• A-League
• A-League Draw
• We Are Football
• Socceroos
• World Football
• Tipping
• Football RSS
• Football pics

The Crowd Says (29) | Page 1 of Comments

• Vince said | February 4th 2010 @ 7:10am | Report comment

  I read VItors article the other and thought he was onto something.
  Makes sense to piggyback the FFA’s work for the National teams into something that the HAL clubs can tap into obviously without any guarantees etc.
  I would imagine that the reports the FFA scouts send back to the FFA are quite detailed and technical so should be a useful document to at least help clubs make a shortlist of players they want to see.
  Dumb question, has anyone posed this question to FFA?

  Reply
  • 

    Davidde Corran said | February 4th 2010 @ 7:49pm | Report comment

    Vince naturally that isn’t a dumb question. I couldn’t tell you if it has ever been suggested within the corridors of FFA’s offices.

    Reply

• Davstar said | February 4th 2010 @ 7:57am | Report comment

  Sassuolo are on top of the SerieB they should get promoted which would be good for Australia to have another player in the Serie A.
  i think its a good idea to get the FFA to help scout players for the A-league, but we also must remember that a lot of internationals dont work out because of numerous reasons it’s not a problem our league faces alone. Internationals fail to meet their hype all the time in other leagues too. I do believe financially clubs in the A-league are streched expecially some of the smaller clubs but the competition is still young many years to go before we can really judge it.

  Reply

  • whiskeymac said | February 4th 2010 @ 9:14am | Report comment

    Re Valeri in the Serie A is good news for him, and reward (assuming they get promoted) for someone who has learnt his apprenticeship in Serie B for a long time now. Congrats to him (and his family – young kids are challenges enough).

    Reply
    • 

      Dogz R Barkn said | February 4th 2010 @ 9:31am | Report comment

      He actually served his apprenticeship in the Serie C.

      One thing about Valeri, and a few of his contemporaries in the Socceroos squad, or fringes of the squad, for one reason or another, they haven’t come on to the extent that we would have hoped.

      Reply

• whiskeymac said | February 4th 2010 @ 8:57am | Report comment

  Interesting idea. Without wanting to sound overly negative, because it sounds like a solution to a problem, albeit a problem i dont really think exists at this stage, but i wonder if the national scout pooling idea wld work in reality. financing such ventures is not a priority obviously, set ups like the NYL and repatraiting o/s aussies is, and is still a good objective iMO (especially the NYL).

  Secondly if players really wanted to play here from countries such as Italy or France havent they got agents who can set up trails etc? or are we talking about untapped players with potential – because i dont think an FFA system wld necessarily deliver the HAl the next drogba, messi or for that matter paul iffil. private eur and asian clubs have more money and infrastructure (and to offer in development) than the FFA.

  If HAL clubs cannot afford it, why is it assumed the FFA can.
  if a player didnt work out wld they blame the FFA, wld team squabbles over players have to result in the FFA stepping in?

  maybe, instead of the FFA incurring more finaical responsibility would it be better to instead make it easier and attractive for HAl clubs to have these players on their books, such as excpetions to asian players, more money for marquees etc.

  Reply
  • 

    Australian Football said | February 4th 2010 @ 9:27am | Report comment

    Whisky,
    correct, the FFA should spend their money in Australia promoting grass-roots football, and Australian clubs do not need to spend money on overseas scouting. Surely this is the responsibility of player’s agents to scout clubs in Australia for their clients and arrange trials for them with a club in Australia.

    Reply
  • 

    Davidde Corran said | February 4th 2010 @ 7:56pm | Report comment

    Whiskeymac, I agree with you completely that our first priority should be youth development. However if we have the resources in place already (for example those being used for World Cup scouting) why not use them for the A-League’s benefit as well?

    I think we’re looking at both untapped potential (though not you’re next Messi because such players have already been picked up) and those who already have something significant to offer an A-League club much like Vignaroli.

    Most of these players do have agents but they don’t have contacts in Australia. I get a real sense from all the players I have spoken to they just need a nudge in the right direction. Think of Benito Carbone. When the idea of playing in Australia was first suggested to him he thought it was a joke but when he really thought about it he loved the idea. Now he refers to his brief time in Australia as the highlight of his career and wants to come back to either play or coach one day.

