Rugby code wars are mindless
By sixo_clock, 27 Aug 2012 sixo_clock is a Roar Guru
- Tagged:
- rugby, rugby code wars, Rugby League, Rugby Union
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There are occasionally rugby ‘code war’ outbreaks. Maybe we can put a end to it with a reasoned argument. The two versions of rugby are now so dissimilar that they operate in different environments.
For a start, league has become a made-for-television product with all the marketing, hoopla and jazz, which is precisely where rugby will never venture without a great deal of thought beforehand.
We do not want the side effects of being in the entertainment industry. We would rather be an enjoyable process where youngsters can use our sport as a valuable tool in the process of self discovery on the journey towards adulthood.
Professional sports tend to drive the less-than-perfect juniors away from all sport because the ultimate goal of selection to the senior levels being denied means they will seek other pursuits. All youngsters should play sport and continue from school to club participation.
Of the winter codes, union can be played for fun and a level can be found for anyone. As their confidence and strength grows they may then dream of selection to higher levels.
It is a deeply held principle of union that it is a sport for all shapes and sizes for the qualities of manhood are held and made manifest between the ears.
Rugby union is technically difficult to master. That is part of the reasoning behind the game. We challenge people to be able to think on their feet accurately and quickly whilst tired, pressured, somewhat dehydrated, bruised and with many other voices calling out around them.
Those are qualities found in every leader. These adults go on to other pursuits with a very clear sense of self and purpose helping them to meet the various challenges and rise as high as their other attributes allow in those fields.
Rugby is also designed to be relatively safe to play. We do not allow tackling or actions which are calculated to injure. Though it is rough, bones and skin occasionally will be broken, it still is a place to test a young persons willingness to put his body on the line and come to the realisation that pain is temporary and bearable.
The above argument is understood by many other leaders. It is why Union is expanding throughout the globe and finds sponsors amongst those seeking executives and team builders.
Being entertained is ephemeral, extracts money from the punters and is soon forgotten by the majority. Being prepared for life at the sharp end lasts a lifetime.
So before you try to insist this is an attack on the NRL, AFL et al, reflect on the above.
Union has become professional unwillingly: it took some serious human frailties in the home counties, a panic attack in the southern hemisphere for it to occur.
The founding raison d’etre for league was to compensate injured players who played rugby. Had our early administrators not been so short-sighted we would not be having these tedious code wars.
Rugby union can, and does, co-exist with all other sports. We know we add value to those who join us – that altruistic goal is our biggest strength.
We would like to be more popular but as most would readily admit, rugby is better as a player than as an observer, that is precisely as it should be.
There will always be some who do not ‘get’ other sports, yours truly included, but my lack of appreciation for basketball, soccer, league and Aussie Rules does not mean I dislike them.
I just don’t enjoy them, so I don’t bother to watch.
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August 27th 2012 @ 8:39am
Johnno said | August 27th 2012 @ 8:39am | Report comment
-You to be honest are the exact reasons why i fear for rugby’s future in this country. You display the old amateur attitude to the game almost elitist attitude, saying only almost smart peole like rugby or the upper class private school people. Such a wrong attitude.
-And your lack of desire to chase the billions and big tv deals concerns me to. Rugby is supposed to be entertaining just as 5 day test cricket was entertaining, and test cricket did entertain the masses once, and so should rugby we need to be seen as an entertainment product to stay commercially viable otherwise we will go down an amateur direction.
-And to quote your article
“We would like to be more popular but as most would readily admit, rugby is better as a player than as an observer, that is precisely as it should be.”
-Not true at all many fans would rather watch than play me included. it is physical game and tough on the body as are all contact sports, id rather watch or coach rugby than play it.
-And that quote you almost seem happy to concede defeat in the code war only have a few gentleman playing rugby than the masses$$$ who also bring in the dollars.
-And as you talk about the home unions a lot, it was the home unions who didn’t even want to have a world cup, just 5 nations and play a few SH nations eg NZ,Aust,Sth africa, occaisoanly the upper classes of argentina or the PI nations for colonial amusment.
-An article of why i think rugby is in trouble in OZ, and i went to one of those snotty nosed private schools, who whilst was good in someways, also had many problems about it in it;s culture and it’s attitude to rugby was one, even though it loved rugby it had an attitude problem very similar to a fellow ex private school boy John Oneil a lot of JON’s attitude to rugby regrettably came out in my private school too, and we played JON’s ex private school joeys.
