Time to sink Waratahs Inc
By Rickety Knees, 13 Aug 2012 Rickety Knees is a Roar Guru
- Tagged:
- NSW Waratahs, Rugby Union, Super Rugby, Sydney University
The woeful Waratahs have the Wallabies staring down the barrel (AAP Image/Paul Miller)
Related coverage
A couple of years ago the NSWRU divided itself between Waratahs Inc. – to solely run the professional team – and NSWRU – to run the rest (read: principally not much else, with the Shute Shield being run by the clubs and the NSWRU having inexplicably given junior development over to the ARU).
What came from that was an immediate disengagement of resources to the junior development of the game.
While the ARU has funded development resources to promote the game in NSW, Waratahs Inc. has its own development strategy that looks after established rugby nurseries with country regions missing out altogether. There is no coordination between the two initiatives.
Junior rugby development is struggling in my region. We have nine senior clubs and only six teams in each age division. The best way to get the kids interested is for them to rub shoulders with their heroes, such as Tatafu Polota-Nau, Berrick Barnes, Benn Robinson and Rob Horne (rather than the Hendrik Roodt’s of this world, who has been served up to us in the past) in a school environment.
Running paid clinics is preaching to the converted, fits John O’Neil’s banking user pays model and helps fund the development officers but does nothing to grow the game.
High profile players need to engage the community, visit schools and preach the rugby gospel – a similar model to what Rod McQueen has created in Melbourne. These activities need to be coordinated with the ARU development team, so that each opportunity can be maximised.
There are murmurings about the power that Sydney Uni wields and the associated entitlement culture that flows from this power. A check of the Waratahs squad list will show that 12 starting players (Barnes, Betham, Carter, Dennis, Halangahu, Jenkins, Kingston, McCutcheon, Mumm, Ryan, Tilse and Vickerman) all have one thing in common – they play club Rugby for Sydney Uni. Indeed Waratahs assistant coach Greg Mumm also hails from the same club.
Favourite Uni son Tom Carter last week was signed for another year with the Tahs – even though the coach had departed. One wonders what the new coach would think about this.
Sydney Uni Alumni members Nick Farr-Jones and Chris Birch, are Waratahs Board Members, with Roger Davis now also a board member. Michael Hawker is the chairman of the ARU. While they all have been wonderful servants of the game, directly or indirectly they have entrenched Sydney Uni’s power and influence through all levels of Rugby in NSW.
Can such centralised control of the game by the one club (that has minimal interest in junior development) be good for the game?
The game is not being promoted in the regions. Witness the fact the some 20,000+ brave souls attended the recent Test in Newcastle in cyclonic conditions. Newcastle is the third largest rugby nursery behind Sydney and Brisbane.
Has there ever been a word uttered by the Tahs to play a game up there or anywhere else instead of inner Sydney?
Witness the outrage generated from the Eastenders when it was announced that Super Rugby would be played 15km down the road in the inner west at the Olympic Stadium.
Rugby in NSW is divided and dysfunctional. It has no strategic plan and is disconnected from its community. It is a bunch of fiefdoms who have a myopic focus on their own agendas.
There is much wrong with NSW Rugby and it all starts at the top. Every man and his dog have been calling for a cleanout – the job is only half done.
Ewen Mckenzie must be holding his sides from splitting, watching how the powerbrokers that engineered his departure have now imploded.
Editor’s Note:
Roar expert Spiro Zavos was asked to respond to this article. His thoughts are as follows:
“It is wrong to blame Sydney University for all the faults and problems with Sydney rugby. I believe they are a force for good for rugby in Sydney, a very powerful force. They provide scholarships to students who can also play rugby.
They helped to keep rugby alive in the 1920s, 1930s, 1940s, 1950s, 1960s and 1970s when the game was under immense pressure from rugby league. And over the last decade, or Sydney Uni have provided the template for how a successful rugby club can and should operate in the professional era of rugby.
Now, as Rickety Knees has pointed out, a number of former Sydney University players are providing leadership in administrative positions in the NSWRU. I take this as an example of people putting back into the code, rather than taking out in an entitlement sense as Rickety Knees suggests.
