Who’s to blame for falling Super 14 crowds?
By Andrew Logan, 12 Mar 2010 Andrew Logan is a Roar Expert
- Tagged:
- Carlos Spencer, Crowds, NSW Waratahs, rugby unon, Super Rugby
216 Have your say

The Waratahs Berrick Barnes kicks the ball against the Sharks during their Super 14 rugby match in Sydney on Saturday, March 7, 2010. The Waratahs defeated the Sharks 25-21. AAP Image/Paul Miller.
Carlos Spencer said it, and I believe it. Super 14 crowds are nothing compared to what they used to be.
Once upon a time, the Super 14 was one of the hottest tickets in town, particularly in Sydney which is its biggest Australian market. But crowds in the Super 14 are falling away, to the point where the Waratahs are expecting a paltry turnout of about 10,000 for their match against the Lions tomorrow night.
I’m sorry. 10,000? On a Friday night after work? Jeez, it’s not like you have to go to church the next day.
How unbelievable is it that in the biggest rugby market in the country, we can’t even half fill the Sydney Football Stadium for a South African touring side playing our boys from the Waratahs. It’s not like we’ve got another team to compete against, unlike the NRL who muster similar figures (give or take a few thousand) for each of four or five Sydney matches each weekend. The Waratahs only have seven home games a year, for Christ’s sake.
It’s a totally unacceptable result, and heads must roll. For too long the culprits have been allowed to hob-nob in their ivory towers – criticising players, coaches and referees and calling for law changes. They’ve embraced players one minute while their form was good, and then plunged the knife into their backs the next.
They’ve been the first to divert the attention from anything they might be able to do for the game instead preferring to place the blame at the doorstep of the mythical “Them” and “They”. Blessed with the cloak of invisibility when it comes to having to defend their views, they revel in the luxury of saying whatever they like, about whomever they like, whenever they like, knowing that they’ll rarely be called to task, and hardly ever sanctioned officially.
The unfortunate thing about this shadowy cartel is that many of them enjoyed the game in their youth. They were happy to take from rugby when it could provide them with something, but now that the time has come for them to fight for its future, they choose to do nothing.
By now you’ve worked out who I’m talking about, and it’s not the ARU, or any of the state unions, or the IRB, or the referees.
It’s the fans. Yeah, that’s right. You guys.
I can now hear the clatter of pitchforks and the whuff of torches being lit as the peasants prepare to storm The Roar castle and lynch the heretic, but I’m ready to go. If the door breaks down and I’m dragged away in the next few sentences by a rabid mob, I’ll die happy, knowing that at least I wasn’t one of you faceless couch-sitters. After all, everyone knows that all it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.
“How dare you talk to me like that?” I hear you say, but since we’re talking (albeit while you’re sharpening that castrating knife and Googling my home address), have a think about the last time you heard anyone say anything really positive about rugby?
What about you? I bet what you actually heard or said was a critique of the rules, the play, the players and their pay, all backed up with the catch-all disengagement….”I don’t bother to go anymore”…as if to say “That’ll show ‘em”.
The problem is, you’re not showing anyone anything, except that rugby people have morphed into a sorry group of home-dwelling, flat-screen watching, IQ-button-tickling, remote critics.
What those critics mostly don’t realise is that you have to earn the right to criticise.
You can earn it in several different ways. Great ex-players earn it by spilling blood on the paddock. Writers try to earn it by building a body of insightful work and putting their head on the public chopping block once or twice a week.
Certain fans also earn the right to criticise by being there through the easy going, and the tough times at altitude. They’re the ones who stick by their team through torrential rain, and early-season heatwaves. They’re always there for the curtain raiser, and they stay for that extra drink after the game is over. They go down to the fence to clap the boys off, even when the game hasn’t been that great.
Unfortunately for most of us, we think we earned the right to criticise by paying our Foxtel subscription on time.
In case you missed it, rugby has got a war on its hands. But unlike rugby league, which is fighting for a big chunk of market share, and AFL which is fighting for new markets, we’re fighting for our very existence.
