Foley between a rock and a hard place
Columnist By David Lord, 1 Jul 2012 David Lord is a Roar Expert
- Tagged:
- Michael Foley, NSW Waratahs, Rugby Union, Super Rugby, wallabies
NSW Waratahs coach Michael Foley is under pressure after a tough season (AAP Image/Paul Miller)
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Michael Foley has spent the last two nights sizing up the Brumbies, and the Reds. His livelihood depends on it.
The beleaguered Waratahs coach must beat both over the final two rounds of the Super Rugby schedule to survive. And in the process decide which franchise finishes on top of the Australian Conference, and automatic finals qualification.
If the previous 14 rounds are any indication, there will be a new Waratahs coach next year. Just four wins and a historic 10 losses, with the last six a record losing streak, doesn’t cut the mustard.
It’s been a wretched season, but why?
The Waratahs provided nine Wallabies in the 3-0 series win against Wales. The entire front row of Benn Robinson, Tatafu Polota-Nau, and Sekope Kepu, plus Sitaleki Timani, David Dennis, Wycliff Palu, Berrick Barnes, Adam Ashley-Cooper, and Rob Horne.
Nine Waratahs, six Reds, five Brumbies, and two each from the Force, and Rebels.
Go figure.
Foley has spent an eventful week trying to justify to his bosses why he should be retained as coach, while denying his Waratahs play better for the Wallabies than they do for him.
It’s hard to imagine he won his point on either count.
Former Wallaby turned television commentator Rod Kafer summed up the Waratahs Super history best since 1996 – “They originally had a three-year plan that hasn’t worked for 17 years”.
There have been seven Waratah coaches in that time, and not one has been able to bring home the bacon.
Ewen McKenzie was by far the most successful with two losing finals, both against the Crusaders, and a losing semi against the Hurricanes, in five seasons from 2004 to 2008.
Yet he was punted, which doesn’t say a lot for the decision-making qualities of the backroom boys at the Waratah bunker.
Bobby Dwyer, the Wallaby World Cup-winning coach in 1991, took the Waratahs to the Super semis in 2002, only to be thumped by the Brumbies 51-10.
And Chris Hickey made the semis in 2010, to lose 25-6 to the Stormers, and the inaugural qualifying final last year to lose 26-13 to the Blues.
That’s a dismal record over 17 seasons – just two losing finals, three losing semis, and a losing qualifying final.
But it’s never too late to rectify a wrong.
Over the next two Saturday nights, the Waratahs meet the Brumbies at ANZ, and the Reds at Suncorp.
Two wins would do wonders for severely dented pride and passion and bring some long overdue respite for the bitterly disappointed supporters.
Whether double success will save Michael Foley’s neck is debatable.
But it’s vital the Waratahs don’t kick off next season coming off eight losses on the trot.
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- Explore:
- Michael Foley, NSW Waratahs, Rugby Union, Super Rugby, wallabies
July 1st 2012 @ 7:40am
Rabbitz said | July 1st 2012 @ 7:40am | Report comment
Hi David,
I believe the Foley will not be shown the door even if they lose 8 on the trot.
The Waratah board are unlikely to admit they made an error is giving Foley the chance to step up from Assistant Coach to Head Coach.
It is likely, however, they will punt him early next season, if / when results don’t improve. Disrupting the team mid-season is far more in keeping with Waratahlands philosophy or fixing one stuff up by hiding it behind another, bigger stuff up.
I have been a NSW follower since I was in short pants. It has got to the stage where I have not renewed my membership, I do not go to games and I do not watch them on the Crystal Bucket any longer. This despair has spilled over to all forms of the game. I find myself walking out of the room when SWMBO settles down to watch rugby.
It has to stop. NSW rugby needs a root and branch rebuild. Not just a new coach.
Before those still rusted on, myopic supporters accuse me of being a fickle bandwagon supporter, let me say that I am a Warringah Rugby supporter and a North Sydney Rugby League supporter, so I reckon that for me it isn’t just about following winning teams.
