The AFL needs to utilise the 'twos' to reduce the gap between rich and poor : Slattery Images
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The gap between rich and poor in the AFL has never been greater. In 2011, the chasm in quality and resources between the powerhouses and the cellar-dwellers was a massive talking point. It could widen in 2012.
Collingwood and Geelong were the premier teams last year – both in a good position off the field, with good crowds and sponsorship. To take advantage of that in a salary-capped league, they had to be creative.
Equalization rules restrict the elite clubs from paying more than the rest, so they channel their funds in a different direction – highly-paid coaches, world class facilities, off-season junkets to Arizona – to get ahead of the pack.
One such method, which is proving incredibly handy, is the movement toward clubs having their own standalone reserves side, under their complete control and behest.
That’s a luxury not everyone can afford – but not always because of fiscal reasons. For some, it’s a structural impossibility.
While the Pies and Cats have been able to go ahead with their own reserves sides in the VFL, and expansion clubs Gold Coast and Greater Western Sydney have been gifted them by the AFL, teams in WA and SA have been lumped with a difficult arrangement for years now.
In those states, and for some other clubs in Victoria, players are ‘drafted’ off to separate teams in their respective state league, a consequence of affiliation with a league rather than a singular club.
For years now, there have been rumblings about how Port Adelaide, Adelaide, West Coast and Fremantle are unhappy with the current state of affairs.
AFL-listed players are at the mercy of SANFL and WAFL coaches, who often take it upon themselves to play footballers out of position, helping their team’s fortunes rather than assisting their own development.
If the AFL wants to move forward over the next 10, 20 years, then something has to change.
It seems the obvious solution is to simply allow the WA and SA clubs their own reserves team – but that’s easier said than done when dealing with a highly sensitive issue that few Victorians can comprehend.
That’s because nobody in Melbourne had to shift their allegiances when the VFL went national – their very own clubs made it big.
That didn’t happen in Adelaide. When the Crows were established in 1991, fans had to ‘abandon’ the clubs they’d followed all their lives, so to speak – clubs with rich histories, like Glenelg, Norwood and Sturt.
They’re still alive as part of the SANFL, a competition which has morphed into a relic of ‘old’ football – suburban grounds, down-to-earth players, a perceived ‘real footy’ vibe.
South Australians love it. They don’t want to see their league spoiled by the presence of reserves teams, and neither does the SANFL. Heaven help half of Adelaide if the Crows’ seconds took on Norwood. Heads and hearts would explode.
And that’s not even mentioning the two Port Adelaides. The same goes for the WAFL. There is no easy fix.
Clubs with their own reserves team hold a significant advantage over those who don’t. In a column for The Age back in April, Garry Lyon said there were many benefits – including the ability to deliver a ‘rigid consistency in message’ when players do not have to deal with two different footballing cultures in the one week.
It’s no coincidence that the two most dominant teams of the past five years – Geelong and Collingwood – have their own reserves teams. Another recent powerhouse, Hawthorn, has a strong 11-year-old alliance with Box Hill.
In the name of fairness, the only answer is a national reserves competition.
Yes, it would cost money – but after that $1b TV rights deal the AFL has very deep pockets. And surely, if the cash-strapped FFA can afford Australian soccer’s youth/reserves league hybrid, so too can the AFL.
But when it comes to evening out the competition, Andrew Demitriou has proven himself to have very short arms.
Instead of investing in equality and the development of players when he’s had the opportunity, he handed a blank cheque to the Giants in wait of a 30-year uphill battle.
Meanwhile, rich clubs like Collingwood can work on their fringe players exactly how they want, while players like former Power prospect Ryan Willits are torn between two clubs, two cultures, two positions.
Willits is a case study in how the South Australian solution stunts the growth of players. Port saw him as a forward, but Glenelg played him down back and he had to apply for a transfer to West Adelaide to find an attacking role. It must have played at least a minor part as to why he never kicked on at AFL level.
The AFL seems set on world domination, but they have real problems at home that need to be addressed first – or else the divide between rich and poor will increase by the season.
