carry on if those stadiums were not used as training venues for the World Cup, which appears at least to be a possibility.
The NRL might also be in a position to take matches across the ditch to New Zealand, to play matches in cities like Hamilton, Wellington, Christchurch and Dunedin, effectively promoting their code in NZ while the World Cup is played in Australia. There probably isn’t sufficient support in NZ for the AFL to do the same thing.
So on balance I can see how the NRL might support the bid, but the AFL wouldn’t.
On the other hand, both codes could lose out if the World Cup results in them losing supporters to football.
Both codes faced the same issue with the 2003 rugby World Cup, but in the long-term rugby wasn’t able to take advantage of the upsurge in interest.
Whether soccer can do better than that will be interesting to see.
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December 11th 2009 @ 2:29am
Freud of Football said | December 11th 2009 @ 2:29am | Report comment
“while improvements to stadiums in Adelaide and Perth would present the NRL with an opportunity to move into those markets after the tournament ended.” – As the old AFL ad goes; ‘I’d like to see that’. NRL will never survive in either city, in Adelaide it would be an absolute death sentence for any club, wouldn’t last 3 years.
December 11th 2009 @ 4:42am
Gatto Nero said | December 11th 2009 @ 4:42am | Report comment
Add to the fact that a new venue in either city is guaranteed to be oval and boast the local AFL clubs are primary tenants.
December 11th 2009 @ 7:17am
Bill said | December 11th 2009 @ 7:17am | Report comment
Adelaide agreed. Perth I don’t agree. Perth would be most likely be a rectangular ground which would be used by the WA Super Rugby and A League teams.
December 11th 2009 @ 8:46am
ren said | December 11th 2009 @ 8:46am | Report comment
any rectangular ground in perth will be an upgraded perth oval (which is actually rectangular) with a capacity of around 25000. anything larger will be primarily oval shaped for the simple reason only one sport has the capacity to fill such a stadium week in week out- football.
December 11th 2009 @ 7:47am
Ken said | December 11th 2009 @ 7:47am | Report comment
Well last time around both teams lasted 3 years – just, before some pretty extraordinary events closed them down. If, and it seems unlikely in the next 10 years, they re-establish a professional team in those cities it would be for the long haul. Perth was always the better fit with the bigger population and, while no doubt in an AFL state, seemingly more open to other codes than Adelaide.
December 11th 2009 @ 3:45am
chris said | December 11th 2009 @ 3:45am | Report comment
I don’t see the problem with the FIFA WC and the NRL as Rugby League is played and suited in the smaller boutique stadiums that hold 15000-20000.
But i do see a problem for the NRL if grounds such as Canberra, Wollongong,Townsville and Newcastle are upgraded to 40000 seater stadiums as they will remain half full for NRL,A-League and Super 14 games after the Soccer WC cup leave town and hence Australia will have even more white elephants of sports ground’s.
December 11th 2009 @ 4:22am
tifosi said | December 11th 2009 @ 4:22am | Report comment
Chris,
the plan is to make them 40,000 seat stadia for the world cup, then reduce them to 25,000 afterwards.
Sort of like what the did for the Olympic Stadium in Sydney. They also did it at euro 2008 for the european soccer championship.
As a canberran, i can assure the Raiders need a new stadium. Its like a wintry hell to watch the raiders play at the current one.
Now imagine, brand spanking new stadium for raiders, newcastle, wollongong, perth, townsville, even west sydney or maybe belmore.
Rugby League desperately needs this believe me.
Even avowed soccer hater Phil Rothfeld from the daily telegraph understands that this is the only way rugby league can move forward.
December 11th 2009 @ 4:43am
Gatto Nero said | December 11th 2009 @ 4:43am | Report comment
The only way that rugby league can “move forward” is for the soccer World Cup to come to Australia? Strewth, I didn’t realise that league was in such dire straits.
December 11th 2009 @ 11:38am
Springs said | December 11th 2009 @ 11:38am | Report comment
So the NRL will have to endure the rebuilding of their stadiums before the Cup, disrupting either the season or the season before, and then downgrading the stadiums causing further disruption to the season or the season after. Newcastle and Wollongong are already upgrading their stadiums, Newcastle to at least 33,000 and maybe 40,000 afterwards. And why would Belmore need a new upgrade when the Bulldogs can play out of the new ANZ Stadium that will have a very relevant roof?
