I am an inaugural Melbourne Victory season ticket holder/member and have been a consistent presence while a variety of chairmen and chief executives have come and gone through the lifespan of the franchise.
Over those nine continuous years I have sat on both the wings but also participated in the club’s active areas – mostly the North Terrace area.
To say there has been a complex relationship between the administrators of the club and the active fans who make up the North Terrace is an understatement to say the least.
The latest episode in this often difficult relationship lies in a letter that Melbourne Victory administrators sent to members outlining its measures to try and clear up the mess it has found itself in.
At the end of the letter they propose the introduction of a “member sub-committee” which will apparently represent all aspects of the member base, will meet every two months and have a club director sitting on in meetings.
In theory this sounds all well and good.
Unfortunately the narrative which the club has detailed throughout the letter and the choice of its timing leads this fan to wonder if the measures are an act of politics on the club administrators’ part.
In the latest letter the club outline that in 2008/2009 season the FFA first mandated it change from a General Admission access model to a fully reserved designated area.
This is important in the present because the latest ‘trial measures’ announced by Damien De Bohun is, in effect, a re-affirming of these old measures.
The club are now essentially hiding behind this to deflect pressure to re-instigate a General Admission oriented system, which will improve the quality of active support at Melbourne Victory matches.
If the current crop of administrators had been either around or paying proper attention, they would know the imposition of Home End Membership (HEM) for the 2009/2010 season onwards was the turning point in which the support for Melbourne Victory began to stagnate.
This held true both numerically and in terms of quality.
Attendances had started off at 14,000 in the inaugural 2005/2006 season when Victory finished second last. They then climbed in season two (2006/2007) to an average of 27,000, and remained steady to 26,000 in the 2007/2008 season.
This is in the seasons where all the bad media coverage and anti-social incidents were apparently so bad it prompted the FFA to act on the advice of security firm Hatamoto – a firm with qualifications in counter-terrorism and career backgrounds in port security but not in football – to arbitrarily impose the ‘Home End Membership’ system (HEM).
The club fail to mention in their letter they were fully complicit in this, even designating all of AAMI Park into an allocated seating stadium when it opened.
What happened next is perhaps most telling – average attendances at Victory games dropped to 24,000 in the 2008/2009 season – despite winning the grand final and Premiership Plate.
In the 2009/2010 season the average attendance dropped even further to 20,000, despite once again making the grand final and nearly winning the Premiership Plate.
The 2010/2011 season was the low point, average attendances dropped even more to 15,000 that season and the security management of the area was so bad that even the Blue and White Brigade packed in and the North Terrace collapsed at the very end of the season.
The statistical evidence seems to suggest the FFA-led response and counter measures to anti-social incidents like arbitrarily imposing HEM without negotiation did much more harm than the anti-social incidents themselves.
The club’s measures in taking this even further and imposing stadium-wide allocated seating would have exacerbated problems even further.
The club then go on to mention the development of the supporter charter, a form of memorandum of understanding between the various parties based on mutual respect.
This of course led to the North Terrace returning for the 2011/2012 season. The atmosphere mildly improved – although it was still a shadow of the highs of the 2006/2007 season – and the average attendance began to recover and was once again in the region of 20,000.
This thankfully led to an expansion of the allowable North Terrace area for the 2012/2013 season and, combined with Ange Postecoglou as coach, the enthusiastic vibe returned to the club.
The atmosphere was the best it had been for in the region of five years and average attendances continued to rise to 23,000 for the year.
Of course with the rise of attendances, the active areas once again began to re-swell in numbers, which naturally meant there were more issues.
The club neglected to mention that in the face of the pressure they supposedly faced, they made the decision to throw away six months of work and unilaterally threw the support charter out of the window and impose the strictest conditions yet.
Rather disappointing they weren’t willing to persevere with the promising charter and work through the teething problems, nor the signs they clearly hadn’t learnt from history.
This naturally raises the question as to why they are once again being complicit in a strategy that will undermine the potential of the club’s support and nurture only mediocrity?
