Australian football has hardly begun to learn from its past
By Davidde Corran, 25 May 2010 Davidde Corran is a Roar Expert
- Tagged:
- FFA, football, Football World Cup, Socceroos
On Sunday, during a lull in a Spanish second division match in Madrid, I was lucky enough to attend, I found myself thinking back to a game at Bob Jane Stadium I went to when I was about 13 years old. As I remember it, South Melbourne’s spiritual home was playing host to a game between an Australian Under 23 side and a European opponent.
However, for the life of me I can’t remember whom our national youth team was up against.
In fact, I’d forgotten about this game for so long I can’t even remember who any of the Australian players were.
I can vividly recall taking the train to the stadium, sitting in the main stand and wondering how uncomfortable it would be to have to sit on the cement ‘seating’ on the other side of the field, and then nearly falling off my chair when I realised a guy I rode the bus to school with was one of the ball boys. But when it comes to the details of the football match, I’m at a loss.
This memory has got me desperately wishing to be able to take a trip down memory lane and find out more about that game, whether it be by reading a match report, looking at the team sheet or a solitary picture.
Yet that will have to remain a simple, and extremely nerdy, wish of mine, for there’s no collection of football games played by Australian national teams or any other aspect of our game’s history available to the public.
This is an old gripe of mine that was stirred up by the launch last week of The Global Game exhibition in Melbourne.
While The Global Game looks like a fascinating exhibition, and I personally look forward to stopping by when I’m back in Melbourne after the World Cup, it is barely a drop in the ocean.
I truly believe that we need a National Football Museum.
Imagine the opportunity to explore an exhibition on the rich 131-year-old history of the game in Australia. To learn about one of the oldest cup competitions in the world which was played in rural Australia between Scottish and English footballers.
To see images from the Socceroos sojourn to wartime Vietnam in the late 1960s. Or even to simply trawl through a history of games played in Australia and find out about that Australian Under-23s game from Bob Jane Stadium.
While FFA is busy managing the Socceroos journey to South Africa and a World Cup hosting rights bid, not to mention denying the true history of the game, there’s little chance of this happening.
Excuse the pun, but on this issue, FFA do have history.
Yet I don’t entirely blame them, they have had other more important issues facing the game over the last five years.
Still, it’s a shame that, from Rale Rasic’s own personal collection of football memorabilia through to the archives of Football Federation Australia, there is a whole raft of football history going untold.
If you ask me it is time that we started to acknowledge our past and such a collection would be a great opportunity to do so.
The Global Game exhibition was launched on the back of the Socceroos’ time in Melbourne, and will no doubt do well thanks to the extra attention the game will receive due to next month’s World Cup.
But last week it should have been a permanent collection on the history of football in this country that Football Federation Australia was helping launch.
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AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 8:50am | Report comment
Davidde
One site I would recommend is http://www.ozfootball.net/ark/Socceroo/Socceroo.shtml
Not an FFA site though.
Davidde Corran said | May 25th 2010 @ 9:32pm | Report comment
AndyRoo, thanks so much for that link! I had seen that site once before but forgotten all about it. What a wonderful collection. The only problem is I found a few different games played at Bob Jane around that time… will have to think harder.
Football in Australia has some fantastic supporters who take up such initatives.
ItsCalledFootball said | May 25th 2010 @ 11:14pm | Report comment
Interesting link, some years we only played one or two internationals all year. How times have changed in our new Asian home.
Back in the good old days when we played A and B internationals and games against Manchester United, Go Ahead Eagles and Colo Colo (all club sides) were considered “international” games.
Forgetmenot said | May 25th 2010 @ 9:29am | Report comment
Very confusing heading. I thought you were talking about Australian Football, not soccer.
Davidde doesnt the National Sports Museum host a few permanent soccer related items, other than ‘The Global Game’ exhibition.
A National Association Football Museum would be very good to educate several Roarers on some aspects of their sport that they are mis-educated about.
Redb said | May 25th 2010 @ 9:39am | Report comment
Got to agree. Soon they’ll rename the A League, the Australian Football League.
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 9:47am | Report comment
I wasn’t confused….. you two must be getting on a bit, maybe get your eyes checked out before you step behing the wheel next time.