August 27th 2012 @ 7:29pm
amband said | August 27th 2012 @ 7:29pm | Report comment
rugby is the old school tie. The Wallabies are living proof of it
August 27th 2012 @ 8:43am
steve said | August 27th 2012 @ 8:43am | Report comment
Can we just start one anyway please.
August 27th 2012 @ 8:44am
David said | August 27th 2012 @ 8:44am | Report comment
Rugby code wars are mindless
Cmon everyone loves a codewar. You would by lying if you said you didnt. The articles that end in code wars are the articles that have the most comments on them. It gives everyone a chance to passionly defend their rugby code of choice and convince everyone their sport is the greatest and that the other rugby code is dying a slow death.
I doubt any other two sports have so much rivalry and hateridge between them.
August 27th 2012 @ 6:06pm
Steve said | August 27th 2012 @ 6:06pm | Report comment
Agreed- Sixo-clock would definitely be lying if he said he didn’t love a code war: he’d be lying if he said this article isn’t actively trying to start a code war: the gist seems to be…
‘Unlike Rugby, League is a razzle-dazzle, technically simple form of TV entertainment- of course RUGBY would never lower itself to such standards, but who are we to deny the value of light, mindless entertainment. Keep the pie chomping bogans happy, and let us keep developing young minds and bodies. We accept that we are less popular with ‘the public’, but we won’t sacrifice our ideals for the devil’s bargain. What could there possibly be to argue about?’
This article could actually have been written by a League fan to showcase everything detestable about the rah-rah attitude.
I agree code wars are pointless: don’t attack League fans because you can’t play the game you claim to love
It isn’t our fault New Zealand humiliated you beyond redemption. If you put as much effort into attacking them, you might get somewhere.
Yes, it must be galling to realise that the NRL Kangaroos could have taken the Wallabies’ place last Saturday, been told to play by Union rules, and still put in a more competitive performance., but it isn’t anything to do with League.
Heck, the NRL is even taking All Blacks away from the side to make things easier for you
August 27th 2012 @ 7:31pm
amband said | August 27th 2012 @ 7:31pm | Report comment
we need a few Kangaroos to come over
August 27th 2012 @ 7:39pm
garth said | August 27th 2012 @ 7:39pm | Report comment
No you don’t, they won’t understand the game. Virtually every league player to switch to rugby has failed to make the transition, the exceptions being Brad Thorn & 1 or 2 backs.
August 27th 2012 @ 7:50pm
amband said | August 27th 2012 @ 7:50pm | Report comment
I don’t subscribe to that theory. There are dozens of league blokes in NRL now that have some to a lot of prior rugby experience
August 27th 2012 @ 8:12pm
Leo said | August 27th 2012 @ 8:12pm | Report comment
The All Blacks will smash the Kangaroos and will be even more embarrass. There no rugby team better in Australia than the Wallabies or league team than the Kangaroos.
Which All Blacks rugby players have the NRL taken?
August 27th 2012 @ 9:29pm
Steve said | August 27th 2012 @ 9:29pm | Report comment
Oh, I dare say the All Blacks would win by a handy margin over the Kangaroos in a Union rules game- no doubt there, I just have a feeling the Kangaroos would score more points than the Wallabies-
after all, they could hardly score less.
August 27th 2012 @ 9:42pm
amband said | August 27th 2012 @ 9:42pm | Report comment
actually I was referring to Kangaroos transferred to Union. The more the better
August 27th 2012 @ 9:47pm
David said | August 27th 2012 @ 9:47pm | Report comment
Ofcourse the All Blacks would smash the Kangaroos in union. The Kangaroos would smash the All Blacks in league. I am not sure why we are discussing this.
August 27th 2012 @ 10:17pm
Steve said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:17pm | Report comment
Hi David: it was a hypothetical- The All Blacks would thrash the Kangaroos at Union, but not as badly as they thrashed the Wallabies, because the Kangaroos are at least familiar with the concept of actively scoring points, and the concept of actually putting a bit of effort in.
The relevance of this to the original article was that Sixoclock claims Rugby is a game for players, not spectators, but Lord knows it didn’t look like the Wallaby players were very interested in the game on Saturday.
