Can the Wallabies bash the Lions tight five?

By Ben.S / Roar Guru

The 2009 Lions pack saw a number of Gatland’s favourites selected, and the repercussions were immediate and devastating. The composition of the pack for the first Test was hideously unbalanced, and the forwards were duly battered by the Boks.

Whilst the Springboks do have noticeably large forwards, the lazy stereotype is that the Wallabies don’t have big forwards, however, this is media myth.

The last few times the Wallabies have played the All Blacks, for example, the Wallaby forwards were on average taller and heavier.

The All Black forwards were just technically more competent, won the collisions, and therefore the game. Size is an irrelevance unless it’s paired with technical accuracy and intensity.

Another media myth is how poor the Wallaby scrum is.

I have seen the Wallaby scrum bulldozed on a number of occasions, but games like the November Test versus France have been exaggerated in my opinion, likewise the better days have also been peppered with hyperbole.

In 2001 the Lions scrum was tipped to dominate, but as soon as Glen Panaho was dropped for Rod Moore the Wallaby scrum had an edge.

Lions series elicit different responses from different players, so who knows which players will step up to the plate for Australia? I would be surprised to see the Lions earning any pushover tries.

In the front row Benn Robinson is a clever operator (when fully fit) and with Stephen Moore he has a robust and experienced tight hooker to bind on. Saia Fainga’a is a clear weakness at Test level, however. With James Horwill and then possibly Sitaleki Timani there will be a bulky lock pair in tandem – although size is arguably all that Timani offers.

Rob Simmons has had an improved Super season, and he would offer that balance in the lineout – not to mention a jumping relationship with Horwill, but I have a feeling that Deans will look toward the bigger man.

Ben Alexander is never going to be bracketed as world class, but he’s experienced and had a very good start to the Super Rugby, however, if Deans does look to somebody like Dan Palmer (who has struggled in recent weeks) then the Lions will likely have an edge in front row mobility around the park.

Overall where I think the Lions forwards will have the serious edge is in terms of mobility, athleticism and dynamism.

I think the Wallaby pack is currently carrying too much stodge, and/or journeymen. Can Benn Robinson match Cian Healy around the park, for example? Can Timani match the work rates and athleticism of Richie Gray Ian Evans?

How does Dave Dennis compare to a player like Tom Croft or Sean O’Brien? The Australia options at 7 are all excellent prospects, but even then, that potential advantage could be negated by a strong performance from the Lions tight five.

I am presuming that Robbie Deans will lean towards the usual suspects as he has done so often in the past. I don’t expect many new caps in the pack, if any at all. Horwill is a bullish player, and Higginbotham is an excellent and aggressive athlete, but the Waratahs forwards have generally seemed rather sluggish and I envisage them making up the bulk of the pack.

Even a player like Stephen Moore, who I am a big fan of, has become increasingly more sluggish as he’s aged, and with no TPN to provide impact off of the bench Australia will have to rely on inferior Super players.

Deans may feel he has to select a large pack, but to fixate on size is to totally miss the point – a lesson Deans should have learnt from the matches against Martin Johnson’s England. The Lions can call on men who not only excel at their core forward duties, but who can also carry, support and spread the ball for 80 minutes.

In the circumstances I think it would be a mistake simply to look to dominate the Wallaby forwards and play 10-man rugby when there are forwards and backs that can play an interlinking 15 man game that the Wallabies, on recent history, cannot match. The style of the 2009 Lions must be the benchmark.

Gatland has made comments regarding the need to score tries in Australia, so I hope we don’t see the one-dimensional power game that Wales play.

The tight five:

Cian Healy selects himself in the 1 jersey. He’s dramatically improved his scrummaging thanks to Greg Feek’s tuition at Leinster, and has maintained his ball carrying prowess. For a prop he’s an exceptional athlete and is arguably the most dynamic prop in world rugby.

He has a noticeably aggressive streak too (as felt by Dan Cole), and offers so much around the field, popping up down the middle and also in the wider channels. He also has the advantage of having had a very good day at the office against Alexander previously.

Gethin Jenkins has a reputation as a poor tourist and a sometimes reluctant scrummager, but he dramatically improved his form across the Six Nations and formed a potent set-piece with Hibbard and Adam Jones, although I think the Welsh dominance against England in the Six Nations was down to Jones on Marler, and not Jenkins on Cole, as has widely been assumed.

