Non-Australian expats growing the AFL game
Roar Guru
By Michael C, 7 Jan 2010 Michael C is a Roar Guru
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For many people – and fairly so – the traditional view of Australian Football ‘clubs’ outside of Australia was of beer swilling ex-pat Aussies getting together for a social kick and a more social after match.
Gradually, we’ve seen more and more clubs and leagues overseas evolve to the point that ex-pat Aussies are often the minority, and in many cases, by some great proportion.
But does it still require ex-pat Aussies to start up clubs? Again, traditionally, this would be so. But this is no longer the case.
Example in point: the brand new University of Birmingham Sharks footy club.
Now ready to tackle the competition, the Sharks’ 22 man roster includes no Aussies and only founder, President and captain Tim Smith has any playing experience.
Smith discovered the game of Australian Football early in 2009, as a foundation player for the Birmingham Bears. The side finished runners up in the Central England region.
Smith, and team mate Ian Mitchell, have both gone on divergent ‘expansion’ paths — Mitchell with the formation of new senior team, the Wolverhampton Wolverines.
Meanwhile, Smith ran a stall at the University of Birmingham Sports Fair last September which has led to the establishment of the United Kingdom’s fourth active university-based club.
The Sharks report that they begin season 2010 by hosting 2008 Wales ARFL champions, the Cardiff Double Blues on 30th January, before embarking on a schedule that includes hosting Portsmouth, Huddersfield, Birmingham Bears and Wolverhampton, as well as visiting Cambridge, Chichester and Leeds Met Universities.
Footy in the UK is progressing quite nicely just for now. And, as per other examples, when Aussies need not apply to ensure expansion/formation and continuation, then the game itself is all the better for it.
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SideShowBob said | January 7th 2010 @ 2:29am | Report comment
Always great to see, but wait until you hear what is happening in Italy!
Michael C said | January 7th 2010 @ 5:10am | Report comment
I’d like to point out that it’s the short sighted theRoar editors who placed ‘AFL’ in the title of this article.
Totally in appropriate,
I used “Australian Football”,
for a couple of clear reasons,
1. that it is certainly not ‘official’ AFL policy or action/funding that is being illustrated,
and
2. the local variants of the game is often an ‘un-official’ variant such as 9s or 12s,
The editors of theRoar need to acknowledge that the game of ‘Australian Football’ is bigger than just the AFL.
SideShowBob said | January 7th 2010 @ 6:39am | Report comment
Couldn’t agree more.
“Australian Football” is the correct title for the sport, atleast it was the last time I check in with AFL. “Aussie Rules”, “Aussie Rules Football” and “Footy” are accepted diminutives.
The AFL (Australian Football League) is but one of many national controlling bodies, albeit by far the most prominent and influential, that can be now found all over the world.
What needs to be done to change the “AFL” tab above (just below the roar logo) to the correct title?
BigAl said | January 7th 2010 @ 1:44pm | Report comment
I’d agree with all this – but getting the name changed on The Roar will be an uphill battle given the influence of the Zavos clique !
. . . let’s see how long this post stays up …
rojo727 said | February 5th 2010 @ 6:53pm | Report comment
Michael C – I recall a few years back that the now chair of the AFL Commission, Mike Fitzpatrick, called on state based administrators such as Football Victoria to change their names to AFL (insert state here).
I also note that the former Football Victoria have done this, becoming AFL Victoria. This despite the fact that AFL Victoria is not a subsidiary of the AFL.
His point was that the term ‘AFL’ be used as a branding tool to better promote the sport of Australian Rules Football. I don’t see why this web site shouldn’t call the sport AFL if that is what various administrative bodies not connected with the AFL call this form of football themselves.
Bob Dobalina said | January 7th 2010 @ 7:03am | Report comment
Ditto – if you have head titles of League rather than NRL, Rugby rather than Super 16, Australian Football for consistency if nothing else.
Paul J said | January 7th 2010 @ 8:41am | Report comment
…albeit by far the most prominent and influential…
Not in terms of TV viewers but I’d say possibly still number one due to crowd figures.
bever fever said | January 7th 2010 @ 12:27pm | Report comment
I dont think he was comparing the AFL to rugby league but the AFL to SANFL to the WAFL etc as a name, or a controlling body.
netrug said | January 7th 2010 @ 8:59am | Report comment
I have been informed by a Georgian colleague that Aussie Rules is alive, well and kicking in Georgia. Unfortunately, I don’t know iwhat form it takes or how many teams.
There was a move to get the bame started in Russia in the early 1990s but floundered for lack of support by the AFL.
Is the game played in any other eastern European nation?
True Tah said | January 7th 2010 @ 9:08am | Report comment
netrug is that Georgia the US state or the Georgia whose capital is Tbilisi?
Aaron from worldfootynews.com said | January 7th 2010 @ 9:12am | Report comment
The Atlanta Kookaburras and their Georgia local league play plenty of Australian rules football in the southern US state of that name also
netrug said | January 8th 2010 @ 10:36am | Report comment
I was referrring to the country Georgia in eastern Europe.
Aaron from worldfootynews.com said | January 7th 2010 @ 9:11am | Report comment
Netrug – in Eastern Europe there are a couple of clubs. The Czech Lions are the national team of the Czech Republic, with a metro league in Prague. Ditto for the Croatian Knights who have a metro league (including Zagreb Hawks and Agram Power) in Zagreb. I know some guys who are looking for players to start clubs in Lithuania and Poland, but they haven’t been successful as yet.
Regards Russia, there was apparently a guy from a Rugby League club in Moscow called the Threshers who wanted to enter a side representing Russia in the EU Cup last year, but it didn’t eventuate.
You want to know where the clubs are, the best resource in my opinion (mostly because I’m one of the people who maintains it
is the World Footy Atlas: http://www.worldfootynews.com/staticpages/index.php/Atlas
Michael C said | January 7th 2010 @ 9:47am | Report comment
Good question.
In a few cases there appears teams representing the Czech Republic, Croatia etc, but beyond that – for now – the main Euro activity has been more Northern and Western.
The main Euro continental leagues are Denmark, Sweden and now Germany and even France.
Other nations with reasonable starting points include Finland, Spain/Catalonia,
outside of that, it’s often more a single ‘club/team’ that effectively represents the country at EU cup level, may have very few matches and mostly 9 aside stuff.
re Georgia – I’ve seen some reference to OziRulz re Georgia, but haven’t heard much more. Perhaps check with your friend whether the Georgia ‘side’ wants to seek to establish a ‘sister’ club relationship with a club in Australia.