Harry
Guest
I find this letter to be fairly well structured, however as a MVFC member I can give my experiences: From the highs of the 5-goal haul from Archie, the club went down the ladder in 2009. Robbie Kruse was being ignored by several teamates one in particular I wont mention - I think he scored 15 or 16 - He could have had 50 imho. F^*K the FFA t-shirts - VERY CHEAPLY printed on whatever 50 cent shirts could be found (I saw green and red ones - and no its was not Christmas!) - and these horrible words were being chanted too. Nobody would tell me where the profit of the shirts was going, and they were charging $20 each for them outside the stadium. I am not an inaugural member. However I was watching Mark Viduka and Ange Postecoglou battling it out regularly at NSL games before many of the self-important NT members were even born. The atmosphere at matches is pretty stale - although as a whole, the rest of the crowd got involved in the matches against WSW and people were on their feet to the east, west and south just willing Finkler to equalise - and if the NT GA ticket holders continue to silently protest, which is an excellent way to protest btw - next season we are moving to the south end. I've lived in Europe, and spent time in England, and they have real problems there with supporters. I think Gallop and Evans are doing a pretty good job at Victory and with the A-League, I thought last night's ACL match was awesome (maybe because we did not have to put up with the rubbish silent treatment that happens at AAMI and Etihad). One last thing: what are you talking about, Victory making AAMI Park all seating? It was built all seating, but I think you mean seat allocation. Go to any EPL or AFL match - you may not end up there, but your ticket will have a seat on it. If something bad happens - I would feel much safer knowing that the person or persons responsible will not be back next week. I assume a lot of you will hate me for giving me perspective so I'm unchecking follow-up comments. I just think its good to have a balanced view - the AFL media thrive on any neg media snippits, and the club are doing all they can to keep those wolves from the door. I'm sorry if your clique has been affected - we go to watch the Victory, not other fans.
Marchisio
Guest
Clayts, this is the point I'm trying to make, the amount of public scrutiny has a dramatic effect upon how rules are enforced. At RSF there is less public scrutiny, and fewer stakeholders than at a football match, just off the top of my head I'm thinking of the sporting venue, its sponsors, the advertisers, both at the ground and on TV, sponsors of the team, the TV station, the FFV, the FFA, Police, security... the more stakeholders, the more scrutiny, the tighter the controls.
clayts
Guest
See I don't find that strange at all. It's what life should be like. I reckon it was what life was like for our parents/grandparent. Back when commonsense ruled and people were responsible for their own actions, without having to look for someone to blame when things went wrong. It's what I was talking about above at music fesitvals like Rainbow Serpent. As long as you have a (by and large) similar mindset amongst the punters, things tend to regulate themselves without incident. It does take that initial mindset though, which might take a little bit of time to get going. But then the best thing about it is, the police presence there turns into what it used to be seen as too, someone there to help you out if you needed it. Most of them join in the fun more often than not. I saw one just a few weeks ago done an indian mask (you know with feathers and stuff) and dance along to the music for a bit. Punters loved it and he had a HUGE smile on his face. I also saw a couple of them rushing to someone's aide on the dance floor that was not looking well. No reason it can't be the same at football matches. As usual though, it's the actions of a few DHs that we have to pander to
clayts
Guest
Fair enough. If you've been to all these festivals you should be able to see where nordster (and I) are coming from then. The average festival goer to these things are really not hung up on what is and isn't allowed (except maybe for bringing glass in - which goes to your OHS and regulations whatnot). There is a (minimal) police presence and it goes off without incident 99% of the time. I totally agree that there are a million regulations in place for these festivals, football games, work places, walking down the street, going to the toilet etc but the way these rules are 'enforced' at places like Rainbow are wildly different to what you'd normally see with WAY less incidents (in the main). If there are incidents, it's usually someone that is taking things way too far, which is what the cops and security guards are there to try to curb. In my experience (as I'm sure now that you have experienced) the security presence there is more to help people that look like they need it, rather than to enforce
Marchisio
Guest
I so dislike to be contrary, but I keep seeing posts in my Facebook feed advocating boycotting matches, and a mass walkout, with the NT singing outside the stadium sounds more like the tired old joke about Lazio supporters than something I'd associate with the A-League and Melbourne Victory. Again, i don't disagree with the aims of the NT, but the uncompromising approach (apparently) adopted, if seen through to its conclusion may result in the kind of situation Inter find themselves in.
mahonjt
Guest
That's dead right. In the A-League era the Northern Terrace pioneered multi-faction, active home ends and for a long time did it very well. As I said elsewhere, they should be respected for this and their contribution acknowledged. Anyone who has been around for a while can see that the Northern Terrace are in many ways re-visiting old debates, old measures and in some cases - taking a different position on them the second time around. This is what experience has taught them. Whatever my differences with the adolescent nature and tactics of the NTC - I can understand the background, context and challenges they face. The RBB are yet to experience these and would do well to learn from the Northern Terrace and avoid some of the pain. The spooky thing about all of this debate is that these issues were debated at the very first meeting of UNION - the original MVFC supporters group (RIP :-( ) Much of this was predictable. We made some good decisions and we have made some bad ones. We will get there in the end and our club will be the better for it.
nordster
Guest
Ouch...managing group psychology! Aunty Ayn no like ;) I agree people shouldn't be micro managed so much but yeah...tread carefully with that other thing...can be applied in all sorts of ways now its considered fair game.