It is not generally known that ‘Doc’ Evatt in the earlier 1920s almost got the Sydney University Rugby Union club to convert to rugby league. My belief, and that of the club’s historian David Hickie, is that if this had happened rugby union might have become a very minor sport in Sydney and may not exist today.”
Do you have what it takes to become a sports writer? Write for the roar
Rugby Union articles
- SPIRO: ‘Captain Magic’ Quade Cooper goes down with all flags flying (333)
- Deans confirms no spot for Quade Cooper (281)
- SPIRO’s Lions Diary: Foley does Australian rugby a disservice (261)
- Want to beat the Lions? Pick Quade Cooper (229)
- SPIRO: All Blacks learning to live without Carter (218)
- Wallabies’ six worst-kept secrets confirmed (204)
- A lesson in Deans-speak (154)
- LEAKED: Wallabies team to play first Lions Test appears early (24)
- Fresh Wallabies face tough early test
- Brumbies loss a reality check: Gatland (20)
- SPIRO’S Lions Diary: Brumbies show Wallabies how to do it (112)
- Wallaby fans, don’t get carried away by the Brumbies win (56)
- British and Irish Lions teams post WW2 (part 3) (9)
- Fifteen reasons why the Lions will beat the Wallabies (17)
- British and Irish Lions teams post WW2 (part 3) (9)
- Fifteen reasons why the Lions will beat the Wallabies (17)
- Lions vs Wallabies: the teams I’d pick (14)
- My Waratahs vs Lions experience (2)
- Brumbies vs British and Irish Lions: Tour match live scores, blog (220)
- These British and Irish Lions are different (49)
- Robbie Deans can learn from those Randwick Greens (27)
Recommend this story.
- Explore:
- NSW Waratahs, Rugby Union, Super Rugby, Sydney University

August 13th 2012 @ 12:38pm
Rabbitz said | August 13th 2012 @ 12:38pm | Report comment
We’ll just have sort this one out on Saturday afternoon…
August 13th 2012 @ 12:53pm
Who Needs Melon said | August 13th 2012 @ 12:53pm | Report comment
Whilst you can argue either way whether Syd Uni has too much influence on NSW rugby, what I think is something more are likely to agree on is that the current convoluted governance structure is disfunctional. This isn’t 20/20 hindsight – it always seemed a weird move to me and many others. We just have more boards/committees and people up the top leading to a dilution of responsibility and confusion over who is responsible for what.
So I wholeheartedly agree with the headline. All objectives are actually aligned – more focus on juniors and development areas means more and better players at club level and therefore an even wider base of good players for the Tahs. Keep it simple!
August 13th 2012 @ 12:58pm
Rickety Knees said | August 13th 2012 @ 12:58pm | Report comment
Cheers Spiro – however I am not blaming Sydney University for all the faults and problems with Sydney rugby. My article when read in context is saying that Rugby is suffering in the regions – the Waratahs are disconnected from the ARU’s junior development initiative and we in the regions are paying the price. The dominant force in Tahland is Sydney Uni.
August 13th 2012 @ 1:56pm
peeeko said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:56pm | Report comment
Agree rickety, how can syd uni provide a template for other clubs when no other club can offer scholarships? Uni were very weak in the nineties and were about to get culled before they started giving scholarships
August 13th 2012 @ 7:22pm
Bakkies said | August 13th 2012 @ 7:22pm | Report comment
What junior base do they have….
August 17th 2012 @ 4:39pm
Sluggy said | August 17th 2012 @ 4:39pm | Report comment
Peeeko, they tried to cull Sydney Uni in the 80s as well – “they” being the Randwicks, Eastwoods, and the like who wanted the Students’ best players in the ‘district’ clubs (or at least their colts sides). They wanted to go back to the 60s when only enrolled students played for the University, and on graduation they transferred to a district club. The same arguments were trotted out then as now about juniors. There were supporters in the media. I remember Evan Whitton referring in an 80s article to the SUFC being a ‘rugby joke factory’, although that may have been directed to the kicking game that was employed in the 70s at the club. I do still read Mr Whitton’s columns in Justinian though, for the entertainment value.