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The Crowd Says (58) | Page 1 of Comments
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January 24th 2012 @ 8:03am
The_Wookie said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:03am | Report comment
The SANFL and WAFL made this bed for themselves, they lie in it. The VFL didnt force them over, and its their own fault they dont have reserves teams – and have fought against the idea for years. GWS and Gold Coast werent necessarily gifted them either, its how the Swans and Lions have operated for more than a decade, although the Swans did have a VSFL team for a while. The other thing that needs to be considered is that additonal players required to makeup VFL sides come under the state salary cap which is much less than in WAFL and SANFL circles.
Not to mention that by the time Fremantle and Port hit us, no one had their own reserves teams anymore as player lists were reduced, every victorian club was off flirting with one VFL format or another. Geelong and Collingwood VFL teams are a recent thing, Hawthorns effective partnership with Box Hill is longer. Carton now have effective control of the former Bullants, Essendon are doing something with Bendigo.
The AFL is already funding both sides of the NEAFL, AFL Queensland, AFL NSW/ACT, AFL Victoria, AFL Tasmania and AFL Northern Territory, It already funds Auskick and the TAC Cup. You cant say the AFL arent investing indevelopment. (not to mention the millions its gifting the SANFL to bail out Port).
For all that, I agree that a National reserves comp has to be created, and then someone needs to pick up the ashes that will be the VFL.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:11am
Redb said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:11am | Report comment
Good comments Wookie, except for your last sentence that is ridiculous you don’t dismantle the second best comp in the land. AFL clubs need to forge/create better links with their VFL/SAFL/WAFL counterparts and the AFL needs make this happen until all clubs have effective reserves. That should be the goal.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:38am
The_Wookie said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:38am | Report comment
Ian makes a damn good point below, theres no reason why the non victorian reserves cant all play NEAFL. Might need to change its acronym
January 24th 2012 @ 9:19am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 24th 2012 @ 9:19am | Report comment
Wookie
Nearly Everywhere Australian Football League
January 24th 2012 @ 11:34am
Vince Rugari said | January 24th 2012 @ 11:34am | Report comment
As they should be funding all those leagues – they are also the de facto governing body of the sport. If the AFL don’t fund them, nobody will.
January 24th 2012 @ 11:43am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 24th 2012 @ 11:43am | Report comment
If thats what you want, then you need to accept the SANFL and the WAFL needs to sit down with the AFL and have a chat about those licences.
A club playing in the AFL should be controlled by it’s members. Full stop, end of story.
January 24th 2012 @ 12:19pm
Vince Rugari said | January 24th 2012 @ 12:19pm | Report comment
No arguments. That’s the way it should be.
January 24th 2012 @ 2:25pm
Nathan of Perth said | January 24th 2012 @ 2:25pm | Report comment
And we’d finally get a clear financial report out of West Coast and Freo……
January 24th 2012 @ 8:07am
Redb said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:07am | Report comment
The SANFL being difficult again, talk about shoot themselves in the foot.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:28am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:28am | Report comment
Redb,
My solution to that is to expel Port Power from the AFL, and then invite Port Adelade into the competition.
January 24th 2012 @ 9:09am
sheek said | January 24th 2012 @ 9:09am | Report comment
Ian,
But with both Magpies (Collingwood) & Crows (Adelaide) taken, SANFL Port would have to come up with another emblem/nickname. The convention being one nickname, one team, one comp.
AFL Port Adelaide Falcons perhaps?
And if SANFL Port are promoted, then Norwood, Glenelg & the rest might demand their inclusion as well. Which takes us back to the beginning of Port Power’s original inclusion…..
January 24th 2012 @ 9:16am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 24th 2012 @ 9:16am | Report comment
Sheek,
There is only one team called ‘Port’ in the AFL. It doesnt need a nickname. They are simply Port, or Poooooort.
And [expletive deleted] Norwood and the rest of them. They supported the SANFL stuffing around the AFL, so now they get to live off the carcass of one AFL team not two … raise your own funds, sign your own members and get your own sponsors.