And like most wars, it comes down to money. Walk into any group of rugby people at any pub anywhere in the country and you hear the same tired old refrain “The (insert union here) should be doing more to develop the game” as though the unions are all out to lunch pissing it up, while the rest of us are running coaching clinics in the rain somewhere with two torn tacklebags and a flat ball. Yeah, right.
What the self-righteous do-nothings prefer not to get is that by opting out and waiting for rugby to somehow fix itself, they play a very active part in reducing the money that filters down to the grassroots.
To give you an idea of the numbers, in 2008, the AFL distributed $188 million to its clubs and associated entities. The NRL distributed $53.6 million. The ARU, by contrast, gave out around $8 million – just 4% of the AFL number.
If the sports were schoolkids, AFL would be arriving on the oval in a chopper, while the ARU hopped off the bus with cardboard over the holes in its shoes.
Whatever your opinion of the ARU, you certainly can’t argue that they’re rolling in dough and holding it back from the rest of us.
In the classic movie Other People’s Money, Larry The Liquidator said “We’re dead alright. We’re just not broke. And you know the surest way to go broke? Keep getting an increasing share of a shrinking market. Down the tubes. Slow but sure”.
In rugby terms, the shrinking market he’s talking about is us. The fans. We’ve stopped going to games. We’ve stopped taking part. And according to the ratings figures, many of us have stopped watching on TV too.
Which means that the three richest sources of revenue the game has, all cop a hit. Gate receipts and sponsorship head south when we don’t go to the games, and pay TV receipts too will eventually go south if we don’t watch.
“So what?” I hear you say. “Why should I waste my money on going to the game when the rugby is rubbish? Why should I support the ARU when they do nothing to get my kid interested in the game?”.
My answer? Because by going to the game, you earn the right to have a real voice. By supporting the players, you remember what is really important in rugby – and that’s hanging in through the dark days as well as the salad days when we’re on top.
By being involved you earn the right to call yourself a genuine rugby supporter, and you earn the right to pass this birthright and tradition on to your kids.
You wouldn’t wait for the police to drop around to your place to give you kids a quick lesson on law and order, or hope that the dentist shows up to teach them how to clean their teeth.
So why are you waiting for the ARU, or the NSWRU or someone else to teach your child the joys of rugby? Why are you waiting for someone else to fix rugby before you get up and go to a game?
Rugby needs us more now than ever before, so it’s hard to believe that we’re deserting it in droves. How in the world could a warrior like Phil Waugh, who has spilt more blood than an abbatoir slaughterman and taken more hits than Evel Knievel, all for our enjoyment, be looking down the barrel of a record number of appearances for the Waratahs in front of a quarter full stadium?
We should be utterly ashamed of ourselves. Not for Waugh’s sake, but because we now care so little about taking part in the important moments in rugby.
It’s about time we woke up and got off the couch and went to the game. Those crowd numbers and gate receipts will eventually trickle back down to your little area of grassroots rugby, in the form of distributions to clubs, coaching support and other development activities. And even if they don’t amount to much, who cares. You’ve reconnected and become part of the family again.
Sure the unions are dysfunctional in some ways. But if that’s your opinion, doesn’t that make it even more ridiculous to be leaving the future of the game in their hands? Get involved yourself.
What to do? Well, I can hear the baying of a torch-bearing mob on the wind as they surge up the windy mountain path to my hideout, so I won’t go through the full million or so ways that you could support rugby.
The easiest one would be to walk out of your office tomorrow evening, grab a kid and/or a few mates, and head out to the SFS to cheer on the Waratahs and their record-breaking captain. As rugby people, it’s incumbent upon us to take the future of the game in our hands, earn the right to criticise, and most important of all, pat one of our own on the back.
Keep an eye out for me and I’ll buy you a beer. I’ll be easy to spot – there’ll be a pitchfork between my shoulder-blades.
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- Explore:
- Carlos Spencer, Crowds, NSW Waratahs, rugby unon, Super Rugby

Spiro Zavos said | March 12th 2010 @ 6:18am | Report comment
Andrew, very well put. Supporters in too many cases have taken the easy option and watched at home. The problem here is that the TV commentary, aside from Rod Kafer, is terrible. The worst of all the major sports broadcasters. So home viewers get this terrible negative view of the game from nit-picking, uninformed commentators.
