Central Coast the way forward for NRL

IMO opinion people who throw stones at another rival bid deserve what they get. I listened to Greg Florimo on radio when he was being interviewed. I was travelling up from Grafton to Brisbane some months ago. During the discussion on the merits of the Central Coast bid he then attacked the NRL and WA bid stating that he could not understand why the NRL would consider them as it was not a RL area. From that moment my limited support evaporated for the CC Bears. It also showed his lack of understanding of Perth and its demography. I have just returned from spending two weeks there and RL is far from being dead. It is alive and growing. Whilst I would like to see the CC Bears introduced the NSW market is saturated. The CC Bears has little to offer TV in bringing more veiwers to the game. Perth offers a time slot that the TV moguls would jump at for live coverage back to the East Coast. The other part of the debate is the NRL can no longer ignore Perth which is growing at a mamoth rate. The Western Force has made inroads into AFL territory. There is also a belief, amongst AFL and some RL supporters that the NRL is scarred to take on AFL in its own back yard. Is it?? I doubt it. I have been to WA many times before when I was in the military. I was aware that the demography of Perth was changing but by how much was to my surprise during my two weeks there. I stayed at my brother’s place in a suburb called Joondilup about 35klms north. So I was amazed at how many schools in the area had RL/RU grounds. The local Rebel Sports Store had many football jerseys from many codes but the no 1 jumper was The Western Force, The no 1 code was Soccer with the big UK clubs. The NRL had a small amount but the AFL only came in second. This was a surprise. But the northern outer suburbs are predominately UK, KIWIS and Eastern Staters. I then spent a week at a resort in Mandurah. The pub next door The Silver Sands was a RL pub. I was amazed to walk in and see Friday night football on the main screen and AFL pushed to a small screen. I was wearing my Panthers Jersey and all of a sudden a call came over “hey Panther Boy”. I felt I was back in my youth. Mandurah is 71 klms south of Perth but as I found out is also full of Kiwis, Poms and Eastern staters as well. I again visited the local Rebel store and the same as before Western Force was the dominate team but there were a lot more NRL jumpers. The WCE were left behind. This was also repeated at two more Rebel stores. Again I was surprised to see many (REAL) football grounds. It appears that despite AFL being the dominate code and spending millions in an attempt to eradicate all other codes in fact RL/RU are becoming more popular in the West. Perth is IMO the no 1 choice for the 17th franchise. It just has to be. That does not mean that the CC Bears should not be considered. I have written the the NRL advocating that 4 teams should be entered over 2013/2014. But Perth, NZ and Central Qld are my prefferrd three with the 4th coming from Brisbane/Central Coast. The problem for CC Bears remains the overcrowded market place. Also I believe that Tinkler has earmarked the CC as an area to be marketed by the Knights. Debate is healthy. Supporting your favoured bid is healthy but deriding other bids only serves to undermine the credability of the, in this case, the CC Bears bid. Intereresting times indeed for the NRL with the new commission to start operation this month.

Gday, Im a resident of Rockhampton and I fully support the inclusion of the Central Coast Bears from 2013 onwards. It just makes so much sense and now with the Knights being financially secure and sound (one of Gallops cons for the Bears was the impact of the then-struggling Knights).. things looks good. PS how is the bid and memberships currently going?

If Central Queensland get their stadium approved then goodbye Perth. If Wellington get their bid up and running then goodbye Perth. People assuming Perth is the leading candidate.... really? 400 members and you guys are the leading candidate? Like Perth Red said, the NRL is a business and as a business it makes more sense to include a bid with 6411 members and financial security over a pipe dream bid that will potentially run the already financially weak NRL into the ground. I was a Perth Reds member too but Ive noticed that they dont support the Central Coast Bears.. so therefore I won't be spending anymore money on the Reds and Ill tell my family and friends (20 of us signed up as Reds members) to also withddraw their memberships.. You dont support us, we won't support you. Memberships are so important and the fact that perth and brisbane have been incredibly lazy in this regards IMO holds great concerns. If Brisbane2 was so strong they'd have atleast 5000 members by now.. If Perth really wanted NRL back they'd have atleast 1000-2000 members by now. TV numbers dont mean squat if people don't care enough to bother watching it or have an interest in. Only CQLD and CC have guaranteed attendances and viewers, regardless of how many.. it's guaranteed and won't lose money for the NRL.

