What to expect in the November rugby tours
Roar Guru By Sam Taulelei, 26 Oct 2010 Sam Taulelei is a Roar Guru
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For southern hemisphere teams, there are two clear blocks of international rugby matches to be played before the World Cup champions are crowned next year: the November tour ahead and next year’s Tri Nations.
The traditional end of year tours have been a welcome bookend to the international rugby season for southern hemisphere fans. After a regular diet of Tri Nations rugby, the northern tours offer a welcome variety of venues, teams, fans and staying up into the early hours of Sunday morning to follow teams live. It’s like a prep school World Cup.
All the major rugby playing nations in the IRB top nine rankings will be on display in November. The path to World Cup glory begins in earnest next month for one of these sides in part one of this trilogy – The Fellowship of the Cup.
The southern hemisphere sides have had a full domestic season of playing under the new interpretations and are expected to have an edge over their counterparts still coming up to speed. Is that necessarily correct and true?
Forgetting New Zealand for the moment, who are ahead of every team at present, reviewing performances of the Springboks and Wallabies this season shows the Boks as a team stuck between playing two contrasting styles and doing neither one justice for themselves and their fans.
There are rumours of friction between the coaches and the body language of players during matches, clearly speak of an unhappy team. There are fears that senior players are in desperate need of a break and are struggling to maintain their normal levels of form. However the pressure of recording wins on the board after a disastrous Tri Nations campaign is forcing Peter de Villiers hand in selecting them to tour.
Until the Boks decide exactly how they want to play the game, select the correct personnel to implement it they are vulnerable to being upset by either of Ireland, Wales and England.
Australia is a dynamic team with enough skill, speed and talent to score points heavily against the opposition. However their defensive lapses, means they also leak points heavily to their opposition. There are still concerns about their mental fortitude and ruthlessness in closing out a game when in the lead. Their tight five will always be seen as a vulnerable area to be directly attacked from bigger packs and the Wallabies won’t want to get bogged down in a game with little continuity and frequent setpieces.
The selection of debutant Van Humphries may well be as inspired a choice as Tom Donnelly was for NZ last year and allow Nathan Sharpe to focus on his own game and not others. In a forward pack that is light on experience, it wouldn’t surprise me to see Van Humphries established in the Wallaby second row and a member of the leadership group Wallaby fans hear about so often but see little evidence of during a match.
Accuracy and concentration for the full 80 minutes is the key to their success on this tour, anything less will see them vulnerable to second half comebacks that have been their Achilles heel all season.
NZ, England and France pose the biggest threats to their aspirations for shaking off the chokers tag with Wales another potential banana peel.
Argentina is for the most part a relatively unknown quantity. There is little information about current player form apart from their top players contracted to European clubs. They did lose at home to Scotland earlier in the year which was a great surprise.
Their match against France will be a bruising encounter as usual and the French will hope they suffer no serious injuries with their match against the Wallabies the following week. From the heady days of 2007 when they enjoyed their highest ever world ranking and first time World Cup semi-finalists, they’ve dropped down the world rankings and will want to prove that 2007 was no fluke.
New Zealand will want to continue their hot streak of form and prove to themselves and doubters they still have improvements left in their game and can remain ahead of the field. The selection of Sonny Bill Williams will no doubt act as a lightning rod for the Fleet St press when they arrive in the UK and a third Grand Slam tour is in the offering again.
Although much interest is focused on the new boy, it will be the two old heads Carter and McCaw who will more likely attract the headlines if the All Blacks cut another swathe through the home unions. Finding answers to the eternal question of who will replace either of them if injured will hopefully be resolved or at the very least confirmed from within the squad, otherwise the search continues.
Other questions about the development and improvement of some of the less experienced tight five forwards, eg the Franks brothers, John Afoa, Anthony Boric, Sam Whitelock and Hika Elliott against their northern opponents will provide a good yardstick for next year.
With the likes of Ali Williams, Neemia Tialata, Corey Flynn and Jason Eaton still in the frame for selection, they can’t afford to ease off. New Zealand’s coaches need only look at the Springboks to see how fortunes can change very quickly in the space of twelve months, when you’re king of the hill.