August 27th 2012 @ 10:22pm
Steve said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:22pm | Report comment
Just to frame this debate in a sensible light, you could have had a game of ‘Roger Federer vs the All Blacks’, in which he was allowed to run around the pitch trying to serve Rugby Balls through the uprights, and he wouldn’t actually score any fewer points than the Wallabies did.
August 27th 2012 @ 10:38pm
Leo said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:38pm | Report comment
Steve, the All blacks will destroy the Kangaroos and beat the Wallabies. Stop trying to bring all sort of excuses in. The Wallabies aren’t firing and the All Blacks are been themselves.
August 27th 2012 @ 9:39pm
amband said | August 27th 2012 @ 9:39pm | Report comment
the NRL doesn’t need ABs
August 27th 2012 @ 10:51pm
amband said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:51pm | Report comment
Leo and Steve, it is not league playing a Union side, I said kangaroos shouldn’t transfer over to Union to improve the ” bloodstock “
August 27th 2012 @ 9:02am
Titus said | August 27th 2012 @ 9:02am | Report comment
Since moving to the north shore I have be able to watch kids doing rugby training and kids doing football training. The rugby training consists of push ups, jogging and going through the motions of a backline movement, the football training consists of a few dribbling drills then a game.
Your belief that rugby is the winter code that is played for fun seems wishful thinking to me. To me it looks like the kids are playing rugby because they go to private school and the game and their training is a continuation of their institutionalisation. The football kids look like they are having fun.
The kids and the wallabies don’t seem to be thinking or having fun.
My suggestion to rugby Australia is to ditch Deans and install Campese.
August 27th 2012 @ 1:28pm
Sledgeandhammer said | August 27th 2012 @ 1:28pm | Report comment
Funny you say that Titus, I think the coaching of all football codes at the junior level is poor, but particulary soccer. I live on the lower North Shore and regularly jog around an oval where the soccer juniors train. A lot of time is spent on poorly constructed drills in which most of the kids stand around watching while one or two boys take shots at goal. In the more organised sessions the kids get yelled at by the more ‘serious’ coaches, whose drills involve full participation, but the atmoshere is anything but fun. In fact one of the reasons I stopped player soccer is the tedium of the training drills. Likewise I tried to get my son to play soccer, but he was turned off by the pressure. so many parents think their son will be the next Maradona. Rugby can also be tedius at training, although methods have improved a lot since I was growing up.
August 27th 2012 @ 6:14pm
Lorry said | August 27th 2012 @ 6:14pm | Report comment
As I wrote in a Roar article once, Campese = Maradonna
Sadly, he is not seen as that by most Aussies…
It’s interesting 6 o’clock what you say about union being different to League in the reasons it’s played… That’s very true.
I am reading the Aust classic, ‘the glass canoe’ right now, and it talks about how even pubs (in this case, The fictional Southern Cross, somewhere in the western suburbs of Sydney), used to have a rugby league team and play in local comps.
Maybe a league fan could tell me, but these micro-local teams seems to have disappeared… While the game of league has got bigger at the top level (although national expansion has proved difficult…), is it now played less socially than in the past?
And what about union? Has that largely remained the same in terms of numbers playing socially since the 60s/70s?
I was at the Newtown Jets game last mate with my friend who loves league and he made the point that if those guys havent had a crack at the nrl by age 28 or something, they usuallly give up on playing altogether cos its too tough and not worth the meagre lower grade financial reward…
In all my discussions with Americans, it seems that American football is almost never played socially (full contact)… The focus, even at high school, is only on the elite levels – there are only ever 1 junior and 1 senior team, and if you’re not good enough, you miss out.
This is sad… I hope Union doesn’t go this way. Is league going this way?
August 27th 2012 @ 7:45pm
garth said | August 27th 2012 @ 7:45pm | Report comment
I have never pictured campeze as a cheating, drug using showpony. “Hand of God” goal = blind referee.
August 28th 2012 @ 4:42am
Bob Anderson said | August 28th 2012 @ 4:42am | Report comment
Young people don’t play sports as much today because they sit on their butts at the computer, play video games, or watch TV. Adults are the same way. Laziness perhaps or more likely too many easier distractions in other things. Just getting people to exercise these days is a problem.