January 24th 2012 @ 11:12am
Nathan of Perth said | January 24th 2012 @ 11:12am | Report comment
Alternatively, set fire to most of Adelaide and storm the state parliament.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:28pm
The_Wookie said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:28pm | Report comment
a man can dream
January 25th 2012 @ 1:31am
amazonfan said | January 25th 2012 @ 1:31am | Report comment
January 24th 2012 @ 11:57pm
amazonfan said | January 24th 2012 @ 11:57pm | Report comment
No, Port Adelaide has too great a history for it to be expelled. No club should ever again be forced to leave the AFL.
January 25th 2012 @ 7:36am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 25th 2012 @ 7:36am | Report comment
Amzonfan,
We expel Port Power – a entity that alleges it is Port Adelaide, but is controlled by the SANFL – and invite Port Adelaide to leave the SANFL and join the AFL.
That way we get the real Port, not the fake one.
January 26th 2012 @ 4:24am
amazonfan said | January 26th 2012 @ 4:24am | Report comment
Except that entity has won a flag, been a Grand Finalist twice, been a losing Preliminary Finalist twice, won two pre-season flags, won three straight McClelland Trophies, made the finals in seven of its first eleven seasons, and was arguably the third best team of 2000-’09 (after Brisbane & Geelong). It has also produced some of the best players of the past 20 years, including Tredea & Chad Cornes.
I’m all for expelling the SANFL. I also think that every club should be controlled by the members, and in fact I’ll never forgive the AFL if they bring back private ownership, for instance. However the ‘fake’ Port Adelaide has too great a history for it to be replaced by a different club.
Perhaps the AFL made a mistake in making Port the second SA team, however the solution isn’t to do a swap. Their contributions are too great, and I think they more than deserve to stay in the competition. I personally would very much oppose their expulsion, and I don’t even follow them.
Plus, from a practical perspective, how would it work? Putting aside the issue of nicknames (and I think that every club should have a nickname), would the new club have the same players? The same footballing staff? The same non-footballing staff? The same sponsors?
Ultimately, if we were going to introduce a different second team into SA, we should have done it 15 years ago. Now, we need to accept that Port, for all of its baggage, is here to stay, and we need to allow them to get out of their current mess; instead of talking about swapping them for another team, which will never happen in a million years.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:22am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:22am | Report comment
Its dead simple.
Put the SA and WA reserves sides in the NEAFL.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:36am
The_Wookie said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:36am | Report comment
actually, that may be the smartest idea ive heard yet. The issue is we’re going to have to put up with their whining about travel forever. They would get games against 7 other AFL level reserves teams and a strong NT side, and as a bonus they get the same foxtel cup qualifications that victorian sides get. Thats quite a level playing field.
I like it, I like it indeed. Get this off to AFL HQ forthwith
January 24th 2012 @ 9:04am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 24th 2012 @ 9:04am | Report comment
Moving 40 players around the country for 4 teams for 16 games will cost this side of $5m.
It will also let SA/WA players get used tio the sort of travel they will need to cop if they are in the firsts.
You might even get some Crowbots or Pooort supporters out to Belconnen to watch their twos run around.
I dont see a downside, basically.
January 24th 2012 @ 2:32pm
Nathan of Perth said | January 24th 2012 @ 2:32pm | Report comment
Ironically they’ll also need to find and hire a bunch of other players for their reserve squad.
January 25th 2012 @ 8:15am
Redb said | January 25th 2012 @ 8:15am | Report comment
Or combine the SANFL & WAFL.into a Western AFL League and put the reserves teams in. The NEAFL would become too big with too many teams by adding the SANFL & WAFL.
January 31st 2012 @ 4:51pm
Adrian said | January 31st 2012 @ 4:51pm | Report comment
Would make it pretty tough on the supporters of SANFL/WAFL Clubs to have their team play interstate on a semi-regular basis. This discussion really seems to be from the perspective of incremental improvements for the AFL Clubs, not much thought for protecting the integrity of the local comps.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:49am
The Cattery said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:49am | Report comment
It’s all evolved higgedly-piggedly, so that you now have something like five different sets of arrangements for the 18 AFL clubs, and whatever you might want to do from this point on has serious ramifications somewhere along the line, including diminishing the VFL/WAFL/.SANFL, and even the NEAFL, with there being now only five Canberra clubs, of which three are financially strong, it would be a disaster to dismantle the NEAFL now.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:52am
The_Wookie said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:52am | Report comment
Im saying add the WA/SA teams to the NEAFL comps. No need for adjustment.
