ARU must move mountains for Smith
Roar Rookie By Worlds Biggest, 19 Mar 2013 Worlds Biggest is a Roar Rookie
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Last Saturday night at Canberra Stadium saw the Brumbies visit another heavy defeat on big brother, the return of the great George Smith and David Pocock suffer a season-ending injury.
When I heard Pocock was injured I feared the worst, he has suffered his share over the years, however this was the most devastating.
Pocock was going to be selected as Wallabies captain and have a huge influence on the Lions series. He is one of the few Wallabies revered and feared in the northern hemisphere.
His biggest attribute is his strength, he is a beast at the breakdown and you can count on two or three pilfers and the same number of penalties for his team each game. He is now an experienced campaigner too, he will be sorely missed.
Which brings us to his replacements – Michael Hooper, Liam Gill and possibly George Smith.
The young guns are great prospects but are they ready to take on the mighty and punishing Lions pack? In my opinion they aren’t there yet, I would have one of them in the 22 but not both.
The man we must have in the back-row is George Smith – be it at number 6,7 or 8.
The back-row is looking vulnerable without Pocock, Wycliff Palu currently injured and the inability to find an adequate 6.
Smith provides much needed experience, toughness and leadership that will be required to beat the Lions – not to mention a sound game!
I realise there is the small issue of Smith being on loan from Suntory and currently, as an overseas player, is not eligible for Wallaby selection.
But as Nick Farr-Jones often says, “Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!”
Translation: the ARU must move mountains to secure Smith for the Lions series.
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March 19th 2013 @ 6:28am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 6:28am | Report comment
i hope smith isnt eligible. too much disrespect from roarers for smiths skills. the guys a legend and imo has surpassed eales as the epitome of greatest aussie rugby player.
March 19th 2013 @ 7:17am
Red Kev said | March 19th 2013 @ 7:17am | Report comment
Smith is the only guy who can realistically challenge McCaw as a complete rugby player in my humble opinion. That said I don’t expect the ARU to changr its stance, they might if Deans asks, but he won’t not after dropping all those years ago and not when he has a chance to claim “discovery” of Hooper and Gill.
March 19th 2013 @ 7:20am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 7:20am | Report comment
agree RK – smith is the greatest aus has ever produced. i cant see deans wanting smith which is a real shame to world rugby.
March 19th 2013 @ 11:28am
Rob from Brumby Country said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:28am | Report comment
I always felt that McCaw was the only rugby player who could realistically challenge Smith
Might be a bit of Brumbies bias there, but there is no doubt that they are both great rugby players. Both would be among the top five players their country has ever fielded.
March 19th 2013 @ 11:30am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:30am | Report comment
nah not bias rob. but i would say the best their country has ever fielded.
March 19th 2013 @ 1:50pm
Hightackle said | March 19th 2013 @ 1:50pm | Report comment
Geez you guys talk some BS.
Big ol nasty Deans doesnt want Smith becuz he is not a fav and Deans wants to claim discovering Hooper and Gill????
I know who wants to claim things without any basis and thats you guys, not Deans.
Would be nice if instead of making up reasons to hate Deans you stayed here in the real world.
March 19th 2013 @ 5:13pm
Red Kev said | March 19th 2013 @ 5:13pm | Report comment
“The Real World” now an internet comment thread!
March 19th 2013 @ 7:29am
Simon_Sez said | March 19th 2013 @ 7:29am | Report comment
Mania, maybe its time to take the blinkers of mate! George Smith, as a 110 test veteran has earned the right to play his rugby anywhere in the world and still be eligible for the Wallabies. The current rules are silly excluding veteran Wallabies from being eligible to play for the Wallabies because they wish to play overseas. George Smith is one of those players who has earned that right and it is fair and reasonable for him to expect he can play. The challengers for the No.7 should have to beat George Smith for the position, if they are good enough. This will have the effect of keeping a high standard of value of the Wallabies jerseys by keeping veterans in the selection mix. The current rule, in my opinion, is also an illegal restraint of trade and would not withstand a concerted legal challenge, if the players decided to mount a challenge against the ARU.