SideShowBob said | January 7th 2010 @ 3:01pm | Report comment
I just wanted to add in addition to MCs list that Norway, The Netherlands and Italy are starting up their own domestic national leagues this year. The interesting point with the Italian league is that one of the teams is located in Lugano, just over the border in Switzerland (which will be the first team ever in Switzerland). Potentially Iceland and Andorra as well.
In the last year, additional teams have joined the existing competitions in Austria, Czech Rep, Croatia, France and Scotland – and pretty much everywhere else where it already exists to be honest. A few more new startup teams are expected this year as well, particularly in the UK where the sport is starting to hit the university scene. The current challenge is to get footy into places like Poland, Greece, Ukraine and Russia.
Almost all growth in Europe is taking place within the 9-a-side game, for all the reasons discussed before.
Netrug, I would be very interested to get in touch with your contact in Georgia. We lost contact about 5 years ago with a chap named Sir Qaflan Jandieri: http://australianrulesfootball.com.au/pages/OzirulzGeorgia
Please feel free to send me the details via http://scr.im/eurofooty
Many thanks!
Jay said | January 7th 2010 @ 9:06am | Report comment
By this comparision, Grid Iron is alive and well in Western Sydney – Team GWS have a huge challenge on their hands on wind the heard and minds of the people out here.
Michael C said | January 7th 2010 @ 10:09am | Report comment
?? what’s your point?
(btw – NFL has a far higher profile internationally than Aust Footy, also, a far higher profile in the English speaking world, the US has about 16 times the population of Australia – - – so, 8 Grid Iron teams in Syd/NSW and 6 in Melb/Vic…..by comparison – Aust Footy is doing okay in the UK)
as illustrated below you can see the pointy end of a fair foot print in Britian and Ireland :
Britain
AFL London Premiership – West London Wildcats 11.8 (74) def Wandsworth Demons 10.7 (67) at Barn Elms Reserve, London.
AFL London Conference – Clapham Demons 8.5 (53) def Shepherds Bush 5.7 (37) at Barn Elms Reserve, London.
AFL London Social League – South London Demons 5.7 (37) def Ealing Emus 1.2 (8) at Barn Elms Reserve, London.
Scottish ARFL – Edinburgh Bloods premiers.
ARUK Central – Huddersfield Rams 13.27 (105) def Birmingham Bears 12.12 (84) at Lockwood Park, Huddersfield.
ARUK Southern – Chippenham Redbacks 15.12 (102) def Bournemouth Demons 14.10 (94) at Havant Rugby Club.
ARUK Northern – Newcastle Centurions (163) def Durham Saints (35) at Novocastrians Rugby Club, Newcastle.
Welsh ARFL – South Cardiff Panthers def Swansea Magpies at Pontcanna Fields, Cardiff.
Ireland
Dublin Demons 10.10 (70) def South Dublin Swans 4.11 (35) at St. David’s College, Dublin.
Forgetmenot said | January 7th 2010 @ 10:15am | Report comment
How awesome wouldit be to have the exposure American Football hashad through Hollywood??!!!!!
It would do wonders for the game.
Anthony said | January 8th 2010 @ 8:06am | Report comment
A pity that the Aussie actors are more inclined to the A-league & Sth Sydney NRL!
Jay said | January 8th 2010 @ 8:07am | Report comment
Eric Bana wore the St. Kilda gurnsey in that Seth Rogan film…
Michael C said | January 8th 2010 @ 5:59pm | Report comment
Anthony – didn’t you see Eric Bana giving regular updates of StKilda’s progress last season across a variety of US talk shows?? telling Letterman about the Sainters being 17-0 at one point last year.
For the Telegraph in UK, a StarTrek interview : In the words of Curtis Hanson, who directed Bana in the gambling drama Lucky You, ‘He’s like the old-time film stars. He loves his home, his family, his motorcycles and cars. He’s a man.’ He is also a committed St Kilda ‘Aussie rules’ fan. ‘I’m a bit of a tragi’ – he translates in his Melbourne drawl – ‘football tragic. I go every week if I’m home.’
btw – Nicole Kidman is a Swannees fan, and Hugh Jackman is a big footy fan – - Kidman previously got Tom Cruise into footy such that he even spent his recent birthday in Melbourne at the ‘G watching Collingwood. Kidman meanwhile has been getting Keith Urban along to the footy.
Only thing is – not having ‘private ownership’ any longer, you don’t get the Rusty Crowe or Anthony La Paglia style ‘part owner’ status of ‘movie stars’.
Forgetmenot said | January 7th 2010 @ 10:07am | Report comment
Yes, the growth of football has been incredible in the last few years.
It seems that globalisation is indeed rapidly introducing more and more people to a sport that previously could only be taught by Aussies.
These non-Australians starting their own teams shows just how great our game is, and that we are currently entering into a new era in the growth of football.
Exciting times!
Michael C said | January 7th 2010 @ 10:25am | Report comment
The ‘Soccernomics’ globalisation advocates seem to forget that no sport operates in a vacuum – - and so, globalisation works on a level for the growth of Aust Footy.
Globalisation has offered greater choice – and in simple terms – where there IS a market niche/void (i.e. a code of football sitting comfortably b/w soccer on one side and Rugby/Grid Iron on the other) then there is any form of possibility.
In Australia and the US – soccer already exists – it has for over a century – - the soccernomics folk seem to forget that there is no domestic market demand or existing void awaiting being filled.
However – the limiting factor on all this is that – yep, whilst there’s every reason to believe that from a participation perspective that there is a demand for the product of ‘Australian Football’ – - it’s quite another thing to aspire to toppling existing dominant domestic professional leagues/codes and the cultural footprint of such. But then – - – who needs to ‘topple’ anything??……this is a story about growing something from virtually nothing.
Tifosi said | January 7th 2010 @ 10:58am | Report comment
“it’s quite another thing to aspire to toppling existing dominant domestic professional leagues/codes and the cultural footprint of such”
Hmmm that sounds exactly like what the AFL are trying to do in NSW and QLD.
Michael C said | January 7th 2010 @ 12:01pm | Report comment
QLD and NSW are quite different in this ‘professional’ clubs/presence sense,
i.e. NSW/Sydney is the centre of the NRL world in the same crowded way that Melb/Vic is the centre of the AFL world – - so, toppling talk is non-sensical when comparing a presence 1 or 2 teams vs a historically established 10 of the incumbant.
