By David Beniuk
December 19th 2009 @ 3:10am
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Are Gaz, Sonny Bill, and Gower World Cup bound?
It seems logical. Mark Gasnier completes his contract with Stade Francais in June, signs with a Super rugby side for 2010, plays midweek matches on the Wallabies‘ spring tour and heads to the 2011 World Cup. Maybe, maybe not, says Gasnier’s former coach in France, Ewen McKenzie.
The new Queensland boss is one of the few [...]
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rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 10:42am | Report comment
gower will, gasnier might, we’ll see what happens with either victoria or the reds, sonny bill won’t, we all saw his appearance for the bah bahs
sportsfanslife.com said | December 19th 2009 @ 11:00am | Report comment
Was Sonny really THAT bad for the Barbarians? I heard conflicting reports that he was either horrible or aquitted himself well, given his lack of experience? To the untrained eye (mine) he didn’t seem to be that far out of his comfort zone, but I am happy for you to rebutt this…politely of course haha.
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 11:08am | Report comment
the main problem i saw was that he was in the wrong position, rugby league players simply cant be rugby forwards, he didn’t know what to do with himself when competition at the breakdown occured.
Joh4Canberra said | December 19th 2009 @ 12:18pm | Report comment
Forwards? He’s not playing in the forwards in RU. In the Babas match he had 13 on his back and at Toulon he’s also been playing in the centres.
What gets me is people are willing to write him off after seeing him play just one game in Australia — and an exhibition match at that where there’s little opportunity to get the combinations going. He’s actually been doing OK at Toulon. Obviously test footy is a big step up from club footy but he has been making progress.
But honestly, I don’t ever see SBW making the All Blacks (or even the Wallabies) but he might make the Samoan World Cup squad.
And sportsfarlife.com: no, he wasn’t bad in the Barbarians match. Not outstanding, but not bad either.
Angus Boyle said | December 19th 2009 @ 1:42pm | Report comment
And I say simply, “Brad Thorn”.
Shahsan said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:06pm | Report comment
Good but not oustanding lock forward. But very experienced professional.
Lucky Chris Jack has taken a sabbatical and Ali Williams is injured. Will struggle to get a spot if both were around
ohtani's jacket said | December 20th 2009 @ 11:32am | Report comment
Way to appreciate one of the best All Blacks we have.
PastHisBest said | December 20th 2009 @ 5:04pm | Report comment
Yep. He’d be one of the first picked in that team Shashan. Saying he’s just ‘good’ is disingenuous in the extreme.
King of the Gorganites said | December 19th 2009 @ 11:15am | Report comment
those who have foxtel will have noticed a new channel in the last month called euro sports (in addition to the previous euro sports news). they show the top 14 matches so i have seen gaz play a bit more, plus the H Cup games over the last year. i think he looks a lot better when he gets closer to the action(i.e. 12 or 13). in the game against Ulster i barely saw him touch the ball. he didnt look for work and it didnt come to him. i think he is wasted on the wing, though has the potential to make a very good centre.
gower set up a very clever try against stade a couple of weeks ago. the only player in the bayonne backline who performs. look for him to help an improving italian team to the 2011 WC.
havent seen much of $bw. to injury prone.
Wavell Wakefield said | December 19th 2009 @ 9:55pm | Report comment
The problem with Gower is that he tends to operate far too deep behind the gainline.
Corey said | December 19th 2009 @ 12:45pm | Report comment
I think Gasnier will come back to Australia, but not for league. I wouldn’t be surprised if he went for the new Melbourne franchise, but its usually the Waratahs that buy league players. League just does not have enough money to buy him back, and the Dragons don’t look like they need him either to be honest, whereas the Australia Super XV franchises do- they need a match winner, and to get into the play-offs.
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 2:59pm | Report comment
I can’t wait to see SBW in a Manu Samoa jersey next to Seilala Mapusua during the 2011 Rugby World Cup. It would be awesome to see Gasnier and maybe Thurston at the same world cup.
Master Blaster said | December 19th 2009 @ 4:02pm | Report comment
I guess you just don’t care about the lifelong rugby union players that will be displaced from the RWC teams to accomodate those NRL cash grabbers.
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 6:54pm | Report comment
Did you care when those lifelong rugby league players that were displace to accomodate all those rugby union players sign by league for almost 100 years ?
Dogs Of War said | December 19th 2009 @ 6:58pm | Report comment
There aren’t many who didn’t earn there spot. Except for Gareth Morgan who should have just stayed in Union.
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:33pm | Report comment
Are you talking about Garrick Morgan the son of a former Australian rugby league international John ‘Pogo’ Morgan ? Garrick Morgan played rugby league as a junior like you guys like to remind us of Wally Lewis, Micheal O’Connor, Tana Umga and so on.
Master Blaster said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:08pm | Report comment
No. Rugby league was freeing them from being rugby union’s wage slaves. Rugby league provided them with an opportunity.
Gower, Gasnier, SBW etc all opted to run away from well paid careers in the NRL rather than face up to the moral expectations of all decent Australians.
That rugby union unashamedly gave them haven shows the code’s duplicity, spitting in the face of the 1000s of amateur rugby union players and volunteer officials and supporters who built and nurtured the code without receiving so much as a cent.
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:23pm | Report comment
or rejecting Rugby League’s new born proposal under threat that it will lose the code war after 100 years of doing the same to union
Dogs Of War said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:33pm | Report comment
Do you really believe Union is going to conquer League in Australia still? You can’t be that delusional.