At the ground itself itself the crowd is responsive enough. But I would love the atmosphere that soccer/football crowds can generate, and rugby crowds in the south of France.
Rugby crowds in this part of the world can do this. Just look at the IRB Sevens in Wellington, the crowds there are fantastic. There used to be a terrific atmsophere, too, on the hill at Ballymore, too.
Somehow we have to get this back.
Bay35Pablo said | March 12th 2010 @ 9:45am | Report comment
“At the ground itself itself the crowd is responsive enough”?
I’ve heard more energetic bingo halls!! Sydney crowds can be quiet.
The fact that biggest noise was booing of kicks last game is damning. But it shows we care. Get some running rugby and then we’ll cheer.
I wouldn’t expect a crowd as low as 10,000. But it might be as bad as 18,000 or so. SAF teams always get the lowest crwods, and the worst the team is regarded the lower the crowd.
Blackfalcon said | March 12th 2010 @ 2:06pm | Report comment
Don’t forget the Saffa crowds, especially the Stormers and Bulls fans. Always good atmospheres at their games.
Melb Rebel said | March 14th 2010 @ 9:41pm | Report comment
lets move the Adelaide 7′s to Melbourne. and put it back to back with Wellington before S15.
Wavell Wakefield said | March 12th 2010 @ 6:37am | Report comment
I blame Stephen Jones…
Rob said | March 12th 2010 @ 6:40am | Report comment
Andrew, a couple of thoughts:
* I think the S15 has started too early in the year. We’ve just got back from the Christmas holidays and the rugby has started.
* My impressions of NSW supporters is that a high percentage of them are a fickle mob. They go to the rugby when it is the place to be seen and when there is success.
* As a consequence when the footy is ordinary ( as it has been at NSW for a while now ) the supporters won’t go.
But as a postscript to this I wrote a piece last year saying that for the first time ever my mates and I (all over 45 years each of involvement in rugby) were flicking across to watch the league. Although league hasn’t started yet we are enjoying the rugby again (except for NSW ) so our TVs are getting a pretty solid workout. If we are indicative of others interest in rugby is coming back but it will take time to get those bums back on seats at the SFS.
Ora said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:38am | Report comment
From a NZ perspective firstly like Rob has said the S14 starts in the middle of our summer when everyones still watching the Cricket and having a few bevies and a BBQ.
Secondly its pretty much the same teams doing well year in year out with the occasional changing of the guard mid – lower table.
From 14 years of Super competiton only 4 teams have ever won it, one of those teams a staggering 7 times with three in a row. In 12 years of the NRL there has been 8 winners with the Storm and Brisbane winning it 3 times each. The salary cap has done wonders for this competition and makes it a more even spread and very competitive unlike the S14 where it’s the same teams doing well every year, NZ Chiefs, Canes Crusaders, SA Bulls, and at times Stormers and Sharks(definitely not this year) Aus Brumbies and Tahs,
Something needs to be done with this competition to make it exciting, maybe introduce a cap but let players move between the three countries franchises, I don’t know but as it stands it’s hardly invigorating, The conference system coming in is also going to be interesting and a team could make the finals not because they are a better team but simply because they win their region. Last year proved this with the Best being the Bulls and the 3 next best teams coming from New Zealand however with the conference system one of the NZ teams would drop out of the finals to accomodate an Australian team. Theoretically they could still play by being one of the best losers,
DERBY COUNTY FC said | March 12th 2010 @ 6:45am | Report comment
1. The commentary is awful, they don’t talk that just shout noise.
2. Sydneysiders are fickle and lazy supporters, they turn up to bigger games or games that ‘REALLY’ matter.
3. The novelty has worn off, it’s not a shiny, new package now.
4. ELV’s are not setting the world alight.
5. The atmosphere that Aussies produce is dire but that’s not new (then again i’ve only been here 8.5 years), rugby in Australia will never produce a football/euro rugby atmosphere, it’s not in their culture.
6. NSWRU treat supporters badly by moving big games to ANZ which i think supporters don’t like and feel they are disrespected.
7. The sport market is ridiculously flooded with TV and live events which i think affects other sports, e.g., so much cricket in the summer, people get bored of attending stadia, getting a train, getting a ticket, buying drink and food, taking time out. It’s tiresome, expensive and hard work over and over again. The novelty has worn off.