Brisbane/QLD is another matter, however, the HAL has rushed to a 3 team national league representation and thus equalling the NRL – - and directly on the doorstep of the NRL in each case,
and the NRL has effectively deconstructed the old Bris/QLD top level of Brisbane RL via an NRL hegemony (similar to AFL in Adelaide and Perth) with first the Broncos plus now the Cowboys & TItans.
all this versus the AFL moving from 1 team to 2,
Does that in some respects leave Brisbane (like Ade and Perth) vulnerable to be toppled?? (not necessarily at grass roots/participation – but, at the top prof level). Perhaps Bris/Gold Coast might be MORE vulnerable due to being a larger & more diverse market than Perth or Adelaide??
but – to me, the AFL aren’t on their own in seeking to grow – - but to topple??
QUestion I guess is firstly – is there room for 2 AFL and 3 NRL and 3 HAL clubs in all of QLD across a 12 month calendar year?? If there is – then ‘toppling’ doesn’t really come into it. Brisbane and Gold Coast and QLD as a whole represents a pretty healthy marketplace.
But you’re welcome to suggest the AFL are seeking to topple, – I’d've thought it’s as much ‘co-habit’, to establish and maintain a viable market presence. That’s far from toppling.
Westcoast929406 said | January 10th 2010 @ 2:14pm | Report comment
MC,
Keep posting articles about international footy – Do not worry about the naysayers from Sydney.
Fortunately the QLD sporting community is more open to our game and it appears anecdotally perhaps that Aussie Rules may have equalled the QRU in participation numbers for the first time.
AFLQLD are saying for 2009 103,000 total numbers up from 97,000 in 2008 and only 30,000 in 2000 from when the AFL got serious and according to this link the QRU running about the same all up
http://www.qru.com.au/library/news/2009/091215_participation_numbers_up,70519.html
Anthony said | January 8th 2010 @ 8:08am | Report comment
Nah…just providing an Aussie choice!
Lazza said | January 7th 2010 @ 11:21am | Report comment
Is having a few enthusiasts playing in an amateur league with no crowds, publicity or public awareness a sign of ‘growth’ of the game? Jay is right, by this standard American & Gaelic Football, Ice Hockey, Baseball etc are all ‘growing’ in Australia which is absurd.
In the US there are 22m Football players, 60-70K Rugby players and only 2k Aussie Rules enthusiasts playing on converted soccer fields. America is not a Soccer nation and likes contact sports so why has Aussie Rules done so poorly over there?
Al said | January 7th 2010 @ 1:01pm | Report comment
Americans are homophobic and don’t like seeing men in tight shorts and sleeveless jumpers simulating intercourse on a wide area of grass, except maybe for a select few in San Francisco.
Michael C said | January 7th 2010 @ 1:37pm | Report comment
Yeah, so, the ‘simulating intercourse’ is a good reason that the Rugby codes are really going to struggle,
btw – AFL shorts have been getting baggier in recent times.
Jay said | January 7th 2010 @ 2:06pm | Report comment
The rugby codes are lightyears ahead in the international game than AFL will ever be.
Im not knocking AFL, but maybe its best suited to an Australian game (its done well to expand beyond the VFL).
True Tah said | January 7th 2010 @ 2:25pm | Report comment
Jay,
Australian football is bigger than rugby league in both the US and South Africa.
Jay said | January 7th 2010 @ 2:44pm | Report comment
I highly doubt that. Dont get me wrong, RL is peanuts compared with rugby, but RL participation should exceed 2k – there is a national RL comp with 10 teams currently.
As for south africa, not sure about numbers, but is an amateur competition there. There have been a few south africans to play in the NRL – Jarrod Saffy currently with the dragons and Tiaan Strauss previously.
Having said that, its not really newsworthy or even a sign of growth of RL that its played in america these areas. Anyone who thinks so is kidding themselves.
Jim Wilson said | January 7th 2010 @ 8:32pm | Report comment
TT
Believe it or not there are over 100,000 expat Australian households in the US. Our expat population is third behind the Russians & Israelis.
If say half of these households come from the southern Australian states & they had two kids playing AFL that would be 100,000 players. They have nothing like that of course but there is potential especially in areas where there are enclaves of Australians i.e. Washington.
BTW when has an AFL game ever got a crowd of 12,000 or so (Souths game last year, Wigan & Warrington at Milwaukie) to a game in the US?
Has the AFL a semi-professional competition in the US?
Michael C said | January 7th 2010 @ 9:08pm | Report comment
JW -
re US exhibition matches – firstly, using the Souths vs some SuperLeague English side is a bit of a dodgey comparison as it draws upon both Aust and English expats as well as any Kiwi’s etc who are into Rugby (and not necessarily League).
however – North American exhibition matches over the journey (make of it as you will):
15/1/2006 Los Angeles, USA Intramural Field, UCLA AFL pre-season practice Kangaroos v. Sydney 3,200 (sell-out)
12/10/1990 Portland, USA Civic Stadium AFL post season exhibition Melbourne v. West Coast 14,787
14/10/1989 Miami, USA Joe Robbie Stadium VFL post season exhibition Essendon v. Hawthorn 10,069
12/10/1989 Toronto, Canada Toronto Skydome VFL post season exhibition Geelong v. Melbourne 24,639
16/10/1988 Toronto, Canada Varsity Stadium VFL post season exhibition Collingwood v. Hawthorn 18,500
8/10/1988 Miami, USA Joe Robbie Stadium VFL post season exhibition Collingwood v. Geelong 7,500
18/10/1987 Vancouver, Canada B.C. Place VFL post season exhibition Melbourne v. North Melbourne 7,980
9/10/1987 Vancouver, Canada B.C. Place VFL post season exhibition Melbourne v. Sydney 32,789 (record to date)
26/10/1963 San Francisco, USA Big Rec Stadium Geelong v. Melbourne 3,500
20/10/1963 Honolulu, USA Geelong v. Melbourne 1,500
True Tah said | January 8th 2010 @ 9:07am | Report comment
Jay there are more than 10 Australian Football clubs throughout the USA. The problem with rugby league in the US is that it is limited to those 10 clubs, how many juniors play, most American rugby league players are guys who also play rugby union. I would also suspect that more Americans would be aware of Aussie Rules than rugby league.
