Roar Guru
Joined November 2010
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I've been arguing for a long time that Australia and New Zealand need a regular three-match series every fourth year in the vein of…
I'm a big supporter of the Four Nations concept and the more matches Australia, New Zealand and England play against each other and against…
You're never going to have a completely fair NRL draw when teams don't play each other the same amount of times. So the people…
Howdy Davo Smithy, long time no speak! I hear a new NRL salary cap review panel is looking to examine the benefits of a…
Dear Davo Smithy, I for one welcomed recent news that a thorough review of the second tiers is currently in progress. Still, obvious questions…
Dear Davo Smithy, I'm sorry to hear that you're having a rough trot of late. As certain agenda-driven 'journalists' fanatically clean their sniper rifle…
Dear Davo Smithy. Let's talk Sydney stadium rationalisation. Here's what you need to ensure: 1) The stadiums are rectangular not oval. 2) They accommodate…
Dear Davo Smithy. Last week the Rugby League International Federation met in Canberra and proposed that the 2015 World Club Challenge format be altered.…
Dear Davo Smithy, there's been a recent spate of Roar articles discussing a potential restructure of rugby league representative matches. I'm all in favour…
Dear Dave Smith, Heritage round should always be used first and foremost to honour specific anniversaries and events in individual clubs histories. Then and…
Dear Davo Smithy, the other day I briefly discussed a divide which exists between the top and bottom Sydney clubs, a letter which triggered…
Dear Davo Smithy, today it's time to kick the hornet's nest. I'm talking about that often feared phrase that strikes fear into the hearts…
Dear Davo Smithy, Happy holidays! Now stop bludging and get back to work. Today's topic: this mixed Easter basket. First up we get a…
Ever wanted to pen a letter to a sports administrator of your choice? Here is the first part of my series of letters to…
It's another summer of love and the Big Bash League's slide, the absence of Test match fans in Hobart and the Boxing Day fizzer/extended…
Before we get into the nitty gritty let me just put one thing on the record - I am not nor have I ever…
For those who have just returned from their week long vacations on Mars, the last ditch efforts of a desperate, defiant and debt laden…
The National Rugby League could soon be a a 20-team international competition. There are currently more bidding teams than available expansion slots in the…
Here's the basic idea of creating a pre-season NRL tournament that has a proper structure, can be taken to regional and expansion areas, and…
The main problem holding cricket back in this country is the mediocre club season. Whilst the Sheffield Shield might be millions of years old…
Facts
The past decade’s tournaments involving Australia & New Zealand
Rugby League:
2005 – 3N (Kiwis)
2006 – 3N (Kangaroos)
2008 – WC (Kiwis)
2009 – 4N (Kangaroos)
2010 – 4N (Kiwis)
2011 – 4N (Kangaroos)
2013 – WC (Kangaroos)
2014 – 4N (Kiwis)
It’s 4 each in that time frame with 1 WC win each.
Rugby Union:
2005 – Bledisloe, 3N (NZ)
2006 – Bledisloe, 3N (NZ)
2007 – Bledisloe, 3N (NZ)
2008 – Bledisloe, 3N (NZ)
2009 – Bledisloe (NZ)
2010 – Bledisloe, 3N (NZ)
2011 – Bledisloe, WC (NZ), 3N (Aus)
2012 – Bledisloe, RC (NZ)
2013 – Bledisloe, RC (NZ)
2014 – Bledisloe, RC (NZ)
The taste of Test football
Be careful. Using facts around here is risky business.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
It was the shield GB & NZ played for in 2002 & 2007 named after Albert Baskerville who organised the first All Golds tour.
Again it’s just a branding to unify the matches. Even something like the All Golds cup for NZ vs ENG has some sense of identification. I’m not sure what cup is up for offer in next year’s series.