Oddly enough, support doesn’t seem to be down in Europe despite similar coverage, the difference is that Marseille, Worcestor, Leinster for example have a captive market… Sydney does not, too many options.
My two cents
Mr cheese said | March 12th 2010 @ 9:55am | Report comment
Derby County FC ?
Nice.
J’adore the rams !!
Me gustan the rams !!!!
sheek said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:05am | Report comment
Andrew,
Wonderfully written & passionate post. Hell, there’s never an easy answer here. 10 years ago I would ensure I went to at least one S12/14 match, usually two. I would also grab one test, sometimes two. 10 years ago I knew I would be entertained watching very good players trying to outwit each other.
And this back in the kick-fest days of the late 90s-early 2000s. But somehow the players found a way around the stifling laws.
Abstinence is the last refuge of the sporting fan, the last roll of the dice. We’re not going to watch rubbish, at least not live. If we start watching rubbish rugby on TV, we can always change channels, or turn the TV off. At least we weren’t dudded by forking out money to go to the game live.
What’s the line from the old rock n roll song – “I hear you knocking, but you can’t come in”.
That’s the stay-at-home fan saying to the go-to-the-game fan that he’s no longer interested in watching rubbish, he’s not going to cop it. Last Sunday in his newspaper column Adam Freier was imploring rugby fans to get to the game. For what….. ?
For what indeed! The rugby laws suck, the style of rugby sucks, the rugby players suck. We can rant & rave all we like on sites like The Roar.
The great irony of modern sport is that we get sport 24/7 both in scheduling & on TV, but most of it is ‘filler’, a kinder word than rubbish!
Only when the fans stop going to the game will the authorities finally wake up to the fact they have a problem. Only then will they realise they need us. But then it might be too late for everyone.
Right now Andrew I just don’t care enough. I didn’t lose the care factor yesterday, or last week, or last month. I’ve been losing it steadily for 5 years.
Spiro says somehow we must get this back. Fans going to the game that is. Well, it’s all been said ad nauseum. If the players, coaches, franchises, ARU, SANZAR, IRB, etc want us back going to games live, then give us what WE THE FANS want!
Gee, sorry for the rant but……….
Wavell Wakefield said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:19am | Report comment
‘For what indeed! The rugby laws suck, the style of rugby sucks, the rugby players suck.’
A day out with friends… for the atmosphere?
Big Steve said | March 12th 2010 @ 8:17am | Report comment
Thanks for pointing out you dont go to the games Wavell. The atmosphere, thats gold.
Wavell Wakefield said | March 12th 2010 @ 8:48am | Report comment
I don’t go to any Super 14 games, Big Steve, on account of the fact that I’m English and live in London. My point, however, was that watching a game of rugby isn’t the only end product of attending a rugby match.
Let me offer a soccer context: I watch Millwall FC. Fortunately, I only live about 25 minutes (approximately) away by train). Unfortunately, Millwall plays in the third division of the English leagues (League One), has a crapulent stadium in a crapulent part of London, with a crapulent pitch and offers an average brand (in terms of spectacle) of football. The tickets are expensive in comparison to the stature of the club, and given the central positioning of the local train stations it is expensive to drink in the area. Put it this way, it doesn’t compare to The Stoop or Twickenham.
Anyway, I digress. The point is this: I attend matches at The New Den because it is a good day out. I meet some friends early in the day. We might have breakfast together and then go on and have a few drinks. We’ll meet more friends etc, have a laugh and then the match takes place. The stadia facilities are horrible and the crowds low, but the atmosphere is good. I enjoy meeting friends and like-minded people. It’s an experience in itself: the jokes; the laughter; the chanting; the cheering; the game. Everything combines and my enjoyment is not reliant on any one single factor. That for me is what a sporting event is.
Bay35Pablo said | March 12th 2010 @ 9:52am | Report comment
WW, right on. Half of why I go is because I go with half a dozen mates, and we have been going for years. Some have changed, but the core are there. If they weren’t going, I’d probably still go. But year after year perhaps not. What you watch is only half the spectacle.