For fans with little exposure to the northern rugby competitions, it’s a chance to see again the talent we know too little about, playing on their home turf and hopefully injury free and in form. It’s one thing to read newspaper reports and another thing altogether to watch with your own eyes.
The new law interpretations from most reports have been embraced by the clubs and reflected in an increase of tries scored and scorelines more commonly found in Super rugby matches. The challenge is to transfer the game played domestically into the international arena but at least the intent is there as well as the talent.
I am looking forward to watching the likes of Brad Davies, Jamie Roberts, Lee Byrne, Ben Youngs, Ben Foden, Chris Ashton and Dan Cole play again.
Who knows what other faces will become household names for Roarers to discuss in four weeks time.
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October 26th 2010 @ 2:44am
Poth Ale said | October 26th 2010 @ 2:44am | Report comment
Sam – don’t forget that Italy, Samoa and Fiji will also be playing in the November Internationals – so it’s the top 12 teams performing for the last time before the World Cup.
By the sounds of it, full-strength teams are being fielded wherever possible, with the exception – as is becoming usual – of South Africa. though reports seem to differ each day as to who’s playing or not.
Not sure about the Sonny Williams factor – he’s a relatively unknown quantity in British and Irish rugby since he didn’t feature in many H Cup matches. Unless he’s paraded by the AB contingent as the latest threat from the ABs – but he’s a lot of players to get past to have that title.
The law interpretations are going to be interesting. Whether they are an advantage to the SANZAR teams remains to be seen.
The english premiership would appear to have got to grips with them more so than the Magners or Top 14. And on the strength of some of the games so far, tries have been flowing a little more freely, though unlikely to the same extent as down south, given the defense-minded ethos of many NH teams. Last weekend had some of the lowest scoring matches that I’ve seen for some time as string defences took hold with little commitment to the breakdown.
Something tells me that we’re going to see a lot of penalties being awarded as the real battle of the breakdown occurs – with the refs in the spotlight. The varying application of the rules around release/holding on is going to test the patience of refs, coaches and players – right across the board. The IRB have not done enough in this area to make them consistent. The cracks will start to show across the 22 odd matches during the month.
October 26th 2010 @ 4:30am
Ben S said | October 26th 2010 @ 4:30am | Report comment
Jamie Roberts will be absent, Sam. He has a wrist injury, I believe. Lee Byrne has also been ruled out today.
Argentina are an ageing side, but if Martin Rodriguez is selected try and keep an eye on him. He was brought in by Stade Francais during the pre-season and has been a revelation.
–
Poth Ale, the weather has been atrociously erratic in England over the past two weeks, which explains the low scores.
October 26th 2010 @ 7:54am
Viscount Crouchback said | October 26th 2010 @ 7:54am | Report comment
Oh no. Not Byrne too? Just when I thought Wales might actually have a good crack at it with a relatively full-strength team this Autumn. I am one of those probably foolish people who believes that the first choice Wales XV is actually very, very good indeed and that they are made to look worse than they are in the rankings by their lamentable lack of depth.
October 26th 2010 @ 4:20pm
scarlet said | October 26th 2010 @ 4:20pm | Report comment
VC, that’s not foolish, it is remarkably insightful!!
October 26th 2010 @ 7:09pm
Ben S said | October 26th 2010 @ 7:09pm | Report comment
‘I am one of those probably foolish people who believes that the first choice Wales XV is actually very, very good indeed and that they are made to look worse than they are in the rankings by their lamentable lack of depth.’
IMO absolutely spot on, VC.
October 26th 2010 @ 11:30pm
jeznez said | October 26th 2010 @ 11:30pm | Report comment
Come down south lad’s. That is the Wallabies refrain every TN for the last decade.
October 27th 2010 @ 12:46am
Ben S said | October 27th 2010 @ 12:46am | Report comment
VC, I’ve just had a moment of clarity – has your moniker anything to do with ‘Sword of Honour’?