But again – not being able to know – highlights the problem. The brand is everything.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
Internationals have the potential to overtake Origin in significance but again that’s not necessarily tied to Origin declining. Rather Internationals could become the most popular rugby league event and Origin simply remain as popular as it is now.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
I think we need Ashes, Anzac & Baskerville series Johnno, as I said once every 4 years. Essentially it’s the same number of games as present but in a Branded format.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
Well the way I see it is a lot of people – fans, coaches, clubs, players – are whinging about the burden and impact of Origin on the NRL season… so why make it worse?
When your club loses a key player for the season because they played for a Tonga vs Cook Islands match crammed between Origin, you’ll see the same whinging start. Origin isn’t going anywhere but I can’t see those matches lasting.
At least by dividing the calendar any players injured during the international season have until March to recover. A lot of sports would like to have seperate season for domestic and internationals, rugby league could easily achieve it.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
I think the main reason why we haven’t seen their best yet is because very few people are going there to scout players. The talent is there, they just need professional training and opportunities.
You just have to look at the players already signed after playing this year for the PNG Hunters. Their goal is to actually LOSE players because they want a more competitive test side and they know they’re easily replaced.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
Why would the kiwis be any less match fit when they are selected from the same NRL comp?
Feel free to point out where I said that.
I said Australia has a bigger player pool so when they’re coming off 5-8 weeks of intense NRL competition and have to put a test squad together they usually have the benefit of picking last year’s Origin/Kangaroos combinations that have been proven and up to match fitness but without being fatigued from Origin. That combined with the fact that only 2 of the Anzac tests have been played in New Zealand is a massive advantage.
7 years ago New Zealand threatened pulling out of the mid-season test altogether because of this. They want extended camps, just like the Origin camps. It’s widely accepted that longer camps result in better performance. Arguing otherwise is ridiculous.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
PJM, there’ll definitely be a higher percentage of non NSW & QLD players in the NRL in future years – I mean just look at New Zealand’s current numbers.
However I can’t see it having much impact on the public’s support for State of Origin as they’re mostly oblivious to things like that.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
The failings and predictability of the Bledisloe Cup is more so worth exploring on a union thread as their shortcomings have little to do with rugby league.
I would argue though that New Zealand also dominates the Tri-Nations/Rugby Championship — they’ve won 13 out 19 tournaments with South Africa & Australia with only 3 wins apiece. Argentina have also only won 1 game out of 18 played but again the predictability there is probably a matter for one of the union threads.
I merely suggest 3 game tour series as that’s the requirement to restore the Ashes but it also eliminates drawn series.
For the record the 4 Nations final will be the third match for 2014. Ideally they would also be fighting for another unique trophy and the match promoted accordingly.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
I’ve been to PNG and watched the local rugby league there and I can assure just like in Australia there are tall players, short players, thin players, bulky players etc.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
Nonsense. The facts are what they are. You only need to compare the mid-season tests to the end-of-season tests to see the difference.
As for the 2013 World Cup they didn’t slowly go downhill. They dominated Pool B with an even greater margin than Australia in Pool A — even if you discount the Aus-Eng match! They then beat Scotland in the quarters.
The only reason New Zealand were drained for the final was because of the epic England vs New Zealand semi the week prior. If it had been England vs Australia fighting and New Zealand breezing through their semi it may have been the other way round…
Now back to your cave, troll!
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
Some pathetic sod didn’t like my comment — so I re-posted it as an article for them to enjoy again!
Sure the All Blacks win, but supporting New Zealand is tough
Just to be clear, I don’t want Australia vs New Zealand to be an annual 3 match series. It should be once every 4 years, ideally in the middle of the World Cup cycle along with Ashes & Baskerville tours.
The Anzac Test should be moved to October with hosting rotated so it becomes a fairer competition.
I agree regarding the Pacific Cup, it should be a bi-annual event as a minimum but ideally every year with a Pacific Shield for the second tier nations underneath it.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
Australia has a bigger player pool so when they’re coming off 5-8 weeks of intense NRL competition and have to put a test squad together they usually have the benefit of picking last year’s Origin/Kangaroos combinations that have been proven and up to match fitness but without being fatigued from Origin.