Big Steve said | March 12th 2010 @ 2:15pm | Report comment
WW agreed that the reason we go is for more that the play on the field. I would describe the atmosphere at a waratahs game the least interesting of all sporting events in the world. Its one of the places you feel bad yelling somthing out as people around you get offended.
i love the game and watching the contest. I have been to atleast 80% of the games in the least 4 years. Including the waratahs in canberra. Watching a game in canberra is completely different to watching a game in Sydney.
i will not go to homebush.
To be honest there is better atmosphere at club rugby and I prefer to go there, but i still support the tahs and go each week cause I dont want them to disappear. The less people who go the worse it gets and if 10,000 turn up tonight it could take many years for the nswru to recover from the follow on of poor crowds for the rest of the year.
Wavell Wakefield said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:40pm | Report comment
Yeah, that’s fair enough, Big Steve. I certainly wouldn’t want to come across as lecturing on a subject I don’t know much about (the workings of matchday in Tahland). I know what you mean about feeling bad to cheer or shout, I get the same feeling in some places.
Seiran said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:39am | Report comment
tut tut tut Sheek.
If you really supported your team and you lived close enough to the stadium you should go.
I unfortunately live in the UK so I can’t go to S14 matches. But I always go to at least one Wallabies match every year no matter where the game is. I’ve been to France, Wales, Scotland and Italy to watch games. All of them when the wallabies have been playing pretty bad rugby.
Why? Because I support the wallabies. When I move back to Sydney, I’ll go to the rugby as often as possible.
Mr cheese said | March 12th 2010 @ 9:58am | Report comment
“I unfortunately live in the UK….” ??????
What’s unfortunate about living in beautiful England ? It’s the greatest country on earth.
What was the rugby like in France ? I’ve never watched rugby over there.
Seiran said | March 13th 2010 @ 1:58am | Report comment
Sorry, I meant it was unfortunate because I can’t go to any S14 matches.
Rugby in France is great! I went to Marselle about 6 or so years ago to see France v Wallabies. French fans are a great laugh and really enjoy their rugby.
I forgot to mention that I’ve also been to twickenham a few times as well.
sheek said | March 12th 2010 @ 1:45pm | Report comment
Seiran,
A fool & his money are soon parted. Fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice, shame on you.
I’m not going to pay money for rubbish rugby (I do enough of that at other times, pay for rubbish, that is!)……….
Keith said | March 12th 2010 @ 9:57pm | Report comment
Sheek, if you don’t like rugby I’ve got a simple solution for you that might save you a lot of typing – watch something else.
Grimmace said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:22am | Report comment
Well done Andrew,
Having never lived within 800km of a S12/14 team I find it hard to understand why people won’t go when in reality its not that far away- “the parkings bad,” “they’re playing poorly.” Boo Hoo. I go a couple fo times a year 8 hour drive included. You’ve got the chance to participate in something big.
One thing i mentioned to one of the Grass Roots Rugby guys- I was talking about country rugby but it applies accross the board- we need to help ourselves. We can’t sit back and whinge and expect someone else to fix the problems.
But as Rob said, people are talking about rugby again, not just the rugby nuts.
katzilla said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:27am | Report comment
Im sorry Andrew, but one day im hopeful that my son will actually WANT to play rugby.
Taking him to see the Sorrytahs is going to put my dreams behind the 8 ball because there is no way they play any kind of rugby that might inspire a young kid to want to play rugby (Mind you he can chase a balloon for hours on end I spose he might enjoy running back and forth while his backs kick the leather off it)
Rugby is entertainment, if they want my cash (and my son) then provide a good show.
You don’t blame movie fans for the fact that Gigli didn’t get any viewers to the movies, you blame the actors and the directors (and a host of others involved) for the fact its rubbish.
I know what your trying to say Andrew and I understand that certain fans just look for reasons/excuses to not go.
But I want a reason to go. I want the Avatar of Rugby to look forward to, not the Gigli.
Pete said | March 12th 2010 @ 8:26am | Report comment
“I want the Avatar of Rugby to look forward to, not the Gigli.”
well for a start, at the least the Tahs are blue
Brett McKay said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:28am | Report comment
Great stuff Andrew, it’s really quite difficult to argue with too much of this. Actually, it’s a nice throwback to Leftie’s “What can you do for Rugby?” piece mid-way through last year, and along similar lines to what I tried to pitch when I wrote about getting off the Wallabies back during the TNs last year.
