Matfield joins Bulls Super coaching team

1 point why it is not to soon is this. 1)It is not a head coach job anyway, so it is less emotional when employed as assistant as you have less influence on selection issues. 2) And 2 probably his closest allies in his career, Danie Rossow and bakes Botha , have left the Bulls so no issues there with selection stuff. backs are different as eh would of had less to do with Morne stein and FDP as they were backs, and players like Hougarrd he did not play for like 10 years with.

I wonder also if its too soon. But I guess the only person who can answer that is VM. Whatever, I expect the Bulls line out skills are going to improve!

I always thought Fabien Pelous was pretty special. I'm not so sold on Thorn. I think he was integral to NZ, but didn't compare to many other 4 locks of his era.

Your 'point' is that he failed without making any reference to context or making any actual specific points or anything worth considering re: the actual wider points of rugby. This is schoolboy stuff. I repeat: repetition isn't a point, and that you thought he was in charge for 8 years renders what you are saying completely free of credibility. Allied to the fact that you have made various wild and unsubstantiated claims... Cringeworthy.

Too hard to disagree with that list.

I would add Colin Meads and Frik Du Preez into that mix...

Look... how basic is this? This is beyond simple. 1) I didn't say White wasn't a good coach. 2) Johnson wasn't a coach. Just leave it. Some of the stuff you're trotting out is cringeworthy. Feel free to carry on with the lunatic fringe behaviour in my absence...

I can say the same about you Ben. You have danced around with all sorts of statements and flaw picking while avoiding to admit too the only point I was making... Johnson failed and was simply not good enough. You can discredit me with every word you mutter its not going to change what I said... He failed because he was not good enough. Read it slowly, read it again and focus on just the last line... perhaps then we can move on. You are right I don't know everything about rugby but I know that England is capable of better.

Wow, you are happy to point out the White was not a good coach and yet he has done better than Johnson while having to put up with the political interference from the ANC. White has a better ratio against tougher opponents. Why don't you just come out and admit you are a hypocrite.

It was clear from your first sentence that you're a very unreasonable poster. You have multiple wild and frankly very bizarre comments, ignored key facts, failed to debate any specifics and failed to justify any of your comments. Repetition isn't an argument. You have no credibility on this whatsoever, so enjoy your prejudice. I think you'd have more fun on the Keo website to be honest...

No Ben its you who fails to see the key point. Johnson failed. He had no tougher job than any other top coach in the world. No amount of skating around this and pointing out flaws in what ever I say is going to disguise that MJ and the RFU has failed the English public and has set the standard slightly below mediocre. If that is good enough for you then it says more about you then it does my mistake filled statements.

In 2004 SA were very, very good. In 2005 they were less good, and in 2006 and 2007 they were plain poor by their standards. Record losses perhaps? Spankings in Europe? The side only moved beyond its one dimension when Eddie Jones jumped aboard, and then SA won a WC without facing a then top 5 IRB ranked side or a 3N side. Johnson isn't a coach - nor is a Sir, and nor did he 'coach' England for 8 years. Why would you think it is reasonable to compare NZ to England? When Johnson took over NZ were easily the best side in the world. No comparison, and no point... again.

Oh dear (shakes head)... This is all quite wearisome. You made a number of personal and childish comments against a rugby figure that you subsequently failed to substantiate. I responded by saying that your comments were OTT and inaccurate... which they were. That was my point, and it is pretty easy to follow. You don't really seem to grasp the key points here - Johnson had to build a squad. He inherited a terrible side with no settled core or extended squad. Some of the sides he put out were the youngest and least experienced rugby sides in English rugby history. Despite that he posted the best results seen in English rugby since its best ever period in 2003. The side that won in Sydney was younger and less experienced than its' Australian counterparts. I could name players like Corbisiero, Mullan, Hartley, Cole, Wilson, Doran-Jones, Lawes, Attwood, Croft, Haskell, Wood, Robshaw, Crane, Care, Youngs, Simpson, Flood, Monye, Banahan, Tuilagi, Ashton, Foden, Armitage... but I would imagine they would mean very little to you. The side that Jake White took over/built was nowhere near as young/inexperienced as the side that Johnson created, for example. I stated previously that he made mistakes, but he took on a very hard job and gained some good results. Pretty simple.

Ben S your statements on White just shows how little you know about South African Rugby.... perhaps you too are all over the place. Why cant you compare England and NZ... the only reason why is that NZ employ the best and take the game serious, they know how to run rugby, not the clown show that goes on in England. Average is not good enough for NZ, Johnson wont even get a super coaching role. Thats is the only reason why you cant compare...

You don't have a point beyond supporting a rugby figure that had more time then most and still failed. Supporting a bloke that by any other persons standard FAILED to do what he was hired for. Out of his depth and with no experience, he did not deliver. You think he did "ok" put your hands together for the below average achiever... So beside having a go at me, you have only managed to prove my point that he is average at best. If that is good enough for England that I feel sorry for their rugby future.

You're all over the place still. There is no point in comparing England to NZ. None, and as for White's winning record, so what? Aside from 04 and a few games in 05 SA were very mediocre under White. He just happened to coach a side that had some once in a generation players like Woodward in 03, except obviously that England side's achievements far outweighed anything that White's Boks ever managed. You don't have an argument.

Off topic .;... But who are the top 4 Locks EVER in your opinions. Me - Eales, Johnson , Matfield and maybe Brad Thorn.

You don't have a point beyond insulting a rugby figure. You thought that Johnson was a Sir and that he was in charge of England for 8 years. No more needs to be said. You've obviously been drinking something from tap... You don't seem to have any understanding of English rugby, so why bother commenting on it? Making personal comments about a person you don't even know is just odd. Johnson took over a terrible England side with very few experienced players, no settled XV and developed a young and capable squad. The incoming coach will now have a host of players to choose from, a luxury that Johnson never had. He took his squads to their two best 6N finishes since 2003 and won away in Australia. His side smashed Australia, Argentina, Scotland, Wales, France and Italy. He also took England to their highest IRB ranking since 2003. There's not much you can say against that. He made errors, but none more than Deans, De Villiers, Kidney, Gatland or Lievremont, so some of your initial comments are simply ridiculous.

Top Tier nations deserve top tier coaches and MJ does not fall under that cat, he should have realised that he was out of his depth and did what was right for the country... instead is ego compelled him to stay. 07 Jake White, won RWC and built a team that lasted. RWC 11 Henry arguably the best coach in the world, win ratio of 80 something percent... MJ 2 six nations and 55% poor no matter which way you are going to try and sugar coat it.

55% God he got beaten by PDV and he had to deal with the tri nations. More fail, we got fail on tap.