Jenkins provides a point of difference to Healy thanks to his work rate in defence around the ruck whilst Healy plays in wider channels.

The media tend to portray Jenkins as being this all singing, all dancing prop – which he was in the early stages of his career, but he actually plays a very tight game, much like Sheridan used to for England. Jenkins can also cover 3 if necessary and is a Lions veteran.

I think he’s incredibly fortunate to tour given the exceptional form that Andrew Sheridan has shown in France this season, but he has a working relationship with Gatland and the Welsh tight five, who are travelling en masse. That should be a real fillip even in terms of little things like knowing the running angles of your locks, the timing of lifting the locks etc.

Mako Vunipola provides serious impact from the bench – such a vital area of the game – and has shown a real game-on-game improvement when playing for Saracens and England. Generally he has scrummaged well when called upon, and I can see him thriving in Australia as he’s such a powerful and intelligent ball carrier, has good timing when entering the line, and is also a strong challenger over the ball.

I’m a fan of Ryan Grant too, but I think he is more suited to wet conditions, and Alex Corbisiero simply hasn’t played enough rugby. I also like Paul James, and he can cover tighthead too, but his overall game is somewhat limited in comparison to Vunipola who could go on to become an England legend.

Adam Jones and Dan Cole select themselves. Euan Murray was an option, but despite what Scott Johnson says about his ability in the loose I disagree, and don’t think there’s room solely for a set-piece specialist, especially with scrum management currently such a lottery.

Like Jenkins, Jones grew into the Six Nations, but his scrummaging, which was badly missed in the Autumn, proved too much for Italy, Scotland and England. D

espite a comically rotund appearance he’s more than comfortable with the ball in hand – more so than Cole, and on the 2009 Lions tour he was clearly one of the fitter forwards on display, consistently one of the first players to the breakdown.

As soon as he returned to the fore in the 6N Wales garnered an increasing number of scrum penalties which could be vital in Australia. He also presents as a thoroughly decent bloke, and good tourist.

In contrast to Jones Dan Cole had a quiet Six Nations by his standards, but he has been playing in front of a pair of callow locks since the retirement of Simon Shaw (Lawes, Palmer, Parling and Launchbury), thus I don’t think it’s a coincidence that with a bonafide tighthead lock in Louis Deacon he is such a force for Leicester, having displaced Castrogiovanni.

He has struggled on occasion against shorter props, but with a bigger man like Evans and scrummaging hookers like Hibbard and Hartley I think he could be very important in Australia coming off the bench and during the midweek games.

If the Lions dominate the scrums in the non-Test games then the referees might be less reluctant to penalise them during the actual internationals.

I also think it’s pretty informative that other international players speak so highly of Cole. He’s a class act, and his work over the ball is superb for a prop, and a tall prop at that – although sometimes he does get on the wrong side of referees in his attempts to compete, not always choosing the best time to refrain.

I’m not really sure on what basis that Matt Stevens was selected? He’s weighing in at around 20 stones these days, and although people still reference the fact that he is a good contributor with ball in hand he is nowhere near the standard of Healy and Vunipola and is a different sort of player to the one he was years ago.

He’s also a very erratic scrummager. Granted he can cover 1, but very badly, as we saw during the 2011 World Cup. I know that he’s a very jocular man, and a good tourist, but I see him as a weak link. David Wilson has been in good form this season, has been playing Test football and can also cover loosehead. Frankly it’s a very bizarre selection. Stevens hasn’t even been that good for his club side.

It feels bizarre that Matthew Rees has fallen so far off the radar, but Richard Hibbard has stepped up to the plate for Wales. Hibbard had a very good Six Nations and is the preferred starter at this stage, but personally I prefer Hartley on the basis that Hartley is the more intelligent footballer. Hibbard is the bigger man, but Hartley plays with his head up, has a good off-loading game and was excellent in South Africa last summer. He’s a proven dry track footballer, and is a leader.

Hartley also likes to set up mauls in midfield by turning into contact fending with his forearms, which the Wallaby pack might struggle to defend with big locks like Evans, Gray and O’Connell able to surge onto the comparatively big target that he sets.

