Thurston isn't better than Johns

Well at least JT isn't a drug cheat! It never ceases.to amaze me that Andrew John's can show hios face and be asked his opinion when there has been so much about drugs in sport - particularly the last few years (and he is a self confessed drug cheat)

When theres an incumbent, particularly one who is the captain of the side (Toovey), and your are only 21, thats what happens. Least they found a spot for him, people like Lewis were left out all together by the likes of Kenny in the test side. Inglis plays centre for SOO because Slater cant play any other position. Thurston switched to no.6 right on Lockyers retirement so Cronk could take the 7 spot, which is his only position. Being included in the side outside your regular position is a positive not a negative. Any Johns was never dropped thats complete BS.

I hear people say this often but its completely bogus, Kimmorley only played when Johns was injured I think it stems from a bogus wiki page. In 1999 Kimmorley replaced Johns in the test team due to groin injury.In 2000 Kimomorley played Origin due to Johns having two operations for an ankle injury. In 2001 Johns didnt play State of Origin due to knee injury, Kimmorley filled in. If Johns was good to play for NSW, he played, never dropped on form. Leave the commentry to the experts Dav.

nunce, John played hooker for Toovey at Halfback for three years in SOO, Johns had to play a bench spot when Kimmorly went to Half Back and moved Toovey to Hooker, Johns was dropped from the side altogether! after an injury or 2 he found himself back on a bench spot for the last 2 games.

Johns had 3 years at Half Back and was dropped for Kimmorley, are you a league commentator and you still don't know that .... jeez Louise .... hope they are paying you peanuts!

It's always good to see different names for the one title. Fascinating. Johns was rated because of his skills in handling football in the field, just all the others. He was a freak of nature. When the ball was in his hands, anything was expected from anywhere. Look at the halves that he played alongside that time. They weren't much competitive. It was a one man show. He is the kind of player that can single-handedly steer a wooden- sponer to premiership glory. Im not saying he could have done that, had he been a player, but he has done that when he was swinging. He was like the Jarryd Hayne of his era. I don't see anybody in your list of halfbacks who is close to being him. As a matter of fact, I don't think I'll ever see one. If only Jarryd Hayne was a halfback, I'd choose him.

Thurston can be brilliant, no doubt, but he's too hit and miss. Just look at the Cowboys, they have two test props, Thurston and Tate. Trying to back the Cowboys in a match is near impossible, it all depends on whether Thurston feels like stepping up, its almost as hard as backing the Warrioirs. Regarding the SOO analogy, I dont see it. What if Joey was there in place of Thuston, im sure QLD would be still 8 in a row. If you want to compare a modern day player against Andrew Johns try Cam Smith. This guy could be the greatest ever. Of the last 7 games that Cam Smith didnt play, Melbourne have lost by an average of 22 points. That means that without Cam Smith one of the greatest teams of the modern era would actually be bottom dwellers. Thats staggering.

There is no doubt that Andrew Johns is the best half back and also the best player of all time He had all the skills, and read the play at least three or four moves ahead He was innovative as well, setting new standards in Rugby League His aurora was such that players from all teams rated him as the very best to play against To manage all this while having bipolar and taking drugs that decreased his performance is truly remarkable

I believe all comments provided are based on each analysis. To my point of view, I strongly think we should be judging this great half-backs on their performance, @ the highest level of football that they ever played and that is the STATE OF ORIGIN simply because, state of origin is where the best of the best are picked to compete over their opposite numbers. So looking back and judging, theres no half-back that ever won for his state @ a consistant performance, apart from Johnathan Thurston himself, for 8 solid years and still counting. So JT is the greatest half-back of modern era.

That's a fair question, but I can't help but think Cronk has got it pretty easy at the storm. Not a lot of playmakers through time have had the best dummy half and fullback at their disposal. Not to mention a team structure inforced by Craig Bellamy

Johns was not quick enough to get out of the way of Jamie Goddard in Origin, when Goddard flogged him. The only time Johns was fast, was getting to where ever the drugs were. I agree with Kevin Martin, concentrate on players who relied on skill, not chemicals.

shouldn't be comparing Johns with all of the clean half backs and 5/8s of the last 25 yrs. as he was taking drugs all through his career..