As for American football, its never been widely played in the US in an organized fashion outside of high school and university levels. There’s plenty of other sports that don’t require all the equipment.
August 27th 2012 @ 7:32pm
amband said | August 27th 2012 @ 7:32pm | Report comment
Campese! LOL LOL
August 27th 2012 @ 9:39am
tc said | August 27th 2012 @ 9:39am | Report comment
There was a code war on here the other day that got about 350 responces ,of course I didn’t enjoy it (not)
August 27th 2012 @ 9:41am
Bakkies said | August 27th 2012 @ 9:41am | Report comment
Titus, yes you have to have fun but people need to get results. Even in kids Rugby it’s demoralising if you are playing in or coaching a team that is losing regularly you eventually lose interest. You will be lying if you didn’t and it’s the wrong attitude to give up or not try when you are losing a few matches (you see this in teams and coaches in kids Rugby too. When adults stop caring the kids pick up on that real quick). I am not a fan of kids running laps and doing push ups. I only use push ups as a punishment if they are mucking around (for this reason it doesn’t happen that often) and short runs for warms up. You might as well be coaching athletics if you resort to that at kids training. Rugby training has to be stimulating for kids (no different to adults) and allow them to speak for themselves. They get more out of it in terms of enjoyment.
”For a start, league has become a made-for-television product with all the marketing, hoopla and jazz, ”
Bingo.
Most of the time I only hear Rugby is an entertainment product from Australians. The thing is it is a game. You get some bad games amongst the good ones no different to any other sport. There are bucket loads of dull soccer games but people turn up for the next match and the one after because they love the sport and their team no matter what. Sure league got it’s billion dollar contract people need to remember their previous contract was almost half that and isn’t influenced by international market prices like Sanzar’s. Sanzar’s tv contract value last time it was negotiated a couple of years ago was in the height of the global recession. Exchange rate fluctuations are there too. Sanzar’s deal is largely pay tv. People forget that the AFL and NRL contracts also have a huge contribution from FTA along with Foxsports (the AFL deal includes internet too). In all three Sanzar countries FTA contributes little to the overall deal so it’s obviously going to be short of the billion next time around (Argentina will contribute if they become a full member). There is more to it than you think when it comes to the value of the tv deal. Sanzar’s deal is effected by international markets and the NRL’s is only Australian oriented really. Australia is still not in a recession which helps its value.
August 27th 2012 @ 9:43am
JVGO said | August 27th 2012 @ 9:43am | Report comment
So as long as you have played in the 15D’s at Joeys or Riverview or Scots you are equipped for life? Slightly simplistic I’d suggest. But maybe like countless other things, including alternative sporting activities or educational institutions even, it doesn’t hurt
August 27th 2012 @ 10:09am
Rabbitz said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:09am | Report comment
Rugby code wars are mindless. And boring.
So is people mindlessly listing their “team selection”.
Unfortunately this is what it has come to. “Conversation as a blood sport”.
Curiously, at the Roar gathering none of angst and bile seemed to be present – it is marvellous how polite and well spoken folks are when they are face to face…
August 27th 2012 @ 10:13am
Jock M said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:13am | Report comment
Modern Rugby differs little from League through Law changes which have destroyed competition for the ball at the breakdown.
League-stand up after tackle and play the ball between legs-one or two hands.Tackler must let go.
Rugby-go to ground in the tackle and push ball back with one or two hands.Tackler must roll away.
August 27th 2012 @ 10:13am
Dasher said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:13am | Report comment
Aussie Rules and NRL will dominate the Australian TV market because they are Australian products that can be tailored perfectly to the Australian audience. Rugby is an internationally-controlled game and no matter how much we whinge, we are only one of many countries playing it and the rules won’t change just for us.
August 27th 2012 @ 10:50am
Mals said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:50am | Report comment
Well said!
August 27th 2012 @ 11:24am
cos789 said | August 27th 2012 @ 11:24am | Report comment
There is something wrong with the rules of Union though. Soccer has a single set of rules yet has mass appeal across boarders.
Rugby Union seems to focus on the international game, but dominate nowhere but New Zealand. Union is aiming for wide global appeal, yet still falls short in most markets.
