Rugby struggles with its superstars
By Elisha Pearce, 3 Oct 2012 Elisha Pearce is a Roar Guru & Live Blogger
- Tagged:
- David Campese, James OConnor, Quade Cooper, rugby, Rugby Union
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Recent events have crystallised a particular thought in my mind: rugby union culture doesn’t fully understand how to guide, promote and maintain superstars.
Quade Cooper is only the most recent example of this. You could probably look in the direction of Kurtley Beale and James O’Connor as well to see the way rugby handles its stars.
Watch other sports around the world and see the difference in star management. They operate in a way that makes the most of the superstar drawing potential without exploding in a cloud of controversy or resorting to passive aggressive pot shots.
The NBA has Kobe Bryant (the talented villain), LeBron James (the lovable, naive villain – somewhat similar to Quade Cooper in terms of media savvy) and Kevin Durant (the all-American hard working star, like Richie McCaw in terms of dead-bat work in public).
Only two years ago LeBron was the most hated athlete in the USA for his poorly handled free-agent decision. It was admittedly horrible and cast a bad light in a number of ways, as such he could have easily been consigned to the too hard to handle basket, but he still enjoys the support of the league. The NBA makes the most of their marketable, talented stars.
An example in the recent history of rugby is The Roar’s own David Campese – a prime case of the rugby fraternity not knowing quite how to handle a superstar.
He is outspoken, sure of himself and not afraid to tell it how he sees it. It doesn’t have to be a bad thing that a well known, talented player is willing to open their mouth and answer questions.
For Campese, unfortunately, this two-sided coin has loomed over him well after his playing career. It has lead to one of Australia’s most marketable, prominent and talented players spending a lot of his time away from the roots of the Australian game.
Don’t misread what happened on Fox Sports recently; Cooper wasn’t only answering the questions the interviewers posed, he was trying to answer questions posed by the public. His, possibly naive, natural bent is to play for the fans and to enjoy fan support.
In a world where sport has at least one leg firmly planted in the ‘entertainment’ category, O’Connor is derided for wanting to expand his ‘brand’.
Without only trying to play devil’s advocate, I would say that he has perhaps worked out something faster than the rugby fraternity has. O’Connor clearly stands out within rugby because he has those ambitions. That is a problem in itself.
Rugby struggles to maintain its brand, let alone any ambition of expanding it. Because of this O’Connor receives “how dare you?” from all parties for making the most of his opportunity.
As we currently see in the world of media – where the feel of paper in the fingertips is becoming less viable – old institutions need to adapt and learn how to conduct business in the 21st century.
The obvious dove-tail for this argument is to look at the NRL and see how they promote stars and the way it builds the game.
Like rugby union, forwards regularly decide the outcome of matches, at least to a point. But it is the showmanship of players like Morris twins, Glen Stewart, Billy Slater, Greg Inglis and most recently Ben Barba that drive viewership and headlines.
This strategy isn’t without its faults, but rugby needs to find a way to embrace this further.
The last time the NSW Waratahs were forced to handle genuine super star expectations they didn’t exactly come out with the sun shining on them; fans (me) included. Kurtley Beale was rushed into a Super Rugby side at a very young age. He was plumped up as a saviour and played some remarkable rugby.
As teams worked him out and the inevitable period of needing to expand his repertoire took hold, he was derided in the media, by fans (by rugby). Eventually he moved on. In a short career for the Wallabies and Rebels he has already had as many game-breaking performances in a jersey that is not Waratahs-blue.
It should be noted that the Queensland Reds may have begun to walk this path. Off the field they have made changes and the fans have reciprocated the arrangement. Memberships haven’t been higher in a long, long time – if ever – at Suncorp.
It is often shouted from the rooftops that the Reds averaged higher attendance rates last year than the Brisbane Broncos. The caveat would be that it is across fewer games, but the achievement is still noteworthy.
I don’t have any doubts that the Reds management would attribute a lot of the up-tick to winning (it certainly helps) but would not discount the influence of star players in the trend.