Both Jarrod Saffy and Tiaan Strauss were RU players in South Africa, I doubt they would have played rugby league there…in the case of Jarrod Saffy he was playing for Sydney Uni and was unable to land a contract with an Aussie Super rugby team before he started with the Dragons.
captain nemo said | January 7th 2010 @ 11:44pm | Report comment
Jim Wilson Quote “Believe it or not there are over 100,000 expat Australian households in the US. Our expat population is third behind the Russians & Israelis.”
where did you get that info from Jim?? I find that very hard to believe mate. Mexicans, Cubans, Porto Ricons, English, Canadians and Chinese. Plus Indian migration to the US has been massive over the last 20 years. eg, the last cricket world cup, the 2nd largest TV audience in the world was in the US watched by Indian expats. I am happy to stand corrected Jim . when we arrive at an international terminal in the US, the cleaners that come onboard are speaking either Spanish or manderin. Our driver to the hotel is usually an Indian expat. BTW, when referring to enclaves of Aussies in the US, Disneyland and the greyline double decker buses in NY would be my first picks.
True Tah said | January 8th 2010 @ 9:10am | Report comment
I think he was referring to Australian citizens in the US. A lot of the Mexicans, Cubans, etc are probably US citizens.
Michael C said | January 12th 2010 @ 10:01am | Report comment
are US citizens…..or…undeclared??
Jim Wilson said | January 8th 2010 @ 1:07pm | Report comment
Captain Nemo
I got the “3rd biggest expat population etc.” reference from one of these these two books book:
1)Rich Dad Poor Dad by Kiyoski & Lechter
(I think the reference to the expat households is in Chapter 17 entitled,’Overcomimng Obstacles.’)
2) The Millionaire next door
http://www.amazon.com/Millionaire-Next-Door-Thomas-Stanley/dp/0671015206
http://www.amazon.com/Rich-Dad-Poor-Money-That-Middle/dp/0446677450
However, on balance I think you are right. There just can’t be more Australians than the expats of most of those countries you mentioned.
BTW for a good rebuttal of just about everything the book suggests read Nicholas Taleb’s books the ‘ Black Swan & Fooled by the Randomness.’
http://www.fooledbyrandomness.com/
captain nemo said | January 8th 2010 @ 2:16pm | Report comment
no worries Jim, thanks for your reply
VooDoo said | January 12th 2010 @ 9:56am | Report comment
Even if the base is small, those of us who are overseas are consumers of Australian football – and prior to the 1990s there were practically no footy consumers outside of Australia. There are now a couple of dozen people in each of North America, Europe, Africa, Asia and the Pacific who make a living off footy, whether through administering the game, running clinics or in manufacturing guernseys and importing equipment. That would have been unthinkable a few years ago.
More significantly, there is more awareness of international players and fans on Aussies’ behalfs – a lot of clubs offer international memberships, which weren’t offered even last year by my club. And that means there must be a growing market for memberships and merchandise overseas – I know a dozen Canadian players at my local team who have ordered AFL guernseys online to train in or to show support for their teams. And our city imports in the vicinity of $3,000 worth of balls and equipment annually, and we’re one of maybe 50 cities across North America with a footy club. International footy mightn’t be huge, but it sits alongside NSW & Queensland as a primary growth area for the football industry.
Michael C said | January 12th 2010 @ 10:08am | Report comment
“it sits alongside NSW & Queensland as a primary growth area for the football industry.”
and that’s the key thing here,
and we’ve had this discussion with a couple of moderate non-AFL types – where the question was put about the ROI of pushing into NSW/QLD so hard vs a bit more investment on the international front.
Personally I figure, where there may be no absolute correct answer (as the test of time will tell) – that the AFL have had it reasonably right. NSW and QLD are critical expansion markets – but, more so to protect the national status of the game.
The International front had to evolve a bit more, and do so on it’s own merits. It’s the hard yards. The stand out nations have been proving themselves and establishing a base – that wouldn’t otherwise have occurred with purely AFL cash injections (that might only created petty politics and corruption!!).
Going forward from now – 2010 is like Day 1 of a new era.
Because, suddenly in Nat Junior Champs, NSW and QLD will be lined up vs the Oceania and World teams.
How much will future strategies be impacted by the results of the next 5-10 years??
Voodoo – is there tangible excitement in Canadian footy circles?? It’d've been great if a Scott Fleming for example couldn’t had access to a World U16/U18 talent pathway.
Dogz R Barkn said | January 7th 2010 @ 11:25am | Report comment
Some non-aussies want to take up AFL – good luck to them – why are people worrying so much about it?
Lazza said | January 7th 2010 @ 11:52am | Report comment
My sentiments exactly – good luck to them but it’s not a sign of a sport ‘growing’. Until we get AFL quality players that learned their trade in these leagues then it’s just a few amatuer enthusiasts playing an exotic foreign sport.
Every country in the world has those, we have plenty in this country but those sports will never be anything more.
bever fever said | January 7th 2010 @ 12:01pm | Report comment
Carlton has rookie listed a guy from PNG who played all his footy over their bar one season in QLD.
Peter Labi.
Michael C said | January 7th 2010 @ 12:13pm | Report comment
Lazza/Dogz -
the points that we Aust Footy folk can latch on to are :
1. that the game CAN appeal to people not born into the game (that bust’s one of the anti-AFL myths perpetuated by some soccer or Sydney anti AFL folk)
2. that having a couple of thousand participants in the USA is effectively a growth from a zero base with effectively no funding or no coverage other than some vague rememberance of a bit of ESPN coverage back in the 80s.
3. seeing non-Aust ‘expats’ growing the game and doing so successfully and in a variety of locations is effectively a brand new ‘growth phase’ not seen previously.
4. when we consider a couple of thousand here and there in the US or Europe as being a positive sign – then point 3 is on a relative scale a pretty big deal.
5. games – including Baseball in Australia, grow or die.
6. the few amateur enthusiasts is pretty right – thus far. The real exciting move is that from 2010 onwards, there will be both an Oceania Under 16s(*) and a World Under 16s(*) sides competing in the Australian National Championships Div 2.
