Having watched the opening two rounds of the Super 14, it is clear that the new law interpretations have brought some welcome changes to the game. Teams seem much more willing to run with the ball, knowing they can have confidence in keeping it.
On the other side, we have seen defenders being very strictly policed if not moving away immediately or if caught hanging onto the ball. Even when on their feet, they are pinged.
This seems to have resulted in some sides conceding the ruck and marking up, hoping to cause a knock-on or other mistake to get the ball.
In discussions on this site, people have been asking how it is possible to force ruck turnovers without an opposition mistake. In my mind, there is no way to legally turn the ball over using last year’s techniques.
Even if a tackler is quick enough to get to his feet, release fully and then go for the ball, by the time this is done, an attacking player is there, and now it’s a ruck.
No hands boys!
Also, it is nigh on impossible to stand on your own two feet in that situation. Players are generally leaning on the tackled player (even slightly). This means they are as good as on the ground and playing the ball is a no-no.
So what do you do? Do you use a second player to attack the ball?
This deoesn’t seem to have worked thus far as they have been pinged for being in the tackle area, and unless the timing is exact, they have the same issues as the tackler.
The only thing you can do is forget about getting immediate hands on the ball at all. You teach your players to clear over the top of the ball.
You will undoubtebly meet the opposition there, and that creates the ruck situation. Beat them over the offside line and the ball is yours.
The scavenger is dead and everything old is new again!
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February 23rd 2010 @ 9:13am
JariusVII said | February 23rd 2010 @ 9:13am | Report comment
Fair point Daman. In my experience the attacking player would be on the ground with the defending player attempting to remove the ball, so i think the onus would have to be on him to release it.
But yes it is a grey area of sorts.
February 23rd 2010 @ 10:12am
sheek said | February 23rd 2010 @ 10:12am | Report comment
BTW CraigB,
Getting back to the thrust of your article, I disagree the scavenger is dead in rugby. Far too early to make this call. If anything, the role of the scavenger might be even more crucial under these new interpretations.
Whenever they change rugby laws, it’s like learner drivers with their steering wheel & brake, they are always either over-compensating or under-compensating. Eventually they find the correct ‘middle ground’.
We can only hope that one day this will also happen with the rugby laws….. !!!
February 23rd 2010 @ 11:27am
tubby said | February 23rd 2010 @ 11:27am | Report comment
gangle tackles won’t become more prominent, you throw 3-4 defenders into the tackle and they’ll get pinned for not rolling away.
lions – chiefs game had more than 90 missed tackles, so were there enough rucks to even see the new rulings?
crusaders -reds, the crusaders never bothered to contest a ruck, leaving the reds facing a full defensive line at 4 paces. the game may have had other thigs going for it, but a contest at the breakdown was entirely missing.
February 23rd 2010 @ 8:41pm
max power said | February 23rd 2010 @ 8:41pm | Report comment
The point of the gang tackle would be to prevent the ball-carrier from going to ground which therefore means the tacklers don’t have to release him or the ball.
February 24th 2010 @ 12:16am
ThelmaWrites said | February 24th 2010 @ 12:16am | Report comment
Then the attacking ball-carrier should stand in the first contact and off-load. If his backline is ready, quick, and skilled, they can beat the defense who would not be strung all along the field. Wales in last year’s Six Nations were magnificen in their off-loads; the Wales team which the Wallabies faced were a shadow of the former.
February 23rd 2010 @ 12:00pm
Tock said | February 23rd 2010 @ 12:00pm | Report comment
Great comments lots of interesting views observations. I am looking forward to this weeks round to see how everyone adapts from last week.
February 23rd 2010 @ 5:47pm
Sam Taulelei said | February 23rd 2010 @ 5:47pm | Report comment
After two weeks the priorities for refereeing the breakdown have been tweaked to allow the second tackler more rights to contest the ball and create more of a balance between attacking and defending teams of what they can do at the breakdown.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-14/3364061/New-rugby-rulings-tweaked-already
February 23rd 2010 @ 6:24pm
AndyS said | February 23rd 2010 @ 6:24pm | Report comment
That will be interesting then, if there is no basis in law for such lee-way. I hope it is not the thin edge of the wedge, where local interpretations again start to take over from the actual laws. That is very much the sort of thing that touring sides could challenge and could get the whole exercise kicked into touch.