The most memorable faces on the Reds team are Cooper, Will Genia, Digby Ioane and James Horwill (every team needs it’s Richie McCaw/Cameron Smith/Stirling Mortlock).
I would submit that between their obvious on-field performance and the placement of their images off the field, it is not an accident on the management’s account that they are the most memorable personalities.
Given all the general distaste for social media in rugby circles it is interesting to note that Ewen McKenzie has allowed Cooper and others to continue using twitter and other platforms to a certain degree even on game day.
Cooper has admitted that he would be happy to continue playing in Queensland. There has to be something to this feeling. After Cooper’s outburst the Queensland office was quick to distance themselves from the claims but at the same time support (read: not defend) him as a player.
On top of that I think give the relative strength he brings to the Reds, on and off the field, the ARU would still recoup the investment made in their part of his contract allowing him to continue playing there – even if not with the Wallabies.
I might be just another naive youngster, similar to the players themselves, who hasn’t really earned the right to try and have this discussion. People of a certain age may want to take my opinions with a grain of salt. After all, I am young enough that a portion of my iPod playlist does include rap music.
Understand that this isn’t an attempt to portion the blame in any particular way. I don’t have access to enough information to even begin to do this. The rugby states, ARU, clubs, media and fans all have a say in the perception and understanding of the game and the place within that framework for legitimate stars.
I do believe an open discussion around these issues could help rugby move towards a healthy state where high profile players are in the best position to continue to attract new fans to the game.
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October 3rd 2012 @ 3:10am
kingplaymaker said | October 3rd 2012 @ 3:10am | Report comment
In my mind Cooper’s an egomaniac brat who needs whipping rather than managing, but the artice is an interesting discussion of the clash between players who are bigger than the game and how to handle them.
Perhaps one way is to use the stick more with the managers more who sow ghastly seeds in their heads.
October 3rd 2012 @ 5:24am
mania said | October 3rd 2012 @ 5:24am | Report comment
u cant blame nasser for qc. nasser is a business man and negotiator. he’s not qc’s nanny
October 3rd 2012 @ 10:39am
NickF said | October 3rd 2012 @ 10:39am | Report comment
Nasser is not a business man, he is an entrepreneur who is interested in get the most money out of his client and clients employer, to the point of burnout. It’s all about short term gain not players welfare. Nasser is a repeat offender and most rugby league glubs won’t deal with him anymore.
October 3rd 2012 @ 1:34pm
peterlala said | October 3rd 2012 @ 1:34pm | Report comment
That’s true.
October 3rd 2012 @ 4:03am
Bazza All Black said | October 3rd 2012 @ 4:03am | Report comment
Perhaps it is a cultural thing.
n NZ we have a natural bent to modesty as opposed to our Ocker cousins (who i often describe as the “armericans” of the pacific).
Our culture, teams and media (public) tend to expect and pressure players to be more like Richie and Dan than Quade (SBW is the exception that proves the rule).
My point is that each country may need a different approach, but agree Western Culture is quick to anoint a hero then vilify him for not being consistently great.
In NZ we generally have a sense of bewilderment about people who want to be famous…
October 3rd 2012 @ 5:13am
moaman said | October 3rd 2012 @ 5:13am | Report comment
Bazza-I think you are onto something but there is more to it than that and you know it. Our “natural bent to modesty” often manifests itself as ‘false modesty’ and walks hand-in-hand with the ‘Tall Poppy Syndrome’ which is decidedly unhealthy.
Elisha–Great piece!
” After all, I am young enough that a portion of my iPod playlist does include rap music. ” I am possibly (probably) triple your age but my itunes library also has some rap-and some classical! (Have you heard Killer Mike’s R.A.P.Music???) You don’t have to be a certain age to enjoy music—just like you don’t need to sport a Jesse McCartney hair-style and watch yourself on the big screen to be a ‘superstar’
The piece is damned-well written and thought-provoking.One thing that springs to mind for me is the comparison of type that are homogeneously lumped together as “superstars”. Here in NZ eg Carter & McCaw are recognised by many as such.Personaly i would compare them with Australians such as Eales,Mortlock& Gregan but none of the current crop. But that is just me.