In my opinion Ryan, I have Joey at the top of my lost easily to be completely honest. These kind of things obviously depend upon the type of criteria you measure these guys by, but for me the most important things are consistency, an all round game, skill and competitiveness. I'd probably rank Thurston the highest in the competitiveness column but in all of the other areas I would have to give it to Johns. This is a man who tackled better than most backrowers in his era, performed miracles for his club week in and week out, but most importantly for mine, was a wonderful innovator. Who could forget his deadly banana kicks (something we NEVER see anymore) that he could land on a five cent piece, precision long passing, kicking on the in step and out step and torpedo bombs that brought rain. I'm a sucker for players who are creative and try to break the mould and set trends - Joey was certainly that. Let's not forget that he brought the Knights two premierships as well, Thurston will need to bring home some silverware for the Cowboys to make a challenge for that mantle. Great player though!

I think I can safely say you are a nsw supporter too !!

You forgot to mention 7 origin series in a row, to maybe 3 in a row.

As a newcastle fan I can safely say that while there were some rep players in both the 1997 & 2001 teams there certainly wasn't a team full of them There were some very hard working players in that team. But without Johns in the team the teams ability to win games dropped considerably. He was the ultimate tough competitor who hated losing. He was also capable of getting his team mates to play to their best in games. He could control a game, had a brilliant kicking game, great passing game, tough defender and utilised his team mates capabilities well. The reason NSW have not won a series since is because we do not currently have a halfback capable of directing a team, controlling a game and utilising their team mates abilities. There is no point having the likes of Hayne, Uate, Jennings, Morris & Stewart if your halves are not going to utilise them. This is where Thurston and Cronk leave the NSW halves behind - they don't always have to do brilliant individual stuff, they just have to use the abilities the guys in the backline have. It is a pity that NSW has never developed the young halves and five eights we have had over the last couple of years, instead we have tossed them in and spat them out. No wonder we can't win a series even if the forwards do dominate. That said at this stage of his career Thurston is still behind Johns. I don't think the difference is ability, it seems to be the fact that Johns was able to inspire his team mates to perform to their best while Thurston's team mates sometimes seem to be letting him down. Things might be different though if his team mates performed better and on a more consistent basis. As an individual, Thurston may not be the best defender he is still one of the most talented halves in the game. I rate him just behind Johns.

Once Thurston accumulates the quantity of personal accolades as Joey did, then we will consider him the greatest. 3 Dally M's, came 2nd on 3 other occassions and came 3rd once So in his 8 of his injury free seasons he was either top or in the top 3 players, 6 times 2 Golden Boots Retired as the leading individual point scorer in NRL History Provan Summon Award 5 straight years (fans favourite player) Rugby League Week Player of the Year 5 straight years Newcastle was an absolute basket case without him, I love this quote "The influence he could have on a struggling team and ability to bring those around him to a new level was unique. No game typifies that better than in 2001 when he came back from 10 weeks out with a knee injury into a Knights team that had been beaten by Parramatta 40-0 the week before and 46-18 by the Bulldogs the week before that. Joey scored two tries and set up six others in a 44-0 victory over Brisbane." And is it a coincidence that NSW have not won a series since he left?

You say that langer had a great team around him I think that Joey had the best number 9 Australian centers front rowers and origin fullbacks and wingers all around him when he played so it is quite easy to look good in that company , also you said in his prime he dominated half back , langer was called in from the Ipswich jets at 19 and dominated from day one but we just came to expect brilliance of him , same with Lockyer he was that good every week and dominated from day dot ,that we came to expect too , Joey was just a hyped up answer to Wally Lewis because you guys needed a king but you didn't come close although all the years of talking him up made him look better , langer was the most consistent and Lockyer for mine dominated the game for longer than anyone , Joey was good but he lacked the focus to make him as good as he could have been ( drugs maybe ) that said they may have helped him too , Lewis Lockyer langer long way to Joey and thurston is there with him now also cam smith is too , that is just my opinion , I expect a gob full in return so have fun with this !!