Perth Red. WA is a no briainer for me. I have just returned from a two week holiday. The amount ofd RL grounds in schools surprised me. I stayed in a resort and the local pub was RL mad. It had Friday Night Football on the main screen with AFL pushed to a small screen with no one watching AFL. I was also surpised at the lack of WCE merchandise in the 5 sports stores I went into to. I do think that AFL is loseing its grip in gthe west as my brother has been telling me for year. This is the time to strike and strike hard

I've been thinking about becoming a Reds' member for awhile. I might send off my application this week. I really want the WA Reds back in the comp. I think the second team should be from south-east Queensland or central Queensland. I don't mind the NRL bringing the Central Coast Bears in, but only if they put them in at the expense of one of the struggling Sydney-based clubs.

Perth is a no brainer. We have the stadium, the fanbase, the management and the Govt and corporate support. We add a great deal of value to the TV deal with a new capital city Oztam rating and a brand new live TV slot option. We are producing NRL standard players from our jnr set up and finally the game needs to grow beyond its heartlands. Check out the WA Red Army - www.warzone.net.au The other team will be Brisbane2 imo, they add more to the TV pie than CC will. Shame for teh Bears fans but the NRL is a business at the end of the day amd will do what's best for its clubs.

I have not been following league that long but have really got hooked on the game. I havent really heard of the North Sydney Bears till the roar blog. Every 2nd article appears to be about them. So I did some research and I found that during the league wars they stayed true to the ARL only to get dumped later on. If the NRL wanted to keep the Bears in what ever form I would have thought it should of already happend. From how I see it the only way the Bears can get up is from a Nathan Tinkler

I like your suggestion.

Qld Games is RL; To some degree I support what you are saying. To use Penrith for this debate have a problem with the crowd support which is creating debate from all sides who see Penrith as their club. I also am aware that Penrith has an 800 million development curreently in with the council to develop the land around the club. Penrith also has assests of over 250 million dollars. I think no other club in any code has that much assets to their name. Penrith, for me, have failed to connect with their demographic area of influence which are, Penrith, Blacktown, Hawksbury and Blue Mountains. I have been advocating the need to change the name from Penrith to a name that trully represents the region they come from. Certainly within the club there is an acknowledgment that the club has not promoted the club (particulary Blacktown) very well. It will be interesting to see how the club adress the issue of poor crowd support but the club is finacally sound but IMO has inept and poor performing people within the executive managament. I do not see Penrith being one of the clubs (if any) that will be relogated, merged or relocated. How ever I have sent a paper into the NRL and amongst the many recomendations I made I suggested that if mergers are on the agenda of the NRL then both Penrith and Parramatta should both be relogated to a new NSWRL state competion and in their postion a new entity owned jointly by the both clubs be established. A true club that would represent the Western Sydney region and its people. Anyway the new commission has much to do and atime line to do it in

Adrian, Im a CC local who has supported the Bears since 1956. I have over 800 people on my phone who are Bears fans and personally know a further 1700 people who are also diehard Bears fans. Each one and their families would happily travel to Bluetongue to see their team play. You obviously are lying when you say you know a few who wouldn't. Because if you did know any at all, you would know that the Bears are a tight knit family club when it comes to support and to pass an opportunity to see the red & black again, be it at Blueontgue, would be stupidity at its highest considering these are the same people pushing for the Bears return to the NRL. Please stip lying, there's alot of Bears fans who regularly post on here and all know that going to Bluetongue if the CCBears get an NRL license is as guaranteed as the sun rising in the morning.