The oldest club’s still there, winning premierships, and producing Wallabies. I am not sure what you see wrong with providing good development to young players, both in rugby, and career wise. I might just wear my 125th anniversary tie from 1988 to tomorrow. Come to think of it, they’ll have to put out a 150th tie next year.
As for former players moving into leadership positions in the hierarchy, you speak of people who have become high achievers in life after rugby, I am not sure why their playing history supports the conclusion that “they have entrenched Sydney Uni’s power and influence through all levels of Rugby in NSW.” or “centralised control of the game by the one club”.
Its a rugby club, not a religious order or secret society.
August 17th 2012 @ 6:47pm
Ian Whitchurch said | August 17th 2012 @ 6:47pm | Report comment
Whats preventing other teams from paying players ?
I mean, apart from indolence and incompetence.
August 17th 2012 @ 7:01pm
Sluggy said | August 17th 2012 @ 7:01pm | Report comment
Indeed. If SUFC actually pays players.
Or starting a mentoring/career assistance program. Such as the one I understand Southern Districts have set up. Randwick like Sydney Uni has a foundation to support it. And so it goes.
August 13th 2012 @ 8:41pm
chester said | August 13th 2012 @ 8:41pm | Report comment
Ricketty- you are blaming Sydney Uni
Sydney Uni has been the dominant side in recent years so why wouldn’t they be well represented
Criticisim of Sydney Uni is typical tall poppy syndrome
August 14th 2012 @ 10:52am
Nicki Drinkwater said | August 14th 2012 @ 10:52am | Report comment
Hi Rickety Knees,
You clearly have some strong opinions on NSW rugby and the Tahs and whilst some of the points you make are valid, you’re way out on some of your facts, as some others have already pointed out.
You ask if the Tahs have ever considered playing a game ‘anywhere else instead of inner Sydney’. The first match of 2012 – a trial against Samoa – was played in front of a sell-out crowd in Tamworth, just as the same game a year earlier was played in Nowra. In 2010 the Waratahs played in Lismore and in Orange. In 2009 it was Newcastle.
You also state that there is no co-ordination between the Waratahs and ARU’s NSW development team when it comes to community work and that the Waratahs just look after their own established rugby nurseries.
In the last 10 months, the Waratahs community program has seen players and coaches make almost 1000 appearances at about 200 community events across the state, with almost all activity co-ordinated by a joint working group which involves the ARU’s NSW development team and the Waratahs – whose offices sit next door to each other.
From Bathurst to Balmoral, Coogee to Coffs Harbour and Gunnedah, Scone and everywhere in between, every week since last November, an average of five players each attended five different events: racing Nippers at North Bondi; running skills and signing sessions; visiting the Tamworth Tricolours try rugby day; supporting the Sydney Convicts at Mardi Gras Fair Day; chatting to students at St Ignatius Riverview, Scone Grammar School, Prairiewood High School; and supporting charity events such as the Starlight Children’s Foundation Christmas party, and many, many more.
And before you say you’ve been fobbed off with the Hendrik Roodt’s of the squad, the two players making the most appearances all year were Pat McChutcheon and Lachie Turner, each attending around 40 events. After them, Drew Mitchell, Damien Fitzpatrick, Benn Robinson and Paddy Ryan make up the top six.
Finally, the Shute Shield is not administered by the clubs, it is administered by the Sydney Rugby Union, who in turn contract it out to Subbies, an affiliate of NSWRU. The promotion of the competition is carried out entirely by NSWRU and Waratahs Rugby.
If you are that passionate about helping junior rugby in your region, make a positive impact by picking up the phone, sending us an email or coming in and seeing us like many, many other rugby supporters do each week.
Nicki Drinkwater
Media and Communications Manager, Waratahs Rugby and NSW Rugby Union.
August 14th 2012 @ 11:14am
Zac Zavos said | August 14th 2012 @ 11:14am | Report comment
Great to have your response to this article, Nicki.