March 19th 2013 @ 7:51am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 7:51am | Report comment
hey i agree simon – part of me doesnt want smith back, a small part. i’d be creating the yoke for my own back if i managed to influence someone who has a say in whether smith makes it in or not. he’s a great player and def deserves to retain his jersey.
however i’m all for the eligibility rule that players must be domestic to get selected. the long term ramifications of relaxing this rule is having a setup like manuSamoa who never consistently have the same team at differing tournaments.
March 19th 2013 @ 6:50am
Who Needs Melon said | March 19th 2013 @ 6:50am | Report comment
I don’t remember him playing 8 much but jeez he looked comfortable at the back of the scrum. Not sure about the Wallabies starting side but he’d make a super sub. I assume the definition of an ‘overseas player’ is one with an active overseas contract. Simple solution would seem to be for someone (ARU/Brumbies) to pay out his Japanese contract and extend his Australian one. Is that not possible?
March 19th 2013 @ 6:54am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 6:54am | Report comment
melon – need to ask deans 1st whether he’d have smith in his squad. somehow i doubt as smith isnt part of deans favourites.
or maybe thats wishful thinking on my part.
now if he were a kiwi i’d be advocating getting him straight into the AB’s. but with aus i’m hoping lack of foresight and plain ol stupidity will see smith miss wearing green n gold this season.
March 19th 2013 @ 1:41pm
Hightackle said | March 19th 2013 @ 1:41pm | Report comment
We really need to stop making things up.
This “favs” thing is made up by fans and I would love to know whos in it. I would guess Robinson but its just not true.
March 19th 2013 @ 7:23am
nickoldschool said | March 19th 2013 @ 7:23am | Report comment
Considering the Lions will have backrowers like Warburton, Robshaw, Tipuric, O’brien, Morgan, Faletau, Wood etc to choose from, I think the wallabies need an experienced guy like Smith. As good as they are, Gill or Hooper, and even Dennis and Mowen, need some guidance, on and off the field, for tests and mid-week games. Palu and Higginbotham do bring something but GS would add some extra confidence to the group.
I think that if the ARU and Deans really want him for the series, there will be no issue with Suntory. definitely worth buying the couple of months he would miss.
March 19th 2013 @ 1:43pm
Hightackle said | March 19th 2013 @ 1:43pm | Report comment
Australia would have to change policy or Suntory release him.
No real issues?
March 19th 2013 @ 2:27pm
nickoldschool said | March 19th 2013 @ 2:27pm | Report comment
No. ARU have to change or amend their OWN policies, how’s that difficult!? They don’t need a IRB referendum or to consult others, it’s their own matter.
Suntory aren’t stupid: if they get a financial compensation they won’t oppose to Smith leaving. They wouldn’t keep one of their highest paid players if he doesn’t want to stay.
March 19th 2013 @ 7:41am
richard said | March 19th 2013 @ 7:41am | Report comment
Interesting that G.Smith is being looked at for the Lions series.Frankly,it’s an excellent idea,as the WB’s are going to need some wise old heads v the BIL.
With Red Kev and Mania here- he is the closest Australia have had to the complete player.I would put Smith in the same bracket as McCaw and Michael Jones,and I can’t give higher praise than that.One of the true greats of the game.
March 19th 2013 @ 7:53am
ilikedahoodoogurusingha said | March 19th 2013 @ 7:53am | Report comment
After the injury to Pocock, I wouldn’t be surprised if The Brumbies management are working behind the scenes to hang on to George until the end of the season. This would involve altering both his Brums and Suntory contracts in terms of when they come into effect…..that could make him eligible. Don’t forget his coach at Suntory is Eddie Jones, ex-brumbies man. What would be better for Suntory, Smith having pre season training with the squad, or good hard match time in Super Rugby and the Lions series? Risk of injury aside, the latter option looks best on paper.