October 3rd 2012 @ 7:52am
Elisha Pearce said | October 3rd 2012 @ 7:52am | Report comment
Haha I have heard Killer Mike Moaman. Not too bad. This disgraceful song from Korea thats gone viral recently has a sound track (definitely not vocals) with a lot of early 90s rap/hip hop influence in it. We are at the point where lifecycles of culture are getting smaller and smaller and repeat more regularly.
Thanks for the compliment on the piece too. Appreciate it. It’s a hard series of thoughts to articulate. You’re right that Eales, Mortlock and Gregan (probably in the middle actually, not as clear cut) are more like McCaw and Carter as the ‘statesman’ type stars. Nothing wrong with that. Horwill is a mini version of that for the Reds atm.
What I’m getting at though is the more mercurial type stars. There are numbers of them and they have the capacity to capture the imagination of the public. Rugby has almost hidden from this type of scenario and I’ve tried to point out a few reasons why. No blame on one particular party. I think fans are part of the blame, if there is any.
October 6th 2012 @ 8:02am
Trevor DeAngelo said | October 6th 2012 @ 8:02am | Report comment
Elisha this was one of the best articles i have read on the roar. Have to agree with the Kiwis about the cultural differences in our countries ‘superstars’. Big personalities are often less tolerated in NZ as they are in Australia. You are expected to be humble – especially the further south you go. Carlos Spencer was treated very my like cooper across the ditch – a very polarising star of the sport. You either loved him or hated him for his on field of of field antics. Both are very free spirited. I whole-heartedly agree with you that these union marque players are not branded and managed here in Aus. One of my League friends often says – where are the stars of Union, where are the big personalities in Union? They are there but they are not branded to the general public. League in general really works at displaying the brands of the star players – even the controversial ones.
October 3rd 2012 @ 2:42pm
Nickdalurker said | October 3rd 2012 @ 2:42pm | Report comment
Never thought in all my days to see Killer Mike’s ‘RAP Music’ repped on the ROAR. Nice one, and great album.
October 3rd 2012 @ 7:47am
Elisha Pearce said | October 3rd 2012 @ 7:47am | Report comment
You probably have a point there BAB. I can’t fully comment on the NZ culture, but my Dad is from there and I’ve got cousins that live there atm so I can have a little go. I get the feeling the NZ is a little more reserved- but thats outwardly. NZ’ers tend to love the quiet intelligence. It’s really valued. Nothing wrong with that.
October 3rd 2012 @ 9:01am
El Gamba said | October 3rd 2012 @ 9:01am | Report comment
Come on Bazza, that’s a little much.
It’s as easy for me to point at a John Eales, James Horwill, David Pocock, AAC, Pat McCabe etc etc etc….
…then point at Zac Guildford, SBW (as you did), Ma’a Nonu (Remember the hand bag incident) etc and use that to argue that NZ rugby is full of ratbags.
I actually think that culturally NZ and Australia are relatively similar (although I do sometimes refer to New Zealand as the Mexico of the Pacific).
Completely agree with “Western Culture is quick to anoint a hero then vilify him for not being consistently great.”
October 3rd 2012 @ 1:47pm
colvin said | October 3rd 2012 @ 1:47pm | Report comment
El
Don’t blame Ma’a for the hand bag incident.
It was Tana Umaga who wacked Chris Masoe sufficently hard with a handbag to cause Chris to burst into tears.
Once again proving to the world how gentle and sensitive we Kiwi rugby people really are and that the tough, uncompromising but humble exterior is just a smokescreen.
You Aus don’t know how lucky you are having such a kindly humble people living right next to you, providing you with daily examples of humility for your population to admire and copy.
October 3rd 2012 @ 1:52pm
Jutsie said | October 3rd 2012 @ 1:52pm | Report comment
hahahaha, love it. But we can blame nonu for being a pioneer of the metrosexual look amongst rugby players. Remember the eye-liner?