    Reply

    • whiskeymac said | February 5th 2010 @ 8:51am | Report comment

      Sure, the more carbone’s, vignarolli’s, bridge’s, miller’s and iffill’s the better. but when tageting these “experienced” players thats maybe best resolved by having an equivalent of an FFA trade commission as oppossed to a scout turning upto games with a sheepskin coat and making notes. a PR campaign to agents, stronger links with clubs and other unions might achieve the same?

      Reply
• 

  TheMagnificent11 said | February 4th 2010 @ 8:59am | Report comment

  This is a great idea. I remember Craig Foster mentioning this on The World Game about 2 or 3 years ago when most of the A-League imports we turning out to be flops (fortunately things have improved but I’m sure we are missing out on a lot of players from smaller nations that we could afford). FFA should do talent scouting in America, Africa, Asia and the lower leagues of Europe make short lists for A-League clubs. Clubs can do their own scouting if they want, or follow-up scouting based on the FFA findings. There a lot of things the FFA should be doing but this one appears to be a no-brainer considering they already have resources doing scouting for the Socceroos.

  Reply

• Phutbol said | February 4th 2010 @ 9:03am | Report comment

  I’ll start by saying that I have no idea what sort of $$$ Serie B/C players earn, but do you think these guys you talked to are aware of the salary restrictions in the A-league? its all well and good to express a desire to play in Australia but not if it means a massive pay cut.

  Reply
  • 

    Dogz R Barkn said | February 4th 2010 @ 9:37am | Report comment

    I think you’re getting into the lower reaches of the Serie C before you start seeing comparable wages – and then you’re wondering if it’s worth it.

    Getting decent players at age 18/19 on loan might be good – where they are getting more exposure to senior football, so that it’s worthwhile for their club – but to be honest – there are probably far more opportunities to loan out players within Europe itself, rather than going all the way to Australia.

    As for the pooling idea (for scouting) – the idea has merit – perhaps in the new TV deal, the FFA might be able to hire a few scouts who are allocated across the World and who provide scouting reports back to the FFA which are then freely available to all A-League clubs – I can’t see why that woudn’t work – if the FFA is willing to pay for it – but let’s be honest – that might cost up th $500,000 per annum ,depending on the number employed and how good they are (the good ones would easily command $100,000 per annum).

    Reply
  • 

    Davidde Corran said | February 4th 2010 @ 8:04pm | Report comment

    The money within Italian football is very erratic. There are players in Serie A on A-League money and then there are those who earn in a few weeks what an A-League club pays its whole squad in a year.

    In Serie B the drop off from Serie A in terms of money is huge. There is a large proportion of players on comparable money and that ratio increases the further down you go.

    There are also two other things at play here:

    - There are players who just want a change of scene. Who would happily trade training in -2 degrees Bologna for playing in the Gold Coast.

    - Also a lot of lower division clubs in Italy are poorly run and have struggling finances. They are following a similar path to that the NSL did in promising players more money then they can afford. Take Pavia (where Benito Carbone is) for example. They have one of the lowest budgets in all of Italian professional football. There players are paid less then most other clubs but they are always paid on time and what they were promised. This means they have no trouble finding players who just want to play football and get paid.

    I think the A-League could tap into that and there are similar stories right across Europe and the world.

    Reply

• Towser said | February 4th 2010 @ 9:36am | Report comment

  Never underestimate scouting.
  Going back to the sixties In England, scouting was the way many professional clubs recruited players. Often scouts were at our school matches & the youth club I played for. Later the works team.
  “Scout from Wednesday, United, Chesterfield or others at match” was often heard.
  The elite of the cities young footballers,Sheffield boys(& I Presume other cities boys-ie15 year old) matches always attracted many scouts.
  To be honest its something I’ve never come across in Australia. Seems to be a lack of scouting mentality here. I stand to be corrected on that, but I ‘ve kept my ear to the ground regarding football & coached juniors so I’m sure I would have heard of it frequently if it happened. Maybe as Vince said above, more is happening nowadays.