Thanks for taking the time to reach out and provide your response to this article.
cheers, Zac
The Roar
August 14th 2012 @ 12:00pm
Rickety Knees said | August 14th 2012 @ 12:00pm | Report comment
Thanks Nicki – we need to get players to visit our schools, especially in February when the kids are signing up for winter sports. It would be great if we had a player assigned to our region so that we could co-ordinate visits not only to our rugby festivals but also to work hand-in-hand with us in the schools. We are actually looking for grass roots community engagement from players the kids see on TV.
AFL Dev guys go to schools handing out Sherrin’s and then ask “who wants to play AFL” and the kids throw up there hands and say “YESSSSSSSSSS”
Is it time to have a system where we can bid for Waratah resouces to assist us in growing our game?
August 14th 2012 @ 9:31pm
Mick said | August 14th 2012 @ 9:31pm | Report comment
Hi Nicki,
Thanks for posting on the site – good to get some real facts from the inside, instead of opinions from the outside looking in.
Is there a plan to ever get Super Rugby games outside of Sydney? Obviously not the marquee games, but maybe the ‘lesser’ ones, versus the Lions or something – I know the Reds have played in Townsville a couple of times in the last few years, and had (relative) success.
Mick
August 13th 2012 @ 1:02pm
Uncle Argyle said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:02pm | Report comment
Good read RK,
what region do you hail from?
I am not really into secret societies and conspiracy theory however I am warming to the theory that JON is a 33 degree freemason, who along with the Australian Rugby Union, IRB, Council on Foreign Relations and Bilderburg Group are the New World Order planning total global domination and enslavement of human race, the Waratah Rugby Public are a test market. I feel for the average rugby person in NSW because the plight of NSW Rugby which has gone from the moustache twirlingy interesting side show to a seriious concern for any Wallaby fan. Its a joke and the laugh is on all of us. Meanwhile back at ARU HQ JON sits in his high back chair spinning his globe whilst patting Mat Carroll on the head saying “be still my pet for the hour is nigh”
August 13th 2012 @ 1:09pm
Rickety Knees said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:09pm | Report comment
Thanks UA – Central Coast – you maybe interested to know that we pick our rep team from just six teams or 90 players – a Sydney Club such as Gordon has three division in each age group – with 9 clubs – they are picking their rep side from 135 first division players.
August 13th 2012 @ 1:11pm
Uncle Argyle said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:11pm | Report comment
Is there any chance of a merge into the Newcastle Comp or is it not wanted?
I understand Terrigal has a 7′s tournament – could be useful.
What about blue tounge – Tahs could at least play A game there wouldn’t you think?
August 13th 2012 @ 1:22pm
Rickety Knees said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:22pm | Report comment
No we are separate to Hunter (Newcastle). We are running 7s programs – which is working well. We need the TPN’s to come to the schools and rub shoulders with the boys. ACC comes from up here!
It would be great to see the Tahs play here. They would get a 20k crowd without too many dramas.
August 13th 2012 @ 1:26pm
Uncle Argyle said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:26pm | Report comment
As evident in the Newcastle test and correct me if I am wrong but when Australia A played the Lions in 2001 at Gosford there was a decent crowd?
Peter Ryan played superbly that night I thought!
August 13th 2012 @ 1:28pm
Rickety Knees said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:28pm | Report comment
That game was sold out – I too was there. What a great night!
August 13th 2012 @ 1:19pm
B-Rock said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:19pm | Report comment
Good article RK
Centralised power in any one club is not ideal, but you do need strong organisations within a sport, ideally more than one however! Your main concern though – promoting rugby outside of sydney – is a bigger issue than just Sydney Uni.
I agree with most of your comments, and would just add that the Tahs should certainly do more in regional areas or change the name from NSW to Sydney, or East Sydney.