New Zealand doesn’t have that same benefit and they’ve frequently cited the difficulty of selecting the best players during the NRL season just as other countries like PNG, Fiji, Tonga and Samoa have said. It also doesn’t help that it’s only been hosted in New Zealand twice since 1997.
But again here’s a section I like to call:
FACTS
End of season matches between Australia & New Zealand during the same period:
Kiwis
6 wins
2 draws
10 losses
And those losses are skewed by the 2006 series.
It is evident that when New Zealand (& other teams, like you’ve seen with Samoa) are able to have their teams together for extended periods like 4 Nations & World Cups under Origin like conditions and don’t have to deal with the NRL, they simply perform better.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
I agree that there needs to be better coordination and I am definitely in favour of shifting the Anzac test to the post-season.
The future of Origin is definitely Sunday nights (it minimizes the effects on the league to just those 3 weekends instead of the current 6-8 weeks) and it will always be played during the middle of the season, however given the current impact of rep matches we shouldn’t add MORE representative matches in the middle of the season. The NRL should just take 8-12 matches and split them over the 3 Origin rounds. Better to have than then people complaining that their club was decimated because of a Tonga vs Cook Islands match.
International Rugby League needs its own season and that’s October-November. As for its cycle that might now depend on the rumored Confederations Cup format but I’d ideally like to see the Ashes, Baskerville and Anzac played as 3 match series once every 4 years.
League needs a Bledisloe Cup to call its own
Other NRL teams already play matches in regional areas, it’s going to keep happening whether you like it or not. The reality is that NSW & QLD are bigger than just Sydney & Brisbane.
A Brothers team can serve both the Brisbane & Central Queensland expansion requirements and you shouldn’t write them off yet.
NRL expansion into Queensland is needed now
Something like the Brothers model would be worthwhile pursuing:
– It’s a heritage brand (vs the corporate Broncos brand) which could form the basis of a strong rivalry
– It’s got a preexisting fan base to build from
– It could target the South & West of Brisbane picking up QRL, non-Broncos & new fans
– 9-10 games at Lang Park
– 2-3 games in Rockhampton & potentially Darwin
– Could be Brisbane Brothers, South Queensland Brothers or even Queensland Brothers (similar to the Texas Rangers)
NRL expansion into Queensland is needed now
Phil, the list of people who have been prophesying rugby league’s demise is old, boring, wrong and pathetic. You fit in nicely!
International rugby league is far from dead
Agree fully, the NZ-ENG matches of late have been wondrous to behold. Likewise with AUS-NZ & AUS-ENG it’d be good if every 4th year that 3 game series could be a regular event.
New Zealand pip England as Lady Luck strikes again
Look at the Australian & New Zealand team lists (also State Of Origin) over the years and they’re littered with players who were eligible for other countries. They opt for those 2 countries because they get regular matches.
Steve, several of the players were born in Samoa and before you get on your high horse you should keep in mind that the vast majority of the Samoan Union team was born in New Zealand…
Give NRL clubs a reason to get behind internationals
Facts
Over the last decade:
Rugby League
England/GB* vs Australia (Won 1, Lost 11)
England/GB* vs New Zealand (Won 7, Lost 8)
*Keeping in mind the GB games were with a predominantly English squad and GB were playing instead of England in those earlier years
Rugby Union
England vs New Zealand (Won 2, Lost 11)
England vs Australia (Won 6, Lost 6)
If you include Union Lions tours it’s:
England/GB&I vs New Zealand (Won 2, Lost 14)
England/GB&I vs Australia (Won 8, Lost 7)
Let’s just dispel the notion now that the Big 3 rugby league matches are somehow much less competitive than their union counterparts.
It’s time for AUS vs NZ, AUS vs ENG & ENG vs NZ to be played as 3 match series every 4th year. Bring back the Ashes, Baskerville & Anzac Trans-Tasman series.
The taste of Test football