Jeff Kennett’s wild suggestion that a woman may, one day, play in the AFL has rightly been ridiculed.
Like his recent attack on the poorer clubs, it seems calculated to bring the soon to be retiring Hawthorn President some media attention, something he has craved throughout a long public career and which he will soon have to do without.
Still, almost no one has taken the time to spell out why the suggestion is absurd.
In part, of course, this is because it’s obvious. No woman (or at least, no woman not born in East Germany) is strong enough to compete in the AFL.
There are some sports where women can compete with men on something approaching equal terms − golf and horse racing are examples − but a contact sport like AFL is not of them.
And yet, Kennett’s call for us to pursue ‘the impossible’ has a long, and very respectable, pedigree. He was paraphrasing John F. Kennedy in 1961, when the latter was announcing the USA’s intention to put a man on the moon.
More fundamentally, Kennett’s call reflects the characteristic modern desire to achieve mastery over nature: in this case, mastery not over our external environment but over ourselves, over the physical limitations we are born with.
This is a desire which, in all other areas of society, is approved and trumpeted. People are told that they can do or be ‘anything’, that there are no natural limits to what they can achieve.
To deny the right of couples, who by nature cannot have children to have them is disreputable.
To suggest that there might be fundamental differences between men and women that are not just physical is downright dangerous for one’s health, as the former President of Harvard Larry Summers found out.
So why then can’t a woman play in the AFL?
Because sport is one of the last bastions of nature in our time, a place where the radical differences between people, including the radical difference between men and women, is still recognized.
Everywhere else, the dogma of equality rules.
But even in sport, there have been cases which have challenged the claim that there are insurmountable natural limits (think of Caster Semenya, Andre Pistorius, even the East Germans), and we should expect more of them in the future.
What if, say, someone born a woman wants to become a man, and receives hormonal treatment? Should she (or he) then be able to compete?
If so why then shouldn’t other people who simply because they were born weak or slow, or like Pistorius have lost limbs, not also be allowed, perhaps with the benefit of drugs or other artificial devices?
The confusion and inconsistency of our attitudes to these questions is nowhere clearer than in the case of Peter Fitzsimons, the interviewer to whom Kennett opened his heart (or his mouth).
Well known for his opposition to all use of drugs in sport, Fitzsimons nevertheless was of the opinion that Pistorious should be allowed to run, on what amount to pogo-sticks instead of legs, in races against able-bodied athletes.
And he did not challenge Kennett about the possibility of a woman playing in the AFL. After all, who wants to be seen to be standing in the way of the aspirations of women or the disabled?
The idea of women competing with men at the elite level (or of women becoming men so they can compete with men, and vice versa) may seem absurd at the moment, but mark my words: you have only heard the first of it.
amazonfan
Roar Guru
"Your response to Aware is the craziest post on this thread." You will have to be more specific. You do realise that I've made several responses to Aware? Anyway, that you call any of my posts crazy is absurd. That's like a lion criticizing another animal for eating meat! "It shows you live in a fantasy world and know nothing about life." Coming from you, that's a compliment. I don't know what world I live in, but I know that I'm delighted to not be living in your world. As for life, none of your posts suggest you know the slightest thing about life whatsoever.
Nathan of Perth
Guest
He's got a point QGirl. Men from the 1850s would have looked at your post and said "By George, that QGirl just spouted a lot of irrational, sexist balderdash, eh what!" That said, this is possibly the most bizarro comments thread the Roar has ever seen.
Queensland's game is rugby league
Guest
Your response to Aware is the craziest post on this thread. It shows you live in a fantasy world and know nothing about life.
amazonfan
Roar Guru
What a ridiculous post. Even by your standards.
Queensland's game is rugby league
Guest
Of course women can play in the AwFuL. They only have to compete with wimpy men who don't have the manliness to play a real man's sport. Women would probably teach the wimpy AwFuL players a thing or two. Rugby league is another story. No woman could possibly play first-grade rugby league.
JVGO
Guest
Most bizarre Roar thread of all time.
Ian Whitchurch
Guest
Aware, Im sorry my attitude to courage under pressure threatens your sexuality.
Johnno
Guest
The wallabies tried to rough DC up and rumble him at eden park aware by the end of the match it was DC doing the rumbling no wallaby wanted to get near him, and it showed QC notably were not able to land a finger nail on him let alone have the guts to tackle him or rumble him. i admit i was a wallaby fan who thought DC could be roughed up coz he is a bi tof a pretty boy but he proved me wrong . looks can be deceiving, jonny wilkinson also can tackle and is tough. Don't judge a book by it's cover. it's funny what i find about QC. He has the guts tot try and rumble and cheap shot Richie mcgaw and pick fights with mcgaw who is bigger than him, yet doesn't have the same guts to tackle and put his body on th eline in defence. Strange. Id love to see the chiropractor Brian lIMA SMAsch QC and the bier.