October 3rd 2012 @ 2:04pm
jeznez said | October 3rd 2012 @ 2:04pm | Report comment
Too true Colvin. As Jutsie notes, let’s just remember Ma’a for the mascara shall we? And we need to remember the beads in the hair as well. Very pretty.
October 3rd 2012 @ 10:19pm
Gravity Basher said | October 3rd 2012 @ 10:19pm | Report comment
i liked the rastifarian look he went with on the weekend.
a shout out to Usain Bolt?
October 3rd 2012 @ 9:05am
rl said | October 3rd 2012 @ 9:05am | Report comment
Bazza, you have absolutely NFI. What a ridculous generalisation. ‘Tall poppy syndrome’ is common to both NZ and Aus, we Aussies relish in bringing big heads back to earth. Why do you think the likes of Mundine & QC (BTW – isn’t he a kiwi?) receive so much attention here? Why do you think JOC copped so much stick for his ‘brand’ statements? They are outliers, not the norm. Save me the effort and go give yourself a massive uppercut.
October 3rd 2012 @ 12:24pm
Jiggles said | October 3rd 2012 @ 12:24pm | Report comment
I love the irony of Kiwi’s telling us how humble they are.
I suspect, however, that they are to stup*d to get it thought.
October 3rd 2012 @ 12:32pm
Jerry said | October 3rd 2012 @ 12:32pm | Report comment
We are, however, smart enough to use apostrophes properly and spell ‘though’ correctly.
October 3rd 2012 @ 1:33pm
Jutsie said | October 3rd 2012 @ 1:33pm | Report comment
Also it should be “too” not “to”
October 3rd 2012 @ 1:48pm
Jiggles said | October 3rd 2012 @ 1:48pm | Report comment
Haha yeah I realized that as soon as I posted.
Good to see the humility in action
October 3rd 2012 @ 2:08pm
Jerry said | October 3rd 2012 @ 2:08pm | Report comment
It’s a proven fact that Kiwis are the most humble people in the world (per capita).
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:21pm
Sircoolalot said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:21pm | Report comment
When it comes to rugby though you are the worst in the world.
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:59pm
Jiggles said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:59pm | Report comment
haha a Kiwi I used to play rugby with said something along those lines once.
October 6th 2012 @ 8:04am
Trevor DeAngelo said | October 6th 2012 @ 8:04am | Report comment
Haha classic
October 3rd 2012 @ 12:38pm
Bring Back the Bears said | October 3rd 2012 @ 12:38pm | Report comment
While there may be something in that Bazza, Quade Cooper was born in NZ and raised there until he was 13! Are you implying his last 11 years in Oz have corrupted him? Time to dust off the old psychology spectacles and revive the nature vs nurture debate.
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:50pm
Bear said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:50pm | Report comment
are you sure he was raised in New Zealand until he was 13?
October 4th 2012 @ 1:32pm
NickF said | October 4th 2012 @ 1:32pm | Report comment
“Americans of the Pacific”! That’s terrific. You must always be the first invited to parties with that wit.
October 6th 2012 @ 8:15am
JVGO said | October 6th 2012 @ 8:15am | Report comment
I would have thought the Americans were the Americans of the pacific, and the Kiwis are the scots of the pacific.
October 3rd 2012 @ 4:21am
Sailosi said | October 3rd 2012 @ 4:21am | Report comment
Rugby doesn’t have superstars. The NBA, MLB, NFL, tennis, Indian cricket and soccer have superstars. Rugby has had one Jonah Lomu. The word superstar gets thrown around too much, especially in Australia.
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October 3rd 2012 @ 7:40am
The Grafter said | October 3rd 2012 @ 7:40am | Report comment
Here here…..
October 3rd 2012 @ 7:56am
Elisha Pearce said | October 3rd 2012 @ 7:56am | Report comment
It possibly gets thrown around too much. Depends on what you mean by ‘too much’. Why do you think it’s too much?