March 19th 2013 @ 1:32pm
Crockycrocky said | March 19th 2013 @ 1:32pm | Report comment
Eddie will still have influence at Suntory but is no longer their coach. At any stage George has the option of accepting a contract here and turning down his Suntory one. He only has a couple of years left playing rugby though so am sure whatever pays the most will be his choice!
March 19th 2013 @ 7:57am
Pollock said | March 19th 2013 @ 7:57am | Report comment
It makes sense he covers 6,7 & 8 and is far and away one of the best back rows around. For the ARU and Deans not to do all they can to make him available for selection shows they couldn’t care if Aust win against Lions. Time for them to stand up and do their job of getting the best possible wallaby team on the park.
March 19th 2013 @ 8:40am
Mikecantab said | March 19th 2013 @ 8:40am | Report comment
As a kiwi, I have nothing but respect for this guy.
March 19th 2013 @ 8:52am
sixo_clock said | March 19th 2013 @ 8:52am | Report comment
As a George Smith fan my heart says do anything to get him into the squad, BUT.
Isn’t this the perrenial problem of hanging on to the promise of the past and ignoring the careers of others? We have to continually balance the squad with enthusiasm and experience. To replace GS will be impossible; he is almost indestructible, what would have injured others became an 45 second icepack for him (which he hid in his dreads).
Hooper is energetic, quick, accurate, can run, sharp; Gill is big, tough and a poofteenth of a second behind him; both see themselves as forwards. We need a current lock to step up/back into the 8 role and the front runner is McMeniman (imho) but time will tell. On the bench we have impact players like Higgers who are not as enthusiastic around the breakdown but after the 50th minute the ruck gets sloppy anyway.
We would do well with the mighty GS but I would suspect it is time for others to entertain him now, and they are ready.
March 19th 2013 @ 11:55am
Simon_sez said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:55am | Report comment
I agree sixo_clock, Hooper and Gill are ready and having the stars like Smith standing in the way can be frustrating for the younger players. There is also beauty when the veterans, whether based overseas or not, can play for the Wallabies, because it forces a higher standard from a younger player to win a place on the team. If you are good enough you will get picked. The problem Australia has had is that some of the veterans who choose to play overseas and no longer eligible for selection, cause the Wallabies to lose their experience and talent, lowering the value of the jersey and resulting in erratic Wallaby performances.
March 19th 2013 @ 8:25pm
Malo said | March 19th 2013 @ 8:25pm | Report comment
Hooper and Gill are not ready alone against the roar of the lions, like QC they will go to water without some tough old heads such as GS, I would just keep the brumbie back row as work well as a unit. Look at the Reds and tahs they are not exactly killing the breakdown. Can afford either or Gill or Hooper but not both.
March 19th 2013 @ 9:11am
The Battered Slav said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:11am | Report comment
This needs to happen. Pollock’s right, he can cover the whole backrow so comfortably and hasn’t looked off the pace even since strolling back into the fastest comp in the world after playing rugby lite in Japan.
Even if he’s just cover on the bench against the Lions, he’s the best cover possible, offering insurance over all three backrow spots. The only issue would be the lack of lineout option should he come on at 6 or 8, however this could be worked around easily enough.
It seems pretty unanimous, which is rather rare on the roar.
Are there any naysayers out there at all that don’t want to see Smith recalled for the Lions? Anyone?
March 19th 2013 @ 9:14am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:14am | Report comment
KPM’s a naysayer
March 19th 2013 @ 9:19am
Red Kev said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:19am | Report comment
I don’t. But only because I want to see the Wallabies flogged and Deans run out of the country.
March 19th 2013 @ 9:21am
kingplaymaker said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:21am | Report comment
Wow such venom and hatred.
What a savage personal attack.
March 19th 2013 @ 9:32am
Red Kev said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:32am | Report comment
You think that is venom and hatred? You lead a very sheltered existence.
March 19th 2013 @ 9:33am
kingplaymaker said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:33am | Report comment
I don’t know but I’d say wanting to run him out of the country amounts to hatred.