October 27th 2010 @ 7:23am
scarlet said | October 27th 2010 @ 7:23am | Report comment
I am interested to hear the response, it was a good television adaptation with Daniel Craig starring.
VC, any truth in the rumour that you are in fact Daniel Craig?
October 28th 2010 @ 6:48pm
Ben S said | October 28th 2010 @ 6:48pm | Report comment
Checked out the adaptation,scarlet, and it’s on 4od if you’re interested. I googled it and that came up. I work from home so I think I’ll have it on in the background today.
October 29th 2010 @ 12:55am
scarlet said | October 29th 2010 @ 12:55am | Report comment
Thanks mate, will do
October 26th 2010 @ 6:41am
Jason Cave said | October 26th 2010 @ 6:41am | Report comment
So which of the Six Nations teams-England, Scotland, Wales, Ireland, Italy, France-is able to meet the challenge posed by their southern hemisphere rivals in the November international rugby matches this year?
October 26th 2010 @ 8:38am
Poth Ale said | October 26th 2010 @ 8:38am | Report comment
I was going to ask the same thing, Jason – which of the six SH teams – Australia, Fiji, South Africa, Samoa, Argentina, New Zealand – is able to meet the challenge posed by their northern hemisphere hosts in the November internationals this year?
October 26th 2010 @ 10:54am
Jason said | October 26th 2010 @ 10:54am | Report comment
England:
England play New Zealand first up. They will be buoyed by their win against the Wallabies during the Autumn Internationals and look as if they are on their way to developing a broader game and a decent squad. They are always difficult to play at Twickenham, but I expect them to lose this game. Their backs are no match for the All Blacks and the pace and intensity the All Blacks play at will find them wanting. Factor in the disparity between the length of time the respective teams have been playing under the current law interpretations and you’d expect the English will be over run in the last quarter – even with an anticipated 5-2 bench. This will be especially true if the Wallabies manage to win in Hong Kong the week previous.
The week after they play the Wallabies. The Australians will be looking to avenge the loss earlier in the year. Either side is capable of winning this and it could simply come down to who has their kicking boots on. If wet, England by two penalties.
Next is Samoa which although a bruising encounter, England will win.
Last is South Africa who are on their own possible Grand Slam tour. Difficult to call as who would have expected the miserable effort the Springbok managed last year following an empathic Tri Nations? If South Africa are lossless coming into this fixture I’d back them to win – this is unlikely If they have a tour resembling the disgrace of 2009, which could be eminently possible, they will lose.
England will come out of this tour with a possible three victories, but likely to be only two; their fixture against Samoa and one of either Australia or South Africa.
Scotland:
A real dark horse. Defeating the Wallabies in the corresponding fixture last year and some excellent results in the Six Nations followed by a good tour in Argentina has them well placed to trip up the tourists, but the Wallabies aren’t about to revisit last years battlefield. So barring a miracle, two competitive losses.
It’s never been an easy fixture for New Zealand, who may be tempted to give some of the fringe squad members an opportunity. They’ll still lose, just a question of how much. Cut to Gavin Hastings having a cry about the nasty New Zealanders and the mystical strength they draw from the haka with affords them an unfair advantage…
I can’t see them replicating their 2002 result, so they’ll lose to South Africa the following week.
They’ll be playing for pride against Samoa and should win comfortably here. Their set piece and general forward play will be the difference.
Wales:
A reasonable squad tempered by some injury concerns makes them vulnerable. The Millennium Stadium has not been the happiest of hunting grounds for the Wallabies. For those who detect a soft underbelly to the Australian team, if they snatch defeat from the jaws of victory in Hong Kong, then the tour could completely unravel here. Otherwise a comfortable win against Gatland’s merry men.
Seven short days later and the Welsh Dragon will be retiring to a deep dark mine to lick it’s wounds against the Springbok. They certainly won’t recover in time to face the All Blacks. Even an act of parliament preventing the haka won’t save them.
Ireland:
Visiting the Irish hasn’t been pleasant for the Springbok and given their form in the Tri Nations, I see no reason why this should change. A possible Grand Slam dead in the water as HMS Emerald Isle torpedoes a ponderous battleship.
