Italy stun France 22-21 for historic win

I thought Palisson did well in his debut season, but obviously I can't use that as justification. I was just chucking an idea out there. Yeah, I quite liked Andreu too. I have ESPN so I only get to see the occasional French game. Re: Dusautoir. I had the same conversation with another chap on Rucku and listed 7s. Not sure why I listed a load of 6s here? I was thinking of Dusautoir actually playing more like a 6 than a 7, I think. Speed typing. I'd rather Hartley off-loaded than carry. He has soft hands. He keeps coming from pace and taking the ball on from deep, but still gets bashed. I just don't get it. He's not muscular enough to be a ball carrier. I just don't think anybody compares to Croft. He's 6'6, runs like a wing, is an amazing support player and in the air, and also gets into really, really good positions at the breakdown, and we've been poor at the breakdown this season, despite the form of Wood and Haskell.

Re: Poitrenaud, it was more his counter-attacking game I was impressed with, he's a very balances runner, but he hasn't hit those heights this season. As for Palisson, no way!! Although he's starting against Wales, I've never seen him anything other than average. To be honest, the guy who continually imresses me in the Top 14 and did well in last season's Six Nations is Marc Andreu. To be fair to Dusautoir, he's not playing as a traditional six; the way they organise the back-row is bit like South Africa, in terms of left and right flankers. So Bonnaire is really the blindside. I thought the scrum was more dominant before Thompson came on, but I do think he struggled in the loose against Scotland and didn't quite have the same impact as he did versus France. He does have this thing, though, on standing up in the scrum even when his side are going forward. I don't know if it's a technical issue or he's found a way of conning penalties, but either way, it's worked. I believe he is a good carrier, however, he sometimes overplays that part of the game, especially when he has got decent hands and other attributes. I think you're being a bit harsh on Wood, I think he's better than reliable and a very able back-up to Croft. It will be interesting to see if and when Croft is selected over Wood, if that changes the back-row dynamics that much. I thought Wood and Haskell both played like 6.5's which complemented them well, but Croft is very much a traditional six. Haskell's arguably been England's best player in this tournament - where has this form been for the last two years!? We all knew he had the ability but he seems to have added a rugby brain to his impressive physique.

I thought Poitrenaud was OK last year, but he was playing behind a phenomenal pack. Time and time again on the national stage he has shown he is weak under the high ball, lacks concentration and is prone to general unforced errors. You can't give a bloke 40 odd caps and allow him to keep on making the same errors IMO. I don't think France happen to be blessed with many other good fullbacks, but surely Palisson is worth a game or two? Dusautoir has his plus points, but if you look at all other blindside flankers: Croft, Elsom, Smith, Ferris, O'Brien, Zanni, Brown etc they all are bigger than Dusautoir, and the majority of them have that little bit extra, be it pace, power or handling skills, that Dusautoir doesn't. I just think in that sense he is limited. I've never been a fan of Bonnaire, but I've been quietly impressed with him this 6N. I don't think there's room for him in the same side as Harinordoquy, but he's been more physical than I can remember him ever being before. Is Hartley a good scrummager? I don't know - hard to tell. Whenever Thompson has come on he has bolstered the set piece, but then he's come on with Shaw. I've been watching Hartley closely and he is very chatty, which some refs like, but he's just like a little tubby boy from the under 7s who all the teachers love because he's confident. He doesn't carry particularly well and doesn't effect change at the ruck like Du Plessis or Rory Best. Granted he has improved his discipline and he has a high work rate, but I just don't rate him. Physically he looks like a small prop, which I find quite informative. Personally I think Croft is one of the best all-round rugby players in the world game. Wood has been reliable and honest, but he doesn't make the greatest impact with ball in hand, and is a little underpowere IMO. Also, whilst Wood has been great at receiving restarts, what Croft does at attacking restarts is immense. His support game is phenomenal too. Big game coming up. We've won 4 games without playing particularly well (although I think that's largely down to the nature of the 6N). It would be great to see a real performance in Dublin. I'd especially like us to win because I'm bored of this revisionist guff coming out of the Welsh camp based on a good 20 minutes against Scotland.

Poitrenaud might be inconsistent but I believe he's their best full-back and was superb in last year's tournament. Dusautoir is a beast for Toulouse, an irrepressible force, and is has been a consistently good performer for France in the past. Perhaps, he hasn't been on that form recently but I still think he's their best option. I think the one who needs dropping is Bonnaire who's done nothing since his return to the side. The back-row of Dusautoir, Quedrago and Harinordoquy was pretty formidable I thought. As for England, I would probably bring Lawes back onto the bench and start with Shaw. Thompson always does well when he comes on and perhaps deserves his start but I think Hartley is a very dynamic player who is a very good scrummager. Agree on Banahan who played very well when he came on and Tindall seemed to be limping anyway yesterday (We'll see how that is). Not sure on Croft, as the back-row has gone very well, and it would be harsh to drop Wood who had a good game - carried well, lineout was solid and was intelligent with what he did around the park. But then, is Croft simply the better player? We saw what he brings to the side immediately when he came on, and England improved. Is he simply a better option than Wood however well he has played?

Italy finally playing with the backline.. They were always had the forwards at scrumtime, mauls and the breakdown... But good to see that their backline is developing... WATCH out Ireland and Oz at the RWC... However, they were pushed around sometimes at scrum time by a superior French scrum.. and they still seem to lack a good lineout which is now their achilles heel. And Again, another sell out crowd of 32k at the stadio flamino.... They need a new larger ground!