nordster
Guest
Cheers clayts et al....well argued...and yes i do take a bit of an OTT position at times though as u say i do clarify a little. I did say "pretty much" anything goes even if there are technically "rules"... Some folks live in a regulatory fantasy land and think everyone else does also. Music festivals are the perfect example...yes there are rules and oh&s etc...but in reality....grrrrls just wanna have fun haha....
mahonjt
Guest
I support your support of Ben's statement on support :-)
nordster
Guest
Leon u might be misinterpreting the lovely lady's views on statism with that comment. And her so called disciples...or 'Randian freaks' as we can be referred to...i actually love that term lol... More inspiration than leader...
ciudadmarron
Guest
I spent a lot of time in moshpits as well. Funnily enough in my experience the more security there was the more issues there seemed to be and the more people within the moshpit seemed to act like idiots.
ciudadmarron
Guest
Ah, so people must be on their best behaviour when someone is looking at them, but if not it's okay.
NUFCMVFC
Roar Guru
Well funnily enough the L3 area on Docklands this season has been a completely ad hoc arrangment very much being run by the NT fans where they set the behavioural expectations, and there were NO incidents at all, funnily enough a relaxed approach by the police and security helped to contribute to this In football, the trick to disorder prevention is to see it as a matter of managing group psychology, not trying to micro-manage people
NUFCMVFC
Roar Guru
Just quickly, it's worth considering though that rather tightening restrictions every time some "DH" as you put it is out of line which adversely affects everyone else, is that if the deployment was different than the incident could have been prevented from going as far as it did, eg as soon as someone starts hitting a giant sauce bottle someone is right onto it If there is an OTT python squeese around games, then the fun is going to get ripped out of live A League games, it all turns into a contrived experience and the spirit goes out of it all, that would be most damaging of all
NUFCMVFC
Roar Guru
Last time I checked no one is boycotting supporting the club, in this case the fans are supporting passively like everyone else Secondly what people are trying to achieve is a system which actually allows for good quality support, and they aren't engaging with a system which doesen't allow for this Naturally everyone will have their opinions as fans as to what is a good transfer etc but I don't think anyone for a minute is trying to suggest fans should be able to dictate transfers, this is a rather disingenuous association with the aims of NT fans who simply want a model similar to the first two seasons, if that happened then it's problem over
AZ_RBB
Guest
I find the two experiences, active support and moshpits, very similar. I pretty much spent my uni years in moshpits. Swapped that for the RBB now. Both instances you're subject to a fair bit of security outside but once you're in it's pretty much self-regulated madness. Flares and throwing objects (except for drinks) is banned in both places. Anti-social behaviour gets you kicked out.
Marchisio
Guest
Difference is, the dancefloor is not broadcast on national TV, nor is it the subject of media reports. Apples and Oranges dear friends.
ciudadmarron
Guest
Marchisio, while the organisers have the red tape to jump through, the risk analyses and assesments to write etc, all to satisfy the OHS laws, in the main your punter in the moshpit does what he or she likes. They are not checking the paper work to see what behaviour is okay; they judge for themselves, and the crowd dictates what is acceptable most of the time; and this would happen regardless of what the regulations are. Not disputing that the regulations are important and serve a purpose. But the regulations aren't the issue; it's how they are used/enforced. Thinking about those big festivals, I wonder if they have about 1 cop per hundred people PLUS security, which is what you might see on the northern end of Parramatta stadium? And yet things go okay... it's rare to see security right in the middle... at the front, keeping an eye and helping people at crush barriers, yeah... but not spread out through the rest of the crowd "enforcing" as you see at the football.
Simoc
Guest
It should be the other way. In AFL it was very noticeable that as the crowds got bigger so did the crowd behaviour improve. In full stadiums at AFL there is rarely a problem except for evicting drunk people. I expect in reality it will be the same in soccer.
NUFCMVFC
Roar Guru
Yeah we are basically further along the evolutionary path than you guys are No one particularly wants to protest, but down here at least we are dealing with people who are used to having submissive AFL cheersquads which are departments of the club in effect, while football fans think in terms of the active areas being completely their domain and fans as a stakeholder in their own right. So there is an issue and a constant undercurrent of control issues stretching back a long time Then there's the fact that over-reactions to otherwise regrettable incdients undermine the ability of fans to give good quality support, you have the first taste of this with the De Bohun measures, for us it is a re-hashing of old ones where the outcome wasn't pretty. The NT used to have a lto of support int he first two years, but now we have the "South End 'till I die types" who unfortunately seem to pereive the South End as anti NT I dare say you will probably come to protest for longer