  Whatever it needs to happen as this article says,particularly in relationship to overseas recruiting.
  Personally I see no excuse for it.
  The quality of scouting/recruiting overseas in the A-League so far is poor at best. I consider it to put it bluntly pathetic.
  We could go through many players Deanes(Blade has been) Jardel, Even Juninho(injury prone). Many others.
  Then at the Roar we have Reinaldo. The most un Brazilian,Brazilian. Surely in a football mad country like Brazil we could do better. To contrast at the Roar we have Henrique. Double the technique of Ronaldo,but half his size. Has had frequent injuries due to the physicality of the A-League. Wheres the clever scouting for a player with Ronaldos size/strength & Henriques technique?
  So for me the money has to be found to set up a scouting network. Its not rocket science. Keep your ear to the ground. Have a look at a player. Keep checking. I saw many a kid who could have been a professional when coaching.
  Admittedly back then football had a lower profile.Also(& this is a statement of fact) many Anglo/Celtic or indeed Turkish Chinese or whatever background kids were not encouraged to play for the “Wog” teams.
  I know this because with some promising players I suggested to their parents that maybe they should have a look at playing for the NSL club on the Northside Brisbane City next season. Of course you never heard the kids name again. Lost to the NSL. Or if you did at was at an overseas club.

  But thats the past & the reason we had an overhaul 5 years ago.
  Given the new “professional ” era of football, scouting is imperative. After all were still competing with the rest of the world for footballers & a half cocked approach wont do.

  Reply

  • whiskeymac said | February 4th 2010 @ 10:07am | Report comment

    where we are at now, and the priorities of FFA, i agree scouting needs to be improved.but lets set up a good scouting system here in Oz first and then worry about sending, or more realistically employing local, people in Luanda, El Paz etc.
    Another way the clubs cld get by this is through making more use of partnership arrangements – CCM set up with Blades etc may not be thatfruitful but its a step in the right direction – didnt Travis come via this route and has been a reasonable success; the roar used their contacts to get Kluivert out to coach – and maybe also did they get Van dijk this way also?

    Reply

    • Towser said | February 4th 2010 @ 10:33am | Report comment

      Agree about setting up a good scouting system here.
      Regarding overseas, say an African country as you mentioned.
      Even if the FFA stepped in & covered costs,having scouts in every conceivable country may be prohibitive.
      Then again as you mentioned how much would it cost to provide a local with great Football knowledge to report back to the FFA on potential players. Sure in Europe a costly exercise,but in Africa no. Or for that matter Asia & some South American countries.

      Kluivert was recruited via the clubs new football manager & a dutch agent whom I believe has a 5% share in the Roar since 2006. I dont thing SVD was recruited through this bloke(agent),but stand to be corrected. .
      What it shows though is if this is the case is that this agent hasnt been utilised properly by the club until now. Ie we got a football manager,5 years behind MV.
      No doubt it is improving & nobody could believe it was easy,given the resources of overseas clubs.
      All the more reason for the FFA to have a proper set up & plan regarding scouting.
      So far its ad Hoc.
      IF Vitor is on the money not one A-League scout In Africa recently is extremely poor.
      But whats to stop the FFA having a scout there & reporting back to A-League clubs?

      Reply

      • cruyff turn said | February 4th 2010 @ 1:01pm | Report comment

        Towser, your last point is a beauty! Maybe the FFA could employ someone on an ad hoc basis to do scouting at various tournaments, who then recommends players to the A-League clubs. He talks with the clubs prior to the tournaments on what kinds of players they’re looking for, and then does his best to find them. What the clubs decide to do after that is up to them. Of course, this person would have to have a proven track record for finding talent.

        I find it staggering that not one scout made the effort to check out the African Cup of Nations. It’s the A-League’s loss.

