USADA and Armstrong have questions to answer
By johnhunt92, 29 Aug 2012 johnhunt92 is a Roar Guru
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- Cycling, Floyd Landis, Lance Armstrong, Tour de France, USADA
Lance Armstrong has both energised and tarnished US Cycling - can it continue to grow? (AP Photo/Franck Prevel, File)
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When I first saw Lance Armstrong gave up his fight on drugs charges, there was only one sentence I could think: gee, this is dodgy on both sides.
I still to this day do not believe that Armstrong is a drug cheat and that his seven Tour De France titles were the result of a hard work ethic and not the result of illicit substances.
However, you have to wonder what Armstrong was thinking in giving up his fight with the USADA?
Surely if he is that clean and that sure of his innocence, he would fight this tooth or nail to keep his reputation untainted.
Even Floyd Landis, the drug cheat who has been the most vocal in accusing Armstrong of doping, fought harder to preserve his soiled reputation.
While Armstrong’s decision to stop the fight will not automatically destroy his legacy, it leaves huge questions over it.
But the USADA’s handling of this has been abysmal and leaves room for questions over its motives in targeting Armstrong.
Of the witnesses who have come forward claiming to have “seen” Armstrong doping, most of them are convicted drug cheats who for years tried to fight the charges against themselves.
How can these types of people be trusted to provide credible and valid evidence when they have proven to unreliable witnesses in the past?
No reasonable court in the western world would convict Armstrong based on the “hearsay” of proven liars.
Even the US District Court, while supporting the USADA’s ability to conduct an investigation, raised concerns about the motives.
Judge Sam Sparks in his judgment wrote: “USADA’s conduct raises serious questions about whether its real interest in charging Armstrong is to combat doping, or if it is acting according to less noble motives.”
For supposedly trying to clear the air, this has been a trial that has had no openness or transparency.
And who at the USADA thinks they have the power to strip Armstrong of his cycling titles?
I cannot remember the last time doping police had the ability to do strip people of titles.
While Travis Tygart may think he can police any sport he feels like, this egomaniac administrator does not have that authority.
Only the UCI can strip the titles of Armstrong and they are in no rush to investigate because the USADA will not cooperate with cycling’s governing body.
God only knows where Tygart was when the BALCO scandal was around?
Knowing the way he works, Melinda Gainsford-Taylor would have been subjected to a humiliating investigation while Marion Jones managed to avoid sanction.
This McCarthy-like witch-hunt will go on and opinions between people will remain ferociously divided.
But I would like to remind you of why Armstrong should be given the benefit of the doubt.
Between the USADA’s Gestapo investigation, the UCI, French authorities (a country which was desperate to catch Armstrong), the US Government and WADA, not one positive sample has been recovered.
Even with the advancements of drug detection combined with the eight-year rule, there are still no positive tests to be found.
That should be the ultimate yardstick when investigating any form of doping.
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August 29th 2012 @ 3:53am
sjposton said | August 29th 2012 @ 3:53am | Report comment
Wake up man! Stop denying realty.
August 29th 2012 @ 4:06am
sjposton said | August 29th 2012 @ 4:06am | Report comment
“Denying reality” I should have said.
August 29th 2012 @ 6:02am
greylag said | August 29th 2012 @ 6:02am | Report comment
I presume you mean Tygart ?
August 29th 2012 @ 6:12am
Rudi Coetzee said | August 29th 2012 @ 6:12am | Report comment
Hearsay from a bunch of already proven positive criminals? Is this all they’ve got against Amstrong.
We have been following his outstanding career over many years. He got us into it year after year.
Every year samples were taken. No one at the time could point him out to test positive. Who the hell are these idiots to think so now – hearsay. Go take a flier USADA. Rather come out and say you don’t like his attitude or something else or he was “nasty” to you and you will get him back.
He remains one of the best sportsman I have ever seen in action year after year – not just a single performance!
Stop wasting your country’s taxpayers money!
Rudi Coetzee – Cycling supporter (South Africa)
August 29th 2012 @ 6:51am
Rudi Coetzee said | August 29th 2012 @ 6:51am | Report comment
Furthermore they claim to be a “non-profit, non-governmental funded organisation? Let them prove this.
Maybe it’s time that they should be investigated?