Also, I’d agree with you but say that I’m having this talk relative to rugby. In Australia Cooper, JOC, Beale, Ioane and a few others are stars. Rocky Elsom was another one I thought about covering too. Relative to rugby he was a star for a while. Its just interesting to see how the rugby community over so many others seem to baulk at the idea so much.
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:39am
Ralph said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:39am | Report comment
Too much because it’s used in circumstances where it isn’t true.
October 3rd 2012 @ 10:30pm
Gravity Basher said | October 3rd 2012 @ 10:30pm | Report comment
I think the definition of a superstar would be someone who was famous in the USA. Americans invented fame so they kind of write the rules.
That aside, I think what you define a superstar and a medium star is an aside argument in the context of this discussion.
A point Elisha eludes to, I think, is the game needs people like James O’Conner and Quade Cooper because they attract outside markets into the game, and ‘keep the kids out of the movies’.
God Bless SBW.
But an interesting article. I think I agree with you. (All except your comment above about Rocky Elsom being any good. He came back a broken man. Rubbish!. Better than me though, it must be said.)
October 3rd 2012 @ 5:09am
richard said | October 3rd 2012 @ 5:09am | Report comment
re Elisha; “ru doesn’t know how to promote superstars’ – there are two problems with this statement : -
1) you may apply this to oz rugby, but I don’t think it applies to any other union, and
2) this superstar culture that exists in oz rugby, where players are blown up by the local media to be better than they really are.
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:02am
Elisha Pearce said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:02am | Report comment
You’re right that it applies mostly to Australia. Sorry, should have made that more apparent. I was trying to do my best to articulate my thoughts on my break.
The media probably does blow people up a bit more than their abilities. But quite often they are on the money when it comes to picking the right personalities.
Just a quick thought about overseas – people like Chabal in France are a fun example of stars (definitely inflated beyond playing value, but a fun personality).
Chris Ashton is one that has caught the imagination of fans in England, whether for good or bad, but has displayed flair on the field. Dallaglio and Martin Johnson were probably stars that captured peoples imagination. Certainly Wilkinson was too.
October 3rd 2012 @ 5:34am
Stanley grella said | October 3rd 2012 @ 5:34am | Report comment
I enjoyed the article but think you may have made the mistake of confusing star making with media coverage.
Is not that rugby can’t maintain stars, it’s that stars in rugby don’t get the coverage (especially in Australia) that there NRL/AFL counterparts do. With no free to air coverage of matches nor “footy shows” to show there personality the scope for actually creating a star off field is quite small.
Rugby produces some fantastic athletes and personalities, it’s getting people to know them that’s the problem.
The problems with JOCs brand was never that he was aware of it nor that he pursues it but that he was happy to say in front of team mates and officials that had poured money and time into his development and needed him that he was doing what was best for his money making ability. Maybe it’s the next generation of professionalism, but at least don’t tell your tea, mates that your bank account is more important than them. Lie if you have to.
I would argue that the Tahs, although rushing kurtley due to injury and need have done fantastic by Kurt’s. The guy needed a lot of help with off field problems, I don’t want to go into them but needless to say kurtley may not be in rugby today without the help of a lot of people at the Tahs who gave there own time to help him. Last year he played out of his skin, was considered one of the top two fullbacks in the world and led a completely injury depleted Tahs side to the finals. I would say this year dispute 2-3 performances has been a let down littered with off field incidents.
As for Quade, he is the tip of an iceberg that has nothing to do with management of deans or the ARu or anyone in between. Quade has fired the first shot in the war for control. It’s QLD v rugby and Quade was to stupid to keep his mouth shut and his thumbs still.
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:05am
Elisha Pearce said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:05am | Report comment
“Rugby produces some fantastic athletes and personalities, it’s getting people to know them that’s the problem.” – Agree with this statement mate. Love that. I would really like to get to know more of the rugby personalities out there. Especially some in the current Wallabies such as Will Genia, AAC, even what it’s like for Mike Harris atm.