The Irish will turn their attention briefly to Samoa, before wondering if the GFC had never eventuated could they have afforded a portal to an alternate universe where they may finally beat the All Blacks, cause it won’t happen in this one on this tour.
To finish with, Argentina. This could be interesting one to watch as there is every chance the Argies could go undefeated.
One win out of three for Ireland, if that.
Italy
Will lose against everyone but be competitive, for 40mins.
France
Only one fixture worries them, the Argentineans. If they get through that unscathed, they’ll push the Wallabies hard, possibly winning the pick of the fixtures this Spring: Two extremely capable countries attempting to run the ball.
October 26th 2010 @ 8:53pm
Poth Ale said | October 26th 2010 @ 8:53pm | Report comment
Jason – maybe you don’t have access to the full list of matches being played in November Internationals series featuring the 12 teams from North and South.
Sat, 6 Nov Wales v Australia
Sat, 6 Nov Ireland v South Africa
Sun, 7 Nov England v New Zealand
Sat, 13 Nov Wales v South Africa
Sat, 13 Nov Scotland v New Zealand
Sat, 13 Nov Ireland v Samoa
Sat, 13 Nov Italy v Argentina
Sat, 13 Nov France v Fiji
Sun, 14 Nov England v Australia
Tue, 16 Nov Munster v Australia
Fri, 19 Nov Wales v Fiji
Sat, 20 Nov Italy v Australia
Sat, 20 Nov Ireland v New Zealand
Sat, 20 Nov Scotland v South Africa
Sat, 20 Nov France v Argentina
Sun, 21 Nov England v Samoa
Sat, 27 Nov France v Australia
Sat, 27 Nov Italy v Fiji
Sat, 27 Nov Scotland v Samoa
Sat, 27 Nov Wales v New Zealand
Sat, 27 Nov Ireland v Argentina
Sun, 28 Nov England v South Africa
going through your post, are you saying:
Four wins for NZ
England – 2-3 wins
Australia 1 win??
HMS Emerald Isle?? maybe gets one win out of three – (they’re playing four matches.)
One win for Scotland against Samoa?
three wins for France?
No wins for Italy – even against Fiji?
Argentina – lose all or win all?
Zero wins for Samoa
one win for Wales against Fiji?
zero wins for Fiji – or do they beat italy?
South Africa – win one??
Is that it?
October 27th 2010 @ 8:33am
Jason said | October 27th 2010 @ 8:33am | Report comment
I took the list of matches being played in November Internationals from the IRB. Fiji, whilst it continues with the AVO against democracy isn’t counted. But since you care; if they lose to Japan, they’ll lose to Italy.
going through your post, are you saying:
Four wins for NZ
England – 2-3 wins
Yes.
Australia 1 win??
No. Up to three.
HMS Emerald Isle?? maybe gets one win out of three – (they’re playing four matches.)
Yes, it’s clearly a typo as I discussed the four opponents.
October 28th 2010 @ 3:02am
Poth Ale said | October 28th 2010 @ 3:02am | Report comment
Jason – I was including Fiji as one of the 6 SH teams playing in the series. Hadn’t realised you were being politically selective in answering the question I posed.
On your obvious typo on Ireland, are you saying that you meant Ireland “maybe gets one win out of four” then? As in they mightn’t beat beat Samoa? Or did you mean to say maybe two wins out of four?
Australia’s matches are the hardest to call given their matches against England and France and those teams ambitions to beat them in particular.
Roll on the 6th.
October 26th 2010 @ 10:43pm
Colin N said | October 26th 2010 @ 10:43pm | Report comment
“Two extremely capable countries attempting to run the ball.”
France don’t run the ball.
Apart from that, some well thought out comments.
October 26th 2010 @ 11:16pm
Chris K said | October 26th 2010 @ 11:16pm | Report comment
yeah they walk it, and sometimes jog it too
October 27th 2010 @ 8:42am
Jason said | October 27th 2010 @ 8:42am | Report comment
Granted it’s not helter skelter like Wales can be, but they are certainly looking to divest themselves of the South African habit of looking to kick as a first option.