January 24th 2012 @ 9:24am
The Cattery said | January 24th 2012 @ 9:24am | Report comment
My comment was more about the concept of a national reserves comp, but even with your idea, the NEAFL is divided into two conferences, so some sort of readjusting would be needed.
January 24th 2012 @ 9:54am
The_Wookie said | January 24th 2012 @ 9:54am | Report comment
not much though, the SANFL clubs could go in the eastern division, WAFL clubs in the Northern Division. The NEAFL allows for crossover between the AFL reserves teams already.
January 24th 2012 @ 10:33am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 24th 2012 @ 10:33am | Report comment
Wookie,
I’d go the other way, just to keep the Port/Darwin link – SA clubs to the North, WA clubs to the East … and Perth-Sydney and Perth-Canberra links are better than Perth-Brisbane and Perth-Darwin.
And, get this, this many reserves teams let us play the Magoos before the main game ! Radical !
January 24th 2012 @ 11:29am
Vince Rugari said | January 24th 2012 @ 11:29am | Report comment
What’s more – all those leagues are of different standards. SANFL is probably the best, followed by WAFL, VFL and then the NEAFL. So you’ve got inequality in terms of footballing standard, as well, and I wonder if that ever comes into a player’s consideration when they switch clubs – knowing they might be playing plenty of reserves footy, would they prefer to go somewhere that will best suit their development?
It’s all so uneven and such a mess, a national reserves comp has to be the endgame at some point.
January 24th 2012 @ 11:39am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 24th 2012 @ 11:39am | Report comment
Vince,
Put the four AFL reserves sides into the NEAFL and it starts looking like a stronger competition.
Take fifty AFL players out of the WAFL and SANFL and they come abck to the pack.
But Im perfectly happy to have the WA and SA reserves sides play in their own comps.
January 24th 2012 @ 1:55pm
Lachlan said | January 24th 2012 @ 1:55pm | Report comment
Something like a reserves laegue may have a possitive impact on clubs and can be well run, but i think it’ll have a negative effect on the NEAFL, but the VFL, SANFL and WAFL will take a hit but can cope without them. The TSL doesn’t have any AFL teams reserves impact, may have a few retired or delisted players, but doesn’t have anywhere as near of an impact as other leagues. It will definitely even out the WAFL, SANFL and VFL, the TSL will be able to compete with these leagues a bit better, but the Newly created NEAFL will get smashed. But as the NEAFL gets stronger and has 9 or 10 financially active clubs that are evenly ranked, in north and south, then may eventually be seperated and AFL reserves clubs removed.
I think in the near future not quite yet, but maybe ten years at the earliest, this could work, and maybe the reseves league can incorporate the two best foxtel cup teams each year, in a promotion and relegation systems.
January 24th 2012 @ 2:35pm
Nathan of Perth said | January 24th 2012 @ 2:35pm | Report comment
Well, another couple teams in the AFL itself and any more growth of the rich-poor gap and we might start seeing a lot more interest in a P/R League system, National to State inclusive. I feel its better than leaving some of the teams dying on the vine. Always easier to support a lower league team when there is a legitimate chance of them eventually going places, after all.
January 24th 2012 @ 2:36pm
TW said | January 24th 2012 @ 2:36pm | Report comment
Hey I wish you guys would settle down on this topic.
Here is whats happening from a WA point of view –
The two WA AFL teams will field reserve teams in the WAFL from 2013 – The deal has been done. I am still trying to find the 30 page WAFC proposal that lays it all out online.
The only sticking point is the composition of each 22 each week from the Eagles and Dockers. That is making up the difference from the AFL squads allowing for injuries and suspensions. It will also create opportunities for other talent missed in the usual talent searches.