March 19th 2013 @ 10:29am
The Battered Slav said | March 19th 2013 @ 10:29am | Report comment
I don’t care whether he;s in the country or not, I just don’t want him coaching the Wallabies any more.
March 19th 2013 @ 10:35am
kingplaymaker said | March 19th 2013 @ 10:35am | Report comment
TBS I was referring to RK’s post, not yours.
March 19th 2013 @ 3:18pm
Jiggles said | March 19th 2013 @ 3:18pm | Report comment
Says he who attacks Foley at every chance….
March 19th 2013 @ 12:18pm
JB said | March 19th 2013 @ 12:18pm | Report comment
Just leave mate – we don’t need or want that negativity anywhere near the game. I hear Rugby League’s looking for whingers.
March 19th 2013 @ 9:34am
Rebel said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:34am | Report comment
I’m fine with him being recalled against the Lions, just not against the ABs. Maybe they can pick Jarrod Saffey for these games. In all seriousness, seeing the way George played against the Tahs was a great reminder of how good he is, pilfered, great tackles, running and ball play. Most complete display by a seven I have seen for a while, it would actually be good to see him resume acquaintances with Sir Richie.
March 19th 2013 @ 9:21am
kingplaymaker said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:21am | Report comment
Yes.
Everyone thinks Smith is the player he was years ago, forgetting his limited final year when he was supplanted by Pocock.
His play for the Brumbies has been fine, but not amazing as the nostalgia-trippers dream.
He has an opportunity now to prove that he is as good as he once was, or somewhere near it, given that one of the three main 7s is out of action.
So if he plays as well as he did then sure bring him back into contention, but unless he does that then he shouldn’t be selected on gushing sentiment.
The thing to watch out for is turnovers. How many can he make. Because that will be key.
March 19th 2013 @ 9:26am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:26am | Report comment
KPM – u must be the one prophesised to bring balance to the force.
March 19th 2013 @ 10:45am
Riccardo said | March 19th 2013 @ 10:45am | Report comment
Mate, that’s funny!
In Yoda’s drawl: “Balance? Bring stability I fear he will not!”
March 19th 2013 @ 10:53am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 10:53am | Report comment
riccardo – hehehe just taking my kids thru starwars starting from the phantomMenace.
this week end is “a new hope” but gotta get sub woofers for the laptop so you get that total immersion in sound when the star destroyer first comes on screen.
March 19th 2013 @ 11:14am
Riccardo said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:14am | Report comment
Good on ya mate!
My son is already immersed in the ways of the Force.
I remember that opening scene Mania; getting chills down my spine as I write. The whole theatre reverberating to the sound of the Empire Cruiser as it comes across the top of the screen, then buzzing whine of the Empire Tie fighters arouind it. Epic.
My Dad took me to it when I was a young fella and I was absolutely hooked from then on. I saw it 15 times in 2 years!
March 19th 2013 @ 11:23am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:23am | Report comment
Riccardo – yes me too. one of my greatest memories as kid being taken to the movies with my dad. did your audience give a standing ovation at the end? we did
yeah that opening scene just goes thru your bones and sets the tone for the entire movie. i’m hoping i leave my kids with a similar memory that i have of hanging out with my dad.
March 19th 2013 @ 9:29am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 9:29am | Report comment
KPM – u would do gSmith a desservice if all u focus on is turnovers. thats gill and pococks specialty.
u need to watch everything that smith does and tally the total contribution he makes to the team and compare that to the rest of the team.
WB’s need georgeSmith alot more than they need folau.
*ps – i thought folau played really well in the weekend. no dropped bombs
March 19th 2013 @ 10:36am
The Battered Slav said | March 19th 2013 @ 10:36am | Report comment
Absolutely mania.
Judging the quality of a 7 purely by the amount of utnrovers is what you do when you don’t have a complete 7 but want to big him up anyway.