Your first point about media coverage isn’t a mistake I’ve made I dont think. Obviously star power and media coverage exist relatively close to each other. And I see no real reason not to embrace it a little more. I know what you’re getting at though, the pump up and let down cycle. That part is a struggle.
Ask any young kids about the future of our game (you’ll have to find ones that know it exists first probably) and they’ll point out the JOC, Ioane, Genia etc. Thats why I think this conversation needs to be had in the context of the future of the game and the aim to widen the supporter base.
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:22am
Leo said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:22am | Report comment
Australian rugby stars are more well known and appreciate overseas than in Australia and league stars are world famous in NSW & QLD.
October 3rd 2012 @ 12:45pm
GWS said | October 3rd 2012 @ 12:45pm | Report comment
That’s the best I’ve heard it put
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:16am
Blue Blood said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:16am | Report comment
Stanley I agree with your comments regarding the 3 untouchables.
In general I find that the fast tracking of youth with amazing talent has often (not always eg Pocock) led to an attitude change that has not been cohesive for a team sport. Back in the day younger, new players in a squad used to get on the team bus last to make sure they didn’t accidentally sit in an established players seat. They went through the club rugby ranks and then worked their way into a Super squad. These days they go straight from school to Super rugby. Now you have The Brand telling senior players in team meetings to shut up before telling the room how it is. Back in the day the senior players would have pulled such players into line. Now they try and the punks complain through their manager to team management. They walk around like entitled superstars. Being a true sports star means being super on and off the feild not only in the eyes of your fans and the media, but most importantly of all, in the eyes of your team mates. You can be brand aware, be a smart business person and still be a humble team mate. I think the 3 untouchables have forgotten the later. Rugby will have stars. But it is still a team sport and no one is bigger than that. Go play golf or tennis if you want the egocentric path. I think they are being mismanaged, but I think they need more tough love and discipline so they don’t grow up to be such schmucks. Without good family, friends and management in the current environment it feeds a star who believes they own press and it is distastful.
Great thought evoking read and a hard topic to write about. Well done Elisha.
October 3rd 2012 @ 9:21am
rl said | October 3rd 2012 @ 9:21am | Report comment
Agreed Stanley, although I think it should read ‘Rebels’ for Kurtley, yes? Also, I think JOC has pulled his head in considerably since ‘brand’ and the RWC sleep-in, and credit should again go to the Rebs management, but also (hopefully) JOC himself is growing up.
QC – well, you’d have to think the Reds have done a great job managing him, but I’m increasingly harbouring the suspicion that the Reds “family environment” has just sheltered him further from the reality of rugby (or any team sport for that matter) at the highest level. FFS, imagine if Knuckles was still coach of the Wallabies. QC would be out the door with a size 10 up his backside. And if he’s considering joining SBW next year, well incoming Sydney Roosters coach Trent Robinson (a former strength & conditioning coach) is apparently no shrinking violet either.
October 3rd 2012 @ 3:52pm
Blue Blood said | October 3rd 2012 @ 3:52pm | Report comment
I question that OConnor has improved. He has been a regular on the booze all season and while injured. It was also senior Rebell players that he told to shut up in a meeting (a mate is in the admin and told me). I’d suggest he has a long way to go.
I agree that Quade likely gets cushioned at the Reds. And many of them have super star attitudes. Just watch them walk around the streets.
October 3rd 2012 @ 5:41am
krisl of Utah said | October 3rd 2012 @ 5:41am | Report comment
the only “Superstars” in the current wallabies are Genia and Ioane….. the rest mentioned in this article are not superstars rather they are still finding their way there…..
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:07am
Elisha Pearce said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:07am | Report comment
You are probably right there KoU. Not at the peak of their powers, or influence. We hope!