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:47pm | Report comment
the NRL will go into financial meltdown, and th eolympics are coming, also union will move towards a more progressive route. one could say the same thing based on ones own experience, either way differences of opinion and a certain amount of zealotness fuels this continual argument. Rugby wil become Rugby one day, it is not known yet whether league will be assimilated or move away from the style completely
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:38pm | Report comment
Rugby union’s wage slaves ? That’s a new one. First it was vichy now its wage slaves. You guys can come up with some classic every week for your codes failure. If the NRL is well paid then they would have left in the first place.
I know 1000’s of rugby league players who never played NRL or got a contract because heaps of rugby union guys was sign out of no where and took their place.
Master Blaster said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:34pm | Report comment
NRL is a failure? What? Hows the ARU club competiton going?
“The World of Rugby According to Siva” will be a big seller when you get it published.
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:42pm | Report comment
For a start rugby has already conquer Western Australia from rugby league . There’s a chance it would conquer Victoria as well from the Storm. Whats your point ?
Dogs Of War said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:48pm | Report comment
What rubbish are you spouting. How many Force/Super 14 games were on Free to Air TV in Perth this year? How many NRL games?
Isn’t the crowd average going downwards for the Force?
It’s going to be scary when the Perth Reds are finally admitted back into the competition. That will put an even further strain on the ARU’s warchest, well what’s left of it, as they will have to prop up the new Victorian team, which the Storm can show isn’t such an easy caper, it does cost a lot of money to build your profile.
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 7:52pm | Report comment
victoria is funded primarily by private equity and harold mitchell, the NRL peeps have openly said they arent looking to expand for atleast another five years, even with the bears knocking at the door with a gift basket and as is discussed in previous articles, free to air tv in the contemporary isnt the be all and end all
Dogs Of War said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:19pm | Report comment
No what the NRL said (more specially Gallop), was that they won’t consider it till 2011. Why? Because they want to see how financially things work out. No point expanding if the game can’t afford it. It’s why the Independent Commission is so important to Leagues future, streamline the structures of the game, and take away plenty of the self interest that exists in the sport administration (as it does in Union). And also take away News Ltd bargaining pay TV rights with itself.
As for the Bears and the Central Coast. That really adds nothing to the game, it’s better that a Sydney club move there from it’s current location to service that market. It’s not like any other codes are really going to take over the area, given how accessible the Central Coast is to approx 8-10 teams.
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:25pm | Report comment
i don’t believe, even with an independant commission (to be controlled by clubs) that the NRL will administer itself to be financially viable, unless they take action into divesting of certain clubs and investing in outside sydney clubs, although i think that they have less in the copher than the ARU does (with crowds and support), which is a bit disgraceful.
Dogs Of War said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:28pm | Report comment
Um it already is a viable competition. It’s actually not that hard to make a viable competition, you just don’t pay players more than the game can afford. It’s that simple really. I get the feeling I am talking to a teenager.
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 12:36pm | Report comment
of course you’re talking to a tennager, geez, its pretty obvious, but more to the point, this is coming from the same competition who’s participants are asking for a removal of the salary cap so that the clubs would have an ability to pay above the means of the clubs, the actual clubs are they ones who keep the NRL sustainable, not the teams, and that means it is not independantly sustainable in terms of its design.
Dogs Of War said | December 20th 2009 @ 12:42pm | Report comment
They are asking for the removal of the 3rd Party Sponsorship cap, not the salary cap.
Though other things could be done with the salary cap, like having a secondary level, where you can pay over the salary cap by up to say 500K, but for every dollar you go over, you have to pay an extra dollar back to the NRL. This money could then be used to help struggling clubs, or go to bush teams to give back to the areas that make the game.
As for what the NRL has compared to the ARU, it just doesn’t compare. It’s not like the ARU is going to have the World Cup come around again for quite some time, so there will be nothing there to boost the coffers. The NRL on the other hand can potentially raise the next TV deal quite considerably (especially if they do relax the anti-siphoning agreement).
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 4:14pm | Report comment
the ARU are going to have 32 game per season when the super rugby tournament is expanded into victoria, and the victorians team will have the private equity behind it, the olympics will come around in 2016 with rugby, pssoibly between 2011-2015 there will be a reajustment of rules, as the northern hemispher are waking upto themselves and the NRL will no longer have the guaranteed backing of news ltd, which anyone, whether a leaguey or rugger has to agree that they helped prop it up sometimes. I do agree that right now the sport is in a bit of strife, but that will change, and the contest at the breakdown is better than the 5 tackles and play of league
Master Blaster said | December 20th 2009 @ 4:51pm | Report comment
Oh please. Dream on! News Ltd has been underpaying the NRL on television rights since it was formed. News Ltd has been bleeding millions from the NRL every year to repay what is blew on Super League. Just stick to commenting on RU’s future.
Dogs Of War said | December 20th 2009 @ 4:52pm | Report comment
Please stop, you have no idea of what News Ltd provide to the NRL, and how there relationship affects what they are getting paid, and future direction of the code.
As for your 32 games? It’s actually 16 games that a Victorian team will play (exclude finals). 8 of those at home. (They play everyone in there conference once, and play 4 teams from each of the other 2 conferences).