        Reply

        • Towser said | February 4th 2010 @ 1:17pm | Report comment

          cruyff turn

          Thats the sort of thing were looking for.
          If you & I can nut out in in 2 posts a simple scouting scenario, surely the FFA can have something planned & organised by people with higher football credentials than you or I.
          Well me at least, you could be the great Johan himself.
          Depends on their priorities. For me money well spent to improve the quality of footballer in the A-League.
          Some of these overseas players come from countries that are at the moment producing players technically better than ours. Until our coaching systems catch up, what better way for our current crop of A-League youngsters to see what can be acheived technically.

          Reply

          • cruyff turn said | February 4th 2010 @ 1:55pm | Report comment

            Sadly, I’m not Johan, but by crikey if I were I’d put my hand up for some kind of role in the FFA – Socceroos coach post-Pim. Now that would be something!

      • Simmo said | February 5th 2010 @ 9:13am | Report comment

        “IF Vitor is on the money not one A-League scout In Africa recently is extremely poor.
        But whats to stop the FFA having a scout there & reporting back to A-League clubs?”

        Not to be too flippant about this but if Kevin Sheedy can sign a young African player from a tiny pool of Aussie Rules talent how come none of our clubs have signed players from the enormous pool of African footballers?

        Reply

• Tom said | February 4th 2010 @ 10:04am | Report comment

  Interesting idea. You’d think the focus might be more on Asia than Africa though.

  Reply

  • Simmo said | February 5th 2010 @ 9:15am | Report comment

    Africans are cheaper

    Reply

• Art Sapphire said | February 4th 2010 @ 1:32pm | Report comment

  1) The idea of playing in Australia sounds great for many European players but unless you are a marquee the best you can hope for is Carlos Hernandez type wages around 250k a year. Problem is Carlos came from Tico land where players are paid less than here. European players of equal quality to Carlos would be demading more money. Once European players learn about this they will opt to stay in Europe where the wages are and tax rates are better. Ofcourse, the only way this will change is with a substantial increase in the salary cap. That is still a few years away at best.

  2) Brisbane Roar are trialling 3 Ghanaian kids. This is an example of something that all A-League clubs should be doing.

  http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,26584861-5003412,00.html

  BRISBANE Roar will tap into Ghana’s fertile football nursery in their bid to rebuild a side capable of challenging for the A-League title next season.Roar coach Ange Postecoglou confirmed yesterday that three Ghanaian players, potentially all members of the squad that won last year’s FIFA under-20 World Cup, will soon arrive in Queensland for a month-long trial with the Brisbane club.
  “It’s an area where there’s enormous potential,” Postecoglou said.
  “We can’t confirm any names yet because there’s a few that we’re looking at and it depends on the fit and what we need in the squad.It’s about finding the right type of players and I think there’s enormous opportunity in Ghana and all of Africa”

  Reply

  • Towser said | February 4th 2010 @ 1:55pm | Report comment

    Art Sapphire

    Your example of Carlos raises the question,Why do we have to look to Europe? Lets look to countries the equivalent of Costa Rica. Poorer countries. where better players than you’d get from Europe, for the same money ,are willing to come here.
    Because as you say they can make more here, without having to go over to the jungle that is European football,but with a similar standard of living.
    That incl;udes most of Asia,Africa & other Central & indeed South American countries. Agnulo also looks promising,

    As a Roar fan,good also to see that Ange & staff are looking to Africa.

    Reply

• David V. said | February 4th 2010 @ 5:18pm | Report comment

  We’ve seen players like Paul Ifill, Carlos Hernandez, Viktor Sikora and Charlie Miller, who bring a level of quality that we all too rarely see in this league. It shouldn’t matter where they’re from, but what they can bring to this league. We should not focus excessively on one part of the world.

  These seem to be exceptions in recruitment, and not the rule.

  Reply

• george said | February 4th 2010 @ 6:52pm | Report comment

  Thank god we have a limit of 5 overseas players , or you lot would leave our youth with no where to go . Lets worry about our own kids first .

  Reply

  • Simmo said | February 5th 2010 @ 9:19am | Report comment

    No-one’s sggesting we ignore our youth. On the contrary we want to supplement them with talented foreigners who can raise the overall standard of the league and give our own youngsters on-field challenges to rise to and off-field mentoring.

    Reply