Just an observation, but its too easy to brush ones problems asside and blame it on the public / other sports.
August 27th 2012 @ 6:28pm
Bakkies said | August 27th 2012 @ 6:28pm | Report comment
Rugby has a single set of laws too (apart from when the ELVs were trialled). I hate when people call the game ”Union” the name is Rugby..
”Rugby is an internationally-controlled game and no matter how much we whinge, we are only one of many countries playing it and the rules won’t change just for us.”
Exactly and I don’t know how many times I have said that.
August 27th 2012 @ 8:16pm
Leo said | August 27th 2012 @ 8:16pm | Report comment
Rugby union goals are not to be the dominate sport in any countries but a major sport play and enjoy by players and fans.
August 28th 2012 @ 8:38am
The Bush said | August 28th 2012 @ 8:38am | Report comment
“but dominate nowhere but New Zealand”
They may not be large places, but I think you’ll find that Tonga, Samoa, Fiji and probably a few other islands have Rugby as their national sport. On a national level the game is also very close to Welsh hearts. If you travel to the south-west of France you’ll find a hell of a lot of passionate Rugby fans, whilst there are many English towns that have top-flight Rugby teams, but no top-flight Football teams (Bath comes to mind).
There is nothing wrong with the rules of Rugby Union; the sport is growing just fine elsewhere in the world. If anything is “wrong” (and it isn’t), I would say it is Australian’s preference for their “own” games. Remember, Rugby’s not the only “world” game trying to crack the national psyche – anyone remember Basketball (and let’s not mention Football)?
August 28th 2012 @ 1:35pm
cos789 said | August 28th 2012 @ 1:35pm | Report comment
But as i said, basketball and soccer are huge in a lot of foreign markets, and they are here due to their shear size overseas – whereas Union struggles to be second or third string in most countries its played in, and Australia is ranked 2nd in the world!
Soccer/Basketball are “internationally controlled sports” as Dasher would have it. Yet they are top tier sports in most markets.
The international standard rules can not be blamed for Rugby Unions troubles in Australia. What I’m saying is there is something inherrantly “wrong” with Union in Australia that its market share is shrinking.
Mark Ella said as much today.
August 28th 2012 @ 8:13pm
A said | August 28th 2012 @ 8:13pm | Report comment
All of a sudden league gets a new TV deal (more or less the same as the last one) and people are jumping up and down in ecstasy about it. Just happens that the Wallabies bomb a couple of tests at the same time. Union just got a new deal recently and they will reap a windfall from the Lions tour next year. Ignoring all the provocative and unfounded statements in these columns (from league and AFL tragics) and despite all the recency affects of the media Union will always have a foothold in the market and will probably fluctuate like all other codes. Its becoming more apparent that kids are both playing league and union more so – and so they should in terms of developing the required skills in order to become an aspiring sportsmen. If professionals want to chase the dollars they could easily follow the pathway to Japan and Europe who will always have bigger pockets than us. If you like your football its in everyones best interest to get behind both codes, forget the stigma of being a private school kid or likewise a bogan from the west – you will learn to appreciate both codes all the more.
August 27th 2012 @ 11:31am
JVGO said | August 27th 2012 @ 11:31am | Report comment
Yes unfortunately for RU it has to fight with one hand tied behind its back in either direction. It will take a lot of ingenuity for RU to remain competitive on both the domestic and international fronts.
August 27th 2012 @ 8:17pm
Leo said | August 27th 2012 @ 8:17pm | Report comment
Which rugby union are you talking about? The sport or rugby in Australia?
August 27th 2012 @ 10:21pm
JVGO said | August 27th 2012 @ 10:21pm | Report comment
In Oz specifically, I think it is in a tricky competitive position for player numbers and as the poster says they are not in control of the rules they play under either.
August 28th 2012 @ 6:06am
Leo said | August 28th 2012 @ 6:06am | Report comment
Well thank god for that JVGO. I wouldn’t want the NH to have one ref while in Super rugby they have two like they do in rugby league. I’m happy with the way the IRB looks after rugby for the fans and the 5 million who play it. Its not the rules that is the problem in Australia its the way the sport is run by the ARU and the performance of the Wallabies. The rules were pretty much almost the same now and back then when John Eales and George Gregan were captains of the Wallabies and the sport was at its highest point ever.