They did so in Marseille last year and Lievremont is on record stating the way he wants Les Bleus to play: “Of course, the All Blacks method is the one which we will try to put in place – although I don’t like to admit it.”
What I should have said is of the NH teams, France is best placed to take advantage of the law interpretations. Hence their match against the Wallabies could be the pick of the Spring Internationals.
October 27th 2010 @ 7:16pm
Ben S said | October 27th 2010 @ 7:16pm | Report comment
‘Granted it’s not helter skelter like Wales can be, but they are certainly looking to divest themselves of the South African habit of looking to kick as a first option.’
When? Not in the 6N they didn’t.
On what basis is France best placed to take advantage of the new law interpretations? Do you watch Top 14 or have you watched France play recently Jason?
October 27th 2010 @ 8:23pm
Jason said | October 27th 2010 @ 8:23pm | Report comment
When? I’ve already told you. Do pay attention, it would be important.
France has, of all the NH teams, the players to take advantage of the law interpretations.
October 27th 2010 @ 8:33pm
Ben S said | October 27th 2010 @ 8:33pm | Report comment
I think you know what I am getting at, Jason. Your rudeness is most unnecessary.
What game are you referring to in Marseille?
Which players does France have, of all teams in the NH, that are equipped to take advantage of the new law interpretations?
I’m presuming you’re not European, so do you watch European rugby, specifically Top 14 or Heineken Cup?
October 27th 2010 @ 8:59pm
Jason said | October 27th 2010 @ 8:59pm | Report comment
I’m not in the habit of repeating myself for the benefit of people being deliberately obtuse. Clearly the reference to Marseille last year was the November fixture with the All Blacks.
Some specific players:
Trinh-Duc
Fritz
Jauzion
Dusautoir
Szarzewski
Poitrenaud
Yes, I watch European rugby.
October 27th 2010 @ 9:20pm
Ben S said | October 27th 2010 @ 9:20pm | Report comment
I wasn’t being obtuse, Jason, but I have a habit of naming Tests by the teams involved, and not where they took place.
So, what you’re saying is that France ‘are certainly looking to divest themselves of the South African habit of looking to kick as a first option.’ based on the Test versus New Zealand last season?
The first problem I have is that that Test match was played under the former law interpretations and therefore Lievremont’s desire to play how New Zealand played then is irrelevant to the game that is currently being played out now.
The second problem I have is that in the multiple matches following that game France played rugby exactly in the manner of South Africa, and not New Zealand. If you have taken in the French Tests since that game then there can be no debate. France aped South Africa during the 6N and made no real attempt to play with width. Not only that, but when they did try to play with width they were awful to the extent that we saw Trinh-Duc putting up Garryowens just outside of the opposition 22.
Conversely, England, Ireland, Wales and Scotland attempted to play a wider brand of rugby during the 6N. Put simply, France were by far the most conservative side in last season’s 6N. It probably isn’t a coincidence therefore that France had some unfortunate results on the end of the season tour, whereas England and Scotland didn’t.
Further, if you watch European rugby, then surely you would have to concede that the Top 14 is inherently conservative, which is a cosy parallel to the national side.
I completely disagree with the list of your players too. Szarzewski is no more of a ball-handling hooker than Thompson, Hartley, Ford, Rees or Flannery. Dusautoir has very poor ball skills for a flanker, Fritz is an aggressive and committed but limited centre, Jauzion is positively pedestrian, Poitrenaud is skilled, but flaky and erratic, and Trinh-Duc carries well but hasn’t really improved over the past few seasons. In short, I don’t think any of the above players are on the same level as players like O’Driscoll, Bowe, Kearney, Flood, Ashton, Foden, Roberts, Hook, Armitage, Williams, Byrne, Halfpenny, Croft, Ferris, Thomas, Wallace, M Williams etc, and that has been played out in the Heineken Cup and on the national stage.
October 28th 2010 @ 12:08pm
Jason said | October 28th 2010 @ 12:08pm | Report comment
No I am not “saying is that France ‘are certainly looking to divest themselves of the South African habit of looking to kick as a first option.’ based on the Test versus New Zealand last season”.