I tell you what, you go and actually read up on BOTH GAMES, as you just have no idea of the history of either. Read up on the Super League war, read up on some of the great games of Union we had all the way up to 2003 (Especially get a copy of the 2000 Bledisloe). I think you need to really understand what’s happened in these codes to see how good they can be, and what’s caused them to get to the points they are currently.
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 5:24pm | Report comment
if i have no idea, then it is only consequential that noone else, except news ltd themselves and the NRL know whats happening, so don’t lecture me on what i know and don’t know. it is quite common knowledge that the NRL is financially inviable, even if it is popular. As for rugby league, there where a couple of preffesional leageuys in my family for western suburbs, onto rugby union, i have been alive for a while, i didn’t wake up to suddenly be interested in Rugby a couple of months ago.
there is a certain amount of human error in opinion, as opinions are based upon personal experience.
Master Blaster said | December 20th 2009 @ 5:29pm | Report comment
“there is a certain amount of human error in opinion,”
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 5:32pm | Report comment
well you certainly havent contributed to pinion, but rather slander, ill take you seriously when you come up with proper rebuttals
Dogs Of War said | December 20th 2009 @ 5:54pm | Report comment
Why should he? You make statements like “. it is quite common knowledge that the NRL is financially inviable” with no proof whatsoever. How is it common knowledge? Why is your spelling so bad? Show me where the NRL has gone overboard by raising the salary cap to levels the clubs can’t afford? Why they have NOT announced new teams yet, as they want to ensure the game has enough money from the next TV deal. Why the game has done exceptional well to survive, and since prosper from what Super League did to the game, and the free kicks it gave to it’s competitors.
You also don’t comment on how that although the Super 15 will mean marginally more money, how will this change things given it will be divided by 5 teams now (so you need at least a 20% increase just to maintain the status quo), while the teams also have to play more games now, so will this mean that the players demand more money?
How will Union Internationals go attendance wise up against AFL and NRL finals series? Will the interest be there? Will they even be seen on TV before midnight anywhere in Australia?
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 6:08pm | Report comment
Victorian selection for super 15: http://www.thesuper15.com/news/viewarticle.asp?id=22613
Financial unviability: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/03/05/2507796.htm
http://www.leagueunlimited.com/article.php?newsid=18690
just for some kick: http://www.cathnews.com/article.aspx?aeid=13782
as for spelling and interest in Rugby, Rugby will always atract a large enough audience to broadcast in one way or another and pardon for misstyping, on these new doodily dads call ed computers, i forgot to think that commenting requires spelling correction rather than understanding opinion
Dogs Of War said | December 20th 2009 @ 6:16pm | Report comment
Your using a link from Tony Zappia who was sacked from Cronulla due to his under the table dealings, and Cronulla being the poorest club in comp, as proof that all clubs are under the hammer? Just Cronulla is under the hammer as Sydney has too many teams.
As for the link from LU, that is just the League being smart, saying that their is a good likelihood that alcohol and gambling sponsorship may be banned in not such a long term, so the NRL is planning for that eventuality. If this happens, it will effect all sports very hard.
As for you kick..given what the Union players are getting up to, the grass isn’t any greener on the other side. And TV audiences for Rugby Union (both on free to air, and Pay TV) are going backwards. How long before it’s only shown after midnight because nobody cares….
As for your last edit, good spelling and grammar makes us believe that you made an effort to explain your opinion. I do realise you kids these days don’t have time for those sorts of things, but think again when an older fella is interviewing you, I love to get you to answer a few questions which require you to write the answers down, just so I can see if you are literate or not. I suggest you get some practice in.
rugbyfuture said | December 20th 2009 @ 6:34pm | Report comment
hold on, i just need to go and read some of your articles…….oh
Dogs Of War said | December 20th 2009 @ 7:25pm | Report comment
Take way too long to get links posted on this site. My comment with links will probably appear tomorrow.
Joh4Canberra said | December 21st 2009 @ 3:34pm | Report comment
@Dogs Of War: if you’re going to pull rugbyfuture up on his spelling you’d better make sure that you get yours right as well. I spotted a “your” when it should have been “you’re” in one of your posts.
Anyway, I’m not saying this to be critical of you, but just pointing out that it’s quite easy to make spelling mistakes when typing — much easier in fact than when writing by hand. I find that when I’m writing by hand I don’t really make any spelling mistakes but when typing on a computer I do. Something for you to bear in mind before commenting on what others have written.
Campbell Watts said | December 22nd 2009 @ 1:00pm | Report comment
Dogs and Rugbyfuture,
Your on-going spat is really getting a bit tired fellas. Some of us like to read these comments for interesting opinions and points of view.
Take it somewhere private eh? Stop cluttering up the comments and leave the rest of us to debates.
Rin said | December 21st 2009 @ 7:02pm | Report comment
Ha ha Dogs of War you are nuts the Force are a success here in Perth, they have big money sponsors…. are pretty much the third biggest attended games in Perth after the Eagles and Dockers, the Western Reds are a joke, NRL is truely dead in the ground here, there are like 4 clubs sides with one grade and all they get is man a dog to come down and watch them while Union has plenty of teams that stretch from Colts to 5th Grade all the way to 1st grade…Perth is Rugby country mate (that is after AFL of course), ppl dont even know what league is over here.
Springs said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:23pm | Report comment
??? Rugby League was never in control of WA, AFL is the dominant code, so there is no way Union could ‘conquer’ WA by taking over League.
