The All Blacks deserve special treatment

;-)

I'm a kiwi Sputnik. What Kevin did was disgraceful and he should have know better, the first rule taught to all Kiwi kids playing rugby is he who retaliates gets punished. Kevin retaliated he got punished suck it up go home and learn the lesson. A lot of New Zealander's agree with me.

Ok then Maoman. The vast majority of kiwis and if the shoe fits, put it on...

A bit 'backward' too Splutnik to lump all "kiwis" in the same boat.

This discussion has gone on for so long now. Still the kiwis defend Kevin and his actions. If the kiwis don't accept visual evidence as can clearly be seen by all from the video footage, I doubt they except the concept of modern day DNA evidence too. A bit backward don't you think?

Yeah, the idea that an offence must be a red card in order to be cited is kind of a nonsense. There's two possible explanations - Eitherr on field refs are unwilling (or afraid) to enforce the laws as written or the reality is that yellow card level offences are in fact cited all the time. The fact that a spear type tackle essentially means an automatic yellow and citing (see JDV, Cooper and Fourie for example) and common sense indicates it's the latter.

...violent illegal play, which has the potential to injure another player, is in fact worse than a professional foul...and in fact, the IRB obviously agrees – as the red card and judiciary system is in effect reserved for such play. Hmmmm...yet interestingly enough the only red card we've seen in the 3N this year was Drew Mitchell's double-yellow; performing a slightly mistimed tackle then obstructing a quick throwin. By this measure we should've seen twelve or fifteen in the same series and probably five in Saturday's game.

Still claiming Mealamu moves Moody... I think this has gone on long enough... I'm speechless.

So despite his arm being in front of Moody's direction of movement, it's actually his arm that is being dragged across by Moody's movement? Ok. You’ve stated that Mealamu intended to eke out punishment, which isn’t far removed from saying that he wanted to head butt Moody. Irrelevant. It's not the same thing. There is no difference because you infer cynicism in his actions from the video replay. Your reasoning and logic process is flawed. Your conclusion is not a valid consequence of the premise. It is unsound. There is plainly a difference. Just because there are similarities does not mean they are the same. Just because Mealamu intended to do violence to Moody does not mean he intended to head butt him. So what are these three arts in which a forearm strike is such a weapon? Kung Fu, bujutsu, karate. Also systema and krav maga hand to hand combat methods. Why is the head butt illegal in contact strikes but a forearm strike isn’t? What's with the red herrings? Forearm strikes are banned in various competitions, such as shooto. Really, this is well off topic and has gone on long enough.

Peter - I wouldn't dream of implying you condone those things. Quite the opposite, it seems you condemn both equally. You seem to be arguing that it is hypocritical to think that one type of cheating is worse than another. My point of view is that in the real world there are no absolutes in such matters. Illegal play in rugby has a fairly obvious spectrum, ranging from inadvertent actions (eg a player who genuinely thinks they have a right to play the ball unaware that the ref has called hands off) to violent foul play. Deliberate cheating/gamesmanship would fall somewhere in between obviously. I think that even the most obtuse person would accept that violent illegal play, which has the potential to injure another player, is in fact worse than a professional foul. And in fact, the IRB obviously agrees - as the red card and judiciary system is in effect reserved for such play. Other than the odd occasion when players abuse match officials or blatant cheating like the Harlequins 'Bloodgate" when has anything other than violent play seen anyone pay a visit to the judiciary. It's not an arbitrary line I've created, it's a well accepted reality.

I see, gotcha. I agree - this lack of transparency with rulings is simply ridiculous.

Ben.From the snapshot clip I have seen he is guilty as all hell;deserved his ban and personally I'm disappointed with Hansen& co for a spurious appeal. What concerned me about the clip was where it began-I haven't had the benefit of a replay and wondered whether the editing might have made it look worse.I admit I was seeking some kind of extenuating circumstances because of who the perpetrator was-I never expected such a dirty(and frankly ,ineffectively pathetic)action from an intelligent bloke like Mealamu.If he had a real grievance it would have been better if he had picked Moody up and then clocked him-for all to see-instead of taking a dumb cheapshot and then denying it. As for the rest of the article....pure garbage! The sooner the IRB institute a proper& transparent proceedure to deal consistantly,globally,with dirty play-the sooner we fans can get back to discussing the play.Spurious appeals could be punished too,Imo.

and the Ben S v Jason saga continues... get a room boys.

you revealed my sophistically encrypted codename!

Watch the replay. Mealamu has his hand on Moody's jersey. His hand does not drag him across, and his hand does not move him. Moody is moved from behind. Mealamu does not move Moody. 'You’re obviously labouring under the mistaken belief that he would be using his brow. Once more and for the last time, you don’t use that part of your head to execute a head butt if you know what you’re doing.' Excuse me? You've stated that Mealamu intended to eke out punishment, which isn't far removed from saying that he wanted to head butt Moody. There is no difference because you infer cynicism in his actions from the video replay. 'I know of three that definitely do, which is three more than you stated when you said none did. London to a brick there are more. Perhaps in future you won’t respond about topics you obviously know nothing about?' The irony. So what are these three arts in which a forearm strike is such a weapon? Why is the head butt illegal in contact strikes but a forearm strike isn't?

very well said

Then I wonder what his hand is doing on Moody here and pulling him across as Thorn (?) tries to clear him out. But when you drive through at an angle, as Mealamu did, then your nose would likely come into with the target. Perhaps if he was as uncoordinated as you seem to think others would be. You're obviously labouring under the mistaken belief that he would be using his brow. Once more and for the last time, you don't use that part of your head to execute a head butt if you know what you're doing. How could you possible determine that? Previously you ridiculed me for using video evidence as proof that Mealamu intended to head butt Moody, so you are contradicting yourself. Because his action at the ruck is not to clear Moody out, nor is it to drive over him. That is obvious from the footage. Stating that he is attempting to meter out some dead ground counselling does not mean he intended to head butt Moody, hence it is not a contradiction. Go on then, how many arts use the forearm strike? I know of three that definitely do, which is three more than you stated when you said none did. London to a brick there are more. Perhaps in future you won't respond about topics you obviously know nothing about?

The AB RWC 2011 ship has a leak, the number of myopic kiwi rants on this thread are symptomatic of a bubble that has burst and a glass house that is now broken. Hec even Ritchie is twitchy and losing his sheen in after match speeches (although not with the refs yet). The unbalanced (by many) schoolgirl type defensiveness about Kev M (a good bloke and outstanding player who unfortunately just f&*$%cked up this time) and Ritchie displayed by Hansen and (reportedly) by some in the AB team, like many kiwi posters on this site, reeks of circle the wagons.......the Indians are coming. What happened to the good old days when Buck would have taken this type of crap on the chin and shrugged his shoulders? A sensitive lot we are all now...god the pressure on this team to win next year is already suffocating - the best thing kiwis could do is just back off and let the team breathe.

The rugby public are losing sleep over this? People must be bored of talking about Sonny Boy Williams or the Australian scrum.

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