No doubt the WAFC would have forwarded to the SANFL a copy.
I can tell you now the WA teams will not be left behind in the arms race as described in the article. What SA do is their business.
January 24th 2012 @ 3:34pm
Tom Dimanis said | January 24th 2012 @ 3:34pm | Report comment
Where did you find this out? I heard one proposal was to have reserve teams for the Eagles and Dockers, but they would only play against teams having their bye in the WAFL, so they wouldn’t be part of the competition proper.
I personally think things should be left as they are, it’s working ok. Collingwood and Geelong are doing well because they have good squads, not because they have their own reserves. The Eagles made the prelims on the current structure after all!
January 24th 2012 @ 4:18pm
Vince Rugari said | January 24th 2012 @ 4:18pm | Report comment
Of course it’s not the only reason why Collingwood and Geelong are going well – but it makes a difference. Ask the clubs, the players – they’ll tell you.
As for TW’s comment, I swear just a few weeks ago I read that proposal was not going to happen. I actually have a PDF of the proposal but my understanding is that it was shut down.
January 24th 2012 @ 5:11pm
TW said | January 24th 2012 @ 5:11pm | Report comment
The original proposal was rejected that is true by the 9 WAFL clubs last July – However the WA Footy Commission who actually oversee the game in WA are having another look. The WAFL do not run the game in WA they administrate a competition.
In reality the two AFL Clubs have a huge influence behind the scenes- They produce the funds after all.
However as always what happens “behind the scenes” governs all. It appears that this year was ruled out but 2013 is likely to get something happening.
Retiring WAFL CEO Wayne Bradshaw said in his retirement speech recently that it was a goer in 2013.
Do you think a club like the Eagles will let any mob over the nullabor get an long term edge – Not B—— likely.
This article outlines what happened earlier in the year.
http://www.dockernow.com/2011/07/08/dockers-eagles-now-want-wafl-sides-in-2013/
I agree about the formation of the NEAFL has highlighted the hodge podge nature of second tier leagues around the country – But it has opened the door for further opportunities.
January 31st 2012 @ 4:29pm
Tom Dimanis said | January 31st 2012 @ 4:29pm | Report comment
Ok, what happens when a team is decimated by injuries like the Dockers were last year? How will they be able to field a reserves team? They were barely able to field a senior side! I heard that they’ll have to recruit players from country and amateur leagues, and really that doesn’t help anybody.
January 31st 2012 @ 4:42pm
Nathan of Perth said | January 31st 2012 @ 4:42pm | Report comment
Well you’re obviously not going to run two separate sides purely on the basis of your 38-man squad and rookie list, if you’re running a separate team it will have its own list and you feed your non-starting players into it to bolster it. Would be good to see some of the stupendous amounts of money that clubs are receiving funnelled back into players at some level, after all, rather than simply spent on hordes of assistant coaches and trips to Arizona.
January 24th 2012 @ 5:33pm
TW said | January 24th 2012 @ 5:33pm | Report comment
On another thread comments were made about the Kangaroos future viability and I made the comment that the TV contracts have a huge say – Brian Cook from the Geelong Cats has come out and said exactly that. Brian is no dummy and he is a good operator and has a lot of respect in the AFL world.
Read on —
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/smaller-clubs-may-have-to-move-cook-20120123-1qdyw.html
January 25th 2012 @ 8:25am
Redb said | January 25th 2012 @ 8:25am | Report comment
Read that article, there is some sense to what he is saying but Cook has to realise that Geelong were a small club only 8-10 years ago, premiership success provides a financial boon for any club. Lets see our how Geelong look in 5-10 years when they are in the bottom 8. Will they be happy moving to Tassie – they’re the closest
January 25th 2012 @ 8:41am
Ian Whitchurch said | January 25th 2012 @ 8:41am | Report comment
The key for Geelong is a clean, correctly sized stadium that someone else paid for and doesnt charge rent for.
January 25th 2012 @ 9:10am
Redb said | January 25th 2012 @ 9:10am | Report comment
That’s true Ian, in fact Geelong are laying down some pretty good foundations for the long term. I just thought it a bit cute when Geelong were hanging on by a thread themselves not that long ago.