August 30th 2012 @ 7:22pm
sittingbison said | August 30th 2012 @ 7:22pm | Report comment
Rudi, who would these “proven positive criminals” be? There has been ZERO evidence made available to either Armstrong or the general public. Including the identity of more than 13 witnesses.
August 29th 2012 @ 6:38am
Welshbloke said | August 29th 2012 @ 6:38am | Report comment
You really need to wake up and smell the coffee.
The soigneur who never noticed saddled sores when he produced a back dated prescription for saddle sores when he failed a corticosteriod test. The tests on his samples once they had developed EPO tests.
The fact that speeds up mountain passes are now 10% slower than in Lance’s time….not even Usain Bolt is 10% faster than his rivals, nor Chris Hoy, or Bradley Wiggins etc etc, so we believe “clean” Lance could keep up with the dopers?
Also that George Hincapie his trusted friend and team mate was allegedly prepared to testify against him.
There’s too much circumstantial evidence, too many eye witnesses and so on.
Lance just got caught in the end.
August 29th 2012 @ 6:58am
Rudi Coetzee said | August 29th 2012 @ 6:58am | Report comment
Once again hearsay. Anyway how can you find someone guilty if a possible “crime” was committed before a law was in place for such a “crime”? Wow, then half the worlds sportmen and business leaders will go down. While you at it, dig up the dead and do the same.
August 29th 2012 @ 7:47am
Tim Renowden said | August 29th 2012 @ 7:47am | Report comment
EPO was always illegal, they just hadn’t managed to invent a test for it until 2000.
Same for blood transfusions.
August 29th 2012 @ 8:40pm
SkinnyKid said | August 29th 2012 @ 8:40pm | Report comment
Marion Jones passed 186 drug tests before a criminal case found her guilty…..coffee is ready.
August 30th 2012 @ 7:24pm
sittingbison said | August 30th 2012 @ 7:24pm | Report comment
probably not a great idea to mention the dead Rudi, as in 1992 alone there were more than 20 deaths due to EPO of Dutch competitive cyclists.
August 29th 2012 @ 7:43am
Dan said | August 29th 2012 @ 7:43am | Report comment
What says it all is that the case would have been open to the public and to the media……
If it was so rigged and one sided, why not expose it all to the World?
If there was only hearsay why not expose it to the world.
If there was no evidence why not expose it to the world.
August 29th 2012 @ 7:47am
ArkieGurl said | August 29th 2012 @ 7:47am | Report comment
“Even Floyd Landis, the drug cheat who has been the most vocal in accusing Armstrong of doping, fought harder to preserve his soiled reputation.”- not so. Lance has been fighting allegations since 1999 off and on. Not to mention he just finished a two year investigation. This isn’t the first time he’s expressed he’s tired of fighting this game. Just this time he’s actually done. It’s real said USADA need to come up with some evidence or admit they just like taking down big names.
August 29th 2012 @ 4:26pm
Jimbo said | August 29th 2012 @ 4:26pm | Report comment
The case isn’t just against Armstrong, they are also prosecuting his old team manager Johan Bruyneel, team doctors including the infamous Michele Ferrari, and one of the team trainers. Bruyneel at least has elected to take his case to arbitration, hence why the evidence cannot be released yet, as it is still part of an active investigation.
August 30th 2012 @ 7:29pm
sittingbison said | August 30th 2012 @ 7:29pm | Report comment
Arkie, Floyd went through USADA arbitration, was found guilty, then went through CAS, also found guilty. He lost all his money plus $500k of fraudulently obtained donations (which he has just been ordered to pay back.
Armstrong has never once faced prosecution until now.
Prior to saying he felt tired and did not want to arbitrate, he spent a month in Federal court arguing on several grounds for an injunction and that UCI should hear the case?
