IRB shouldn’t restrict players to one country
Roar Guru By NPG, 6 Jul 2011 The Crowd is a Roar Guru
- Tagged:
- International Rugby Board, IRB, Kyrie Irving, Matt Dunning, Radike Samo, Rodney So'oialo, rugby, Rugby Union, Rugby World Cup, Rugby World Cup 2011
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Many of the world’s best rugby players will not be playing in the 2011 World Cup, and it isn’t because of injury. It’s because the IRB (International Rugby Board) forbid it by limiting each player to just one country.
If the IRB wants a competitive World Cup, then they really are shooting themselves in the foot.
Fiji, Samoa and Tonga are begging to be World Cup contenders, but the current rules just won’t allow it.
A perfect example of this is Radike Samo, who will play number eight for the Reds in the Super Rugby Grand Final.
Samo was born and played under-19s rugby in Fiji, he also lived and played rugby in Australia over a long period. Calling Samo anything other than a Fijian-Australian would be absurd.
Samo played six Tests for Australia back in 2004 and so he won’t ever represent Fiji at a full international level, despite having clear as day links to the nation.
We live in a glorious world in 2011, a world where one could fly right around the globe in around 40 hours. This has led to many men and women identifying with more then one nation.
This is recognised in all kinds of different ways, most notably dual-citizenships.
Governments the world over are willing to recognise that people can identify with more than one nation, yet the IRB are not.
This is not saying a player should be allowed to switch between countries at will, but surely a system could be found.
How is it that the ability to play for more than one country in a lifetime has not ruined so many other sports?
I think, there is much to be said for the International Basketball Federation and their willingness to look at things on a case-by-case basis, this might see Kyrie Irving play for Australia making us more competitive and adding to the international game.
Perhaps, a more realistic system would be much closer to International Cricket Council’s, which says you can’t play for two nations within a set time period.
Another rule added to this could be that both nations can’t be tier one. This would ensure that for the most part, the rule would see great rugby players playing out their days for the nations of their ancestry and there is nothing wrong with that.
How great would it be to see James So’oialo run out with older brother and international rugby legend, Rodney, in the Samoan strip?
How much would being around a seasoned professional like Matt Dunning add to the Canadian team?
Do terrific players like Erik Lund and Isa Nacewa deserve to never play high level Test matches because of a mistake in their youth?
Surely, a balance between our current system and rugby league’s can be found. Rugby needs more nations to be competitive to further our tag of being a world game.
The IRB needs to make a ruling on this before the 2015 World Cup.
And the answer is obvious.
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July 6th 2011 @ 4:19am
jus de couchon said | July 6th 2011 @ 4:19am | Report comment
I think crickets the best model where players are allowed to change their team once but only after a couple of years . If Samoans disscarded by Aus and NZ were allowed to play for Samoa there would be a team to rival the closed shop of the big 5 .
July 6th 2011 @ 8:25am
anopinion said | July 6th 2011 @ 8:25am | Report comment
Conversely,
If all Samoans played their best years for Samoa they would have a great team. Samoa should not have to wait for hand me down players from big brother nations.
July 6th 2011 @ 8:53am
jokerman said | July 6th 2011 @ 8:53am | Report comment
NPG, Great article and I so agree. If this was allowed it would make it such a better WC. All the island teams would be improved, and we would get to see old players return.
IRB have been cruel and tough with this. It benefits the Island teams, and perhaps that concerns the IRB. Steve Hansen, All Black assistant coach said a year ago when IRB rejected the proposal to allow 2 countries to be represented, that it didn’t help that Samoa had just nearly defeated Wales. There is some truth to this.
Japan would also be stronger. There is probably 50 players around the world who could add flavour, talent, and competition to this WC, who won’t be there, because of a rule.
In the end it comes down to dictatorship, control. Samo should be allowed to play for his native country.
July 6th 2011 @ 10:59am
jokerman said | July 6th 2011 @ 10:59am | Report comment
You are right, Jus de, that format would be perfect. Come WC time with players like Jerry Collins, Tana Umanga, they could challenge the top 5. That is where the problem lies, on one level the IRB does not want that.