Correction: I think you’re overlooking the circumstances that caused the Reds’ failure. On a second note, I think the Bears shouldn't enter the competition until one of the deadweight teams from Sydney is given the boot. The NRL needs to wake up and throw Manly, Penrith and Cronulla out of the competition. Maybe even the Roosters.

Why are the Sea Eagles still in the competition? They were an unprofitable entity with a poor stadium and a tiny fanbase when they were originally kicked out of the NRL. Nothing has changed since they were readmitted. The smart decision is to relegate Manly to the NSW Cup or relocate them to Queensland. And should that lead to a few Manly fans throwing a tantrum and never watching the game then that's a shame, but it's nothing for the NRL to worry about. The amount of people who are lost to the game whenever a necessary culling of a Sydney-club is made will be overshowed by the amount of people who are brought into the game by the inclusion of teams in Gosford, Perth, south-east Queensland, Rockhampton and PNG. Teams like Penrith, Cronulla and Manly are too much of a liabiility.

"And put simply, those who favour expansion into Perth or Adelaide need to look at the failings of the Western Reds and Adelaide Rams in the 1990s." While I agree it makes sense to give the Bears the 17th licence, I don't think you're overlooking the circumstances that caused the Reds' failure. The Super League war and short-sighted management from the NSW-based ARL caused the Reds' demise. The stupid ARL forced the Reds to cover all travel expenses of the other clubs when they played in Perth. An upstart club in foreign territory is going to fail when it put in this position. If the Bears were admitted into the NRL then were forced to cover the travel expenses for the Cowboys, Broncos, Titans, Warriors, Storm and Raiders when they played in Gosford then they might struggle to stay afloat.