October 3rd 2012 @ 5:55am
darwin stubby said | October 3rd 2012 @ 5:55am | Report comment
are any of those rugby players mentioned actually superstars ?? …. McCaw, Campese etc are without doubt greats of the game – but globally rugby really isn’t that large a deal – as someone above has mentioned Lomu is probably the only player to transcend the sport – which puts him in the same league as as the Jordan, Beckham etc …
but the likes of Cooper, JOC, Beale are nothing more than overhyped flawed players that have been given a gravy train ride into being big fish in a very small pond too early into their careers … managing these guys is probably to late – pandering to them and others before has lead to the situation Aust rugby finds itself in now … the only learning experience would be to learn from it and try and ensure it doesn’t happen again
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:27am
stillmissit said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:27am | Report comment
TRue Darwin – The problem is that Gen ? will do whatever is good for them regardless of the damage they cause to those around them. They are even more selfish than the baby boomers I am a part of and maybe we schooled them in self-interest and they have taken it to a new level the rest of us are not comfortable with? There is nothing you can do as an old style manager you need a manager who is likewise self-interested and if they don’t add to the managers $$$$$’s then p them off and find someone who will. It is a colder world dominated by self-interest and that is possibly where Robbie Deans is coming unstuck – they don’t understand anyone who is not like them totally narcissistic and self-interested.
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:32am
mania said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:32am | Report comment
stillmissit – i dont subscribe to this gen y. i’m gen x but similar thigs were said about us in my lifetime. i have a daughter who has all the attributes of gen y but thats more conincidence than a clear category. i have nieces and kids i coach who dont show gen y attributes and are hard workers and caring conciencious people.
no generation should expect to understand the generation before and after their own.
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:39am
stillmissit said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:39am | Report comment
True mania and that is what gives Q and Nasser their opportunity the majority are caring decent people, it is the propensity within the group and that was the same for Boomers, we were disliked (for good reasons as it turned out) by our parents generation.
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:46am
mania said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:46am | Report comment
sorry stillmissit i dont understand the boomer comments. my parents were boomers and they were hard workers. all the btching i’ve heard about boomers has been from genY not realising the times the boomers had to go thru and all the hard work they put in. genY tend to sterotype the boomers as the haves and themseleves as the have nots.
but u profess to be a boomer yet do u agree with the genY?
October 3rd 2012 @ 7:00am
stillmissit said | October 3rd 2012 @ 7:00am | Report comment
Yes we worked hard but nothing like our parents who felt they were building a better world than the war torn one they came through. We had it easier due to circumstances but mainly their vision and planning which we are still living off today ie snowy mountains scheme, builiding infrastructure to last 50 years etc etc
The tragedy is that any dying gen cannot understand the ones that follow and I am no exception to that. This is all madness to me! QC is the pinnacle of screaming self interest which even a boomer jags against.
October 5th 2012 @ 12:36pm
Harryonthecoast said | October 5th 2012 @ 12:36pm | Report comment
I read somewhere recently that the Titans on the Gold Coast were told to take a leaf out of the Sydney Swans “playbook” and don’t employ “Any More Dickheads”. Any chance of the ARU adopting this?
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:20am
stillmissit said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:20am | Report comment
INteresting article and offers a different view on how Quades Made. I think this all stems from Mohamed Ali and has been slowly building from there. The idea is you talk yourself up and then have to live up to the hype which makes expectations about you higher. We are all herding animals and we look up to and in a strange way fear those (read pay more) that stand out from the herd.
Now there are many sports people who try this and don’t make it, SBW is one who is making it. Quade Cooper has no defence on the field and therefore is a flawed genius, will he make it? Who knows, but one thing is for sure he won’t be in rugby in 12 months time, his manager wants more money and exposure from him and he won’t get that in rugby. See you Q – not sorry to see a perp leave the game and a gutless one at that.
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:28am
mania said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:28am | Report comment
stillmissit – i reckon even khoder is shaking his head at qc’s comments. nasser is a business man and an awesome negotiator but even must be regretting having qc in his stable. khodder is not to blame for qc and mundine have big mouths
Mohamed Ali was a special warrior and champion. initially he shot his mouth off to hide how scared he was as a young cassiusClay, as time went on he learnt to use it as a psychological weapon. i do agree that many have since tried to emulate it but 99.9999999 out of a 100 fail.