Never mind, all will be revealed in the fullness of time
August 29th 2012 @ 8:10am
sjposton said | August 29th 2012 @ 8:10am | Report comment
Either he cheated or he didn’t. Any other athlete that was confronted with the allegations and the evidence that we know so far would be laughed out of the room if he continued to stonewall and profess his innocence. Only Lance Armstrong and a few other “media made-men” can get away with this kind of smoke screen. “I quit because this thing is giving me a headache” is essential Armstrong’s current position. Make no mistake; this is a well-coordinated and well planned attempt to muddy the waters. I would be surprised if phone calls to certain “journalists” weren’t made and if many of these articles weren’t already in the can waiting for this moment. I don’t “know” that he is guilty any more than any of you “know” that he is innocent. That is not the point of this discussion. I “believe” he is guilty based on the minimal evidence that is out there and his behavior. The last thing in the world an innocent man with Lance’s resources would do would be to give up the fight, especially now. This was it! This would have been the “Lance Armstrong is clean Superbowl”. If he had gone in there and crushed the USADA case, he was done. Nobody could ever question or touch him again. If I was innocent I would be looking forward to that opportunity. That is the reason why I “believe” (don’t know) he is guilty. So why is it specifically that you “believe” that he is innocent? Again, 500 or 1000 test won’t detect blood transfusions or HGH, so witness testimony would be the only available evidence. Most of what I’m hearing from Armstrong apologists is self-righteous indignation and not a lot in the way of logic and critical thinking.
August 30th 2012 @ 6:03pm
SkinnyKid said | August 30th 2012 @ 6:03pm | Report comment
sjposton, very very well said.
It episodes like this, and the blind faith/naivety shown by his fans, that makes you understand how religion became so popular.
September 1st 2012 @ 3:16pm
Kev said | September 1st 2012 @ 3:16pm | Report comment
I have no idea who to believe. USADA haven’t scored a slam dunk on this case but Armstrong hasn’t done himself any favours by refusing to fight these allegations on the basis that he has done it for years and never been proven guilty and that USADA don’t have jurisdiction.
If he hasn’t been doping then why have doping allegations followed him for the best part of 20 years? The first question is probably the easier one to answer given that dopers are always in a war to stay ahead of the testers but the second one is harder. What sort of vendetta could motivate this relentless pursuit to nail him?
The only conclusion I can fathom is that there has always been enough evidence to arouse suspicion but never enough to nail him. Other than that I’m as confused as anyone else.
August 29th 2012 @ 9:47am
jack said | August 29th 2012 @ 9:47am | Report comment
So confused by this whole matter. Both pro and anti Armstrong camps come out with conflicting “facts”. Lance tested positive? He didn’t test positive? USADA has no authority to strip him of his titles? USADA has the authority to do so? He has been banned for life? He hasn’t been banned…. etc etc. Where do they get their information? You can’t all be right !!! Think I will wait till Lance says “yes I did It” or for the outcome of the lengthy court case and then possibly the appeal. Still, enjoy reading the opinions of contributors, subjective as they are.
August 29th 2012 @ 9:51am
adamg said | August 29th 2012 @ 9:51am | Report comment
The USADA are legally empowered to make this judgement. Armstrong is still entitled to take the matter to court but he must demonstrate lack of due process.
He gave up because he was guilty as hell and that dragging out the process would have revealed to everyone the depth and duplicity of his cheating. This way he can pretend he’s the victim of an injustice and can keep exploiting his mythology, and it appears to be working if you’re any indication.
August 29th 2012 @ 10:33am
FrancisC said | August 29th 2012 @ 10:33am | Report comment
I agree adamg… if he is not ‘guilty’ then FIGHT IT!!! Don’t ever give up!!! Funny how he says it that he never tested positive. Of course he will not test positive – didn’t they mention “blood transfusion”? Once that is done of course results will be clear and free of drugs. I heard it on the radio the other day that he has prior notice hours or days before testing is done that someone from the inside is alerting him of the fact.
AGAIN, if he says that he is not ‘GUILTY’, FIGHT it! Let it all out in the open! I sure hell will do that if I was accused and I am not ‘guilty’ and will fight it even if it will cost my life. I’d rather have my family know that I have fought a good fight to clear my name and that in itself will attest of my integrity.
August 29th 2012 @ 12:23pm
jack said | August 29th 2012 @ 12:23pm | Report comment
Adam. You may be quite right in what you say. He may be as “guilty as hell”. I DON”T KNOW. Just because I don’t jump in and kick him in the head like others, doesn’t mean that I am under some mythological influence. I am simply saying that “experts” from both camps can’t agree on who has the authority to do what. Therefore as I said before, I’ll wait. Too many times have I seen the bloody obvious ending up being incorrect. I can’t help it if I look at things objectively, but it is the better method.
August 29th 2012 @ 10:11am
Justin Curran said | August 29th 2012 @ 10:11am | Report comment
You can’t be serious? Gee, there are so many holes in your argument, I don’t even know where to start. I presume you are just trawling for comments. Where do you get your information? Yahoo answers?