The first problem I have is that that Test match was played under the former law interpretations and therefore Lievremont’s desire to play how New Zealand played then is irrelevant to the game that is currently being played out now.
a) Lievremont wasn’t talking about then. Perhaps I didn’t make that clear.
b) New Zealand have merely benefited from the adjustment in the application of the law as the method in which they were attempting to play then and how they’re playing now is more closely aligned than any other team, except South Africa…
France, during the 6N played to the application of the law and were better than the limited efforts of their opposition. That their approach was demonstrated to be inadequate against SH opposition, combined with the law application change means they have to change their method of play. Hence Lievremont’s statement.
You make the mistake of extrapolating club rugby to national approach. A disinterested observer could point to obvious difference between any of the New Zealand franchises and the All Blacks manner of play.
Your observations of the players is faulty as well. Ball handling is not the change – it’s the momentum of possession and speed of the breakdown that has changed the game. Speed, size and aggression are necessary to gain dominance. And half the players you nominate are donkeys in my humble opinion. Then again, I’d say the same to Deans…
October 28th 2010 @ 7:00pm
Ben S said | October 28th 2010 @ 7:00pm | Report comment
‘Lievremont wasn’t talking about then. Perhaps I didn’t make that clear.’
I see. Yes, you didn’t make that clear. Given the reference to a year old Test and a NZ quote I assumed you meant that Lievremont had said that post-loss, and not recently.
‘You make the mistake of extrapolating club rugby to national approach. A disinterested observer could point to obvious difference between any of the New Zealand franchises and the All Blacks manner of play.’
It’s not a mistake because I understand the French context. I have been watching French rugby for years and read variousFrench rugby books. I understand the French philosophy, and the philosophy is based on the pack, hence Lievremont’s gleeful ‘No scrum, no win.’ comments.
That resonates throughout the Top 14 which is why basically every French side plays the same way. Every side has a big kicker and a big pack. There’s little running rugby, and that philosophy has spilled out to the national side, and it was a philosophy that Laporte absorbed and Lievremont has too. By and large we have seen a very conservative France side over the past 10 years. That validates my point.
‘France, during the 6N played to the application of the law and were better than the limited efforts of their opposition.’
And when the side attempted to play with the ball they struggled, and put together some inane pieces of play, which suggests that France are not the side most likely to profit from the current law interpretations.
‘Your observations of the players is faulty as well. Ball handling is not the change – it’s the momentum of possession and speed of the breakdown that has changed the game. Speed, size and aggression are necessary to gain dominance. And half the players you nominate are donkeys in my humble opinion. Then again, I’d say the same to Deans…’
Then my point remains because none of the players you mentioned are big, apart from Jauzion, or fast. Also, I think ball-handling is the charge. If the game is quicker and there are more phases then more players will carry the ball. More significantly, of the players you list only two are regular starters.
Half the players I listed are donkeys? Well which ones, Jason?
October 26th 2010 @ 6:44am
mcxd said | October 26th 2010 @ 6:44am | Report comment
great read as always Sam.
I dont know why but im looking forward to this EOYT more than past years. All games actually. Maybe its just i can watch my team at a more convenient hour.
The big bad old enemy England seem that they may have actaully turned a corner especially with some of the exciting new faces in the squad such as Lawes, Foden and Ashton. That should be a cracker of a game. Wales im not sure of. With their clubs recently they havent exactly been setting the field alight.
It will also be a great test for Elsom as a captain, can he show the smarts required and can the wallabies show they have developed a mental fortitude they have been severly lacking ? Time will tell and im ready and up for it. (well by that i mean watching it in a pub with a pint or two)
October 26th 2010 @ 7:30am
Viscount Crouchback said | October 26th 2010 @ 7:30am | Report comment
I think this Autumn series is shaping up to be more interesting because England, finally, just might have a team. World rugby is better when England are good. The new variations are good, too, and I think we’ll see genuine athletes prosper and hopefully negative, one-dimensional breakdown cheats like Ireland wll be whistled out of the game.