And don’t listen to Phil Rothfield, he has no idea.
December 11th 2009 @ 11:58am
Mr said | December 11th 2009 @ 11:58am | Report comment
In the case of a winning bid, some of the stadia would have to be at WC standard by 2017 or 2021 for the Confederations Cup. This tournament does not use all 12 stadiums.
It’s also worth noting that Australia is the sole bidder for the 2015 Asian Cup which will use stadiums along the eastern seaboard. There is debate as to whether this tournament will be played in summer or winter.
December 11th 2009 @ 3:19pm
$1 Billion Compensation for AFL/NRL said | December 11th 2009 @ 3:19pm | Report comment
If they try to play the Asian Cup in Winter – and cause more disruption to the AFL/NRL – they can forget wringing any concessions out of the AFL/NRL for the World Cup bid.
That would mean, potentially, the 2015, 2017 and 2018 seasons would all be disrupted by mid-Winter Soccer tournaments!
No thank you.
December 11th 2009 @ 3:33pm
Art Sapphire said | December 11th 2009 @ 3:33pm | Report comment
Hold you horses Compo Man – the 2004 Asian Cup was staged in China was only held in 4 venues.
Unlike the WC the tournament requires fewer venues as there are half as many games played.
FYI – little Qatar is hosting it in 2011.
December 11th 2009 @ 12:02pm
Michael C said | December 11th 2009 @ 12:02pm | Report comment
You’d do all the stadium redevelopment work over summer wouldn’t you – and put a stop to the HAL season.
Only fair.
December 11th 2009 @ 8:44pm
NCB619 said | December 11th 2009 @ 8:44pm | Report comment
Surely there is an adequate break to do the developments in stages during the NRL off-season, as it seems absolutely nothing is done at ANZ during this time (I.E. do the seating developments one summer, and the roof the next, or something like that)
December 11th 2009 @ 6:42am
dom ROmeo said | December 11th 2009 @ 6:42am | Report comment
“The AFL wouldn’t benefit from any of that investment”
Actually the AFL will benefit. The redevelopment of carrara on gold coast, the adelaide stadium will be oval, and also the perth satdium will be oval. Those eggball nuts in melbourne will have stadiums redeveloped in three cities.
December 11th 2009 @ 7:07am
Mr said | December 11th 2009 @ 7:07am | Report comment
There is a bit of assumption going on around Carrera v Robina increase, Adelaide Oval v the new City Multipurpose stadium, and Subiaco v the proposed MES Rectangle. It’s too early to bet on ovals, as we have seen NSW is ready to invest to bring the visitors to it’s cities.
December 11th 2009 @ 7:20am
Redb said | December 11th 2009 @ 7:20am | Report comment
Even the soccer fraternity have pointed out white elephant stadiums should be avoided. To not cater for future AFL games in Adelaide and Perth would be plain stupid.
December 11th 2009 @ 8:58am
$1 Billion Compensation for AFL/NRL said | December 11th 2009 @ 8:58am | Report comment
Hang on, the new Adelaide Oval redevelopments are going ahead with or without the World Cup – for the long-term tenants, Adelaide Crows, SA Redbacks and Port Adelaide Power.
How is the World Cup bringing this to fruition in any sense at all?
No benefit to the AFL in Adelaide, who knows about the Gold Coast, and any redevelopment in Perth will also go ahead with or without the World Cup?
Tell me where the benefit is there for the AFL? These are things that are going to happen anyway (Adelaide & Perth) or we don’t know yet (Gold Coast).
AFL should be very careful not to sign a blank cheque – it is monetary compensation they should be after, not contra deals on stadiums that will be built anyway.
December 11th 2009 @ 12:14pm
AndyRoo said | December 11th 2009 @ 12:14pm | Report comment
Adelaide oval won’t go ahead without the World Cup. The 150m from the Commonwealth Government of Australia is only coming if the World Cup bid gets up.
December 11th 2009 @ 7:49am
formeropenside said | December 11th 2009 @ 7:49am | Report comment
I dont understand why the NRL or AFL would even pretend to support the bid. Be obstructive – its not your game, and cant help your game.