At least the Bears and the Rats gave / give it a red hot go, something that can not be said for the pretenders in sky blue/
July 1st 2012 @ 7:44am
hog said | July 1st 2012 @ 7:44am | Report comment
So that’s the solution then, a couple of wins at the end of the season and its all okay, carry on with the 3yr plan
July 1st 2012 @ 8:34am
Red Block said | July 1st 2012 @ 8:34am | Report comment
Seven coaches but very few changes at board level. A wise man once said, ‘a fish rots from it’s head first.’
The power brokers in Waratah land who serve the interests of their clubs first and the Waratahs second are holding the whole thing back.
It is a great mystery as to why there is no first grade rugby team in Campbelltown, Liverpool, Central Coast or the ‘Gong.
Imagine how strong NSW could be?
Of course for Foley to survive, the players must want him to. Remember Greg Smith in SA? One wonders whether the Tahs will just roll over.
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July 1st 2012 @ 12:00pm
Atawhai Drive said | July 1st 2012 @ 12:00pm | Report comment
RB, Campbelltown play in Division 6 Subbies.They’re going quite well this season. Division 6 is an intensely convivial competition.
Campbelltown play in Division 1 Subbies and their first-grade team had a good win over Hunters Hill yesterday.
The Central Coast has its own club comp. Judging by last year’s grand final between Gosford and Avoca, the standard is pretty good.
Wollongong also has a long-running comp of its own.
Like water, I suspect these clubs and their players have found their own level. Not everyone wants to be a professional.
July 1st 2012 @ 12:49pm
Atawhai Drive said | July 1st 2012 @ 12:49pm | Report comment
Replying to myself, that should read “Liverpool play in Division 6 Subbies.”
July 1st 2012 @ 1:45pm
sheek said | July 1st 2012 @ 1:45pm | Report comment
AD,
I have long wondered why Sydney University play in the premier rugby Shute Shield, which began life in 1900 as a DISTRICT club. All other clubs could find their place in suburban rugby.
Sydney University had an exemption back then, & it continues to have an exemption today- a non-district club playing in a supposedly district-based comp.
The problem is, University is taking the place of a development area, precisely like Campbelltown, or Hornsby perhaps. Also, it would be nice to see the famous St.George back. Southern Districts could remain as such, but remove the red in their playing outfit, which obviously belongs to the Saints.
Up in Brisbane, Queensland University is also taking the place of a district club such as Beenleigh, or Redlands, or Redcliffe, who used to play in the premier comp.
If rugby administrators were serious, they would gently urge Sydney & Qld Unis to move back to subbies, where you can also find NSW Uni, Macquarie Uni, UWS, Griffith Uni, & the like. Plus all the old boys clubs.
This would then free up at least one place in each city for a club in a rapidly growing youth catchment area – Campbelltown in south-west Sydney, & Beenleigh in south-west Brisbane.
July 1st 2012 @ 2:07pm
Atawhai Drive said | July 1st 2012 @ 2:07pm | Report comment
I think we’ve been over this ground before, Sheek.
My origins are in New Zealand, and I’ve always just accepted the presence of “varsity” teams in club rugby. In NZ that has meant, or used to mean, university teams playing at the top club level and providing heaps of provincial and international players. Varsity A in Christchurch were a traditional powerhouse of the game in Canterbury.
Likewise you have non-geographic Catholic rugby clubs everywhere in NZ but not so much here _ Brothers in Brisbane being an obvious exception.
I’m not sure that forcing (or even gently urging) Sydney Uni back to Subbies would necessarily have a beneficial effect on the state of Sydney club rugby. Who’s to say that a Campbelltown club would be willing or able to take the step up? That said, Uni were in second division in the early 1980s but they dragged themselves up again, with a little help for the old boys network.
I can’t see St George coming back any time soon, unless they’ve got a potential Peter Lucas or two kicking around.