7. and that there are 2 pretty good young PNG kids (International) rookie listed at Carlton and Essendon, plus a couple of fellows up at GC17 who’ve had an opportunity – it might just mean that it’s pretty well on the cards to achieve the goal of “AFL quality players that learned their trade in these leagues”,
….it’s all just steps, but, in recent times the steps have been more frequent and getting louder. But, it’s relative to the ‘global pool’ of AFL, which is miniscule compared to Soccer, and pretty small relative to Rugby……although, on a global scale the actually world RL participation numbers might not be that far off AFL!!!
(btw – there’s been plenty of Aussies graduate to College, Minors or Majors etc of baseball/grid iron etc…..and that’s without those sports being deemed major players in the Australian context. What’s wrong with that??)
Ken said | January 8th 2010 @ 8:54am | Report comment
“…although, on a global scale the actually world RL participation numbers might not be that far off AFL”
That’s a bit of a stretch, firstly there’s two full professional comps in RL with teams in 4 countries. The participation numbers in these countries alone probably well exceeds AFL’s totals without considering semi-pro and amateur competitions that RL likely wins easily as well.
That said of course, both games are minnows in a world sense and this is not going to change in the foreseeable future. This might be a new road for AFL but it’s a road RL has been on for a long time, looking at small comps around the world just waiting for them to break and become mainstream. By all means, take an interest and provide support but don’t hold your breath and just enjoy what you have.
Michael C said | January 12th 2010 @ 11:12am | Report comment
Ken – once you get past Aust and Eng, there’s not a huge lot.
RL is so often able to leverage off existing RU competitions. Thus, able to access pretty talented players without necessarily having the grassroots/history required for a full start up league/comp.
Reality too in participants – is that in NZ there’s not that many, even in England, the participation isn’t huge, so, quite possibly, the Australian Football domestic pariticipation within Australia might near enough balance out that of RL in Aust, Eng, NZ and Wales? combined.
Beyond that then, I’ve check a lot of the countries in the RL world ‘top 20′, and in some, they don’t have an existing competition, or have only a handful of teams.
Well, the global Aust Footy participation might be able to match here as well.
That’s where I suggest it might not be that far off.
It might be worthy of some investigation. The reality with the RL professional comps is that there’s an awful lot of sharing of the Australian pool of talent, and again, that ability to lure guys from the RU pool of talent (somewhere along the journey).
Michael C said | January 12th 2010 @ 11:48am | Report comment
Okay – rough guide – quick numbers of Wikipedia (dubious or otherwise)
RL Eng + Aust + NZ = ~ 700,000 (total).
AFtbL Australia = ~ 700,000 (total)
AFtbL in Eng + NZ + RSA = ~ 27,500 (total)
PNG is interesting,
wiki puts RL PNG at 15,000 (10K adult),
and AFtbL at 30,000 total (2K adult).
I can’t find a number for RSA.
At any rate – it’s pretty even to this point with potentially the AFtbL just in front.
re adults vs juniors – we could try to distinguish on this basis – but, in Aust for example, WIKI puts RL adults at just over 50,000 vs Aust Footy at 120-130K.
England total participation has apparently jumped from 114,000 in 2005 to 250K or even 285K (depending upon source). Based mainly on greater exposure in schools.
This suggests 2 things – not a huge adult representation, and the 2nd is the question we always raise of at what point a school kid is counted from country to country.
IN Aust it’s normally to be signed/engaged in a program of at least 6 weeks duration (either within school or outside – - – which might also mean some double dipping).
So – all in all, I reckon I’m able to get away with claiming that globally – the total numbers might not be that far apart.
Dogs Of War said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:03pm | Report comment
Whatever makes you happy.
The Link said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:49pm | Report comment
Michael C – if only Australia could split in half and play itself in an international game of Aussie Rules. Otherwise the participation numbers tell you nothing of global reach given the dominance of Australian figures.
A nice theoretical exercise but lets get fair dinkum here, 4 nations have either won the RL world cup or made the final since 1954. If Aussie Rules achieves this in 100 years it will be an imposing achievement.
Jim Wilson said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:54pm | Report comment
Michael
What figure are you using or the AFL numbers in Queensland?
Is it 100,000?
How are you treating Touch & Tag Football?
http://www.rl1908.com/History/touch-football.htm
Extract
“…Forty years after its birth, touch football has now taken rugby league around the world, with “The Federation of International Touch” holding a current membership of 34 nations (link).
The touch form of the game, which is still six tackle sets and a form of play-the-ball, is played socially and in formal competitions across the globe, by men and women of all ages, as well as boys and girls and in school competitions.
Modified social forms of rugby league:
Touch Football
Touch Rugby League
OzTag
Kick it to Touch
Gridiron Rugby
Touch football is recognised as the largest participation sport in New Zealand, with over 300,000 players.
In Australia, touch is played across the nation (not just NSW and Queensland) by more than 300,000, another 500,000 in school competitions.
Other forms of modified rugby league have also been taken up inclusing OzTag (over 400,000 participants), as well as more recent variant games of “Touch Rugby League” and “Kick It Touch”.
All of these games provide a means for people to enjoy and gain an appreciation of the game of rugby league, particularly the ball-passing and running skills.
There seems little doubt that participant and spectator interest in these modified social forms of rugby league will continue to grow…”
BTW here’s the full quote from Wikipedia about RL in PNG:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rugby_league_in_Papua_New_Guinea
“Rugby league is the most popular sport in Papua New Guinea (especially in the Highlands region)[citation needed] and is commonly referred to as the national sport[citation needed]. In a nation where communities are far apart and many people live at a minimal subsistence level, rugby league has been described as a replacement for tribal warfare[citation needed] as a way of explaining the local enthusiasm for the game (a matter of life and death)[citation needed].
The annual Australian State of Origin matches are the most watched sporting event of the year[citation needed]. Australian rugby league players who have played in the annual (Australian) State of Origin clash, which is celebrated feverishly every year in Papua New Guinea, are among the most well known identities throughout the nation[citation needed].
During the 2000 Rugby League World Cup an estimated audience of 2 million[citation needed] watched the Kumuls lose to the Welsh Dragons in the quarter finals in the early hours of the morning local time. Despite this loss over 50,000 fans welcomed the team at Port Moresby Airport later that week. [5]
[edit] Participation
Rugby league has a huge participation rate in the junior level with 50% of the population under-20 playing rugby league[citation needed] and every school in the country involved in a rugby league competition.[citation needed] There are 5,000 registered players between the ages of 12 and 18.[citation needed]
There are 10,000 registered senior players. They compete in 40 affiliated leagues around the country. Each league has a minimum of seven clubs and each club has four teams.[citation needed]
On RL
Jim Wilson said | January 12th 2010 @ 1:05pm | Report comment
I forgot the last paragraph of the Touch Footy article:
…Combined with the over 400,000 playing the full 13-man version of rugby league, the participant numbers playing the various forms of rugby league push well beyond the 1 million mark, dwarfing those of Australian rules and rugby union, and rivaling soccer (another code which is played in various modified forms).
http://www.rl1908.com/History/touch-football.htm
Michael C said | January 12th 2010 @ 1:23pm | Report comment
Jim Wilson -
you tell me.