February 24th 2010 @ 12:21am
jus de couchon said | February 24th 2010 @ 12:21am | Report comment
I think Union is going down the League route. The emphasis on entertaining rather than the actual playing is too much of a temptation for Unions law makers. Baby and bath water etc.
February 24th 2010 @ 2:02am
counterruck said | February 24th 2010 @ 2:02am | Report comment
but having said this i cant believe they have already tweaked the laws after two weeks!! that is amazing
ok i can find endless phase rugby extremely boring, almost as boring as aerial ping pong but give the laws a chance to work ! bulls showed how to compete at the tackle – counterrucking brilliantly on a couple of occasions when the brumbies were on attack. there is a way to complete without hands in the ruck, its just a lot harder to execute than under the old interpretations and requires committing more players to the ruck!!
if we have to have radical solutions id prefer to take a leaf out of the NFL than league. if a team isnt making ground over the advanatage line then hands are allowed in the ruck, if they are going forward current interpetations apply.
February 24th 2010 @ 2:56am
pothale said | February 24th 2010 @ 2:56am | Report comment
Well if you’re experimenting with a new set of interpretations/laws/adjustments then tweaking is the order of the day.
I think it’s a positive move by SANZAR refs to recognise what’s working and what’s not.
Funnily enough, even though the new tackle laws are also being trialled in the 6 Nations, there’s been less fuss about them, even though occasional penalties are being handed out for the tackler not moving away.
February 24th 2010 @ 3:34pm
AndyS said | February 24th 2010 @ 3:34pm | Report comment
You’ll enjoy this then… http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/sport/new-refereeing-philosophy-puts-accent-on-running-rugby-for-2011-world-cup/story-e6frg7mf-1225833622374
February 24th 2010 @ 6:03pm
Working Class Rugger said | February 24th 2010 @ 6:03pm | Report comment
counterruck
If competing at the ruck has become harder though not impossible as you have said then its up to the defending team to put more pressure on the attacking teams in the tackle, around the ruck, set piece and general defense. I would ask any Rugby fan what would they prefer. The kick heavy penalty riddled past 3 seasons we have witnessed of the more open play thus far in the S14.
Stuart Barnes in an online rant regarding the ‘new’ interpretations he refers to these as reverting back to the way the game was played in the 90s. Now I’ll admit that nearly all of my Rugby memories are from that era but the Rugby was superb. Why not look to emulate that once again.
February 24th 2010 @ 3:43pm
AndyS said | February 24th 2010 @ 3:43pm | Report comment
I’m curious – where is the claim of endless phase play coming from? By my count across all seven matches last weekend, there were 20 instances of >7 phases, with only 7 greater than 10. I would hardly say that was excessive, or is everyone getting all conservative and knee-jerk about something that merely might happen, maybe, perhaps?
February 24th 2010 @ 5:16pm
ohtani's jacket said | February 24th 2010 @ 5:16pm | Report comment
There’s been a lot of hypothesising going on, but perhaps that’s a result of how strictly the refs have enforced the new interpetations, making the changeover somewhat extreme.
February 24th 2010 @ 4:01pm
Working Class Rugger said | February 24th 2010 @ 4:01pm | Report comment
Andy S
You’d love Stuart Barnes’ comments on Planet Rugby then. Basically a big whinge on how these interpretations could remove all sense of competition in the ruck. Complete rubbish. All that says to me is as an Englishmen he prefers to watch stodgy 12-12 GP scorelines as opposed to the high scoring ande most importantly entertaining S14. Evidently Rugby isn’t in the entertainment industry.
February 25th 2010 @ 2:42am
Rowdy said | February 25th 2010 @ 2:42am | Report comment
Yes, we much prefer the endless 12-12 draws up here, as opposed to the thrilling 79-62 stuff down there. Grow up.
February 24th 2010 @ 8:58pm
ThelmaWrites said | February 24th 2010 @ 8:58pm | Report comment
I don’t know why Southern Hemisphere teams and their proponents seem so loathe to consider standing in the tackle and off-loading. Because it’s so League-y? Because, as in the case of Australian teams, they have been so habituated to phase play that on the lightest approach of defenders, the Aussies go to ground? Because it requires the ball-carrier to be exceptionally strong to stand in the tackle? That the off-loadee has to have finessed the sprint so that he has both timed and propelled himself well? (My son is researching sprinting for his MS in Sports Science, so it’s quite prominent in my thinking at the moment.) Done well, it can be awesome. I keep referring to the British Lions tour of NZ in 1993 (the first test) and the Wales v England 6 Nations last year as classics.