Restoring comments after outage – apologies for this issue. The Roar =============== =============== lopati Submitted on 2011/04/08 at 12:45 am | In reply to oikee. Ipswitch the better choice for southern qld than Redcliffe, the latter allmost a northern suburb of Brisbane (probably in 5-10 years it will be just that) so not enough distinction to create a separate spirit or rivalry. If you are wondering about Sunshine Coast – it’s probably got the lowest proportion of actual Queensland born residents of any area in the state – (inland not so much but the coastal population swamps them) so it would also be hard to generate any inter-Qld spirit/rivalry there too. Ipswitch is a real long time Qld heartland city (not a town) and enough history with big brother Brisbane to create a local derby spirit. On the others Perth is not a rivalry town, but definitely into pride and recognition. Not just with the money is in place but with the young people that went west to get into the mines hungry for sport too, much hungrier than last time Perth was in. For NZ best 2nd team location is Christchurch – long footy heritage – enough to share into a new code and really get behind it. =============== Australian Football: Central Coast Represent Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 9:55 pm | In reply to oikee. Thats not the only code thats being played around the world buddy. http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/107353/default.aspx http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countries_playing_Australian_rules_football =============== beowulf Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 9:06 pm | In reply to Adrian. Wrong on all counts. The NSW Govt win’t be paying for redevelopment of the historic and magnificent North Sydney Oval. For 1 game per year it passes the NRL scrutiny as a special event. By dilapidated, you must have it confused with Brookvale. The model envisages about 10-15K of the Bluetongue crowds coming from the Central Coast, with the remainder away fans and at worst 1-2K old bear fans from Sydney, probably more around Hornsby due to proximity. HOWEVER, the Bears have negotiated special ‘Bear Express’ trains stopping North Sydney, Chatswood, Hornsby only, travel time from Nth Sydney approx 1 hr, Chatswood 50 min, Hornsby 30 min….this may boost old Bear numbers to Bluetongue. The old Bear fans will have their creater impact on away games in Sydney and the heritage round at North Sydney Oval. Specail away memberships will be sold for Sydney games, meaning Bear fans living around North Sydney can get membership access for games at Brookvale, SFS, Homebush, Parra Stadium, Kogarah etc Perth is a strong possibility as the 18th franchise after the Bears, but you’re way off the money with Brisbane 2 any time soon. CQLD and Ipswich are more likely as the next QLD entrant. =============== Adrian Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 8:53 pm Wow how wrong I was the Central Coast is a big town 320,000 people!!! If any govt in NSW pays a cent to redevelop the completely dilapidated North Sydney Oval for one trial game and one NRL game they are kidding themselves. The Bears fans I know (and I know a few) have no intention of going to Gosford to watch games so essentially it’s a new NSW club which the NRL doesn’t need. It’s going to be Perth and Brisbane2. – Comment left via The Roar’s iPhone app. Download The Roar’s iPhone App in the App Store here. =============== beowulf Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 7:48 pm | In reply to Nick. The CC Bears as per my post above do not impact on other teams hence the number of teams in NSW is irrelevant. if you had said there are too many teams in souh east Sydney, and it was Glebe or Annandale or Newtown bidding iso Central Coast, you may have had a point. David Gallop has said the attraction of the Bears bid is the reconnection with northern Sydney, which in turn means increased TV ratings as they are not diluting fans from other teams, rather reconnecting with Bears fans who now watch AFL & Union. =============== oikee Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 7:01 pm I never laughed as much for years reading those reports and feedback about kennedy and Origin in the mail papers. =============== oikee Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 6:59 pm | In reply to Fool. Rugby league is a tv game, crowds are a bonus. Once we hit 250 thousand members, everything will be good. Our house is the best new add for rugby league. Members are rocketing. =============== oikee Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 6:08 pm | In reply to Crosscoder. Your on the money crosscoder, listen to this, we are expanding into China, we are showcasing our game and going to promote it in Hong Kong. We have troops on the ground in Isreal and Palistine, we alreadyhave troops playing the game. We have teams playing in London, kids are flocking to the game. We are looking at pushing into the Pacific islands, we are even thinking of taking over the talent coming out of these areas, we just signed a player. We are now thinking of having a new team in NZ. If this was rugby league you would be thinking, yes thats about right, we have Lebanon pushing into the Arab states, yes we stop over in China on tours, yes we have the Harlequins 160 teams around England in the Co-op, second division. And yes, we are just starting to make headway on the islands being a union dominated area. And yes, NZ wants a second team, but wait. This is the talk of “not the rugby league, its the propaganda coming out of AFL headquarters, makes you smile. =============== Whites Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 6:06 pm | In reply to Les.. The Souths vs Manly game had 469,000 viewers in