The trouble is Spiro, Rob and Sheek and others have all detailed what annoys us about rugby and S14. Hell, even Wavell has a solid point!! I’d imagine there’ll be plenty more responses along these lines.
Think back to the overwhelming response to your Rugby Australia article, and how many pledges for membership were offered. But how many of those pledges have turned into actual payments, to build on the brilliant work you and Pablo have been doing behind the scenes?
But the fact remains, if we do all love rugby as much as we say we do, we should do what we can.
We can all come with heaps of reasons not to go, but the reason TO go should be simple (and admittedly hard to accept sometims!)…
Look forward to taking you up on your beer offer at Homebush on April 24
Grimmace said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:35am | Report comment
i’ve signed up and paid my money
sheek said | March 12th 2010 @ 8:22am | Report comment
Brett,
I met both Kersi & Vinay last night, they are a great pair of gentlemen. Kersi said he met you at the cricket test & thought you a wonderful gentleman also!
I would like to eventually meet both Loges & yourself, & some other roarers also. The 24th might be the go. Even if the rugby is boring, we will have plenty of conversation to occupy ourselves???
Brett McKay said | March 12th 2010 @ 8:28am | Report comment
Sheek – and all Roarers for that matter – if you are going to the Tahs-Brumbies on the 24th of April, be sure to register your interest and we’ll send you the meeting point info closer to the date.
The link is at the bottom of Loges’ (and all rugby) article – right below the bit where he promises to buy you a beer!!
Sheek, Kersi and Vinay truly are great gentlemen, and I can assure you and them the please of meeting for a beer at the SCG was all mine. Look forward to meeting many more of you at Homebush..
RickG said | March 12th 2010 @ 12:34pm | Report comment
Brett, just in case you’re not aware the link appears to be broken at the moment.
Brett McKay said | March 12th 2010 @ 1:06pm | Report comment
Rick, I’ve been able to get to it just now, so maybe try again?? If the problem persists, maybe use the Contact Us section, and I’m sure the guys will add you to the list…
Brett McKay said | March 12th 2010 @ 12:55pm | Report comment
Rick, thanks for that, I wasn’t aware. Just talk amongst yourselves for a while…
Zac, if you’re out there??
Ballywhore said | March 13th 2010 @ 12:21pm | Report comment
How is the massive tide of support through “Rugby Australia” going?
Signed up 100,000 members yet?
Or 15 from the roar?
formeropenside said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:33am | Report comment
I prefer to watch rugby on television. You can actually see what is going on at rucks and mauls, what is happening at scrumtime, etc. As a rule, I dont really care about “atmosphere” at the ground – you can get that at any sporting event, if you want it.
Wavell Wakefield said | March 12th 2010 @ 8:53am | Report comment
‘I prefer to watch rugby on television. You can actually see what is going on at rucks and mauls, what is happening at scrumtime, etc.’
I think this is a really good point. The game has become quicker and more complicated and the quality and value of TVs has improved. I’m pretty serious about my rugby, and one thing that puts me off watching rugby union live is the fact that I often miss so much. That’s why if presented with the choice of union or other sports I would always take boxing, snooker or soccer.
oikee said | March 12th 2010 @ 7:36am | Report comment
Did not the public schools only just open there doors to the AFL. ? The way i see rugby union in Australia, its only going to get worse.
I will make 3 points.
AFL is now sweeping into each state with a level playing feild, not only in public schools, but private.
Soccer has grown a larger presense also at all levels, and will continue to eat away at union support. Which i think it has nearly gone past union for 3rd most followed aussie sport.
And this is the final reality, who would most people watch this Friday nite, the excitement machines called the Eels or the waratahs.
It seems to me the real enemy for rugby union is AFL, there games genarates so much more excitement for the fans, and someone said the other day, he took his kids to the Waratahs game, then later took them along for the soccer semi final, and his kids loved the soccer game. Bigger atmosphere, and it only had 20 thousand. So your fighting a 3 way battle, most people at union games get more excited when they see the stock market rising.