Clark, Twelvetrees get England rugby call

Whats with this "need" stuff? Clark is clearly not needed with Robshaw as captain and playing well and both Wood and Croft very good blindside players. I like Burns at 10 but I think Farrell has been very good in the majority of his test matches. Goode was excellent in Fodens absence. Imo England will be favs in 2015. The age of quality players such as the Youngs bros, the Vunipola bros, Morgan, Cole, Corbisiero, Goode, Burns, Farrell, Tuilagi, Marler, Lawes, Launchbury, Ford, Wade, Joseph makes me think that Eng will be the ones to beat in their home WC.

Theres players that make the step up to test level and those who dont. some say Twelvetrees won;t.. Have to wait and see. Whichever England need a fly half LIKE Freddie Burns to make the step up as, much as I rate flood, England arent going to have consistent success at the top level with him or Farrell in the side, they need a flair player at 10 who is a threat and knows how to unleash his backs. in terms of delivering the goods I want to see Foden in the team as I feel he delivers consistently in attack at test level. I understand the need for continuity but the sooner waldrom and a couple of others go the better. Clark reminds me of a young Danny Grewcock, he will still make errors but he has that mentality that England need.

If Lancaster saw Joseph as a utility player then why does he keep playing him at 13 off the bench and moving other players? Simply having the 23 jersey doesn't automatically make you a utility player. Joseph has not represented England at any position apart from 13. There really isn't any more to it.

Ben, Lancaster uses J.Joseph as a bench player. Coaches normally use utilities on the bench. Joseph does play wing, Joseph does play centre, Joseph can play full back. To say he is not a utility is wrong imo and to say that Lancaster clearly doesnt see him as a utility is also wrong. J.Joseph has represented England at fullback, wing and now centre. I would consider that a utility and Lancasters use of him on the bench suggests to me that he also knows this and sees him as flexable and thats why he is used as the bench player in the first place.

Didn't Joseph play on the wing at U20 level? I don't think it's unreasonable to see him as a potential wing option.

Same here, cant wait for the tournament to start. PSA announced that Pascal Papé will captain France this year i.o Dusautoir. Dunno if it means that Nyanga (and/or Ouedraogo) has a chance to retain his spot in the starting XV, dont think so really but who knows. why change a winning team though. Plenty to look forward to this year.

He lives next door to Mr Mole and Freddy the Fox...

Really not sure all the debate about proper wingers really matters that much with Barritt in the line. I'm with HT on this one - may as well pick someone out there who can do more than typical wingers duties and don't necessarily agree Browns positioning against the Boks was any worse than many games I've seen Ashton play for example. Surely this has to be the tourno he gives Twelvetrees a decent run of games. Is there really anything new we need to know about Barritt and for all his heart and bravery, don't we all wish there was a different option?

It's his professional wrestling name

Yep, or 36 as he's commonly known.

But how is Joseph a utility? Because Smith has shifted him about? It's clear Lancaster doesn't see him that way. Tuilagi used to play wing. He's only been playing 13 for 3 seasons. The talk in England a while back was about shifting Tuilagi to wing and Joseph to 13. I don't see Clark as a locking option, but he's listed as such. He used to be an out and out 7 at age group, but having grown to 6'3/6'4 he was shifted to 6. I still think he could do a job at 7 if necessary as he is a real pest over the ball, but I don't think he's as capable as Neil Back has stated this week. Yeah, exactly, one injury, although I think after what we saw with Wood in the Autumn at the set piece that Lancaster doesn't feel the need to have another middle jumping 5 in the senior squad.

How do you know fitness isn't a problem? Warren Gatland commented on it recently with regard to Mike Phillips, and players like Tom Smith, Paul Volley, John Daniell, Tom Palmer and Perry Freshwater have all made comments about the training routines of French clubs. Unless Armitage has dramatically improved his fitness, which I doubt, then he has no real case for inclusion into the EPS. Robshaw has been the best 7 in England and has by and large played very, very well for England. I don't think it's accurate to say Brown is playing well on the wing. He played well, and on that one game is probably the man who deserves the next shot but it's not like he has a (to quote Robbie Deans) any background there. If he continues to play well there then fair enough, but IMO he is an out and out 15. Conversely, I'm pleased with the options on the right wing. I just think we need players to bring the best out of Ashton. The only player to have done that to date is Flood, and to a lesser extent Cueto and Foden.