Jules
Guest
Im a girl and even though Im for women and girls doing whatever they want - and having every option men do - i dont think this is a logical argument. Women can play the womens league - there is no woman in the world who could match it with a man of 6'6" and 120kgs - its not sexism its just biology. On the same token there are plenty of things women are just better at - men can and do these things but it depends on the man and his capabilities. Thats why certain roles have been seen as dominated by women - we are just better at those things. Noone should be on a footy field playing AFL, NRL or any sport at that level in a diminished capacity cos they "deserve" to be there. Maybe the AFL should have an open round - let women and men play together - and show people how a woman would go up against Barry Hall or Jonathan Brown. This is the stupidest argument - in mixed tennis there has to be 1 woman and 1 man right? Not 2 women vs 2 men or any variation on that - why not kick up a stink about that??? I dont understand why this is still coming up - women can play AFL against women - noone is freaking out there is no mixed netball or mixed rugby league or rugby union.
Johnno
Guest
LoL ian, i agree i will not favour good looking woman over average 1's i will dream tonight about rucking out the likes of ell mcpherson megan gale, nigella lawson, jessica alba kylie mingle, i wont discriminate ian no matter what gender or appearance, if beuaitufl woman choose to play contact sport and ar eon the paddock they are there to be hit, shoulder charged smashed in the head nose, rucked out spear tackled whatever can happen on football field stays on it, look out ladies you don't want to enter a ruck with john atoehrwise there modelling days are over Ian .
amazonfan
Roar Guru
Yawn. Yet another comment about sex from the sex-obsessed. Just note that the only person who was talking about sex has been you, but since when would you care about reality?
Johnno
Guest
Ian i agree mate, wow elle mcpherson or mena gale may spill blodd on the rugby field by getting rucked out what a interesting sight. I think models wouldn't last a game of rugby , let alone the warm up, they would be of the moment they dirtied a fingernail let alone broken it . I They at half time would be asking for meek up not oranges, and saying who they need a manicure, and how there modellingcareers are over so soft. remember the sight when percy montgomery who was a bit off pretty boy, i thought in the 1998 tri nations match in NZ, jONAH lOMU AND tana Umaga were running straght at him after a kick was done into the corner , he had to dive on it to save the try and in process had to accept getting absolutely smashed by those 2 scary men, it was the biggest sign of rugby fear i have seen other than the french fullbacks pathetic attempt on jonah loom in 1999 RWCAsemi final but that try stills old of been scored , but percy was to worried to damage his pretty boy face smashed or face concussion, or a broken nose or by 2 of the scares looking men on a rugby field. Not suprisngly he was dropped after that match. i would not like to run into joanh loomu or Tana usage in a back street in kings cross late at night haha.
Ian Whitchurch
Guest
Johnno, DC, JOC and indeed Justin Bieber have the same rules as anyone else ... even including the Ella boys and that tackle-averse Wallaby David Campese ... if they are on the paddock, they are there to be hit, rucked, used as a stepladder, hit when looking at someone else, maneuvered onto the wrong line or smacked upside the head. At that point, it isnt about what bits you have, or who or what you like to sleep with, it is about who you are. And that is what I love about sport.
Aware
Guest
I'm going to bed. You two blokes are boring me with your kinky talk. Pleasant kinky dreams both of you. We can resume hostilities another day. I'm always up for it.
Aware
Guest
Backtracking now.
Ian Whitchurch
Guest
Hey,I'm not calling Dan Carter a five foot eight geek. Im certain he doesnt know who Hogger is, or what "rm -rf *" does
Johnno
Guest
LOL aware some bad men out thare aware. hOWEVER i don't object to rucking out pretty boys like DC and JOC bIEBER, lol
Aware
Guest
"That weak five foot eight geek they have at halfback". BIg talk. Go and challenge Dan Carter to a rumble then if you think he's weak.
Ian Whitchurch
Guest
Aware said "My wife just said she will box with you and Whitechurch, seeing as how you both enjoy mixing it with women in a sweaty, physical and close sense" I dont do boxing, at least I dont do Marquis of Queensberry rules, although the line between German swordsmanship and wrestling gets pretty freaking vague, as the various holds and such in Lichtenaueur, Mair, Mayer, Fiore and so on detail. Remember, 'gambit' came out of 'gambetto', which is an offer of a hold to put them into a false guard, or a false time.
amazonfan
Roar Guru
"My wife just said she will box with you and Whitechurch, seeing as how you both enjoy mixing it with women in a sweaty, physical and close sense." You really are obsessed with sex. Just a tip, not all male/female activity needs to involve sex.