December 11th 2009 @ 8:13am
sheek said | December 11th 2009 @ 8:13am | Report comment
Or to paraphrase a famous line from the famous movie ‘Shawshank Redemption’ – be obtuse.
This is an awkward situation for AFL & NRL. Sure, why should they go out of their way to accommodate another rival football code? But is it wise to rattle the cage of the FFA, or more precisely, FIFA?
FIFA care more about the world game than they do Australia, but if they come to view Australia as the “last frontier”, you can be sure they will approach the football conquer of Australia with evangelical zeal.
And that would spell a heap of trouble for AFL & NRL.
Besides, I think there’s been too much ‘hot air’, & not enough thought into how the other codes might realign their seasons.
December 11th 2009 @ 11:59am
Michael C said | December 11th 2009 @ 11:59am | Report comment
FIFA cares a truckload about the FIFA WC, they derive about 90% of their revenue from it.
If they have any doubts about Australia – - and that might include AFL/NRL exemptions – - then FIFA would be hopeful it doesn’t go there,
however, it IS a vote though by delegates isn’t it??
I still just reckon the bid is doomed to failure if for no other reason – than that the FFA is unilaterally organising it, but, requires multl-lateral concessions and compromise from the other codes in ways that are pretty unfair to ask of anyone in a competitive environment.
December 11th 2009 @ 12:08pm
Mr said | December 11th 2009 @ 12:08pm | Report comment
Do you think FIFA has become the largest and wealthiest sporting body globally by running scared of other sports? Governments run scared from FIFA (Iraq and Chile most recently). FIFA will conquer a frontier if it exists – this is playing into the hands of our bid. This parochial little discussion is keeping our bid on the sports pages around the world.
December 11th 2009 @ 12:24pm
BigAl said | December 11th 2009 @ 12:24pm | Report comment
This sounds like Pip’s arguement for NOT having the WC here !
If it is true you’d have to be mad not to sympathise with him .
December 11th 2009 @ 12:37pm
Michael C said | December 11th 2009 @ 12:37pm | Report comment
so,…FIFA is an all conquering empire…..and that means we should just roll over and play dead??
funny though you say what you did, I heard a news story about the Copenhagen summit and how the world’s most powerful man came along,…..
….and I’m thinking Wen Jiabao, or Bill Gates, or ….Sepp Blatter,….
stay with me here,…….apparently it was the US President.
December 11th 2009 @ 3:52pm
Paul J said | December 11th 2009 @ 3:52pm | Report comment
As a league fan I’m not a huge fan of “socca”. But i think it would be fantastic to have the WC in Australia.
If we get the WC it will make stupid amounts of money so surely the NRL & AFL can let FIFA know how much they would potentially lose for their games that are moved and get compensation.
December 11th 2009 @ 5:12pm
Tifosi said | December 11th 2009 @ 5:12pm | Report comment
Any compensation wont be coming from FIFA. Why would they host it here if that was the case?
Compensation would come from the federal/state govt. Which means in effect you and I the taxpayer.
Seems the NRL wants 100 million. Small change really. Where is my cheque book !!
December 11th 2009 @ 6:31pm
pete said | December 11th 2009 @ 6:31pm | Report comment
Why would the FFA pay the NRL $100M? FFA could instead buy 8-10 NRL clubs for that money! Russell Crowe paid $3.5M to takeover the Rabbitohs a few years back.
Anyway in the June period they would normally get 15k crowd to a game on a good day. State of Origin matches are played 3 weeks apart in May, June, July (moving these games to an earlier/later time in the year is the only issue)
December 11th 2009 @ 7:30pm
Springs said | December 11th 2009 @ 7:30pm | Report comment
The Knights CEO has said that a two month break would send the Knights broke. State of Origin generates 25 million annually, then there are gate takings, membership, corporate sponsors, food and beverage, merchandise, signage and jumper sponsors.
December 11th 2009 @ 8:41pm
NCB619 said | December 11th 2009 @ 8:41pm | Report comment
And it’s still another 8-12 years until a 2 month break would be constituted…plenty of things can happen in this time. I’ll leave you all to speculate in what could happen.