August 14th 2012 @ 3:57pm
Rickety Knees said | August 14th 2012 @ 3:57pm | Report comment
Cheers B-R
August 13th 2012 @ 1:29pm
levelheaded said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:29pm | Report comment
Just did some research RK, and I suggest you do. The Waratahs fund the NSWRU game, and well over $1.2m last year alone, they have a small administration and for half of the year they have between a thrid to half of their squad with the Wallabies. In fact I reckon less than 10% of their income is spent on admin staff from reading their p&L, the rest is the football department and payments to NSWRU. Don’t let a good story get in the way of your flippant remarks, and I continue……the ARU manage the junior development and activities in field, are you satisfied with that? The players you mention are controlled half the year by the Wallabies, have you requested a training camp in your region, I doubt it??? The Waratahs have a contract in place until 2015 to play 6 games at SFS and 2 games per year at ANZ Stadium – commercially they simply cannot jump around as some of you please – how many times will this one come up! This is a business, not some hobby for a passionate few. With regard to NSWRU, they control other competitions Subbies, Country Footy, the Refs etc all critical components of the Rugby experience. Here’s a thought and it may take a while to sink in, support the Waratahs and the more successful they are the more money will go into the community game, but that would be a big call!!!!!!!! They have to share their profits with the community game and it all goes around!
August 13th 2012 @ 1:34pm
Uncle Argyle said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:34pm | Report comment
All that and they still can’t win a game or keep a decent coach.
August 13th 2012 @ 1:38pm
Rickety Knees said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:38pm | Report comment
I am reporting from the coal face – please read my article – it is about the disconnect between the ARU junior development (who btw are doing a great job) and the invisible presence – yes – INVISIBLE – presence of the Waratahs in our region (1 hr north of Sydney). Again we need the TPN’s of this world RUBBING SHOULDERS with our kids, especially in January/February (when they are yours) at the time that kids sign up for a winter sport.
August 13th 2012 @ 6:31pm
stanley grella said | August 13th 2012 @ 6:31pm | Report comment
levelheaded is right, if you actually read into the report on what tahs inc does you would see that funding is better under there leadership than it was under nswru. they are assured 1.25 million a year were as if NSWRU were running the tahs any losses in revenue would result in that funding being cut.
as far as there community connection campaign that they relaunched this year they have increased school visits and clinic. they can’t cover every area and while i agree getting a big name or media relevant player is always the dream, with wallaby and waratah commitments these players obviously do less due to a larger season.
i suggest contacting the tahs directly with your concerns and locking in dates for a coaching clinic and suggesting they return for a trial match again.
im not sure if a team with only 8 home matches can actually achieve playing in enough places to fully “represent the large state there from. revenue from membership and corporate would drop if a couple of games were played outside of sydney (they dropped with the home bush games) and unfortunately in a professional sporting environment, rightly or wrongly this is what teams rely on to succeed.
August 13th 2012 @ 1:33pm
Elisha Pearce said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:33pm | Report comment
I don’t know enough about Sydney Uni so I can’t comment much there. Not sure it was really the main thrust of this article anyway, mostly just an observation. Although I will admit that the thought of 12 players in the starting side hadn’t escaped me. Even when sitting in the stands that thought comes to me. I wonder, if scholarships are really the main drawing card for all the players to move there, why doesn’t Randwick for instance, partner with Uni of NSW?
Or Manly with UTS or something?
The main thrust is regarding NSW Waratahs being mostly the “Inner West of Sydney Waratahs” in practise. This is true. The ownership change was a little perplexing in that it muddies the pathway of junior development to the top tier of rugby in the state.
I think the only really valid reason to split the ownership of the Tahs so clearly would be because a private investor wants to have it that way in order to ensure the Tahs are run his way and to make money etc. I could see the merit in that if in fact a benefactor was to step up and pour money into the professional game. There would obviously have to be checks and balances to guarantee some funds be paid back to the state through a license fee or some such.
With the lack of an overseeing third party putting his hard earned on the table , it appear the change in structure was to make some people’s jobs easier and the proper portions of blame cloudier.