I see Hibbard either as a Test contender or nothing. I don’t think he is an impact substitute, and when he carries it’s nose to the ground stuff, which can always be exploited by good opensides (which the Australians have aplenty) as you’re not aware where your support is. Hibbard is a heavy hitter, but I just think he’s a little one-dimensional at this stage in his career and would be more suited to touring New Zealand.

Like Hibbard, Tom Youngs is also a ground to the nose type of carrier, but he has an outstanding leg drive which tends to keep opposition defenders unable to gain purchase when trying to pilfer the ball. He likes to carry through rucks down the middle, and has an eye for a gap. When playing off the bench Youngs has added immediate dynamism and injected some urgency into the game.

I don’t necessarily view him as a Test starter, but he could be a real fillip playing as a substitute. Richardt Strauss is a similar player, and it’s very unfortunate that he was unable to feature for Ireland this year as he is a real livewire.

Youngs is also a very good defender, and he hits players low, akin to chopping down a tree, which allows the supporting forwards to get in over the ball. However, he has had various wobbles at the lineout, and it’s been suggested that he’s a naïve scrummager.

Obviously it’s very unfortunate that Rory Best has again missed Lions selection. He is apparently a very strong scrummager, generally a very good lineout technician, is excellent over the ball, and has a good work rate. I think that he’s a quality player, if not a little unfashionable.

The second row is one of the more contentious areas of selection with an abundance of 4 locks: Davies, Evans, Hines, Hamilton, Gray, Ryan, Lawes and Launchbury.

I am a big fan of Ian Evans. In many ways he reminds me of Simon Shaw – huge wingspan, clever footballer. He has very soft hands for a big man, runs good angles and seems to be all over the pitch, although obviously he doesn’t compare to Shaw as a defensive mauler.

Defensively his tackling stats are really up there, and he could really thrive on the Australian pitches. I also think his compatriot Bradley Davies is an excellent option at 4, albeit a different type of player: Davies carries down the middle to really tie in the defence, and he could be used to combat the presence of Timani/Douglas, but again he has not featured in the 6N.

Richie Gray didn’t experience a vintage Six Nations, and his form has clearly dipped since joining Sale Sharks, and the selection of form players is vital on a Lions tour. That aside, I think Gray is too loose to play 4 at this stage in his career, and there’s an element of the headless chicken to his play.

On form he could be devastating, and perhaps being surrounded by elite players like Jones and O’Connell will bring the best out of him. One issue I do have is that I don’t see where he fits into Gatland’s plans? With Scotland he plays with a real dog of a 4 in James Hamilton, which allows Gray a certain freedom, however, on this tour he’s been picked as a tighthead lock. Does he hit enough rucks? I’m not sure.

Nathan Hines was an option as he has an excellent off-loading game and an overtly aggressive streak, but again he has not been playing Test rugby, and so it’s hard to gauge his ability to step up at this juncture in his career. His former Scotland locking partner James Hamilton has also been mentioned by various pundits, but he’s basically a wet weather player with an awful disciplinary record. I just don’t see what he could bring to a Lions tour with a side trying to (hopefully) play a brand of attacking rugby? He’s a hard man, but he often oversteps the mark, and gives away unnecessary penalties at the breakdown. He has a ridiculous habit of trying to kick the ball out of the 9s hands, and likes to plant a leg straight down the middle of the breakdown.

Donnacha Ryan is another hard man, but smaller and able to cover 6. He’s aggressive, and has been calling the lineout with Ireland, but might have suffered, along with Rory Best, due to Ireland’s 6N lineout wobbles. I’m personally a big fan of his and think the dry grounds would have been perfect for him. In my mind he would have been an excellent midweek tourist.

I’m also particularly gutted that Joe Launchbury was omitted. Launchbury is not your typical four lock, but neither is he a real 5 lock either. He plays somewhere in between the positions which highlights the fact that he is simply a quality footballer, who is generally error free and does the basics exceedingly well. Allied to that he is an excellent athlete.