The Shute Shield may have been “supposedly a district-based comp” but there is no reason for that situation to remain static.
Keep Uni, bring in some district clubs if they’re up for it, and some Old Boys clubs too. Last but not least, there has to be a place for a revived Drummoyne!
But as you say below, keep Newcastle-Hunter, Central Coast and Wollongong out of if and encourage them to develop their own competitions.
July 1st 2012 @ 5:10pm
sheek said | July 1st 2012 @ 5:10pm | Report comment
AD,
The situation you describe with NZ rugby is the same with Australian cricket. Each of the 8 major cricket association district comps in each of Sydney, Melbourne, Adelaide, Perth, Brisbane, Newcastle, Canberra & Hobart features at least one university club.
But it doesn’t matter because cricket permeates every strata of Australian society. Not so rugby union in Australia.
Rightly or wrongly, university clubs in rugby are seen as a continuation of the narrow, elite band of private schools. This is turn says everything that is wrong with rugby. How can it ever hope to be widely popular while maintaining its narrow, elitist focus?
I have had a look at the schoolboy teams for the upcoming national championships on another site.
Queensland have just one, repeat one, state high school student out of 44 players across 2 teams. The situation is slightly better in NSW, but only slightly, where 7 out of 44 students are from the state high school system.
In the ACT, none of the 23 students are fro the state system. The Combined States, which is made up of leftover NSW & Qld players, features just 2 out 23 players from state high schools.
Thus far, out of 134 rugby schoolboys, only 10 come from the state school system. School distribution in Vic & WA is unknown, but I seriously doubt it would even be a handful.
10 out of 134 represents just 7.46% of the state school system. Clearly, Australian rugby is not serious about endearing itself across every strata of Australian society.
Okay, here’s the alternative. Keep the uni clubs in premier rugby, but pour resources into the youth catchment areas of places like Campbelltown, Penrith & Parramatta in Sydney, & Beenleigh & Redlands in Qld.
Once these clubs take off, then the presence of Sydney & Qld Unis in premier rugby will as irrelevant as it is in NZ rugby & Australian cricket.
July 1st 2012 @ 2:23pm
jeznez said | July 1st 2012 @ 2:23pm | Report comment
Sheek, the Rebels only formed in 1989 – do you expect Port Hacking to revive as well in their sky blue, black and white? Southo’s are really only hitting some consistent form in the last couple of years. Bringing back St George at the expense of Southo’s would leave the Shire excluded from the Sydney premiership.
I’m not sure how returning St George as a stand alone club would strengthen Sydney rugby.
July 1st 2012 @ 5:16pm
sheek said | July 1st 2012 @ 5:16pm | Report comment
Jeznez,
It is wrong to focus solely on St.George, as I also mentioned Campbelltown & Hornsby as alternatives.
Even I’m well aware the return of St.George (just like Drummoyne) anytime soon, is a wish rather than a reality.
I’m thinking St.George from a historical & traditional perspective. Also, there was a time when Sydney rugby could service both the St.George (Hurstville, Rockdale, etc) district & the Port Hacking (Cronulla, Caringabh, etc) district.
The fact that St.George went by the bye suggests a failure of rugby union to expand into the south-east.
Otherwise, I further offer my reply above to AD.
July 1st 2012 @ 6:25pm
jeznez said | July 1st 2012 @ 6:25pm | Report comment
Sheek, I focussed on the St George coment as Southern Districts is my Shute Shield club. I started playing for them straight out of school in their third year of operation, 1991. I had seven years between Colts and Grade down there before moving on to subbies.
The merger of St George and Port Hacking was always a little uneasy off the pitch, amongst the older guys and a few of the board. For me I joined the club having played at school rather than as a local junior so unlike many had no affiliation to anything but Southern Districts.
I just think that if you re-found St George then you have to re-split the club, I don’t see how with its history you could allow Southern Districts to remain without the red on their shirt. I think you would have to call them Port Hacking again.