July 6th 2011 @ 2:01pm
Michael Clark said | July 6th 2011 @ 2:01pm | Report comment
Except that these guys are not Samoan. They are New Zealanders, born and bred, who happen to be of Samoan ethnic heritage. If your logic was extrapolated uniformly, no Australian or New Zealand players of European heritage would be eligible as first choice players for Australia or NZ unless they renounced eligibility for the countroies of their ethnic heritage.
July 6th 2011 @ 2:05pm
kovana said | July 6th 2011 @ 2:05pm | Report comment
Actually, they are also Samoan Citizens…. They have Samoan Passports, and parents or grandparents were born in Samoa.
Jerry Collins is a Samoan citizen as well as a NZ citizen.
Surprise surprise, SO AM I! Im also hoping to get my Ozzie Citizenship!
July 6th 2011 @ 2:08pm
Michael Clark said | July 6th 2011 @ 2:08pm | Report comment
That’s right, just as many of us are eligible for dual citizenship with the countries of our ethnic heritage (the qualification rules vary considerably from country to country) many Islanders who were born and bred in Australia or NZ are also eligible for Samoan, Fijian or Tongan passports. What’s the difference?
July 6th 2011 @ 2:15pm
Michael Clark said | July 6th 2011 @ 2:15pm | Report comment
The point I’m trying to make is that the PI players are not somehow being treated differently to players of any other ethnic identity and the islands are not being maliciously stripped of talent by larger countries. These are myths. PI players born and bred in Australia and NZ probably have an easier route to represent the countries of theeir ethnic heritage (rather than the country of their birth, and day to day citizenship) if they so choose. However, most don’t and I think we can reasonably assume that this is for similar reasons to other sportspersons opting to represent the country in which they grew up and developed. Their are exceptions to this in many sports, but they are exceptions.
July 6th 2011 @ 4:56am
Damo said | July 6th 2011 @ 4:56am | Report comment
NPG this is a debate worth having. And you make some sound points.
Yes it would be great if Radike could play for someone in this world cup. The way he is going though it could be for us.
One question in your structure though – how to define a top 5 nation?
Another thing – what about European cllubs releasing players to play for their homelands in the cup?
July 6th 2011 @ 5:48am
Lee said | July 6th 2011 @ 5:48am | Report comment
The only way it should be, in my opinion is if you only play a handful of matches for the first nation you represent – so in Samo’s case, having only played 6 tests for Australia, he can then represent Fiji. In So’oialo’s case, no way! He chose the ABs and made a very successful career out of it.
International rugby should not be like club rugby, where you can pick and choose who you play for. You make a decision to go for personal glory and results by picking the ABs(or any other team) over your home country, then you should have to live with your choice.
July 6th 2011 @ 8:16am
Darwin Stubbie said | July 6th 2011 @ 8:16am | Report comment
“Do terrific players like Erik Lund and Isa Nacewa deserve to never play high level ” … Nacewa really doesn’t fit into the overall argument he can play for Fiji
July 7th 2011 @ 10:05pm
Colin N said | July 7th 2011 @ 10:05pm | Report comment
And neither does Lund because he’s average. He wouldn’t get into the France or England squads.
July 6th 2011 @ 8:18am
Willy said | July 6th 2011 @ 8:18am | Report comment
I agree with most of your main points.
Maybe when a player is first selected to play Test rugby they can nominate (up to) two nations they are eligible to represent – a Tier One Nation (Four Southern Nations and Six Northern Nations), and a Tier Two Nation (everyone else).
And a player will then be able to represent either nation.
You would need to introduce some limitations – maybe you can’t represent more than one nation in a calendar year… something like that.
But it’s got legs. No doubt about that.
July 6th 2011 @ 8:25am
defunkt said | July 6th 2011 @ 8:25am | Report comment
Meh, test rugby should be about representing your (or a) country, to let players move around test sides would make a farce of this. The Pacific Island case is relatively isolated and would be better served by getting a combined P.I. team up & playing in Super rugby so that their best players have a professional channel that doesn’t involve being consumed by the systems of other major rugby nations.
July 6th 2011 @ 8:48am
jus de couchon said | July 6th 2011 @ 8:48am | Report comment
Man for man Samoa produces the best rugby players on the Planet. Look at the average All Black team . Its a travesty the IRB stop them from potentialy winning the RWC.
July 6th 2011 @ 9:02am
allblackfan said | July 6th 2011 @ 9:02am | Report comment
This is a half-full argument.