He is still comparatively physically callow for a 4 lock, but his all-round play is something that Timani just can’t match: his chasing game at re-starts, his support play, his anticipation of the breakdown, his cover tackling. He’s a very complete footballer for a big man, and is more suited to hard, dry surfaces than soft, wet European conditions. I think a Lions jersey could have brought out the best in him, especially when surrounded by tight five players like Healy, Best, Adam Jones and O’Connell. It’s no coincidence that he was last night voted England’s player of the year.

Courtney Lawes was also possibly worth considering, as he is dynamic and has played so well against Australia for England previously, but his injury problems have held him back from developing as a lock, and he is still more of an athlete than a rugby player, and yet another lock who is neither a 4 nor a 5. He is competent in the air, but he doesn’t put any tangible pressure on the opposition either at the lineout or the re-start. As in impact substitute he would add value, but there’s too many good locks ahead of him at this juncture.

Parling is another incredibly mobile lock with a relentless work rate. He isn’t the biggest, but he has a penetrative running game, hitting the line late and running intelligent angles. He’s also all elbows and knees which makes him difficult to hit hard and legally. Like Ben Kay he joined Leicester Tigers from an unfashionable club, and then cemented himself in the England jersey.

The England lineout has had a few blips with him in charge, noticeably against South Africa and Wales, but against South Africa Tom Wood was overused, and in both cases Tom Youngs was the hooker.

Obviously the lineout is a team effort, but Youngs is still a rookie and is prone to the occasional bout of yips. Significantly, Parling was one of the only England players to come away from the Wales debacle with his reputation intact, if not enhanced.

AW Jones looked very strong on his return from injury, but I don’t think he the sort of athlete to really excel in what will likely be very three fast games. He really struggled in 2009, and like Hibbard I feel that he is more a wet weather footballer.

Obviously Gatland has a good working relationship with him, and he is a clever lineout leader, who apparently is the clichéd consummate professional. He’s also an excellent re-start forward, and with more tries coming from lineouts than scrums it’s going to be a huge area this summer.

Paul O’Connell has also looked very strong for Munster upon his return – his performance against Harlequins was epic, but I do feel that he overplays his hand when carrying the ball a la Steve Borthwick, and he isn’t the most natural footballer, but he is very good at the breakdown, and his lineout work could be vital against the Wallabies. He again has that experience which tends to be so crucial on Lions tours.

In the absence of Nathan Sharpe the Wallabies will likely be reliant on Higginbotham and Dennis (potentially Simmons), with neither player yet to convince in a Wallaby jersey. The lineout is such a key phase of play, as is the restart area, and I would envisage the Lions having an advantage here.

Further, the Lions can call on excellent scrummagers, and genuine impact players. With 20 minutes to go you could have Vunipola, Youngs, Cole and Gray entering the field: size, pace and power. In that respect I think the tight five selected by Gatland is far more rounded and balanced than the parallel 2009 selection. There’s also a number of players who are very strong at challenging for turnover ball, and against players like Hooper and Gill this will be vital, as it’s one area the media automatically assume Australian dominance.

The Crowd Says:

2013-05-26T10:44:25+00:00

fredstone

Guest


Lambie's not too bad, probably better than Barnes. Katrakillis is definetly better than Barnes, JOC and Beale and I think the only 10 that actually created an actual try in the stormers reds game was Jantjies. Oh and Goosen is out... But in the longterm I think he's gonna be better than all those named above, including the toxic avenger.

AUTHOR

2013-05-25T15:12:59+00:00

Ben.S

Roar Guru


I literally can't believe that. After Leicester were awarded that scrum penalty I walked downstairs to boil the kettle. I missed it... I heard Barnes warn him a few minutes earlier. What a fool.

2013-05-25T15:08:25+00:00

Rugby Fan

Roar Guru


Hartley has just been red-carded in the Aviva final. The initial reports say he abused the ref. Parise picked up a ban 6Nfor a similar offence, so Hartley might miss the Lions if there is any follow-up. Rory Best an obvious replacement,

2013-05-25T12:58:55+00:00

Well Ruck me.

Guest


The Welsh side toured in 2012 but was 6 nations champions. The Welsh side at the WC was red hot and Australia beat them in NZ and then in Wales after the WC. The performances against Russia and USA were poor?! They scored 21 tries in those 2 games! They only beat SA due to one of their players playing well? Its clear you want to believe that Australia was poor in 2011 but they were better than everyone except NZ so I disagree very very strongly. You play down everything they did well and play up everything that went wrong. I can not reason with you because no matter what I say you will play it down. In 2011 Australia was 4-2 against the top 3 and won 70% of their games. If any other team in the world besides NZ and SA achieved this it would be their best year for over a decade or actually ever for most top 10 sides. For Australia its a poor year?