Aka said | May 25th 2010 @ 9:58am | Report comment
They’re like six year olds with their hands over their ears. Yelling ‘I cant hear you’
Redb said | May 25th 2010 @ 10:11am | Report comment
My eyes are fine, its the focus of some Association football journos that needs adjustment. The over use of ‘Australian football’ demonstrates a reinforcement need that did not exist 5 years ago. Could have just said ‘football’ in Australia,etc.
It’s a bit of a mission for some no doubt.
Forgetmenot said | May 25th 2010 @ 10:25am | Report comment
AndyRoo,
No. Still on my Green P’s if that gives you hint about my age…
Aka,
Exactly. Soccer fans do not listen at all do they.
RedB,
Still confusing. Easier to use ‘soccer’. It would grow the game as well.
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 10:34am | Report comment
Well before telling people to get their eyes checked I should probably do so myself.
The irony of spelling “behind” as “behing” has undone me.
I felt the header fit the article and given it’s not really a cross code article didn’t seem forced. I think save your powder for Foz’s next piece
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 11:07am | Report comment
Artilce like this one (from the ABC) will fire him up
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/05/25/2908494.htm?site=news
MyGeneration said | May 25th 2010 @ 11:26am | Report comment
Jonathan Green and Craig Foster – cagefight?
Baz35 said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:13pm | Report comment
I have no problem with the term “football” being used by soccer supporters in this country
The term “australian football” describing soccer in australia though is clearly confusing unnecessary and aggressive.
The fact that our game is being referred to in the growth areas as AFL is a shame, but the AFL is responsible for that. They have taken a shallow “branding” approach and perhaps there is a little political motivation in making the independent commissions name synonymous with the game.
You’d think though on the tab it could be bestowed with a name most of its followers would be comfortable with. If Australian Football is too much for the weak stomachs of the those with an inferiority complex who think the native code is an evil tyrant, than at least “australian rules”
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:17pm | Report comment
Baz35, one thing AFL has going for it as a name on the Tab is it’s much shorter than a two word name.
Forgetmenot said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:22pm | Report comment
How about footy as a name for the ‘AFL’ tab.
I await your reply.
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:28pm | Report comment
Forgetmenot, I nearly suggested that!
It’s a nick name though so it sounds a little bit disrespectful. At least AFL is now the codes name in two states.
I don’t care if they name the tab Australian football or Australian Rules Football… I only brought up the issue of space because either of those would be bigger than the other tabs.
Lingerie football would be a good name if your looking to up the clicks
Beast-A-Tron said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:37pm | Report comment
Baz35 – “If Australian Football is too much for the weak stomachs of the those with an inferiority complex who think the native code is an evil tyrant, than at least “australian rules” ”
Well said, an indictment on a particular mindset I see all too often here.
Still a fair few people on this board who don’t understand the etymology of the generic word ‘football’ (or how dialects evolve for that matter) and seem to think that authoritarianism will enable them to ‘own’ a word from the English language, so sad.
Beast-A-Tron said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:50pm | Report comment
Witness the aforementioned inferiority complex in all its glory:
The World Game Forum – X’s Dirt Files:
http://www21.sbs.com.au/wgforum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=175626
Seriously a dirt file? Who does that?!
Some deep insecurity issues on that thread, good for a laugh.
PS. Notice how its ‘stickied’ to the very top of the forum listing, even though its latest posting is over a month old (compare to the latest posting dates of more recent threads listed below it). Clearly this thread has tacit approval from the TWG admins moderating their forums, which is very telling indeed.
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:51pm | Report comment
Beast and Baz
You should probably take up the issue with your own codes governing body.
Edit: I think their’s a little sub forum on the AFL big footy site that doesn’t exactly paint you guys as innocent…and after all you guys are the ones getting upset in a football thread because of the article title when the pictures (and the little Soccerball) make it pretty clear what the topic is.
Beast your link goes nowhere “The requested topic does not exist”….. so to answer your question “it doesn’t say much”.
Edit2: Now working
Beast-A-Tron said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:57pm | Report comment
Andyroo,
If there was an equivalent ‘dirt file’ on big footy I would indeed be highly ashamed.
As for my opinion on the naming tabs, I really don’t care. But it is indicative of the owner/admin’s attitude, those whom are responsible for the tabs.
I have seen on occasion in footy articles where ‘football’ was edited out and replaced by ‘AFL’, against the authors’ own wishes. Thus I think its more than just marketing but some sort of active attitude amongst the mods governing the site.
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:02pm | Report comment
Beast, look at the sub forums.
http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=5
Soccer is as big an issue as umpires and the MRP for you guys….. come on where not as bad as those Maggots are we?