Such a move could potentially devastate the Island unions. No-one would want to play for the Island teams when they could play for NZ or Australia; the difference in income is too great. So the Island unions would be reduced to playing geriatric has-beens, so to speak.
In any case, given the increasing level of top-level rugby being played these days, there’s no guarantee that these players at the end of their careers will want tokeep playing on. They will be looking for a golden handshake — more money, less stress. Look at Fiji; it just lost Vilimoni Delasau, Sireli Bobo and Rupeni Caucau who WILL NOT be playing at the RWC (ostensibly they want to do outreach work for the church in Fiji although there are suspicions their French clubs forced them to)
July 6th 2011 @ 11:55am
mitzter said | July 6th 2011 @ 11:55am | Report comment
How could this devastate the home unions anymore than they have been?
“No-one would want to play for the Island teams when they could play for NZ or Australia; the difference in income is too great.” – This is already the case so how would this be any different.
July 6th 2011 @ 3:36pm
allblackfan said | July 6th 2011 @ 3:36pm | Report comment
because it will happen en masse.
At the moment you have to live in either NZ or Aust for X number of years (3?) before you are eligible. You have to have permanent resident/citizenship status.
Allowing dual eligibility will allow clubs from richer nations to openly poach them and it will be far worse to what is happening already!
July 6th 2011 @ 9:17am
Sailosi said | July 6th 2011 @ 9:17am | Report comment
Garbage, i could never accept seeing Nonu, Mils etc running out for Samoa at the 2015 world cup. These players chose to represent NZ, Aus or in Manu Tuliagi’s case England, which i have no problem with but they should not be able to change their country beyond that. It was embarrassing watching Tuigimala and co running around for Samoa when they were washed up hacks. The PI nations are becoming increasingly competitive and will continue to do so. The way the European market is there is more incentive now more than ever to represent a PI nation and play your club rugby in Europe. This has led to a greater development in PI players being introduced to pro rugby.
Could anybody imagine how ridiculous it would look if at the 2015 world cup NZ were drawn to play Samoa and Mils, Kaino, Toeava, Nonu etc were lining up against NZ after being 50-100 test All Blacks and possibly world cup champions.
July 6th 2011 @ 9:30am
King of the Gorgonites said | July 6th 2011 @ 9:30am | Report comment
Totally agree.
it would just make a mockery of international rugby. We dont want it to be like international rugby league was a few years back, when you had such a mickey mouse qualification rule, that if you had ever had a pint of guiness you could then represent Ireland.
Lets not under estimate the PIs who actually choose to play for the country of origin. Look at Samoa. they beat Scotland recently. they almost beat england. Fiji drew with Wales. The islands is on the improve. we do not have to undermine our game to make them step up even further, they are doing it naturally.
as more PI players play in europe, then are no longer representing Australia or NZ at age group level, therefore they can still paly for their nations. though recently some have started to play for england etc.
July 6th 2011 @ 11:03pm
Sylvester Hyde said | July 6th 2011 @ 11:03pm | Report comment
“Could anybody imagine how ridiculous it would look if at the 2015 world cup NZ were drawn to play Samoa and Mils, Kaino, Toeava, Nonu etc were lining up against NZ after being 50-100 test All Blacks and possibly world cup champions.”
Reminds me of the Samoan league side – made up almost entirely of washed-up Kiwis. Sad really.
July 6th 2011 @ 9:21am
kingplaymaker said | July 6th 2011 @ 9:21am | Report comment
The reason behind this is truly vile: the stronger nations do not want to be threatened by the Pacific Islands and apparently the draw between Fiji and Wales last autumn made the likes of Scotland, Wales and Ireland so afraid they voted off the possibility in the IRB vote.
That these far wealthier countries should intentionally weaken opposition is utterly repulsive.
July 6th 2011 @ 11:59am
klestical said | July 6th 2011 @ 11:59am | Report comment
I’m hoping this is just a conspiracy theory!
July 6th 2011 @ 12:45pm
The Bush said | July 6th 2011 @ 12:45pm | Report comment
kingplaymaker,
Why would a draw in a normal Test Match last Autumn make any difference?
Fiji knocked Wales out of the last World Cup, surely that was a moment if ever there was one…