Poitrenaud couldn't catch a cold, Colin! I'm not against Dusautoir, but I think Nyanga and Ouedraogo are simply mroe rounded and more dynamic. I know Nyanga has fallen off the national radar, but I have seen him a few times on ESPN this season, and he is great at attacking restarts. France need to innovate in areas like that. England did something quite sharp at one of the restarts today: Wood caught the ball and then Hape came bursting in from the blindside. I know that sounds simple, but it looked better than my description. Apart from that restart not a lot went too well. Agree re: intensity. In 3/4 games this 6N we have struggled at the ruck in the 1st half. I don't think the tight five is athletic or powerful enough with Hartley and Deacon in it. They have high work ethics but just don't have the power IMO. The problem we have had this 6N, aside from being tactically inflexible until after half-time is a lot of unforced errors. We make lots of line breaks but it's always the final ball. Guscott made a rather salient point, as did Johnson after the game - some games will be tight, so don't overcomplicate. Bash up the middle, flood the rucks, quick ball etc. When we were on the front foot we looked good. I thought the breakdown was badly reffed today. I can't recall the amount of times I saw Barclay holding on to the tackled player/ball with his knees on the ground. Lots to work on this week. With that in mind I'd start Thompson, Shaw, Croft and Banahan.

Ah okay, I missed the first 20. I've never been a fan of Huget, he seems like another once of those players picked from nowhere to all of a sudden starting. I watch quite a lot of the Top 14 and he's not one the French wingers who I thought stood out. I like Poitrenaud and Dusatoir, but agree on the others. As for Scotland, they played well today and cut out the errors. England, on the other hand, I thought were lethargic and lacked intensity. It improved when the subs came on and once again Haskell had an outstanding game. If Scotland can play like that then they should overcome Italy, especially at home.

Italy win, you beauty!! Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of Frenchies ;-)

I'm not a fan of sides who repeatedly take scrum options because it's a risky strategy. Most refs are very poor come scrum time, and as Colin has noted, Lawrence has shown us before that he is stunningly inept at officiating the scrum. However, France probably got their just desserts. They have been conservative and stodgy for far, far too long now, and yet you still hear these ridiculous claims of French flair. Time for a reality check. -- Colin, France were looking to go wide really early, shifting the point of attack, sort of like England did, but without setting the platform first, so they just crabbed sideways. It was pretty horrible to watch actually. I honestly reckon that Thion, Dusautoir, Chabal, Jauzion, Traille, Huget and Poitrenaud all need to go. The Scotland Test will be a big game for Italy. I'd pick Scotland at this stage, unless England turn them over and Scotland suffer a real crisis of confidence. As bad as I think Andy Robinson is as a head coach I reckon Lamont and Ansbro would pose far more of a threat than the French backs did.

And just awhile ago some were expunging about what a crap coach Mallet is. Of course we've heard about how rubbish France are (when they play Italy and Australia and get beaten/flogged)- but are the biggest threat to England's NH hegemony who scrap by them scoring one try. Que?

Hooray! Well done Italy! I can't wait to see a few wins strung together. Scotland perhaps?

Well. thanks to the greed of RBS Ltd and News Ltd, I had to wait until I had downloaded the game to watch it this afternoon. We no longer get any televised rugby in China. For ten years we have all RBS and 3N matches live and a selection of four to five S14 matches every weekend. Now we have only OZ Rules, whatever that is. A wonderful occasion and I was feeling pretty emotional myself. This will be a great boost to Italian rugby and will perhaps deliver a belief that Italy can compete with the best. They have always given the Wannabes a run for their money, and when they got 90,000 odd people along and Stu's help, gave the AB's a run for their money.

Italy deserved the win as they played some good rugby and showed a bit of flair and a decent amount of grit to come back from a reasonable deficit. After having come so close to beating Ireland they are starting to come of age and have shown a number of times that they are a difficult side to beat and now they will hopefully start to string some wins together and garner some respect.

I think France were idiotic in repacking that scrum three times trying to milk a penalty when they had the ball available for use. Incredibly negative option and showing that they didn't back themselves.

Italy's been arriving for a while now ,I discovered it when they played the ABs in Milan.

Indeed, Italy were much improved when Burton came on and yes I was saying while I was watching that France should have had a penalty for one of those scrums, but I think the referee got 'Kaplan syndrome.' And it was also Bryce Lawrence, who has shown many times in the past that he doesn't know what is going on at scrum-time. I didn't watch the whole match as I was covering Leeds-Saints, but I had it on a stream and Italy looked the better side for the periods I was watching. It seemed to me that only once Italy went ahead that France started playing, but it looked an exciting game nonetheless and hopefully this will be a building to which they can move on from. I can certainly see them beating Scotland who have been awful in this tournament so far, although if they happen to turn over England tomorrow, I will probably take that back!

Awesome. Well done Italy! I've heard the French are no longer as strong as they were but still a good reward and good sign for Italy.

Well done Italy. Very pleased for Mallet and the team.

Go Italy!!!!! The only time I like the French is when their beating the ABs!! -- Comment left via The Roar's iPhone app. Download The Roar's iPhone App in the App Store here.

Miracles do happen. It's not that long ago when the French B team would annihilate Italy.