Edit: On the AFL tab in an AFL article if it’s only about AFL I don’t see why they would change the word football…. that just seems weird.
Beast-A-Tron said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:06pm | Report comment
I went through the URL and clicked on the title and it didn’t take me to any specific thread. Which are you referring to?
“Edit: On the AFL tab in an AFL article if it’s only about AFL I don’t see why they would change the word football…. that just seems weird.”
Because the author is talking about Football and wishes to use the correct term to describe the sport they admire and follow (Note: this does not denote exclusive ownership of the generic word ‘football’).
You may have no problem with such agenda driven editorialising, but I find it rather unappealing and inaccurate to say the least. I know nothing will change, but I may as well highlight this subjective editing.
Harvey the Scouser said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:08pm | Report comment
how I long for the days when it used to rain, milk came in bottles, and umps were white maggots, and you could shout it out loud without feelin guilty
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:18pm | Report comment
“Edit: On the AFL tab in an AFL article if it’s only about AFL I don’t see why they would change the word football…. that just seems weird.” Andyroo
“Because the author is talking about Football and wishes to use the correct term to describe the sport they admire and follow (Note: this does not denote exclusive ownership of the generic word ‘football’).
You may have no problem with such agenda driven editorialising, but I do.”Beast
Sorry if it wasn’t clear but I was agreeing with you. In an AFL article I don’t see why they would change any of the authors terms (e.g. football) for their own game. If I am reading an article about AFL I know what the term football means, just as if some one in Lions top tells me he’s going to the football I know what he means.
Beast-A-Tron said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:22pm | Report comment
“Sorry if it wasn’t clear but I was agreeing with you.”
Uh no I misread what you said, didn’t realise you were expressing suspicion over the veracity of the claim (I initially thought you were advocating such editorialising).
I’ve seen it happen and there isn’t really a way to prove it because well… the article is permanently changed, so I guess you’ll just have to decide whether or not you believe it. I did see an author a while back make such a claim in his own article, I think it might have been ‘forgetmenot’ or something.
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:31pm | Report comment
I believe you. My declaring it weird was more a statement on the act. It is weird as I don’t see what the problem is with AFL fans calling their game football or whatever else they want.
I never had any problem with the name Soccer and often used it….. until people kept insisting we shouldn’t call the game Football. While calling Association Football Soccer isn’t really an issue for me being told what to call it instantly makes me think “we will call it whatever the **** we want” and I now use the word football pretty much all the time (unless it would be too confusing).
So I understand if you can’t call AFL football why you wouldn’t be happy.
Beast-A-Tron said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:36pm | Report comment
“…being told what to call it instantly makes me think “we will call it whatever the **** we want” and I now use the word football pretty much all the time (unless it would be too confusing).”
Exemplary of how authoritarian attitudes produce counter-reactions.
The whole ‘you must call it…’ is prevalent in all codes of football unfortunately. So yeah I’d agree with much of what you’re saying.
Baz35 said | May 25th 2010 @ 9:17pm | Report comment
Andyroo
In response to “Bigfooty”
a) that sub forum is a minuscule percentage of the total traffic on Bigfooty
b) it is essentially half a dozen footy supporters and half a dozen soccer “trolls” arguing over the world cup bid
c) it has less traffic than pretty much all the club sub forums and far less than the association football sub forum (aussie rules fans of soccer)
d) it was probably created so that the the “code wars” arguments could be demarcated from the rest of the forum
There is simply nothing even approaching symmetry. the number of australian soccer’s who share in the collective persecution complex is not even close to being rivalled by any of the other codes and certainly not australian football
Davidde Corran said | May 25th 2010 @ 10:29pm | Report comment
I find this to be a rather tedious debate and Forgetmenot, I WAS talking about “Australian football”. Like many things it is the context that defines the meaning of that term.
No one has ownership of the word football and I think Midfielder summed it up perfectly when he wrote, “What I find weird is people claiming to own a name… and the name they claim are two of the most common words in Australia… they are …. Australian & Football”
Why are we all so paranoid and riled up that an innocuous, and entirely appropriate, heading can be called “aggressive” on the same day some ABC hack writes some seething commentary on a game he has no interest in?
It’s as boring as it is disheartening.