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:34am
peeeko said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:34am | Report comment
exactly, i blame mundines influence on coopers behaviour. they are wannabe Ali’s
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:34am
stillmissit said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:34am | Report comment
Mania – I wonder about Khoder’s influence in this as many are saying it is a standard tactic of his negotiation style that he gets the ‘talent’ to drop something controversial and distract those he is negotiating with, delay and ignore is another of his tactics which takes it to the edge with the ‘talent’ talking up offers in other directions. Simple really but effective if you want to hold the player and he can find or at least give a credible lie that there are offers in other sports. It is this cross sport negotiation that gives him the upper hand. Cooper is just another pawn in the game.
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:38am
mania said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:38am | Report comment
stillmissit i dont think khoder is the boogey man that everyone is making him out to be. you could be right but what i see is an awesome agent who goes hard out for his client. if i were a pro sports person i’d have khodder as my agent. he is as u say very effective.
cooper i reckon is fking this perfectly without any help from khodder
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:40am
stillmissit said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:40am | Report comment
HOpe your right mania doesn’t look like that to me…..
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:47am
mania said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:47am | Report comment
haha so we’re both saying that the other is possibly right. i like arguing with gentlemen. u get all the facts across without any of the bs
October 3rd 2012 @ 7:02am
stillmissit said | October 3rd 2012 @ 7:02am | Report comment
Mania – getting emotional kills logic and Nasser knows it.
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:33am
mania said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:33am | Report comment
a very very handy weakness that the great Ali exploited. cant blame nasser for using clever tactics but i still dont think he would’ve told qc to go tweet your idiocy
October 3rd 2012 @ 2:50pm
garth said | October 3rd 2012 @ 2:50pm | Report comment
Also, Ali really was as good as he thought he was, Cooper & co.? Not even close.
October 3rd 2012 @ 6:50am
The Mountain said | October 3rd 2012 @ 6:50am | Report comment
I think you are giving Quade way too much credit. You obviously haven’t spoken too him or know anyone that works with him. There is silence in his head, with a desert type environment and tumbleweed blowing across the plains of emptiness.
He was not trying to answer questions for the public. Quade thinks of one person and one person only. Himself.
He should do his talking on the field first and then learn how to be effective in a positive way off it.
Why everyone gets caught up here in the media thinking he is brilliant because he can do a flick pass behind his back is beyond me.
The All Blacks and the New Zealand public see Quade as a weakness and they attack him and it works.
Being a five-eight you are the General of the team. You are a leader. You make the most important decisions consistently throughout a game. He is a terrible General.
He is also a confidence player. Put him in front of a packed Suncorp Stadium who are cheering him on and you watch his flick passes galore and he play alright. Put him in New Zealand where he is being booed and attacked, he drops balls, kicks out on the full and falls to pieces. He could learn a lot from Pocock and Genia on how to handle himself.
All of his comments contradict himself. He is a spoilt brat and an idiot and has much to learn. That is all.
October 3rd 2012 @ 7:15am
jutsie said | October 3rd 2012 @ 7:15am | Report comment
Great article Elisha, I think alot of the old fashioned supporters don’t know how to deal with the new breed of “superstars” (although I’m not sure that’s the right term) either.
I don’t have an issue with the attention seeking marketing stunts and social media promoting (although it does make me cringe sometimes especially oconnors hair lol) as long as they still adhere to the team ethos.
For me qc didn’t adhere to the team ethos on this occasion and when he had a chance to retract he refused to and went further. But ur right he has got to this stage because he has not been managed properly from the beginning.
October 3rd 2012 @ 8:12am
Elisha Pearce said | October 3rd 2012 @ 8:12am | Report comment
It’s not just management though, it is Justie? It’s more than that. It seems like its a history and a culture that doesn’t accept it quite as well.
October 3rd 2012 @ 9:00am
Jutsie said | October 3rd 2012 @ 9:00am | Report comment
Yes good point Elisha, we probably hold onto this culture and attitude because we still havent fully moved from an amateur sport into the professional era.