AUTHOR

2013-05-25T12:26:37+00:00

Ben.S

Roar Guru


It's all subjective, but when sides don't play their top players that generally tends to undermine the value of any wins. It's probably not a coincidence that SA and NZ didn't win the 3N in 2007 and 2011 but went on to win the WC. The Welsh side that toured Australia was by no means red hot. How could they be when the last international was in March? Re: the WC the Australian performances were basically pretty turgid. Losing to Ireland was a huge body blow, and realistically Australia only beat SA due to an exceptional performance from Pocock and Bryce Lawrence. They were then absolutely smashed by NZ in a manner far more convincing than the scoreline suggests. Even the performances against Russia and the USA were poor. Given that Deans had 4 years to build toward the WC there was absolutely no suggestion of forward planning, as evidenced by the removal of the captaincy from Elsom, the creation of a new midfield and the reversion to conservative tactics that totally negated the abilities of Genia and Cooper. I said the NZ forwards were vulnerable as a number of senior players were/are out of form and clearly close to being past their best. I also said there was a lack of depth in key positions. Hardly controversial stuff. If you think Australia had a good year in 2011 then I'm not particularly fussed. Like I say, it's all subjective, and a lot of Roarers seem to have exactly the same opinion that I do. Anyway, this is totally off-topic. I raised the issue of the technical competency of the Australian forwards, and you have failed to engage with that.

2013-05-25T11:52:02+00:00

Well Ruck me.

Guest


Yes beating SA in SA and the number 1 side in the world means a lot. Their WC was horrific? It was better than every team except for NZs in my opinion. They beat SA and the red hot Welsh team. Look I can recall you playing down the European player of the year not long ago and now you are playing down the team with the 2nd best year in world rugby in 2011!? I also read you playing down the All Blacks forwards so I guess we do differ in whats quality. Who was better at the WC besides Australia, I would argue NZ and Wales was also good but Australia beat Wales. So apparently every team besides NZ had a horror WC, is that what you are saying? Look I know you will say "Im not talking results". Im not excusing the Samoa game but what I am saying is that it doesnt define a year that was hugely successfull in all other areas. But to dismiss all of Australias successes in 2011 and use the reasoning that it was a WC year so it doesnt count and so Australia wasnt good that year is an argument I will never understand. I would argue that NZ was the only team in the world that had a better year. Even in 2012 when Australia was over the place with injury and form issues, they still came out of that year better than all of the worlds teams besides NZ and SA. So Australia must be incredibly lucky or they are doing something right.

AUTHOR

2013-05-25T11:11:10+00:00

Ben.S

Roar Guru


Just for the sake of it, my starting tight five: 1. Healy, 2. Hartley, 3. Adam Jones, 4. Evans, 5. O'Connell; 16. Vunipola, 17. Tom Youngs, 18. Cole, 19. Gray

AUTHOR

2013-05-25T10:37:23+00:00

Ben.S

Roar Guru


I repeat: I'm not talking about results. And as biltongbek points out, the pack didn't do particularly well in some of those games. 3N tournaments aren't particularly valuable in WC years due to sides resting and rotating players. If you are going to write-off the Samoa game for a similar reason, then the 3N victory becomes less sparkling all of a sudden. Allied to that the WC campaign was close to horrific.

2013-05-25T07:27:11+00:00


Wallaby pack didn't dominate two of those wins against SA,

2013-05-25T07:15:23+00:00

Well Ruck me.

Guest


Beating SA 3 from 3. Beating Wal. Winning the 3 nations. Beating NZ. Gaining the #2 ranking. Coming 3rd at the WC. Im sure you will bring up the loss to Samoa as if 1 game where debutants, fringe players and bench players were used defines a year. Go ahead Ben, tell me why a tophey winning, #2 ranking gaining, 70+% earning year was bad. Oh they lost to Ireland right. No team except for every team besides NZ would ever do that.