Sydney. =============== oikee Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 5:50 pm | In reply to Fez's are cool. That is right, and is where all the t/v dollars are going to come from, 1 game of rugby league every week from the best stadium in Australia for league. =============== Crosscoder Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 5:43 pm | In reply to Australian Football: Central Coast Represent. If the NRL were trying to match AFL club for club expansionwise,they would have rushed expansion,and not taken its time in a claculating manner. And judging by the hasty manner to get a team in GWS and the Gc in NRL territory and the less than impressive competitive nature of those teams,I tthink the tortoise approach rather than the hare is the way to go. And a few AFL cubs lost money last year,so that has nothing to do with whether the expasnion goes to the CC.A bigger Tv contract and bigger club grants will assist loss making clubs.Lets face it few NRL clubs have historically made money. The i.C will decide on expasnion based on the bids received,the money available in the kitty and what expansion does for Tv contracts and for the game as a whole.The fact the AFL has expanded comes well down the pecking order of the NRL concerns. Expansion will be based on what is best for the game. =============== Crosscoder Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 5:35 pm Based on your argument Fool,there would be few Sydney clubs that qualify.Cronulla gets hardly anyone along.On a miserable monday night with little cover,they got over 12,000 in attendance.Yet we get heartland clubs like Panthers and Eels struggling to match that mark,on occasions.I will await the final decision re the Shark’s development ,because if that gets the go ahead,that will make your remarks look rather foolish(sic). =============== Bilbo Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 5:30 pm | In reply to smithha. If the CC come in the clubs in the Sydney market will be forced to become better operators off the field. If this results in a club being unable to compete, I think the league will be stronger as a whole from this taking place. This could be offset by the NRL offering large amounts of money to move to Brisbane, Perth or NZ (whichever doesn’t get a team in the next round of expansion. This would be the less controversial way of improving the Sydney market without having to force mergers or cull teams. =============== Fez’s are cool Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 4:55 pm | In reply to bilbo. There is also a flow on effect by having an alternative to the Broncos on Free-to-air in Queensland – there will be more PayTV games with Queensland sides, ergo more viewers in Queensland for Foxtel, and a higher $ figure NRL can claim. =============== Fool Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 4:55 pm NRL needs less clubs in NSW, not more. If Gosford is to get a team, it needs to be a relocation from Sydney. Cronulla gets hardly anyone along, so maybe they should go to ‘Old Sydney Town’. The NRL bosses need to be building teams that can average 25,000 a game minimum to justify calling itself a major sport. It will take clever planning, creating stadiums in accessible, public transport friendly locations and turfing some old historic clubs to achieve it, but it has to be possible. =============== Australian Football: Central Coast Represent Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 4:44 pm Is the NRL only wanting more teams because Australian football has 2 new additions and would they still be considering new teams if the afl didn’t add new teams? NRL didn’t gain any profit from 14teams last year, so by adding new team/s is it going to increase the revenue? The AFL will soon have 18 teams, there teams are placed in NRL territory, should the NRL, if they were going to add new team/s, put teams in AFL territory or try and hang on to there own territory? – Comment left via The Roar’s iPhone app. Download The Roar’s iPhone App in the App Store here. =============== Nick Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 4:43 pm perth needs to be te next team cc will do nothing for tv money and nsw has too many teams =============== sledgeross Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 4:36 pm Perth will be next, they can get an extra live game in on Super Saturday! =============== smithha Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 4:27 pm | In reply to Fez's are cool. Ok, you need to keep your pants on ‘Fez’s are cool’. The GWS comment has been taken way out of context. Perth= 2 AFL, 1 A-League, 1 Rugby Adelaide= 2 AFL, 1 A-League. Sydney dominates rugby league, and in my opinion, which is what this website is for, is that a CC team should come in to the NRL. This could even be at the expense of a struggling NRL club, which there are in Sydney. The AFL kicks the NRL’s ass in terms of crowds and revenue, and I simply noted that the GWS will not exactly benefit the NRL. First of all, i didn’t say it would be the ‘DEATH OF NRL’ as you put it. Simply that the ‘stranglehold may loosen’. cheers =============== smithha Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 4:12 pm | In reply to Stu. I agree, a CC team could very well come into the comp at the expense of a struggling Sydney club. =============== Jammy Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 12:04 pm | In reply to Les.. I didn’t say anything about a 2nd Brisbane side in my post Les. I’m for a Perth side and the next best bid whoever that may be, I don’t believe that is neccessarily the bears. =============== M1tch Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 12:01 pm | In reply to Redback. Oh yeah the Storm are crumbling..90% of members from last year and crowds steady..this is after playing for no points and