January 24th 2012 @ 8:22pm
Rob McLean said | January 24th 2012 @ 8:22pm | Report comment
Off season prattle.
January 25th 2012 @ 12:08pm
Lachlan said | January 25th 2012 @ 12:08pm | Report comment
Ok, how about this.
By 2020 (abit optimistic). 20 AFL teams. Coll, Ess, Carl, Melb/St.K, Haw/Rich, Geel, Ballarat/Bendigo, Adel, Port, WCE, Frem, Mandurah/South Perth, Tassie, Syd, GWS, Bris, GCS, FNQ, Canberra, NT. WB and NM can relocate or leave to the national 2nd tier competition.
Reserves League. Includes all AFL teams reserves. Run off same fixture, played 2 hours before, their AFL teams corresponding fixture.
National 2nd Tier Competition. 32-Teams, 4 Conferences of 8 teams OR 64-Teams, 4 Conferences of 16 teams. North (DLD/NT) South (VIC/TAS) East (NSW/ACT) West (SA/WA). For example, if its a 32 team league, in each conference the team that finishes last, leaves the comp the next year and after the season is over each conference holds a knockout competition between the 8 premiers from around that State and/or territory and the winning team is introduced the next year. However if it’s a 16-team conference the same things happen except the bottom two teams are removed and the last two teams remaining in the knockout competition take their spots.
Foxtel Cup. Remains the same or can be disbanded.
January 25th 2012 @ 8:20pm
woodsman said | January 25th 2012 @ 8:20pm | Report comment
Twos seem to be moving towards the original model for all but SA- I suspect its just a matter of time until they have teams in the NEAFL. Agree with Lachie that a conference system with a large number of teams may be good at the second-tier.
However with the premier league, I still dont see a reason for having any team merge or relocate if we eventually reach 25 teams in the comp (although it would be a good match to regionalise NM to Ballarat as StKilda is now regionalising somewhat with the move to Seaford.. Frankston stadium anyone?).
That would leave 7 inner Melbourne teams, 3 ‘regional’ Vic teams; 2 SA; 3 WA (add South Perth ‘Ore-ers’; add 1 Tas ‘Devils’; add 1 Can ‘Snakes’; 4 NSW (add Newcastle ‘Black Diamonds’ and Wollongong ‘Wombats’); 3 QLD (add Cairns ‘Stingrays’); add 1 NT ‘Goannas’.
Play each other once. Full coverage of the country both geographically and in terms of population centres. No need for conferences at top tier- which in my mind erodes the entire competition at the elite level.
January 25th 2012 @ 8:29pm
Ian Whitchurch said | January 25th 2012 @ 8:29pm | Report comment
Lachlan,
Dont kill teams. Its not worth the stress.
And with “timesharing”, there is no need to do so.
Actually, I read the whole post and thought about it … as far as planning for a code, for likelihood to work, you’re up there with Qgirl, turbodewd and Johnno.
January 25th 2012 @ 10:15pm
Lachlan said | January 25th 2012 @ 10:15pm | Report comment
Ian
How much longer can we have 9 teams based in the City of Melbourne?
If you were bringing a game to Australia and assuming it continues for 20 odd years, you wouldn’t want anymore than 2 or 3 teams tops based in Melbourne. I understand all the history behind the game and Melbourne/Victoria will always be the home of the only Australian sport, but at some point we must axe teams, it’ll only help the game in the future. Look at Fitzroy they got axed and no one cares about them.
January 26th 2012 @ 5:35am
amazonfan said | January 26th 2012 @ 5:35am | Report comment
“Look at Fitzroy they got axed and no one cares about them.”
Tell that to all the Fitzroy supporters!
Can someone please tell me why we need to axe any teams from Melbourne. ‘Oh, nine is too many’ people say. But why? Why is it too many?
From an organizational point of view, it shouldn’t make any difference in a competition with a draft and which revolves around club, rather than state.