It is a long time since I’ve been apart of the club, my last game down there was in 1998 (except for a single cameo appearance in 4th grade around 2004). I think if you brought back the two old clubs then you’d have two more teams for subbies, I don’t think either of a split team would be competitive in the Shute.
Southern Districts Rebels have been improving year on year and will be looking to make the finals this season, just as they did last. Like the strongest clubs in the comp they will be boosted by numerous Super Rugby players coming back. The likes of Ulugia, Douglas, Timani, Timani, Samo and Horne will boost them (our Brumbies are now lost to us due to Jake White’s rules so that Ita Vaea and Dan Palmer will now play John Dent).
You can see though that there is Super Rugby and Wallaby level talent coming through that club – Samo is the only rep player not developed by the club.
I really don’t think breaking up a side that is finally finding some success is a great move. No matter how much the nostalgic would like to see the return of St George and Port Hacking.
July 1st 2012 @ 1:28pm
Hatchet said | July 1st 2012 @ 1:28pm | Report comment
Newcastle hunter have won five NSW Country Championships on the trot, a much better option than Cambletown or the Gong.
July 1st 2012 @ 1:47pm
sheek said | July 1st 2012 @ 1:47pm | Report comment
Hatchet,
Newcastle-Hunter have such a vibrant comp in their own region, I would be loathe for them to have a team in Shute Shield. Ditto Central Coast, Illawarra & ACT. They should all be encouraged to develop their own comps.
July 1st 2012 @ 9:06am
Damo said | July 1st 2012 @ 9:06am | Report comment
Yes Rabbitz – the revolution could be called ‘Root and Branch” and should include choice of venue.
What is SWMBO?
July 1st 2012 @ 9:13am
Rabbitz said | July 1st 2012 @ 9:13am | Report comment
SWMBO – She Who Must Be Obeyed.
aka ‘er indoors
aka The beautiful Bride…
July 1st 2012 @ 12:26pm
kiwi said | July 1st 2012 @ 12:26pm | Report comment
An old “Rumpole of the Bailey” reference?
July 1st 2012 @ 12:36pm
Rabbitz said | July 1st 2012 @ 12:36pm | Report comment
That, ‘The Minder’ and “The Sweeney”.
July 1st 2012 @ 12:52pm
Atawhai Drive said | July 1st 2012 @ 12:52pm | Report comment
In Minder, Mrs Daley was “‘er indoors”.
In The Sweeney, well, all their marriages were defunct. Ex-wives were likely to be known as “the strife”, or by some form of rhyming slang.
July 1st 2012 @ 9:53am
bennalong said | July 1st 2012 @ 9:53am | Report comment
David
Your article is problematic, as is your response Rabbitz
New South Welsh fans are a quiet, conservative bunch who you’d expect to support their team come hell or high water. And to be fair I’m not alone in the bleachers despite a disappointing season.
But they cannot get audibly behind their team to lift them in crucial periods! They remain mute!
I have been hugely frustrated by the second half performances of this team and their successive losses. And I do agree David that the sacking of Ewen McKenzie after taking the team to a semi final, points to a problem at the highest level. But it still must be said that only Queensland’s triumph in taking out the competition makes the Tahs’ performance (until this year) look shabby, or perhaps a comparison to the Brumbies of old, (though we beat them frequently at home.)
But as with this team you just always knew they could have done better!
The new Brumbies give me every hope that this Waratahs team will rise like Lazarus, but we need a top coach…….. surely that’s obvious. Foley hasn’t the experience to lead the training staff from the front and like Link, he’s a foreward ! And the forewards are not the problem. They need backs making line breaks to keep them doing the hard work in the engine room.
The guys up top lost Mowen and Beale (who had been badly handled), could not use/did not use Tamana Tahu having lured him from league, AND they pulled Rocky who had been injured for two seasons. Not smart !