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:27pm | Report comment
there really isn’t any competition with the AFL, because it is a very popular and good sport, but i believe they were talking of the more direct league-union rivalry, there is room for three codes in australia
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:29pm | Report comment
Why is it that when a league vs rugby post comes up every league fan mention soccer as the number one sport on this planet and AFL in Victoria and WA ? Hello….we all know who is king in WA and Victoria.
When the Western Reds (RIP) were in Perth im sure rugby league had a bigger profile and playing numbers than rugby and now its the other way around. Bingo.
Master Blaster said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:35pm | Report comment
Really? The Force caused the demise of the Reds? Loving your stuff siva.
siva samoa said | December 21st 2009 @ 12:00am | Report comment
I was talking about international rugby league. The world is not Australia.
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:10pm | Report comment
It does cost alot to run a team in melbourne. The Storm had to sell their game as there was stuff all people interested or playing league in Victoria when the Storm started. Rugby has a history and a profile in Melbourne and all those rugby fans and clubs who had been waiting for professional rugby to come to melbourne will have their wish come true in 2011. Storm have been in Melbourne for over 10 years and still no local player has played for the Storm . Despite the Storms winning two premiership title and making the finals in the last four years rugby union still have more players in clubs and schools than rugby league.
The ARU has money coming from News limited, sponsors and huge crowds from international game. Two international matches by the Wallabies at ANZ stadium makes more money than the whole rugby league world cup.
Dogs Of War said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:14pm | Report comment
Melbourne Storm have pllenty coming through the ranks, with their U20 team having a whole host of Victoria players (and they won the comp).
While Rugby Union being such as hot property in Melbourne, moved from Channel 7’s prime time slot on Saturdays, to after midnight. Your kidding yourself if you think that Union has anything but a niche in that market.
And as for News Ltd, you do realise you aren’t getting much more money for the new contract, and that money needs to be divided around another team.
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:30pm | Report comment
its actually bigger because of the new zealand and south africa deals which come with the equal contract dividing for the News ltd deal
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:38pm | Report comment
Im sorry if I got that wrong Rubert Murdoch. So how is life with your new wife Rubert ? How the baby and when did you meet with SANZAR and told them that they weren’t getting much more money ?
TV ratings. If I had a father inlaw who was a one eye rugby league fan I would buy him the 2009 Australian TV ratings results for Xmas.
Try playing numbers, juniors and school rugby numbers.
Springs said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:19pm | Report comment
Jeremy Smith was raised in Melbourne and played junior footy in Melbourne, effectively making him a local junior.
Master Blaster said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:41pm | Report comment
Professional rugby came to Melbourne in 1998 via the Storm.
The Victorian government is building a stadium for the Storm. The new Melbourne Cuckoos are going to nest in it in the Super 15s but they did nothing to bring about its coming into reality.
Not one stadium has yet been built in Australia because of public demand to watch a RU game.
Crow all you want about RU around the globe, but in Australia it is a passing interest one or two evenings a year to a few Australians north of the Murray River.
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:52pm | Report comment
Is that the same stadium the Victorian goverment promise the ARU it would built if Melbourne gets a place in the super 14 ? The stadium is not just for the Storms but for rugby and soccer as well. The idea came from Melbourne trying to get a super 14 team. Do your homework.
One or two eveings a year is how many times Australia rugby league fans get to see their international team in action . Australia is a very huge place and I wouldn’t grow about if I was a league fan too until you put N in the NRL.
Dogs Of War said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:57pm | Report comment
You see you miss the point, people want their own local teams. Ones they can see each week at a convenient timeslot.
Even moving to the new format, it is only going to provide 16 games, with the Union Internationals then going up against the AFL and NRL finals series. It will be very interesting how that works out for Union, the ARU has some big balls in trying to pull that one off. Tribal passions of AFL/NRL club supporters vs Supporting an Australian team which really is playing for nothing.
Master Blaster said | December 19th 2009 @ 9:04pm | Report comment
Here we go again – the world according to siva.
The Victorian government negotiated to get the Origin and Kangaroos games to Melbourne in return for their funding the new stadium. The decision to put in the Force instead of Melbourne obviously was irrelevant to the decision to build the stadium because they are building the stadium.
It must irk you something shocking that rugby league is the main game in NSW and Queensland. It’s been that way for over 100 years now. You’ll be waiting a long time for that to change. Even if it happens, it won’t be RU that comes out on top.
Of course, on the Roar you can feel like RU is a lot bigger than it really is. Kind of a virtual reality for RU fans who can imagine alternative worlds actually exist.
siva samoa said | December 21st 2009 @ 12:05am | Report comment
FROM THE OFFICE OF THE PREMIER, MINISTER FOR SPORT AND RECREATION
DATE: Friday, November 19, 2004
BRACKS GOVERNMENT PLEDGES NEW STADIUM FOR RUGBY BID
The Bracks Government today backed Victoria’s bid for a Melbourne-based rugby union team by pledging a new $100 million stadium at Olympic Park.
Premier Steve Bracks said State support to create a dedicated rectangular stadium could tip the balance in favour of Melbourne scoring a new Super 14 team.
“The timing of rugby union’s bid for a Melbourne team is an ideal opportunity to create a new mid-sized stadium catering for rugby union, rugby league and soccer,” Mr Bracks said.
Melbourne and Perth have been shortlisted to host a fourth Australian team in the expanded Super 14s international rugby union competition from 2006 with final bids closing today. The Australian Rugby Union is expected to decide next month which city gets the nod.