From an economic point of view, it also shouldn’t make a difference. While there are clubs which need help, almost none of them (North might be a possible exception, however I don’t know enough about their finances to comment) can be regarded as a drain upon the AFL. Melbourne, which you so callously suggest should be merged, is debt free. The AFL, and its clubs, are not-for-profits. They don’t exist to make money, they exist for a higher purpose, and the AFL can afford to ensure that all clubs remain viable.
Morally, I think we are bound to keep all of them. You say “Look at Fitzroy they got axed and no one cares about them” (which is nonsense of course), however if a club gets axed, its supporters and the community around the club gets devastated. Fitzroy didn’t have to die, and I hope that the AFL does not listen to people like you (who undoubtedly supports one of the big clubs) and instead realizes that it owes it supporters, and the community, to ensure that no club gets axed ever again.
January 26th 2012 @ 5:46am
amazonfan said | January 26th 2012 @ 5:46am | Report comment
I just saw that you support Essendon. Why aren’t I surprised?
I might be willing to reconsider my views if you agree that Essendon be the first club to be axed. Perhaps you could merge with Carlton.
January 26th 2012 @ 7:51am
The_Wookie said | January 26th 2012 @ 7:51am | Report comment
we dont want them
January 26th 2012 @ 8:11am
amazonfan said | January 26th 2012 @ 8:11am | Report comment
No, I don’t imagine you would.
My brother wouldn’t want them either.
January 26th 2012 @ 12:46pm
Lachlan said | January 26th 2012 @ 12:46pm | Report comment
I follow the swans, 12th year member and 2nd year member of giants this year. Im not even from Victoria, (although i do go their several times a year). The logo in my Profile picture is the logo of my local club the “Killarney Vale/Mingara Football Club (Central Coast)”. I’ve followed the sport my whole life and apparently im the only one that sees how we can improve the game and help it continue to be the national game.
January 26th 2012 @ 1:31pm
amazonfan said | January 26th 2012 @ 1:31pm | Report comment
“I follow the swans, 12th year member and 2nd year member of giants this year. Im not even from Victoria, (although i do go their several times a year). The logo in my Profile picture is the logo of my local club the “Killarney Vale/Mingara Football Club (Central Coast)”.”
I don’t think it matters whom you go for. Although that you’re not Victorian partly explains your ridiculous statement about nobody caring about Fitzroy. Only partly, though, as any knowledgable Football fan would be aware of how angry & upset many Fitzroy supporters still are.
“I’ve followed the sport my whole life and apparently im the only one that sees how we can improve the game and help it continue to be the national game.”
Oh, please. Don’t act as if you have some special knowledge. We simply disagree with you. It doesn’t mean that we don’t want to improve the game and help it continue to be the national game as well, we simply disagree about the way to do it. Certainly I don’t see at all how axing Melbourne clubs would be for the benefit of the competition, for reasons I’ve already stated (and which I’m not going to repeat.)
January 26th 2012 @ 7:53am
The_Wookie said | January 26th 2012 @ 7:53am | Report comment
You realise Fitrzroy still exist and play in the VAFA. It will be news to the club that no one cares about them.
January 26th 2012 @ 11:07am
brendan said | January 26th 2012 @ 11:07am | Report comment
Your right had the pleasure at Cheltenham Football ground to watch a grand final between South Districts (in the original South guernsey) and Fitzroy ,in the Fitzroy guernsey,quite surreal didnt support either or know game was on.
January 26th 2012 @ 1:33pm
Ian Whitchurch said | January 26th 2012 @ 1:33pm | Report comment
Lachlan,
All the Melbourne teams are viable, especially with timesharing.
I wouldnt agree no-one cares about Fitzroy … but it created a lot of tension, a lot of doubt and a lot of heartache … and Australian Rules was Don Scott away from doing to itself what News Corp did to Rugby League.
January 31st 2012 @ 4:45pm
Nathan of Perth said | January 31st 2012 @ 4:45pm | Report comment
I will say that Lachlan is right in that, now that the AFL is up to its current level, we must develop the underpinnings of the game, such as the state leagues. The gulf of quality between first and second tier is not healthy, in my opinion.