Pocock hasn’t got as many facets to his game as Smith. Smith might not be the groundhog he once was, and is surpassed by Pocock and Gill in that regard, he trumps them both insofar as running, passing, linking and versatility go. Of these qualities he’s lost nothing in the past few years judging by current performance.
Smith to me is like a combination of our three best flankers in Pocock, Gill and Hooper. Each possess their own individual qualities as a 7, but Smith seems to being those qualities together into a complete game.
…and Folau isn’t fit to wipe the p*ss from G Smith’s d*ck, so can we all stop discussing him until he actually shows he can do something other than take a high ball with reasonable security please?.
March 19th 2013 @ 11:13am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:13am | Report comment
agree slav – my comments about folau were directed at KPM
i disagree tho about your line “Smith to me is like a combination of our three best flankers in Pocock, Gill and Hooper.”. smiths better than that. the thing that seperates smith from these 7′s and most players is that smith thinks and then does. pocock, gill and hoopeer are automatons in their roles. not that thats a bad thing, being as relentless as the tide has its place in test rugby, but having a player that can think and come up with ways of undoing the oppn efforts is gold.
March 19th 2013 @ 1:24pm
Sage said | March 19th 2013 @ 1:24pm | Report comment
A lot of man love for Smithy here, me included.
A standout against the Sharks even though i wasn’t looking for him particularly. I think he should be in the WB’s at all costs. Understand the sentiment about new blood and opportunity for the up and comers but George still has it very obviously and a few trots around for the younger guys with him will be invaluable. I agree with the above about him being an amalgam of our current 3best flankers. Jeez he was good to watch on Saturday. Over the ball, his defence and his running in particular. Our best ever i think.
As an aside and something I may be ridiculed for, I personally would like to see Ant Faianga with a number 6 on his back. He is a solid centre whilst not outstanding but his main attributes would serve him very well as a 6 I reckon. He’s wasted where he is and would make an awesome flanker, especially at 6 and we’re blessed with a few good 7′s currently so it makes sense to me.
March 19th 2013 @ 2:59pm
The Battered Slav said | March 19th 2013 @ 2:59pm | Report comment
A Faingaa at 6?
That’s so for out fo left field that it would make KPM blush.
Interesting thought though…
March 19th 2013 @ 3:20pm
Markus said | March 19th 2013 @ 3:20pm | Report comment
The Faingaa’s all seem to have that aggression and defensive technique ideal for a loose forward, but I still think Anthony’s best position is the centres. He may not be a worldbeating centre, but he is a very solid one. With a lack of size for tackle busting and height for lineout jumping, and a strong list of opensides available, I think that solid is all he would be as a flanker, too.
You are probably better off keeping an eye on his younger brother, Colby. Former Aus U20s captain, he is primarily an openside but has plenty of experience at blindside too, especially when partnering Hooper in the backrow during the 2011 IRB U20s cup.
March 19th 2013 @ 4:05pm
jeznez said | March 19th 2013 @ 4:05pm | Report comment
Agree that Colby looks the goods although Smith’s return will see him benched a lot.
Gill is too small for 6 and is two centimetres taller and four kilo heavier than Ant Faingaa. It just isn’t an option – given his pace he could potentially be a 7 but that isn’t an area we are short.
March 19th 2013 @ 4:06pm
jeznez said | March 19th 2013 @ 4:06pm | Report comment
ps Colby is the same height as his big brother but 8 kilograms heavier.
March 19th 2013 @ 4:54pm
Sage said | March 19th 2013 @ 4:54pm | Report comment
He would make a better 7 I agree but we’re pretty OK there as you say Jez. I take your point but they don’t have to fit a cardboard cut out either. Messam is only 2 inches taller but he certainly is carrying more meat around for sure. I’d just like to see him more involved. Maybe he can start practicing some hooking. Saia would love that.