October 26th 2010 @ 7:43am
Poth Ale said | October 26th 2010 @ 7:43am | Report comment
Yeah absolutely. Rock on VC.
October 26th 2010 @ 8:04am
Jiggles said | October 26th 2010 @ 8:04am | Report comment
VC it is common knowledge that everyone loves a losing english team
October 26th 2010 @ 3:54pm
Rugby Fan said | October 26th 2010 @ 3:54pm | Report comment
Careful, Viscount, you’re courting controversy talking about new variations rather than new interpretations…Perhaps some referees have the same issue.
Scotland pose something of a conundrum for visiting SH teams. They won’t feel safe fielding too many second stringers against a team with their recent run of results. Scotland will still be underdogs but seem to have more attacking threats now and I wouldn’t be surprised to see one of the big 3 might trip up there.
Can’t help thinking that controversial yellow cards, injuries and the weather are all going to feature rather more prominently than we’d all like.
October 26th 2010 @ 8:03am
Sam Taulelei said | October 26th 2010 @ 8:03am | Report comment
Thanks Ben S for the update about Jamie Roberts. That’s a shame about Lee Byrne the way he approaches the game really suits the current law interpretations.
VC, I agree it’s good for world rugby when there are two or three genuinely strong teams from the six nations. The game needs a strong England and France, if Gatland can continue developing the Welsh team to one day finally end their drought against NZ, that would be a brilliant result as well.
October 26th 2010 @ 10:13pm
Ben S said | October 26th 2010 @ 10:13pm | Report comment
More bad news for Wales, Sam. British Lions Ryan Jones and Leigh Halfpenny are now injured, with Halfpenny to miss all four games, and Jones to miss the Australia Test. Matthew Rees has been promoted to captain.
October 26th 2010 @ 8:46am
Hayden said | October 26th 2010 @ 8:46am | Report comment
It seems also that the English are dropping like flies: Wilkinson, Flutey and Shaw all in doubt, plus a couple of others. If Johnno doesn’t start Youngs and Flood together, then he really is an idiot. Borthwick’s absence is probably the best bit of news around for an English supporter.
VC, tell us how you really feel about the Irish.
Sam, I’m not sure if I’d accuse Gatland of developing the Welsh team at the moment. Much like the Ospreys in the Magners, they often seem to be less than the sum of their parts.
October 26th 2010 @ 8:51am
Intotouch said | October 26th 2010 @ 8:51am | Report comment
Lee Byrne has not been in great form so is not such a huge loss to Wales.
It will be really interesting to see how countries try to adapt their tactics to the laws. Everything seems to be still developing in that regard.
I’m dying to see how Scotland go this Autumn as they have had such a great run recently. I’d love them to keep improving. It’s a long time now since they were the top side in Europe.
This is going to be a surprising set of tests i think. England have some great players coming through, France went backwards and their players sound seriously frustrated, Wales is still weak (i think) in the the back row but still have some serious talent elsewhere, Ireland are missing a couple of key players but have some great prospects too and Italy are still lacking in the backs. Who the best team in Europe now is is also a mystery. It’s really strange now the standard in Europe is fairly even in the top four or five sides, even with the contrast of styles. But having said all that the SH sides look well ahead still. Ah the gap.
October 26th 2010 @ 9:05am
kovana said | October 26th 2010 @ 9:05am | Report comment
Samoa to lose to Japan….. to extends its losing streak to 2 against the Japanese.
But redeems itself with a clean sweep of England, Scotland and Ireland!
October 26th 2010 @ 9:06am
Lazlo said | October 26th 2010 @ 9:06am | Report comment
Youngs is a real talent but what happens when he passes the ball (assuming he does pass instead of scoring a try)? Wilko is no threat to run and if Flood starts or comes on later, he doesn’t make any opposing back row shiver either. Then the ball gets to Tindall and Barkley. Not a hell of a lot of excitement there, either. I’d like to see England do well – good wings and a very fine 15 – , but that midfield problem just won’t go away.