losing the last 5 years of history, losing players, sponsors and respect they are still around and doing well on the field and also off the field. Perth is a good chance to work, if its done right..yes they will need money just like GC17 and WS18, their advantage is come 2013/14 they will have local players in the squad. Their business model last time was terrible and that has been admitted, the current bid has been in the works for 5 years. Fans wise, 10 000 for trials and 13 and 15k for nrl matches in last few years, I think the locals have shown they are interested in the game. =============== oikee Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 11:55 am | In reply to TammyS. Another good post Tammy, yes now you put it on paper, the NRL has to shore up Queensland, another team would finish the iceing on the cake, which has never been finished. I keep saying this, and looking at only 25 thousand turn up to the Broncos game the other day, you leave Brisbane much longer without a Team from Ipswich to keep them on their toes, they will kill rugby league. The Broncos have sat idle doing nothing for the last 10 years, no membership drives, no pamphlets, no players going door to door, they dont care about anyone but themselves. Numpties, nothing but numpties. Competetion makes you strong, the Broncos dont have anyone to compete with, its not rocket science, its common sense people. Like i said thwe other day, you add Ipswich and set up shop on the Brisbane river at west end. You go into the city and sign up members right from under the broncos noses. =============== oikee Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 11:49 am | In reply to Les.. Well said Les, this is why i keep saying to let Ipswich have a team. They love rugby league and would support it every week. I cant see other Brisbane bids having the same connection. Ipswich is a city, close to Brisbane, the clashes would become personal. =============== oikee Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 11:42 am | In reply to PaddyBoy. I did say over 20 years, and if you add teams into those areas, you would pick up extra numbers over time to keep the player talent topped up. The NRL has only scrapped the surface on island talent, even NZ talent, over time most players will be coming from aussie kiwis, and islander aussies. All mixed in to make the perfect storm. =============== Jay Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 11:41 am | In reply to Fez's are cool. Did you even read my post before replying? =============== Les. Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 11:40 am | In reply to PaddyBoy. Many of these non supporting Bronco brisbaneites either follow the Roar, Lions, Reds, Titans or another team from else where. Sure they would still be more people that dont follow any team but like their league which a second Brisbane side could tap into. But let’s not forget that Brisbane has it’s fair share of teams in a smaller populated region than say a Sydney or Melbourne. Regionally Ipswich and Central Coast, who have one team between them (the Mariners) would be better suited for new NRL teams in heartland areas. =============== Redback Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 11:07 am Perth never worked last time and wont again. Anyone who tells you that they were well supported in their last two years is kidding themselves. I used to support the reds and go to games for free with the free tickets out of the west australian newspaper. There would be about 7000 people at the wacca and about 5000 sitting in the free ticket area. With the force there now a league team will not work. Look what will happen to the storm in melbourne their support will slowly get smaller. =============== Jojo Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 11:03 am I think PNG deserves a team in the NRL. They are fanatical about the game and could certainly improve the standard of the all league, if given a chance over a few years. Further Central Queensland and Ipswich need teams. CC will certainly cannibalize Newcastle and manly fans so the jury is still out. Maybe some large market research could shed some more light on this. Perth? do they actually watch or like NRL over there?? =============== Andy Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 10:21 am There are 10 nsw clubs in a 16 team competition, why shouldn’t the 17th NRL club be somewhere else? Perth has a population of 1,696,065 don’t you think they deserve a nrl team? =============== Jay Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 8:55 am The Perth and QLD bids will bring arguably more revenue from sponsorship and tv than CCB. Until the case for inclusion goes beyond the sentimental argument, im yet to be fully convinced by having another NSW team. And for credibilitys sake, please don’t use GWS as a basis for arguing your case. CC and North Sydney are not relevant to GWS =============== oikee Submitted on 2011/04/07 at 8:40 am We need 3 teams at least, maybe even 4 or 5 teams. You could even go as far to say we need 6 teams to enter over the next 20 years. 3 teams that need to be added, Bears, they will bring back a team that was victum of the superleague war. It will finally heal this wound. Perth, we can then puff out our chests and tell the world(australia) we are truely national. And they have a good amount of juniors. Brisbane or Ipswich, second team, this will shore up Queensland and help crowds grow and produce the biggest derby in queensland sport. Then you have the likes of a central queensland bid that could support itself. And you probably could add a second NZ team with-in 20 years, finally, we should be thinking of a second Melbourne team. In 20 years time with rugby league on t/v into this city, i think a second team would work by then.