No panic for Boks as they name team

I am picking England by 15points. As some posters have said the Boks are playing an outdated style based on the Bulls, who got bundled out of the Currie Cup this year. Sadly for Bok fans the pain will continue, either way. SARU are never going to sack Pieter Div and his two useless assistants. No matter how badly the Boks play, we are stuck with this pack of idiots until after the World Cup. We will be lucky to win a quarterfinal game against anyone currently. The best result for SA rugby, would be for England to absolutely trash the living daylights out of us, a 50 point hiding, might be the only thing that will make Div lose his job. It's notable, that SA Rugby asked for assistant coaches to help them for this tour. Not one coach threw his hat into the ring. Rats off a sinking ship, no-one is prepared to drink from a poisoned chalice. The ship is going down boys. Currently barely afloat.

Actually saying that... It should be a great match. An angry Bok team....embarrassed and looking for some credibility. And an England team that is desperate to show they are real contenders. I'm picking England....simply for home advantage. The Boks often seem to struggle on these EOYTs

Ummm PDV, when exactly do you panic. Half a dozen tests before the world cup and you get beaten by Scotland!! AND a week after New Zealand beat them by 49-3. The rugby worlds laughing at you mate...not with you. Well I suppose they didn't panic when the Titanic hit that naughty little iceberg...

The way I see it, Rusty, is that regardless of how South Africa have been playing I think England have weak points that the Springboks can expose. It's all well and good thrashing Australia because IMO Australia will always be there for the taking and are overrated. England and Australia was a good match-up because they both wanted to play in a similar way, but England are more physical than Australia and so the potential was always there for a good win. England haven't faced a side with the physical robustness of South Africa, and that may seriously impinge upon the way they want to play the game. Also, the way England want to attack there will always be the opportunity for mistakes, and with kickers like the Steyns, and an intercept king like JdV the potential is there for SA to build a score. I think this is a huge game for England. PdV can always cite missing players, but if England are serious they have to win, and they will have to win against a side playing a brand of rugby they won't have experienced before. They will be tested in new areas. I can't wait. I think it will be a good game. Stay up and watch it.

That's true actually.

they arent even playing Bulls rugby - its a mismatch of parts and execution where the sum of the parts is less than the whole

Ben - please dont talk up the Boks. Leave it to people like myself so I can say things like .... things like...... ah bugger it. Whatever you said then.... The only saving grace from my point of view for this match is that it wont be on Foxtel so I wont be getting up in the middle of the night to shout obscenities at the tv

Not in the beginning but the Sharks one they started to click over went through the latter stages unbeaten and then carried their progression into the currie cup... but again, arbitary details as the Boks arent really playing any sort of style with conviction. I honestly believe that the Sharks, Stormers and even the Bulls in their entirety would have toured better...

So he does, Brendan. Didn't see that. The spine of the team is pretty much a Bulls side. The only decision maker in the side who is a Stormer is De Villiers, so I don't think it's realistic to expect this current Springbok side to play as the Stormers did. Fair enough if there were more Stormers in it, but there isn't. The Sharks didn't set the world alight either in the S14.

It's all a learning curve, I suppose. I'd be less worried if Stegmann wasn't playing, VC. Although Moody, and therefore England, have fared reasonably well at the ruck contest recently, the South African performance at the ruck was woeful in the 3N. Stegmann's inclusion removes a weakness. I'm positively petrified how the lineout will run. It was painful watching Lawes go up for every ball against Samoa. Goodness knows how any of the Samoan pack didn't cotton on to it. It should be an interesting contest if you weigh up both teams: SA - inconsistent scrum, excellent lineout, conservative game plan, lots of kicking; England - very good scrum, inconsistent lineout, like to play an up-tempo off-loading game, not a great deal of kicking.

Ben S, Gary, thefirst contributor refers to them as"Dad's army". I don't know about the majority of the side being Bulls players. You've got the locks, 2nd choice scrumahlf half and Morne Steyn & Spies from the Bulls. Anyway thats besides the point the Boks are playin an outdated game plan and while they might moel it on the Bulls game they aren't doing it nearly as effectively perhaps because of the better class of opposition.

Good analysis. Some of England's forwards - Croft, Lawes and Moody come to mind - look pretty thin next to the beefy South Africans. I suspect Johnson will be hoping for a dry track.

Who said the 'bok players are over the hill'? The Stormers played an exciting brand of rugby, but the Bulls kicked the most of all sides, and this Springbok XV is predominantly a Bulls side playing a Bulls style of rugby.

I disagree with the comments above implying that the bok players are over the hill. I think what the problem is, is PDV's coaching style and game plan that has turned these players into plodders. If you look at the current bok players who played in the super 14 this year you'd have seen that in the S14 most of them played with pace, purpose and attacking flair precisely because their respective coaches instilled a more modern and positive style of play. In particular the Stormers have by far the most modern, attacking style of any of SA's 5 S14 franchises and if you watched some of their games like against the Crusaders, then you'd see a team full of exciting players with pace to burn. Take Jackque Fourie, who I know isn't touring, a lot of Aussies & Kiwis on this site like to rubbish the guy as useless and not nearly as good as SA rugby fans think he is? Of these detractors how many saw the Stormers v Crusaders game in this years S14 when he scored 3 brilliant tries and single handidly carved up the Crusaders backline in the process. Hence in summary I think the boks woeful performance on this tour is entirely PDV's fault and hence she shoudl be booted as soon as the tour is over.

I think this game could/will be a very, very tough challenge for England. Firstly, you have to factor in the experience of South Africa, and secondly you have to factor in the age of South Africa. As promising as players like Hartley, Cole, Lawes and Croft are, they are physically still quite callow. Coming up against older men like Bismarck du Plessis, Botha and Smith will be a huge challenge for them. Last week England were clearly a little shocked by the Samoan ferocity and power at the ruck contest. Another issue is the South African line-out. England have been erratic these past few Tests, which doesn't bode well. Against Samoa, in the absence of Croft England were forcing throws to Lawes, and with the inexperience of that tight five Matfield could have a field day. Aside from that I would hope that England would have a clear edge. The SA backline is none too threatening and beyond forward carries and the boot of the Steyns there isn't a great deal of variety. If England are accurate at the point of contact and physically committed then there is no reason that they shouldn't show improvement. Conversely, the side must also worry of not overplaying their hand and forcing the ball. With the ability of Morne and Steyn accuracy must be the word of the day. This should be an interesting match-up, and I think it will be very close. I certainly would not write off the Springboks.

C'mon England! Help us put the nail into the Mexicans coffin

If they give england the ball as they did the scots, they are in a lot of trouble (assuming england don't adopt a kicking strategy). Tinkering with the line up won't change that.

Nothing much to say, not having seen the game V Scotland, did Hougaard play badly??? Pienaar hasn't impressed me with the games I've watched with him at halfback. Hougaard has impressed me in the games I've seen him play. But I'm no PDV, I'm just a mere mortal. South Africa will get a touch up if England perform at half the level that they did against the Wallabies. I can't wait untill the super 15 starts so that we can see other younger players force their way into this Springbok side. They are starting to look like Dad's Army.