Mr Bracks said Victoria’s backing of the stadium proposal and infrastructure upgrade at Olympic Park was subject to Melbourne winning its rugby union bid.
“This exciting proposal will result in a purpose-built rectangular stadium constructed by 2008 to seat 22,000 to 25,000 fans in comfort for matches planned to be held year-round,” Mr Bracks said.
The new stadium could potentially host the new Melbourne Super 14 franchise, Melbourne Storm (rugby league) and Melbourne Victory (new A-League soccer team).
Arrangements would be made to minimise the impact on existing users of Olympic Park.
“Construction of any new stadium would commence after the 2006 Commonwealth Games,” Mr Bracks said.
The Minister for Commonwealth Games, Sport and Recreation, Justin Madden, said a new stadium would be an exciting prospect for sport in Victoria.
“While it will immediately cater for professional teams representing Melbourne and Victoria, the flow-on benefits to club and junior playing ranks will provide a real and lasting boost,” Mr Madden said.
“We’d also expect to attract a greater number of drawcard major national and international events to Melbourne featuring our national rugby union, rugby league and soccer teams.”
A recent independent study by Ernst and Young projected a Melbourne-based Super 14 team would generate $14 million a year in economic impact for Victoria.
The Bracks Government would make a significant contribution towards the total cost of the anticipated $100 million new stadium. The balance would be funded by the Melbourne and Olympic Parks Trust (MOPT) from borrowings, offset by revenue from rent, ticket sales, naming rights and sponsorship deals.
A State Rugby Centre in the stadium would be a focal point used to promote community and school-based rugby programs.
Mr Madden said during the 2005-08 seasons, Melbourne Storm, Melbourne Victory and the new Melbourne Super 14 team could continue to play home games at the current Olympic Park stadium.
Chair of the MOPT, Alan Oxley, said once the proposed new stadium opened, the existing Olympic Park complex could be opened to the public for recreational use outside times when major events and elite athlete training were being held.
“This will be a fantastic outcome and result in the Olympic Park precinct expanding its major contribution to Melbourne’s reputation as the nation’s sporting capital,” Mr Oxley said.
http://www.legislation.vic.gov.au/domino/Web_Notes/newmedia.nsf/b0222c68d27626e2ca256c8c001a3d2d/b78c2e8829c9a6adca256f53007cf446!OpenDocument
Where is your link to the ARL and Victorian government meeting to discuss the stadium in return for SOO and kangaroo’s game ?
Barking Glider said | December 21st 2009 @ 4:29am | Report comment
That bid for a Victorian RU team failed. It never happened. The fact that the stadium has now been built is evidence that it was built in response to the Storm and Victory.
Master Blaster said | December 21st 2009 @ 4:38am | Report comment
“These events, as well as the new rectangular stadium at Olympic Park, will boost future interest in rugby league in Victoria, and build on Melbourne’s reputation as the sporting capital of Australia.” http://www.dtf.vic.gov.au/domino/Web_Notes/newmedia.nsf/bc348d5912436a9cca256cfc0082d800/0cc901261835eb7aca25718e00837c62!OpenDocument
Matt said | December 21st 2009 @ 7:43am | Report comment
SO it was originally aimed to be completed by 2008 to house the Melbourne Rebels team. But when they missed out to the Force it was put off by 2 years and will now be opened in time for the 2011 Super 15 season.
That worked out pretty well really for the Melbourne Rebels, as I don’t imagine the books for a team playing out of Olympic Park would be that flash, Storm losing $6M a year anyone!
siva samoa said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:44pm | Report comment
He was born in New Zealand and recruited by the Storm from Runaway Bay on Queensland’s Gold Coast. He wasn’t actually develop by the Storm from junior up to the senior team. A good mate of mine Jake Webster was born in Melbourne but played most of his rugby in Queensland.
Springs said | December 19th 2009 @ 9:08pm | Report comment
Smith played junior footy in Melbourne, making him a Melbourne local junior. I was not born nor do I live in Griffith, but I played my junior footy there, which makes me a Griffith local junior.
Damo said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:50pm | Report comment
I reckon if two ants were racing up a wall and a Roarer posted an article on it it would turn into an argument between League and Union.
rugbyfuture said | December 19th 2009 @ 8:51pm | Report comment
is that a challenge?
PastHisBest said | December 20th 2009 @ 5:13pm | Report comment
Yeah, but was the RL or RU ant winning???
jake said | December 20th 2009 @ 1:33pm | Report comment
You really are a delusional chap Siva. Have you ever met any Victorians?? They follow the AFL Religiously witch is quite a cool game compared to your snooze-fest of a code. Its too late for RU in down here the Storm have been building a valuable niche for the last 10 years. Mention “Rugby” to any Victorian and the automatically think Billy Slater, Greg Inglis, NRL and State Of Origin. Rugby League is a growth Sport Here. Growth will only increase over the next few years aswell with the New Stadium Next Year. Olympic Park was a dogs breakfast of a ground really (Although it had a cool atmosphere) the new purpose built stadium will bring big crowds.