March 19th 2013 @ 5:59pm
jeznez said | March 19th 2013 @ 5:59pm | Report comment
Messam is massive next to these guys:
Anthony Faingaa – 182cm 92kg
Liam Gill – 184cm 96kg
Colby Faingaa – 182cm 100kg
Liam Messam – 190cm 108kg
Agree there isn’t a single cookie cutter you can apply but your 6 needs some size – lets look at some good ones:
Best of the last few years is Jerome Kaino – 196cm 113kg
Best relative new comer is England’s Tom Wood – 195cm 105kg
Australia’s bolter after a long wait Ben Mowen – 195cm 110kg
You just can’t give away 12cm’s and 13-20kgs. You will not contribute at the lineout, scrum or in the heavy exchanges which is where the bread and butter efforts of a 6 come.
March 19th 2013 @ 6:06pm
jeznez said | March 19th 2013 @ 6:06pm | Report comment
And to loop it back to the discussion George Smith is 180cms and 103 kgs
He used to be a surprise secondary option at lineout despite his relative lack of height because he’s such a dynamic and athletic player. The one thing that can’t be escaped though is size – he has 11kg on Ant – you need those kilos in the tight work.
March 19th 2013 @ 3:23pm
Jiggles said | March 19th 2013 @ 3:23pm | Report comment
Gill is far far more than just a Jackel. Anyway I don’t disagree that Smith could add a lot to the Wallabies.
March 19th 2013 @ 10:51am
Rebel said | March 19th 2013 @ 10:51am | Report comment
From memory he had four against the Tahs. Not too many players get that many in a match, so if this is his only perceived weakness, then he is traveling well, especially since he has been away from super rugby. This has nothing to do with nostalgia as I don’t follow the Brumbies or the Wallabies, it is just how I have seen the games in recent times without any sense of allegiance. Just like Hooper impressed me last year, but is off the boil a bit this year. I have no reason to play favourites or go into Aus derby games with preconceived ideas, I just call it as I see it, and I saw class from GS.
March 19th 2013 @ 11:22am
nickoldschool said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:22am | Report comment
Kpm, wouldn’t you select him considering his versatility in the back row? Surely we could do with a ‘utility back rower’? I think most agree with you that GS is probably not the GS that he was 5 years ago….when he was miles ahead of anyone in the country and in the top 3 flankers in the world. It’s still early days but after a couple of games I would say that he has been doing more than ok (wasn’t expecting him to slot in that easily tbh).
With Pocock out now, I would not think twice: versatility, leadership, he would get my vote.
March 19th 2013 @ 11:26am
kingplaymaker said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:26am | Report comment
nos I would really judge it on how he plays. Actually, he has hardly been seen at a decent level for a long time. If he does well over the next few matches then yes, but I would wait to see. He is versatile, he was outstanding, but I would see a few more games before judging how he is this year.
March 19th 2013 @ 11:28am
mania said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:28am | Report comment
KPM – did u see georgeSmiths 1st game back? he was outstanding then and has gotten better. on his performances so far do u think he deserves a jersey?
and do u still think folau is worthy of a call up?
March 19th 2013 @ 11:40am
nickoldschool said | March 19th 2013 @ 11:40am | Report comment
Would agree with you Kpm. Thing is it might take a little while to negotiate with suntory, paperwork etc, dunno. Anyway, would def consider him as an option and get things moving now before it’s too late.
March 19th 2013 @ 8:37pm
Malo said | March 19th 2013 @ 8:37pm | Report comment
Ok KPM you cant be serious gushing sentiment please. Have a look at the Brumbie backrow, the go forward and the protection they provide their backs with good clean clear out. George is getting better each game and is doing a lot more than Gill and Hooper for their teams in terms of pilfering and results. Are you just trying to be different for the sake of it. 4 out of 4 and tonnes of tries so the Brumbies and GS are obviously performing and with GS improving and adapting all the time he will further improve. Toughness is what is required against AB and Lions not a couple of good runs. Pocock was a huge loss the loss of Gill and Hooper would not be as they play the same game. Mowen has earnt his stripes. GS turnovers has already been impressive. The season has started KPM catch up.