How many regular season players play touch during the off season? (double dipping),
a bit like a soccer person trying to claim mutual exclusivity from indoor to outdoor soccer,
It’s dangerous territory. (btw – soccer is an example of a sport that the Aust Govt ERASS survey stats always show a very high level of ‘un-orgnised’ participation. Again, potential there for double dipping)
Also, it can cloud the male/female breakdown and if we’re talking a RL vs Aust Footy ‘professional’ talent pathway development topic – then, we’re talking about males.
But, go ahead, tell me how we should use those figures.
re PNG, as I commented “Interesting”, and my disclaimer on Wiki figures as being dubioius or otherwise,
so,…..I revert to my initial assertion….”not that far apart”
btw – I recognise that the AFL for too long ignored female participation, and ignored ‘social’ variants, however, RecFooty as a program is going okay nowadays. As above though – I’m not sure how it should really be recorded, ….I reckon probably as a separate category…..unless RecFooty players can nominate for the AFL draft!!!!
hutch said | January 12th 2010 @ 9:26pm | Report comment
this is possibly the most ridiculous post i have ever read on any message boards on the net. i hope you dont believe the tripe you just posted. afl with more players in png than rugby league??? rugby league is png’s national sport, its like a religion up there. they estimate that half the children in the country play the game at some level.
i highly doubt that afl has 700000 participants in this country, but im not surprised by the adult participation figures. rugby league is a physical game, it cannot be played socially and may adults arent willing to risk injury and time off work. a lot of adults play touch instead. aussie rules, while at the elite level requires extremely high cardiovascular endurance and not a whole amount of skill, can be played by pretty much anyone at an amateur level. there is an amount of physicality, but not so much that your average punter cant have a run.
Siva Samoa said | January 12th 2010 @ 9:49pm | Report comment
touch rugby or touch football is not rugby league. its not run by the nrl or arl and even most rugby union clubs in nz and australian run touch tugby/football but its control by touch australia and touch nz.
png has just over 10,000 rugby league players.
bever fever said | January 12th 2010 @ 10:00pm | Report comment
RL is by far PNG’s national game but like any country it contains pockets of support in some areas/regions for other codes.
Dont know the numbers but RL would i imagine rival soccer for numbers.
Springs said | January 12th 2010 @ 10:50pm | Report comment
Michael C I would say that 700,000 (pfft) or so would include all forms of Australian Rules? And wiki states that Aussie Rules has 284,000 juniors, which means 500,000 or so adults (?). No way.
A hell of a lot more than 15,000 people play League in PNG, that’s less than NZ. Supposedly over 50% of the population under 20 play it. That’s anywhere from 500,000 to 1 million players. And France has 34,000 and then there is Wales, Fiji, Tonga, Samoa and Russia and Lebanon and Ireland etc etc If you got the PNG info from wiki then look again. It says there are 40 Leagues with minimum 7 clubs. With 4 teams to a club. Do the math and that’s nearly 20,000 minimum, without counting juniors or recreational/school teams.
And Siva OzTag or LeagueTag IS part of rugby league and touch football was completely derived from the sport of Rugby League. It’s the same as indoor cricket/cricket, futsal/soccer and so on.
Michael C said | January 13th 2010 @ 10:09am | Report comment
reply to the Link -
on any other continent in the world – Australian rules current reach WOULD see it as an international professional league.
Prior to federation – the game had spread across all colonies as well as to New Zealand – - in a certain respect – at that time, it was one of the worlds MOST ‘international’ (well, inter colonial) games.
Continent Australia is a special case.
Siva Samoa said | January 13th 2010 @ 1:17pm | Report comment
A hell of a lot more than 15,000 people play League in PNG, that’s less than NZ. Supposedly over 50% of the population under 20 play it. That’s anywhere from 500,000 to 1 million players. – spring
there are only 15,000 rugby league players in png at all level springs . don’t be fool into what you read about that artical by the png prime minister. he was only trying to hype up rugby league to get an nrl license for png.
And France has 34,000 and then there is Wales, Fiji, Tonga, Samoa and Russia and Lebanon and Ireland etc etc – spring
france doesn’t have 34,000 rugby league players. they don’t even have a professional competition and their main comp the elite 1 have many problems with teams pulling out halfway through the season. a french poster on another rugby league forum said there might be only 7000 rugby league players not 34,000 because the french rugby league federation is trying to milk money from the government.
new zealand has 15,000 rugby league players, samoa has only ten pub teams with no other age, schools or senior competitions.
similar to tonga and fiji but there is a small school comp in fiji. there are more afl players in samoa than there are rugby league players . league players in samoa all are rugby union players.
And Siva OzTag or LeagueTag IS part of rugby league and touch football was completely derived from the sport of Rugby League. – springs
says who ? oztag might have been from rugby league but touch rugby and touch football all have different history. the pacific islands have a similar touch game to touch rugby that started by rugby union players in the 50′s. the same for the touch game in south africa which started way before australia and nz started playing the game.
if you claim all forms of touch for league then rugby union claims all form of rugby league and touch rugby.
Springs said | January 13th 2010 @ 8:19pm | Report comment
Siva how the hell would you know? Been to PNG and counted all the League players. There are 280 clubs in PNG, with four teams in each. That’s 20,000 players minimum, playing in senior comps, without including junior/school/recreational players. And a Frenchman on another league forum? Please you have strange sources Siva. I’d believe the President of the FFR-13 before a frenchman on a League forum. And if League players are Union players, so what? They’re still League players. Their are many, MANY, Union players in NSW/QLD who play it as a secondary sport to League.
Touch Football was created in League training sessions in the 50s/60s. League was not created by Union. The NSWRL was actually created by cricketers. The game in South Africa is often called SIx Down, hmmm. Wonder what that means? Six tackles (or downs) maybe?