If the independent commission gets up and running before the start of next year one of there most important priorities should be getting Storm and NRL games on free to air television at times before midnight. there is demand for the product.
http://www.facebook.com/home.php#/group.php?gid=17496342779
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/storm-reigns-supreme/comments-e6frf7jo-1225782671996
Of course NRL will never out rate the AFL but interest can only grow if it is on at viewer friendly hours. As for your precious super 14 do u realise it is not even on FTA Television in Australia! I suggest you stick to commenting on Rugby in NZ because you clearly know nothing about the Australian Sporting Landscape! Never mind your Private Schools and clubs The Storm a trying to court the Victorian Public. Thats why there’s a Kwis v Kangaroos test here next may and Origin the following year. Grass roots are developing aswell the under 20s storm side won there grand final with a team stacked full of locals.
The day after the grand final the storm were all over local papers with headlines such as “Welcome to Victoria home of the Rugby League Superpower”. There is a NSW v Victorian rivalry over here and they love beating the New South Welshmen at there own game, Another thing Rugby Union will never have! The Victorians like there sport hard and fast!!
Severian said | December 20th 2009 @ 5:04pm | Report comment
Number of registered league players in Victoria: 800
Number of registered union players in Victoria:5,000
Number of professional league players produced by Victoria since the Storm went there:0
Number of professional union players or coaches produced by Victoria since 1995 (professionalism): 9 or 10, including current Wallabies Digby Ioane and Rocky Elsom, and World Cup winning prop and current Queensland Coach Ewen McKenzie.
Springs said | December 20th 2009 @ 5:59pm | Report comment
Elsom was only born in Melbourne, he went to school in Brisbane. McKenzie played before 95.
Jeremy Smith played junior footy in Melbourne, Tahu was born in Melbourne, Dean Triester was raised in Melboune and played Aussie Rules as a junior, Webster, Polla-Mounter and Wallace are all born in Melbourne.
Dogs Of War said | December 20th 2009 @ 6:03pm | Report comment
How about the Victoria U20’s in the Storm team, who are professional league players. Don’t they count?
siva samoa said | December 20th 2009 @ 7:14pm | Report comment
So the Storms under 20 team are professional rugby league players but all rugby league players from 1920’s to 1990 and the Wigan rugby league teams in the 90’s were semi-pro according to you guys . Which one is it ?
Dogs Of War said | December 20th 2009 @ 7:19pm | Report comment
Your statement was “Number of professional league players produced by Victoria since the Storm went there”
siva samoa said | December 20th 2009 @ 7:42pm | Report comment
I coached and played rugby in Victoria for a couple of years Jake/Sam. Once again if you read my other post everyone here knows which football code is king in Victoria (AFL). Since your a paranoid Kiwi who hates rugby union with passion this is about rugby and league and we don’t need someone from across the tasman giving us history lessons.
Did you ask all millions and millions of Victorians about rugby or did you find that out from another Indian working at the local seven eleven ? Your style of BS agruement is so old school you need to get in line. Every league fans has a Indian, Kiwi friend and then often say ask any Victoran, Kiwi’s or Argentinians that your penis or my penis is big. Your not getting it are you ? Storms has been there for 10 years and yet rugby union still have more numbers of players at school, juniors and club level .
The independent commission will only worry about the NRL clubs so the rest of rugby league will fight for little scraps. Another history lesson from the guy across the tasman. Yes super 14 is not on FTA TV but Im more than happy because there are heaps of rugby from all over the world shown on Foxtel here in Australia. Since your new to Victoria check and see if the SOO or rugby league internationals have been played there in the past. International rugby league is been moved to Victoria because no one in league heartland of sydney wanted to go and watch the games. Check the Melbourne under 20 team and you will find there many players from outside of Victoria as well.
The Warriors were all over the papers in NZ when they made the NRL grand final. Whats your point ?
jake said | December 21st 2009 @ 5:12pm | Report comment
Siva
State of Origin in Melbourne – 1990, 1994, 1995, 1997, 2005, 2009
Test Matches in Melbourne – 1991, 2006, 2008, 2010
Id say Rugby League has had a vested interest here for a while. What the hell are you on about with these Indians and were all sure you have got a big shlong there’s no need to bring it up on a sporting blog. My point with the storm grand final win being all over the front pages of the papers it that it is finally getting through to the public that they have a league team and that there quite good. I was in town today and saw three dudes wearing storm jerseys. Do you think the Rebels are going to conquer Melbourne from RL with the same or less coverage from the AFL mad media?? and no FTA coverage. The fact that NRL games haven’t been shown on free to air at decent times over the storms last four years can only be explained as incompetence from the NRL. Its a missed opportunity, this is going to change though the demand will get too high. Dont worry about your junior clubs the VRL has 13. Whats more important is the profile that the Storm already have, there on TV adds and every thing. No but the Rebels will come in and take this all from them. Keep Dreaming bud
Severian said | December 20th 2009 @ 9:12pm | Report comment
McKenzie won a World Cup as a player in 1999, and if you’re not going to count Elsom, you can’t count the league guys who were born there then moved either.
McKenzie and Ioane both played schoolboy rugby in Melbourne until their mid to late teens.
Also the Storm’s under 20 team are semi pros from Queensland and NSW, not genuine locally produced players.
Can you even name one regular first grader who is legitimately from Melbourne? Considering the financial support they’ve received from News ltd, and the amount of success the Storm has had on the field, they should be smashing union in terms of local juniors, crowds, etc.
Springs said | December 21st 2009 @ 1:16am | Report comment
If you count Ioane, I count Smith. Dean Triester was born and raised in Melbourne. There’s two. Tahu lived in Melbourne until he was 12, does that count?