October 26th 2010 @ 9:57am
Colin N said | October 26th 2010 @ 9:57am | Report comment
Agree about 12 and 13 (although there is talent there, but no one’s playing particularly well), but I’m personally a big fan of Flood, who isn’t quick but is an intelligent footballer who challenges the gainline and off-loads well. He’s a very underrated player. When him and Tindall have been in the same team, England have played well – France 09, France 10 and Australia 10
October 26th 2010 @ 10:41am
Hayden said | October 26th 2010 @ 10:41am | Report comment
Agree. I’ve seen a couple of the Tigers recent games, and Youngs and Flood have been combining well. England are definitely lacking a good centre combination, and a bit of nous and balance in the back row. Steffon Armitage always seems to be injured. I’ve read some say that Lawes real position need to be at six. Thoughts?
October 26th 2010 @ 10:50pm
Colin N said | October 26th 2010 @ 10:50pm | Report comment
Armitage has been injured at the wrong moments, but I think he’s just incredibly unlucky not to be selected. He had a couple of excellent games against the Aussie Baabaas and New Zealand Maori, yet Hendre Fourie is chosen in the EPS over him. Ironically, both of those are now injured – Armitage is definitely out and Fourie is a doubt. Moody is a certainty providing he’s fit
As for Lawes, I hope his future is at lock – we have too many good sixes and not enough brutish locks (a la Simon Shaw) and Lawes seems to be that man
October 26th 2010 @ 7:18pm
Ben S said | October 26th 2010 @ 7:18pm | Report comment
Barkley isn’t in any of the England squads, Lazlo.
Flood challenges the gainline far more than any other European 10s and he has a good off-loading game. Tindall is also underrated, but only by people who don’t watch him. I have said this endless times, but whenever England have played well over the past few seasons Flood has been at 10 and Tindall at 13. They offer balance.
(Edit: I’ve just read what Colin has written. Great minds, eh…)
I wouldn’t write Hape off either. He was very good in the second Test versus Australia: tackled well, often drew more than one defender into his channel, and he looked for off-loads. England can afford to play two bigger men in midfield when they have forwards with the speed and athleticism of Croft and Lawes who cna play off them.
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Hayden, I can’t ever see Lawes being a 6. He’s simply too tall, on the verge of 6’8.
October 27th 2010 @ 3:19am
Colin N said | October 27th 2010 @ 3:19am | Report comment
Indeed Ben and I agree about Hape. He’s a big man (which some people assume means you musn’t good hands) but his main strengths are his ability to off-load out of the tackle and create space for others.
However, he’s played primarily at 13 for Bath and not done that great. I sort of want Barritt to come in but – strong, get’s over the gainline, decent hands – but I’m not sure if he’s got the quality for international level
Now Waldouck is a player who I like, but he’s been pretty awful this season, in an admittedly woeful Wasps side.
October 27th 2010 @ 4:43am
Ben S said | October 27th 2010 @ 4:43am | Report comment
Whenever I’ve seen Hape this season he’s been pretty under the radar, Colin, but were his performances that standout toward the end of last season when he was playing 13?
Agree about Barritt. I can’t ever recall him putting in a truly dominant club performance.
I don’t see why Tindall couldn’t shift to 12, and a player like Waldouck play 13? I think Waldouck is a lovely player when on form.
October 27th 2010 @ 10:39pm
Rowdy said | October 27th 2010 @ 10:39pm | Report comment
Ben, putting Trundle at 12 would mean it wouldn’t matter who played 13 as they’d never see the ball.
October 27th 2010 @ 10:52pm
Ben S said | October 27th 2010 @ 10:52pm | Report comment
Since 2003 whenever he has played he has always been one of England’s best players, and playing Tindall at 12 wouldn’t necessarily mean that he has to set up any great movements. Give him the ball, let him lay a quick ball platform and let the others like Armitage, Foden, Ashton, Cueto and potentially Waldouck do the rest. Tindall offers balance, Rowdy. Jamie Roberts wasn’t throwing out 30 yard miss passes on the Lions tour, and look how he dominated the midfield.