But the team has been competitive despite a dreadful injury toll and could (I know it’s wishful) have beaten the Bulls, or the Chiefs if their first half dominance had been carried on for twenty minutes
In a way this is the bleedin’ obvious given the Wallaby contingent that played such a part in defeating Wales
It may not be the fans fault but I wish a few others would actually barrack for their team, perhaps taking a ‘leek’ out of the Welsh book of “How to get behnid your team”!
July 1st 2012 @ 10:21am
Rabbitz said | July 1st 2012 @ 10:21am | Report comment
Bennalong,
I reckon you are putting the cart before the horse. If there was something to cheer on, the crowd might respond.
If these professional players need the crowd to urge them on then I suggest rather than going through the motions and giving away possession and every opportunity they do things to get the crowd excited. I doubt you will ever get the noise of a Welsh or English crowd, it just isn’t in the DNA but crowds do respond to interesting, exciting, innovative rugby.
If the players who are getting the big money can’t seem to get excited, then why would the supporter who is paying through the nose get excited?
July 1st 2012 @ 10:35am
Kuruki said | July 1st 2012 @ 10:35am | Report comment
It’s hard for the fans to have pride in a team who has no pride in the jersey.The Tahs need to stop buying in talent and start producing there own. Bring through young guys who are proud to play for the Waratahs not just a pay check. Too much money has been wasted at this club employing players who spend half their careers on the sideline. This is the rebuild the Tahs need. The Hurricanes hit rock bottom they cleaned out the excess baggage introduced a new breed of young local kids built a new team culture and are now in a position to make the top 6.
When the fans start to leave it is there way of saying enough if enough. I can get behind a team playing with pride and giving 100% even if they are losing. Getting behind a team of internationals who use the Super 15 as a holiday between test series is out of the question.
July 1st 2012 @ 11:01am
Bakkies said | July 1st 2012 @ 11:01am | Report comment
”Bobby Dwyer, the Wallaby World Cup-winning coach in 1991, took the Waratahs to the Super semis in 2002, only to be thumped by the Brumbies 51-10.”
Losing 96-19 the week before was a massive stain on his record
July 1st 2012 @ 11:07am
David Lord said | July 1st 2012 @ 11:07am | Report comment
Bakkies, how about the stain on the Waratah jersey? Bobby Dwyer didn’t drop the ball, or miss the tackles.
July 1st 2012 @ 11:52am
Atawhai Drive said | July 1st 2012 @ 11:52am | Report comment
That game against the Crusaders was a disgrace. Clearly, the players had given up playing for Bob Dwyer, and he surely deserved better than that.
July 1st 2012 @ 12:43pm
jeznez said | July 1st 2012 @ 12:43pm | Report comment
Dwyer did pick the team and decide to rest six of his regular starters in Brendan Cannon, Rod Moore, Van Humphries, Phil Waugh, Duncan McRae and Marc Stcherbina.
Hard to suggest that the replacements in Huia Edmonds, Dunning, West, Tawake, Manny Edmonds and Cullimore were going to aid the team in toppling the competition leaders at home.
July 1st 2012 @ 12:54pm
Atawhai Drive said | July 1st 2012 @ 12:54pm | Report comment
Good point, jeznez. A classic case of not taking it one game at a time, of looking too far ahead.
July 1st 2012 @ 2:27pm
jeznez said | July 1st 2012 @ 2:27pm | Report comment
AD, it was an absolute shocking set of selections in hind sight. The match against the Crusaders as the last regular season game could not change the order in which teams finished. The Crusaders were playing the Highlanders in one semi, while the Waratahs would host the Brumbies in the other.
Dwyer decided to get cute and rest over a third of his starting team. Given those selections the team can not have been in a positive mindset to mix it with the Crusaders in a tough game. History shows the Waratahs were scarred by their walloping and even with a full set of cavalry back the following week got belted at home against the Brumbies.