Crosscoder said | December 21st 2009 @ 5:44am | Report comment
Severian
Wouldn’t be the same semi pro under 20 Toyoata cup teams that are giving S14 a run for its money on Pay TV.
Bit like the Force in WA with many Eastern staters.Pro teams and semi pro teams bring in players from wherever.The Swans did and still do it in the AFL.Hell the Brumbies are in the majority blow ins.
Rugby league is being played(in mnay guises)in many schools primary and high in Victoria, compared to years ago when there was sweet fannie adams
Rugby league had virtually a zero base on which to build in 97 in that state,compared to union having the luxury(as they discriminatory do) of access to the private schools for decades.
iI’ll stick with the 25% increase in junior registrations in 2008,and the 30% increase increase in junor registrations in 2009(as per official ARL stats).
Hmm1 we were told the ARC team the Rebels would have big crowds due to union being well established in that state.If they were so depserate to have a team and were union fanatics,they would have supported this semi pro comp.They didn’t.
Crosscoder said | December 21st 2009 @ 5:55am | Report comment
Rugbyfuture.
You appear quite emphatic that the NRL will not expand in the next 5 years,yet ignore recent history(as apppears to be some union people’s tendency).
Funny the same thing was said to other aspirants including the Gold Coast a few years back.In fact the GC was knocked back and Searle was about to throw in the towel,but persevered, and the GC got in the following year,despite the NRL having no plan for expansion.
Suggest you read the latest figures provided in today’s SMH shwoing just how popular rl is on TV.Being very popular tends to get you a bigger TV deal,anmd more so when News Ltd pulls out of the joint NRL venture.
News ltd has alo stated categorically that it will ensure the Storm’s future short term and long term via private equity down the line.
Let me just quote what Gallop actually said re expansion”There is no plan for exapnsion in teh immediate future’.Then he goes on,when asked to clarify the situation “if an area comes up with a submission that is financially self sustainable and contributes to the NRL income ,that is another matter”.
Much as it appears you would like the NRL to remain stifled,don’t put your house on it,you may end up living in a tent.
rugbyfuture said | December 21st 2009 @ 8:54am | Report comment
news ltd when they pull out will still have a moratorium on the first and last bidding rights for a few years down the line anyway, It would be a huge rarity for a new club to be established in the sydney area given the idea that so many clubs already are financially implausible. i do understand that the NRL is gaining figures, but overall the game is unsustainable.
JF said | December 21st 2009 @ 6:01pm | Report comment
It doesn’t matter how many people in QLD and NSW watch RL, or how much money the NRL make from this viewership, RL will always struggle to expand into new areas – simple. This is one of the defining features of RL – it is regional. Look at the UK, how far have the super league been able to expand in the last 100 years? Nth Wales, London? RL has true heartlands in Australia, heartlands where no other code will ever challenge them. RL should be proud of these areas and reward them with teams/games, not pour millions into expansion in some pissing contest with rival codes. For those who will say “If you don’t expand – you die” maybe true, but isn’t Sydney expanding? Isn’t Brisbane expanding? Isn’t the entire population of NSW, QLD expanding all the time?
The reason RL will struggle to expand interstate, is that is chasing the same crowd that go to the AFL, both are ‘the peoples game’. They both appeal to the same type of punter, this is why futbol and RU can succeed in expansion, but RL and AFL will not. RU will never challenge RL in NSW or QLD, it will never challenge AFL in the other states, but what it is good at, is creating an identity of an alternative. RL is seen as a direct competitor to AFL, RU is not seen in the same way, it will be able to attract a crowd and build a greater rugby culture in Melbourne.
Rod said | December 21st 2009 @ 6:15pm | Report comment
rugbyfuture, you said it would be a huge rarity for a new club to be established in the sydney area given the idea that so many clubs already are financially implausible.
What new club would that be and why wouln’t a team from outside Sydney be considered?
If you are talking about the CC, well they wouldn’t be a new team, they’d be an old team.
Plus wouldn’t the NRL want an 18th team to stop the bye coming into play?
Say somewhere like Perth?
King of the Gorganites said | December 21st 2009 @ 7:28pm | Report comment
the fact is that RL tried to expand into Perth and they failed. they cant od it again. the force simply are a force in WA. they will only get bigger now they are in a rectangle stadium.
same applies for adelaide- RL failed in there expansion there. the RU 7’s in March is going to be the biggest yet. early talk is a crown of over 80K for the 2.5 day event.
stick to the heartlands RL (i.e a few counties in Northern England and sydney and Brisbane).
BN said | December 22nd 2009 @ 1:27pm | Report comment
And RU is failing in it own heartlands in Australia. Its as simple as that. And no matter how much spin you put on it King is not going to make RU seem bigger here. Its a dying code down under which the Administrators and fans (well except for you) are constantly debating on how to improve/save it.
Lets put Union into perspective here.
Australia- 4th biggest sport and falling fast.
Europe- Maybe 4th biggest sport, behind the likes of Soccor, Cycling, Basketball, Handball etc.
World- Not even in the top 10 (especially with paticipation rates). It is beaten by the likes of Soccor, Cricket, Field Hockey, Tennis, Volleyball, Ping Pong etc.
So like most RL fans on this site I do realise that Union is bigger on the world stage but with the spin you put on it King you would think it was taking over the world when it clearly isn’t. In fact it is starting to shrink at club level (even overseas) and if the grassroots die, the tenuous claim of Union being true world sport will die with it. I think the Adminstrators breathed a sigh of relief when Sevens was included in the Olympics (at least they Score tries in Sevens). This has help breath life into what has become a dull and boring game, especially at the international level that you hold so dear.