And my local comp has a women’s grade, guess what they play? LeagueTag, juniors too. Haven’t heard of many clubs who have a grade that plays a completely different sport.
Justin said | January 13th 2010 @ 9:24pm | Report comment
I wouldnt believe much on the wiki site in regards RL in PNG. Just about every fact produced needs a citation!
Siva Samoa said | January 13th 2010 @ 11:08pm | Report comment
i’ve been to png and played rugby over there during the spc games. like every rugby league fan you are a dreamer and easily fall into a trap when anything is mention in other rugby league forums you guys spread it like a wildfire even if you have nothing to back it up. show me a link apart from wikipedia which suggest 50% of all under 20 in png play the sport ? even the references on wiki won’t tell you. show me a link ?
i don’t have time to read your own history version of touch rugby and nswrl because last week it was rugby union clubs who defected to league now its the cricket players and next week it might aliens from mars who came through a stargate.
rugbyfuture said | January 13th 2010 @ 11:17pm | Report comment
but stargate is awesome nonetheless
Springs said | January 13th 2010 @ 11:53pm | Report comment
Siva you’re not really one who can go on and on about no links. With your outlandish claims with no proof whatsoever. I don’t go on any other League forums so I don’t know what you are talking about there. Just because you have been to PNG means you know what? Nothing, that’s what. I’ve never been myself but the people I know who went over there said… They’re League-Mad! Most of them followed the Broncos.
And with wiki, please mate, where else did you get the 15,000 from? I never said definitely 50% of the under 20 population play League. I said supposedly, as on the same site it has 50% of the U20 pop. play, which means 500K-1M, and also that only 15,000 play. It also says that AFL has more participants, which is obviously false. And rugbyleagueplanet goes even further than wiki, saying ‘recent government reports have estimated that up to a third of Papua New Guinea’s six million population play League.’
The PNG NRL bid site states that 50% of the population are under 18, every school participates in the League competition, there are 280 clubs. This means more than 20,000 players at least plus the school teams. While if you look at any newspaper article ‘PNG kicks off bid for NRL team’ PNGRL President Danny Holmes also said that an estimated third of the population plays League. But of course you will just dismiss this as League bias or something else ridiculous.
And with the League dreamer statement. You are just a Union Doomsayer who whenever Rugby League has a positive event or experience or article you come to the League threads saying it’s because of union, League is dreaming, League is a bad game, or it just won’t work. Notice I did not generalise like you did (every league fan is a…)
Siva Samoa said | January 14th 2010 @ 12:52am | Report comment
this newspaper artical was written after the samoan observer interviewed the png chief executive officer danny holmes last year before a rugby league international game between samoan and png.
http://www.samoaobserver.ws/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5156%3Aunder-strength-kumuls&Itemid=54
The inaugural one-off home test between Toa Samoa and the Kumuls is history in the making.
The test is a ground breaking achievement for Rugby League Samoa and for the development of the sport of league itself.
For the Kumuls Rugby League is their country’s national game. With a population of six million people, an alarming 10,000 registered adults play league in Papua, while some 5,000 juniors also play league. There are 280 clubs alone in Papua New Guinea, so the player pool in comparison is enormous.
And rugbyleagueplanet goes even further than wiki, saying ‘recent government reports have estimated that up to a third of Papua New Guinea’s six million population play League.’ – springs
the report is not an official government report but a tongue in cheek remarks by the prime minister or minister of sports of png to help get a nrl license. its an old pacific island joke because if third of png play rugby league then your adding kids as young as two, grandfathers and grandmothers.
Springs said | January 14th 2010 @ 1:41pm | Report comment
No I am not. I said before 50% of the population is under 18. Easily a third would be between the ages of 5-40/50. And a Samoan article? Why should I trust a Samoan atricle over PNG articles, or actual League articles. 280 clubs with 10,000 players means only about 9 or 10 players a team.
And of course ‘a tongue in cheek remark’. I don’t seriously think that 2 million players play League or whatever. I’m justquoting to say that there are obviously way more than 15,000.
Siva Samoa said | January 14th 2010 @ 3:29pm | Report comment
there are 15,000 players and 280 clubs. most sports in the pacific islands have one village/club one team and most don’t have junior competitions.
Springs said | January 14th 2010 @ 3:43pm | Report comment
Thought so Siva. You have nothing more to say.
There are 280 clubs, each club has 4 teams, minimum 17 players. You lose Siva. 10 year old juniors cannot play for senior clubs. 20,000 minimum. 1 million maximum. Not 15,000.
Sth Auckland First XV said | January 14th 2010 @ 6:23pm | Report comment
First of all I wouldn’t believe anything on Wikipedia about rugby league. the amount of outright lies written there about the game is incredible. 700K players of league in Eng, Aust and NZ??? Come on!! There are only 13,000 league players in NZ, 10,000 of whom are in Auckland. League is not really a big participation sport anywhere outside of West Sydney, and if you count every PNG villager who throws a coconut around then you are really scraping the barrell of credibility. According to the Sport England Web site, there are 88,000 registered league players in England (compared to 314,000 Union players in England). So the total number of league players in Aus, NZ and Eng is more like 200,000, which is less than the number of Union players in England! If RL was such a big participation sport it would have already made multisport events like the Commonwealth Games, South pacific games etc, but lacks any international credibility. South Africa has about 400,000 Union players, NZ 125,000, France 250,000, a total world playing pool of about 4 million for RU. So could the leagies please get their facts right and stop living in a Wikipedia Dreamworld! In short, it wouldn’t surprise me if there were more AFL players around the world than league cos AFL is such an easier game to play – you just pick up the footy and boot it around. I can’t see a bunch of ex-pat mates playing five tackle, hump the grass and kick league in a New York suburban park.
Siva Samoa said | January 14th 2010 @ 6:37pm | Report comment
post a link that says each club in png have four teams and that this are all senior clubs not juniors.
its no secret that rugby league fans control wikipedia and change everything on it to their advantage. bloody scums.
Springs said | January 14th 2010 @ 11:34pm | Report comment
Oh and here’s this guy again with his anti-league comments.Don’t listen to wikipedia about rugby league (everything else is alright though) but listen to this guy, he knows just how bad everything in Rugby League is.
If PNG people have to play with coconuts, so be it. No worse than counting Auskick figures for AFL. Wikipedia says 22,000 League players in NZ, has a source, you don’t, i believe wiki. And League not big anywhere outside Western Sydney? cause I’m in the country and I can tell you it’s damn popular out here! I’m sure many Queenslanders will tell you the same.