August 13th 2012 @ 1:43pm
ncart said | August 13th 2012 @ 1:43pm | Report comment
I think the point abut getting ‘big name’ players out to mix with the juniors is a very good and important one. I don’t think they necessarily have to be the Wallaby players though (who of course would be unavailable during Test match time) but some of the recognisable S15 players from the area would work well. In the case of the Waratahs I think some of the players like Bernard Foley, Tom Kingston and even Tom Carter, like him or not, would be good ambassadors for the game as they have had a high profile within the Waratahs this season. In fact I think that it should be a requirement for the professional players to go out and do this sort of work, and not just visiting the traditional rugby nursery schools, but get out to the junior clubs and to schools where they could work with the PE teacher to have some sort of intro to rugby sessions. Give out some DVDs of a highlights package of some of the players – quick snippets like jumping high in the lineout, strong running and passing, kicking and tackling, and the touch – pause – engage of the scrum – I have found young kids love the scrum and pretending to scrum each other. Give each kid who attends a session a Waratahs (or other S15 side depending on location – this is transferable to every area) cap, DVD, and drink bottle and run a fun session with the ‘big’ players and it would go down well.
At my kids junior club in Brisbane one of the teams (not ours alas) won a training session with Reds players as a result of doing best in a car wash ticket sale so had 4 of the club’s Reds players come down to help with this particular Under 7′s team’s training session. My daughter’s team was training nearby and all the players in our team wanted to see the Reds guys and train with them. More sessions like that would be great, I’d like to see the Reds do it with more of their players and to actually get out to the schools as per my suggested approach above – they can’t wait for the schools to create a rugby program as it is not going to happen unless the PE teacher is a rugby fan but the potential to get some sort of intro to rugby sessions going at the school is definitely viable and would introduce a lot more kids and parents to the game.
August 13th 2012 @ 3:29pm
Rob said | August 13th 2012 @ 3:29pm | Report comment
RK,
Have been wanting to put thoughts down for a while but even now not sure that I will be making a totally coherent argument but here goes.
Son of a mate of mine goes to a Sydney CAS school. They are not a top private rugby school and yet at that school just for rugby has its own Gym, doctor, physio, maseuse,trainer backs coach,forwards coach and individual coach. They play maybe 10 games a year.
A boy going to one of the GPS schools will probably from the age of 13 get some of the best rugby coaching going around.
Come 16, 17 and 18 years when rep squads are being picked, those boys will have a skill set way above and beyond any others. When it comes to selection, you couldn’t blame selectors for picking those boys.
At 18 or 19 though, they will start to get earmarked for higher rep honours and it is from those ranks that the academy squads are drawn.
From the academy squads the senior squads are invariably picked.
What I’m leading to is 2 things:
1) is there a pathway for the player who doesn’t have the skill set of the better coached junior but who in fact may be the better footballer?
2) is there a pathway for the late developer?
The theory is that players can show their wares in club football but experience is very different. Once a player is in the system , he is in and its almost impossible to break in from outside that group.
At a Super 15 level is the team picked on form?
My guess is that on a day to day basis there would be many players in the Syd comp playing better than some in the S15 squad.But how do you take the place of a contracted player. Who covers your wages if needed to train full time? The S15 squad is picked at say October with the hope that players will maintain their form in almost 12 months time.
What do you do?
Scrap the costs of running the Academy and fringe contracted players.
Make the Syd 1st grade the academy where the young up and coming well coached and well skilled schoolboy players can show their true mettle against hard men for 22 games a year.
Cut the S15 squad to a bare minimum, use the Syd comp as the selection zone and use the money saved from no longer needed contracts and academy running costs to reimburse uncontracted club players if they get called up at short notice to S15 duties.
August 13th 2012 @ 5:47pm
Matthew Skellett said | August 13th 2012 @ 5:47pm | Report comment
Great article Rickety , WE ALL KNOW that Waratahs Inc. needs to be sunk , but who’s going to do it ? The ‘Cashed-Up White Knights’ Mr Crowden crows(sic) about so often NEVER SEEM TO MATERIALISE into anything recognisable to the common or garden rugby fan -the absolutely farcical Circus-McGurcus that passes for a ‘professional’ rugby franchise seems to lurch from one iceberg to another miraculously intact without ever learning from the experience -the powers that be continue to sail on to disaster -I wish that they held personal liability in the organisation so that they are carrying the majority of the debt when S.S.Waratah sinks with all hands