Baz35 said | May 25th 2010 @ 10:58pm | Report comment
Rubbish article by the ABC “hack”, with out a doubt
as is said i have no problem with people calling “soccer” “football” in this country it has made things a little confusing but soccer people have every right to refer to their football code as “football”. you whack australia in front of it and it is a different ball game all together.
midfielder summed up nothing. child like logic is not summing “it up perfectly” i’m afraid
australian football is the most correct name of the code. referring in the title to australian soccer as “australian football” on what is supposedly a multi code site is disrespectful and aggressive. the “aggressive” adjective might be what you are referring to as “paranoid”…you are right i have no evidence and merely suspect it
Galloping Guru said | May 25th 2010 @ 11:40pm | Report comment
One mans freedom fighter is another mans terrorist, so a ABC hack is a bit unkind , he calls it the way he sees it, it’s just not the way you see it.
BTW IMHO soccer is not Australian football, its just to easily confused with the native code of Australian football.
Why would the ROAR not call soccer Association football, thats precisely what it is.
If soccer has a 131 year old history ( as your article claims ) in this country, why all of a sudden is it now called Australian football, when its been known as soccer for association football or as in several street maps in Perth British football for 125 or so years.
It appears to be some sort of attempted cultural takeover of a combination of words that historically are not yours to take.
Davidde Corran said | May 26th 2010 @ 5:26am | Report comment
“hack” is a fairly common slang term for a journalist. I have seen it, and used it myself, on here in the past but maybe it is more of an English word? Either way that’s where I was going with it.
Baz35 don’t worry there is nothing to suspect. This article doesn’t reference any other code or sport at any stage. For what it’s worth, I can’t imagine any professional journalist would try and sneak in a cheap jab at another code in the heading of a piece like this.
Meanwhile, Australian football, football in Australia, etc. There’s many ways to skin a cat and I am trying not to indulge this debate because it feels like banging my head against a wall.
The use of “Australian football” is much like the use of “Australian music”. It is referring to the game in that country or football/music from Australia. So I can say “British football”, “Italian football”, “French football” but not “Australian football” because of the sensibilities of whom? AFL lovers? I’m a member of an AFL club and I have no problem with it so what’s the big deal?
Galloping Guru I don’t know how you’ve misunderstood me like this, nor how many people have as well, but I have never heard football/soccer referred to as “Australian football.”
I’m signing off on this debate now. There’s just so much more of interest, relevance and importance to discuss.
Zac Zavos said | May 26th 2010 @ 11:06am | Report comment
Just re-iterating Davidde’s point to stay on topic here please.
BigAl said | May 26th 2010 @ 11:18am | Report comment
Very amusing request Zac !
-especially considering this diverging from ‘ on topic’ is caused by the heading of the article , which was created not by Davidde, but, I believe , your good self ?
Michael C said | May 26th 2010 @ 11:37am | Report comment
agreed.
Australian Football said | May 26th 2010 @ 1:19pm | Report comment
BigAl,
and what is so wrong with the article or the headline..? Davidde’s point is quite clear, legitimate and correctly put. AFL do not own the titles “Australian” or “Football” and has all the right to use the terminology. Best you could do is lobby your own governing body and present your code as Aussie Rules or preferable the indigenous name Marngrook.
BigAl said | May 26th 2010 @ 4:06pm | Report comment
nothing wrong with article – just confusing headline(sic)
Australian Football said | May 26th 2010 @ 5:26pm | Report comment
BigAl,
Davidde, has written an excellent article that even a German poster from across the other side of the world (Andre) has picked up on. An Australian Football article about the possible creation of an Australian Football Museum on the Football Tab. You are not confused you are just annoyed that the goal posts have changed and you can’t accept that, Football Federation Australia are on the Australian Football sporting landscape—end of story.
Towser said | May 25th 2010 @ 10:44am | Report comment
Why do you need a museum?
Museums are for stuffed mummys(pardon the expression).
Watching football over many years a lot of incidents are just a blur. I remember the feel of the moment, but the majority of the time the names, dates, opponents are lost in the midsts of time.
All you have to do is remember the moment. That it was satisfying as an expression of what you like about the game.
Then you pass it on to the next generation. Thats the museum of the mind.
Thats how I learnt about football in England,how people in traditional football countries pass on the history of the game.
What your saying to me its that by creating a museum you can somehow fast forward and make a history that has previously been weak look stronger than its reality.