Rod said | December 21st 2009 @ 8:21pm | Report comment
Well if the RL teams are a failure, the Rugby Union should just give up completely seeing as every one of their ARC teams failed.
Sound about right King of the Gorganites?
I mean, it’d be a waste of time putting any union teams back in wouldn’t it, they failed before so they’d fail again huh?
King of the Gorganites said | December 21st 2009 @ 8:44pm | Report comment
the ARC was a semi-professional competiton at best. RU has proven that when it expands (i.e the Force) they do it successfully (except for fire-power). RL has plenty of money but the people simply did not buy it.
face the facts RL has continually failed to expand beyond its heartlands.
heard of the celtic crusaders? they have had to retreat to North Wales, a stone throw from RL heartland. they couldnt handle it down south where rugby is King.
rugbyfuture said | December 21st 2009 @ 8:59pm | Report comment
and to add that the teams werent actual failures the administration of the competition was, the teams set out a way to reduce costs in the next year but the ARU halted it because they werent thinking ahead
Master Blaster said | December 21st 2009 @ 9:22pm | Report comment
Face the facts King of the Gorganites RU in Australia is 4th placed football code. Your fortunate that there isn’t another code for you to fall behind. Feel smug about RU around the world if helps you, but in Australia your code is irrelevant to most Australians lives.
Crosscoder said | December 22nd 2009 @ 5:41am | Report comment
The NRL is unsustainable sheesh on its current format.They are being diddled ATM in the TV contracts ,but after the latest report showing on an aggregate basis they are more than matching AFL,methinks they are in for a far far better TV deal.
And if we are talking about clubs having financial problems,suggest the Reds with their crowds are hardly setting the world on fire.
“The ARC weren’t actual failures”.what is the definition of failure? small crowds,losing money,no TV interest.Oh that’s right they gave some up and comers a go.The ARU spent large sums in advtg”you won’t know them now,but you soon will”
JON at least knew a dud when he saw one and this comp spelled it out in spades.
Club union left this comp for dead in passion,committment and a times crowds and of course history.
Just a little note on the worth of the Storm jumper by a survey group called Repucom in 2008 29/10.”Melbourne storm have laid claim to the best value playing strip in australian sport.storm’s strip has been estimated to return more than $15.8m for its 5 major sponsors.The return is an increase of nearly 40% from 2007.65% from 06,and 250% from 05.
Storm’s jersey front and back is valued at more than $4.2m”
That is another reason in addtion to the money that teams being in a major city brings to TV contracts,that both News Ltd/the NRL will ensure the long term viability of that team.
King of the G.You have done it again my friend”failed to expand beyond its heartlands”.Since when is Victoria a rl heartland,and NZ Warriors is hardly in a huge rl area(the home of union).
Sorry to disappoint but a the WARL is already plannning for entry into the NRL.And there are as many juniors playing rl now in WA ,as there were in the Perth Reds days.I can understand the Force would not be happy to have another competitor in their market.Especially one that entertains.
Just a little reality check on your cynical shot at heartlands for rl..It was noted(in a NZ column) that the last RUWC of 2007 ,secured the overwhelming majority of its audience from the 8 countries where it has a decent presence.yet the game is supposedly played in over 150 countries.Maybe union shpould just stick to the 8 countires involved.Hey what!i
Judging by the TV ratings 7s unions gets,they could have a nude event and it would barely blip on the radar in the city of churches,even with 80,000 or 4 billion in attendance..
Redb said | December 22nd 2009 @ 6:18am | Report comment
re Tv contracts and aggregrate ratings – can you provide an independent report? or where it has been published?
Masters numbers are way out on the regular season cumulative TV audience according to other analysis.
King of the Gorganites said | December 22nd 2009 @ 1:11pm | Report comment
another example of league losing its heartlands……
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/breaking-news/sport/rugby/tony-switches-codes-14607108.html
Master Blaster said | December 22nd 2009 @ 1:22pm | Report comment
Oh yeah. Big loss! The end of rugby league is nigh!
“after being released by Hull, was unable to find another Super League club.”
Then the best he could do in RU was a “National League Two rugby union side.”
Take your blinkers off King of the Gorganites. You’re becoming a tiresome bore.
Barking Glider said | December 22nd 2009 @ 1:35pm | Report comment
King of the Gorganites you’ve stooped too low this time. How is an unwanted NRL and Super League player joining a 3rd tier rugby club, now living in Hull but developed in New Zealand, got anything to do with a breaking down in RL heartlands? Even by your standards that is delusional.
Sad that you would trawl the web to find such stories and sadder still that you would post it here.
Campbell Watts said | December 22nd 2009 @ 1:12pm | Report comment
I dont think Gaz is that great at union.
The Top14 games I’ve seen he was a bit of a non-event – stuck out on the wing and had little impact when he got the ball. The Toulon game in particular comes to mind – I think he got burned twice for trys down his side!
Gower will make it cause the Italians don’t have much in the 10 department, and he’s been playing quite well – he seems to have adjusted to the 15 man game well!
Sonny won’t get close to making the AB’s I’m afraid!
King of the Gorganites said | December 24th 2009 @ 1:44pm | Report comment
merry Christmas all.
Let the war resume in 2010.