With J.Joseph being a utility, it is true that he is very unlikely to play FB with Brown and Goode playing but Im sure he would be considered as a wing as well as a centre otherwise I see no point in forcing Tuilagi onto the wing. Surely in that situation Joseph would go to the wing first? Clark is only 6'3 and surely not an international locking option? Anyway they only need 3 locks and if 1 gets injured they just pull in somebody from the wider group.

Are you seriously telling me there's someone called Twelvetrees?

Lancaster is tying to justify his reluctance to include players who play in France. Armitages fitness is not a problem. He has only had 5 caps from nearly 4 years ago and judging a player in obvious form based on 4 years ago is flawed to say the least. I hate the phrase "If it isnt broken..." but in this case it applies to an extent with Brown. If Brown is playing well I cant see any point in worry. Would be nice if Eng pulled a Savea out of somewhere.

Brown was excellent against NZ, but that doesn't mean he's a natural fit in the 11 jersey. I'd certainly prefer to see an out and out winger. Wade is defensively inconsistent, very fallible under the high ball and a natural 14, and Joseph has no real history of wing play. We are just lacking 11s in England ATM, but as Launchbury has shown, who knows what people are capable of when given the chance. Barritt has had one noticeably good game for England. His width of passing is terrible, and for a former 10 (albeit a SA 10) his kicking game is nonexistent. He's a robust defender, but he rarely crosses the gainline in attack. He will likely start the bigger games, but Lancaster seems to realise his obvious limitations. I don't see the point in Waldrom either, but there you go. Perhaps Lancaster thinks it's a little too soon for Vunipola? I would imagine that Marler will start ahead of Vunipola, with Corbisiero looking unlikely to feature at this point in time. I think Armitage is just a good club player. He has always looked off the pace when playing for England, and it's generally recognised that players in France are less fit than in England. I made a point a few months ago that Lancaster echoed recently, that Armitage is playing behind what is one of the best non-Test packs in world rugby, so of course he's going to look good. Also, there are very few over the ball 7s playing in the Top 14 so he has an automatic advantage. As an England fan I'm content with Robshaw playing 7. He's a warrior - always gives his all.

Corbisiero Hartley Cole Launchbury Parling Wood/Croft Robshaw Morgan Youngs Flood/Farrell Brown Barritt Tuilagi Ashton Goode Vunipola, Youngs, Wilson, Lawes, Croft/Wood, Care, Farrell/Flood, Joseph. Is the team they will go with imo.

Lancaster has only ever played Joseph at 13, either starting or off the bench, and being shifted around by Brian Smith doesn't automatically mean he is capable of playing wing or fullback to a high enough level. This is the same Brian Smith who has played Watson on the wing and fullback, Steven Shingler at 10, 12 and 13, Geraghty at 10 and 12 and Homer at 15 and wing and Tagicakibau at wing and centre. That aside, my point was where he fits in for England. He has started with Tuilagi at 12, so if he starts again does he feature alongside Barritt or Twelvetrees, yet another new combination. Brown has had one good Test on the wing. His positioning against the Springboks was poor. Clark is included in the locking group, but I imagine the fact Croft has moonlighted as a temporary lock has been considered by the coaches.

It was a head butt in the JWC I think. Still, grooming him to take over from Robshaw at openside could pay off as long as he doesnt lose control...again.

I think this is a reasonably strong squad, but I don't know if I agree with the selection of Clark, there is agressive, yes, but there is just being a plain thug and I tend to think Clark falls into that category. There was the elbow breaking incident, which was disgusting, but he was also sent off in the U/20's WC final a few years back after being yellow carded earlier in the game. If he carries on like that at top international level, he'll get rubbed out reasonably quickly I'd imagine...