2013-05-25T07:01:55+00:00

Jerry

Guest


Other way round - Boers are the Dutch descendants.

AUTHOR

2013-05-25T06:46:21+00:00

Ben.S

Roar Guru


I'm not talking about results: I'm talking about the ability of the pack to complete their core duties with technical accuracy consistently. And if you think Australia were very good in 2011 then we have different ideas of what the concept of good entails.

2013-05-25T06:37:56+00:00

Well Ruck me.

Guest


Oh Ben, there results over the last few seasons have kept them in the top 3 and are better than 90% of the top 10. They were nowhere near full strength in 2012 and in 2011 they were very good and took the #2 ranking.

AUTHOR

2013-05-25T05:33:24+00:00

Ben.S

Roar Guru


I'd compare Croft to Dennis because Higginbotham is playing number 8 ATM. The Australian lineout and re-start area has long been erratic, as has the scrum and ability to contest the ruck. In reality the forwards are very badly coached as they rarely work as a unit and I think that's been reflected in the up and down nature of the results of the past few seasons. This current Wallaby pack isn't the well drilled group we saw in 2001.

AUTHOR

2013-05-25T05:23:55+00:00

Ben.S

Roar Guru


Tbh I lazily skirted around the Wallaby forwards - no hiding there. I think I'd start Alexander in the 1st Test simply because of his experience and his relationship (or background as Robbie likes to say) with Robinson and Moore, but if he received a towelling I'd be very quick to start Slipper thereafter. Alexander has something like 38 caps, so at some point he needs to really kick on or be dropped out of the equation.

2013-05-24T13:19:27+00:00

Well Ruck me.

Guest


Boers are South Africans. Decended from the English I think. They tend to act, speak and talk like English people. Pictures of the Queen everywhere. Boer is Afrikans for English I think. Great bunch of people.

2013-05-24T12:18:12+00:00

Colin N

Guest


O'Connell came back from injury in mid-to-late March but he's been outstanding since. Remarkable really. During the Six Nations I wouldn't have even considered him for the squad due to a lack of game time, but since he's come back his form's been such that I would start him. Not sure about O'Brien. He's not playing in the Pro12 final on Saturday but Gatland's confident he'll be fine. As for Launchbury, he suffered a slight knock against Wales and he hasn't quite been the same since. I personally think he just needs a rest as he's a bit battered and bruised from a tough campaign. This is his first full year of professional rugby year and it's shown towards the end of the season. P.S Great stuff, Ben.

2013-05-24T08:30:33+00:00

Well Ruck me.

Guest


Croft, Warburton, Felatau with O'Brien vs Higginbotham, Hooper and Palu with Mowen. I wouldnt write off Australia there. Hooper is hitting very good form, Higginbotham is probably in the form of his life and Palu vs Felatau is a close call. I think the Lions have a slight edge with their bench options but its not one sided in the back row at all.

2013-05-24T07:43:19+00:00

nickoldschool

Roar Guru


Very thorough analysis of your tight five Ben! (almost feels like you have betrayed Gatland's troops giving so much info ;) !) Quite agree with your assessment that your tight 5 might not only dominate their wallabies opponents but also annihilate our (aussie) backrowers who might be too busy plugging the holes. I probably even see a bigger gap than you see at scrumtime between the 2 teams and I really think the wallabies will suffer in this aspect of the game. Even if Gatland and co are saying the wallabies have now a good steady scrum, am pretty sure they still think they are superior and will spend a lot of time getting things right before test 1.

2013-05-24T07:05:18+00:00


I am impressed Ben, detailed article weighing up pro's and cons. I think the Lions will have a slight edge in the tight five, but having said that the Australians are wiley characters, you don't easily gain benefit from having a dominant scrum against them as they have many tricks to negate that, not all legal. In the backrow, I don't think there is much in it, perhaps depending on selections the Lions will have more experience which might be to their benefit. But again, you need numbers at the breakdown, no matter whether your team is the dominant one or not. Slow ball can be the catalyst to slow Genia down, slow ball can negate the Lions as well. For me the battle of the breakdown is going to be a big factor in the series, and that depends on which team puts enough numbers there. The Aussie might decide to avoid the breakdown area as much as possible. Until final selections it is difficult to say what will happen.

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