Redb said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:03pm | Report comment
Ken,
No problem with those comments. The international development of footy is very interesting given it was nowhere t ten years ago to the point where only in the last 1-2 years the AFL admin itself has identified opportuntities and provided an international pathway.
The intro of GC and WS has had an unexpected benefit in that clubs are starting to look beyond the square for recruitment and the international pool has never been tapped.
Redb
Michael C said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:10pm | Report comment
Hey Redb!!!
unexpected…..in some quarters,
we’ve been heralding this opportunity for a little while and people who have tuned into our rantings will have been ahead of the game on this front!!!!!
We have a good track record!!!
DOW –
as I said in the first instance – - “may not be far off”,
I reckon I was right.
For what it’s worth!!!!!
No – it doesn’t make me overly happy……
perhaps worth a
but not too sure of it’s worth of a
(although KB is the revered doyen of emoticontamination).
Redb said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:15pm | Report comment
no worries MC, I know.
Seen this on the PNG AFL academy?
http://www.worldfootynews.com/article.php/20100110093539697
“A real testament of the Coca Cola backed Talent Path Program’s exceptional player development ability was the interest shown by AFL Club Recruitment officers who attended.
Even the 2009 AFL Premiers, the Geelong Cats showed faith in the Coca Cola Talent Path, sending its recruitment team up for the weekend event. Other Club recruitment staff getting ‘hands on’ with the talent on show were the Richmond Tigers, the Essendon Bombers and the Brisbane Lions. The Fremantle Dockers didn’t let distance dampen its search for talent calling in regularly through phone conferences with AFLPNG and AFLQ staff.
The two new Franchises coming into the AFL, the Gold Coast based team and the recently announced Greater Western Sydney have rallied behind the PNG and Pacific commitment, both sending their Academy staff to earmark PNG talent for their player pool. ”
———-
Redb
Michael C said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:26pm | Report comment
Yep (did you note comment number 4 on that article page!!! – - I’ve referred to it on the other theRoar AFL thread about recruitment looking outside the square).
It’s exciting times – and very much as the other WFN article speaks of – hope turning into reality.
Redb said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:35pm | Report comment
AFL Cairns makes sense logisticially but it would be far better development wise if PNG competed in AFL Queensland along with NT Thunder.
Michael C said | January 12th 2010 @ 12:42pm | Report comment
Yeah, exactly.
For the next couple of years, AFLQ is going to attract some pretty good quality of ‘discarded’ or non-drafted players hoping to attract the attention of locals.
From the whole ‘rookie’ perspective, Perth has 2 teams that effectively share the hidden riches of the WAFL, Adelaide 2 teams sharing the SANFL, and the 2 QLD sides will probably do quite well sharing the riches of the AFLQ should PNG join it along with NT continuing.
The Vic clubs will need to spend more and more time travelling around the country.
I guess the question is – if PNG (and as they are already channelling through QLD) becomes incorporated into AFLQ,
could we see an NZ or an ‘other Oceania’ side incorporated into even AFL-NSW into the Sydney or ACT comp?…….or……wait for it…….back to that chestnut of an all Irish side!!!
ah well, ya never know.
Beast-A-Tron said | January 7th 2010 @ 3:47pm | Report comment
Lazza there are teams, competitions and players where none were before. That is growth. It is not big, but it is growth nonetheless. You’d perhaps serve yourself by looking up “growth” in the dictionary.
Lazza said | January 8th 2010 @ 12:00pm | Report comment
Gaelic Football has been played in Australia for decades by dedicated enthusiasts. Does anyone expect it’s going to grow into a major or even respectable sport in this country? There are many niche sports like that in Australia.
It’s just a bunch of amatuers enjoying themselves but it doesn’t mean the sport is growing or becoming more popular.
Beast-A-Tron said | January 8th 2010 @ 4:55pm | Report comment
Have all these Gaelic teams, players & competitions suddenly sprung up in the last 5 years? That’s what I thought.
Growth = positive trend. You may further qualify it being ‘large’ or ‘insignificant’, but it is growth nonetheless. English doesn’t appear to be your strong point eh?
Michael C said | January 8th 2010 @ 5:42pm | Report comment
I believe we’ve pointed out in the past the glorious amateur nature of the squads that pay their own way to come to Australia for the International Cup(s – 3 thus far and next due for 2011).
Just amateurs…..but,…..’just amateurs’ used to be the backbone of a minor sporting movement called the Olympics,
‘just amateurs’ used to be all that Rugby Union was,
‘just amateurs’ can be just as dedicated followers, players and growers of a game.
20 years ago – they did not exist for Australian Football overseas in either reasonable (by relative standards) numbers or co-ordinated network. This is changing.
Glorious amateurs they are……
but, obviously thus far – they aren’t growing the ‘revenue base’ of the game. The fact that there are now more people playing the game out side of Australia than are in Tasmania…..doesn’t say much……about Tasmania!!!!!
btw – being Amateurs outside of the EPL or NBA is a harder professional career nut to crack than being an amateur outside of the AFL???
VooDoo said | January 12th 2010 @ 10:15am | Report comment
And, to add to your point Beast-a-Tron, it’s easy for knockers to dismiss, say, 50 clubs in North America started over 12 years, but it fails to appreciate how tough it is to start leagues in the first place. When footy first got underway in western Canada in 2001, it was restricted to individual clubs in Vancouver and Calgary. In both of those cities nearby clubs were few and far between, necessitating long road trips or flights to play games against one another or across the border in Seattle. Fast forward 9 years and there are 8 men’s clubs spread across the same area, 3 women’s clubs and juniors programs running in Vancouver and Calgary. Footy isn’t challenging any established sport for market share, but those wanting to participate are finding it easier to locate a nearby club, and new clubs that form no longer have to travel as far or spend as much to enjoy their footy.
Most of the large North American cities with expat populations now have clubs, and most have turned their focus inward to developing local ‘metro leagues’ of 9-a-side. To outsiders, it may look as if development has plateaued, because most of the growth recently has been in the expansion of the metro leagues in large cities. The next phase of growth is unfolding steadily – clubs are spreading to smaller regional centres like Des Moines, Columbus, Sacramento, Austin and Baton Rouge, where expat Aussies are scarce and locals are taking on the tasks of coaching and administering the clubs. In my opinion that’s great.