It will happen, but you cant pretend you own a Rolls Royce when all youve really had in the past is a Ford Fiesta.
bazza said | May 25th 2010 @ 1:04pm | Report comment
I am not surprised that you found a soccer game totally forgettable
Midfielder said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:27pm | Report comment
What I find weird is people claiming to own a name… and the name they claim are two of the most common words in Australia… they are …. Australian & Football ….
Me thinks over reaction…
RickG said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:29pm | Report comment
Perhaps there’s scope here for a well researched book. There’s several titles covering the other codes with pretty thorough histories, team lists, game dates etc, with extra material available on CD-ROM or online. Given football’s increased prominence in recent years now might be a good time to do it.
Chris said | May 25th 2010 @ 3:39pm | Report comment
Headline could have been a tad more precise.
How about “Football in Australia”?
Saying “Australian football” is deliberately inflammatory and ambiguous.
For the record I am a Rugby/League fan – so I hate Soccer and AFL in equal measure.
Davidde Corran said | May 26th 2010 @ 5:31am | Report comment
No, Australian football means the same thing as “Football in Australia” but is simply one word shorter. It is a headline not a paragraph hence the need for being concise.
As I mentioned above it all depends on context. This article has NOTHING to do with any other code or sport so how could it be “deliberately inflammatory and ambiguous”?
Harvey the Scouser said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:05pm | Report comment
I actually found the title ambiguous for a different reason
it sounds as if we’re going to get another sermon about how New Football hasn’t learned the lessons of the failed Old Soccer
but in fact it’s got nothing to do with that at all
its really about preserving history
the title should have reflected that theme
Midfielder said | May 25th 2010 @ 7:24pm | Report comment
Same here Harvey …
MV Dave said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:23pm | Report comment
OMG Football having the temerity to call itself…errr…football? What next? AFL can call itself what ever it wants…nothing to do with football.
BTW WTF is Jonathon Green? Perhaps he sould write about some of the snorefests in other codes…then perhaps he could feel better about himself.
On the topic…would be nice if there was a permanent Football Museum but…where would it be located?
AndyRoo said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:33pm | Report comment
Sydney of course…. why you even bothered asking.
The best you could hope for is Canberra but not while Lowy is alive.
Forgetmenot said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:34pm | Report comment
So there should be 4 football tabs on The Roar??
Harvey the Scouser said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:34pm | Report comment
Isn’t there an Australian Football Hall of Fame?
Alders said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:40pm | Report comment
If you say Australian footall in the UK for instance they will think you mean the AFL. Get over it in any case guys. Neither of you have have a better claim to the name.
Forgetmenot said | May 25th 2010 @ 4:56pm | Report comment
Yes there is an Australian Football Hall of Fame, and it is for Australian Football.
Alders, Australian Football has a much greater claim to the word. It is the official name of the sport. Soccer has no right to use it at all and are only using it to create interest in the Soccer World Cup.
MV Dave said | May 25th 2010 @ 5:02pm | Report comment
“Soccer has no right to use it at all and are only using it to create interest in the Soccer World Cup” FMN…havent had such a laugh for some time. Now its a promotional gimmick!!!
Forgetmenot said | May 25th 2010 @ 5:09pm | Report comment
MV Dave,
Soccer supporters are mostly deliberately using the term to create a discussion, and in turn creating interest in the Soccer World Cup.
Even your mate Craig Foster agrees with me that interest needs to be created by any means necessary.
MV Dave said | May 25th 2010 @ 5:14pm | Report comment
Oh yeh the World Cup desperately needs more attention…what planet do you live on?
Forgetmenot said | May 25th 2010 @ 6:01pm | Report comment
Knowledge does not equal interest.
Discussion breeds interest.
Andre Zeh German said | May 25th 2010 @ 7:47pm | Report comment
come to Hannover in Germany and you will see the biggest Aussie football mueseum on the planet, uhh, mno maybe the second. Rales garage is much bigger, but I am close ……. Andre
Andr ezeh German said | May 26th 2010 @ 1:49am | Report comment
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbp73G8mqzA
look at the exhibition 4 years ago in Öhringen
Australian Football said | May 26th 2010 @ 9:28am | Report comment
Andre,
many thanks for the youtube video it was a grand gesture and as it has been said by Rale “There is no country without history”. I was touched and delighted that you took the time to post up your comment and video… Dunka (sp)
Davidde Corran said | May 26th 2010 @ 8:11pm | Report comment
Thanks for the link Andre.