I was at that semi-final and remember seeing the team behind their try line while the Brumbies lined up another conversion. The side was scattered about, players were lost in their own thoughts. There was no cohesive huddle of the team together making a plan to get themselves in the game. Very depressing as a Tahs supporter.
July 1st 2012 @ 11:54am
Johnno said | July 1st 2012 @ 11:54am | Report comment
Well on a side note i have just been watching the live stream of the junior word rugby trophy and USA has just beaten japan 37-33 to win the final and now next year USA will be included into the Junior under 20-world cup, and Italy having lost in South Africa in a relegation play off with Fiji goes down to the 2nd division JWRT. Great match by both teams and a great day for USA rugby. Look out Wallabies, AB’S,BOKS the USA are coming to get you next year andover the next 10 years.
They have beaten Tonga, Japan, in this 2nd division world cup some great wins.
July 1st 2012 @ 12:10pm
Damo said | July 1st 2012 @ 12:10pm | Report comment
Kuriki, you are getting close to the whole issue here. Players who do the right thing in the right place for the ‘right’ reason.
But I don’t blame the wallaby Tahs for a lack of commitment to the spirit of the team. I blame a lack of team spirit as the vacuum that individual efforts get lost in.
Bennalong, I am one of those nuts who yells loudly at every game from the U/12′s to test matches. But I don’t blame Tahs crowds for not getting excited. I blame decision makers for placing this team and such a turgid crowd together in the first place.
And it is my view repeated ad nauseum in this forum that the waratah ‘mountain’ should move to suit ‘mohammed’ (i.e. a passionate crowd) if that’s what it takes, to get the show moving.
It is not any one thing – it is probably many things changing simultaneously with united purpose that will deliver the spirit required for
Good coaching
Player passion
Vocal crowd support
Exciting footy
Sponsor attraction
Well placed, well attended and affordable venue
Every other OZ team has had to make big structural decisions in order to find the way to a passionate fan base.
Tahs are behind the rest in this regard.
What decision should they make?
Whatever it takes. Including venue.
July 1st 2012 @ 1:29pm
sheek said | July 1st 2012 @ 1:29pm | Report comment
The Tahs coaching saga is precisely why I have cautioned against sacking Deans as Wallabies coach, simply because his win/loss ratio isn’t good enough. Whatever the aliment of the Wallabies, I reckon much of it is structural, & will challenge Deans’ successors, as it has challenged him.
The Tahs have gone through coaches at a ridiculous rate (although 7 coaches in 17 seasons isn’t too bad, I guess), & it is evident that throughout their history, they have failed to solve the problems bedevilling the province.
Sacking the two most recent coaches – McKenzie & Hickey – may have temporarily treated the ailment, but it has failed to heal the cause of the sickness.
It is said that knowledge is knowing tomato is a fruit, but wisdom is knowing not to put tomato in fruit salad.
it’s one thing to acquire knowledge & most of us can point out the Tahs short-comings, but true wisdom is knowing how to provide the cure. And sadly, most of us fall short in this area.
I welcome, & applaud anyone, who can solve the problem of NSW rugby.
July 1st 2012 @ 1:48pm
Blinky Bill of Bellingen said | July 1st 2012 @ 1:48pm | Report comment
As a devoted Tah’s fan I’m left wondering what the hell is the answer to the problem, THE solution if you like.
Do we need to go down the same road as the Brumbies in order to find a cure and become the team we all dream of being? Perhaps that’s being too simplistic. Besides, how many Jake Whites are there out there to step in and weave their magic?
I hear good things about Cheika but that as a true professional he would want to do things HIS way. Well is HIS way the best way or will it lead to just more problems? I just have more questions than answers.
Meantime Michael Foley seems to be a decent guy who was promoted from forwards coach to head coach. Was that a step too far or is it the case that with our injuries Mandrake could not have done any better?
July 1st 2012 @ 1:30pm
Hatchet said | July 1st 2012 @ 1:30pm | Report comment
It would appear that the Waratah Board have opted for failiure.