Let’s assume there are two realistic suitors for Kevin Love – Golden State and Cleveland. One is being asked to give up a streaky shooting guard and solid offensive power forward, and one the #1 pick in the recent draft and potentially the most explosive two-way player in the game.
In 2020.
Love is an elite player. The hit on his stats being empty can be attributed to the fact that his team were terrible and someone had to score, rebound, assist and do everything. He is not seen as a leader and has been seen as a locker room disruption. But, by any measure he is one of the best 10 players in basketball and is in his absolute prime at 25.
So which team should be throwing the kitchen sink at him? The stacked, young team with the new coach in the already powerful west? Or the team from a city that hasn’t won anything pro-sports related in 50 years and with the best player of our generation?
Well the answer isn’t easy. Let’s take a look at why.
Case for the Warriors
If you are Golden State, the idea of combining Steph Curry and Love is a dream. As a pick and pop combination they would be unlike anything we have ever seen before, and the two most talented one-way players in the game today.
Neither plays D, and neither would have to if Andre Iguodala and Andrew Bogut stay fit. Bogut would allow Love to chase rebounds, throw outlets and pretty much be what he is currently on defence – a sieve.
Having Love, Curry, Iguodala and Bogut with Harrison Barnes, Mareese Speights, Draymond Green, Shaun Livingston and Jordan Crawford is a title contender without a shadow of a doubt. The Warriors offer Klay Thompson, David Lee and a couple of draft picks for Love and Kevin Martin without thinking for mine.
Case for Cleveland
If you are Cleveland, you are in a unique position. Three months ago Kyrie Irving was the face of the franchise and demanded a max contract accordingly. Unfortunately for the Cavs, if Irving is your best player you scrape into the playoffs at best.
The basketball world mocked them selecting Anthony Bennett as the #1 pick in the 2013 draft, but clearly the guy has potential (hold that thought). True, it was the most puzzling first choice in the draft since Andrea Bargnani in 2006, but at least Bennett has something that you can see could blossom.
So fast forward to 2014 and the Cavs fluke first pick again. Wait, what? There are two standouts in Andrew Wiggins and Jabari Parker and an injury-riddled third wheel in Joel Embiid, and the Cavs can’t go wrong. They pick Wiggins but it was the right call.
At worst he lemon images defensively and contributes offensively. If he matures and becomes a star, who knows what his limit is?
And then a giant spanner is thrown in the works. Public enemy number one LeBron James comes home. Can you unburn a jersey? Ohio sure hopes so, because the best player in the world is coming home in his peak.
Irving and a bunch of kids and role players won’t cut it as a support cast. James has made the NBA Finals four consecutive years and isn’t coming home to cruise to retirement. LeBron might have made up withDan Gilbert but unless he makes this roster into a title contender then The Letter will be the least of Gilbert’s problems.
So Love wants out of Minnesota, James wants Love to help him win a title, Minny say they want Wiggins and Cleveland say “how about Bennett, Dion Waiters and a few draft picks”. If push comes to shove this deal happens. Minnesota don’t risk losing their franchise guy without getting something back, because let’s be honest K-Love isn’t staying once his contract expires.
The verdict
Assume there are two offers on the table for Love – Thompson and Lee or Wiggins and spare change.
The best deal for Love is Cleveland – the Cavs have two of the the best seven players and 3 of the best 15 in their prime, and will fill the gaps with savvy veterans and become title favourites immediately. Wiggins may one day be a superstar, but are you – and more importantly is LeBron – going to wait and see if that happens?
If Cleveland won’t budge, then the Golden State works just as well. The Splash Brothers might be no more but the offensive power and individual defensive skill makes the Warriors a title chance.
Kevin Love won’t even need to start play D and yet still can’t lose.
As basketball fans neither can we.
Steven Paice
Roar Guru
Love is going to turn up to training camp as a senior team member, but are the other players going to be annoyed with him? The onus is on him is to show some kind of leadership, an area in which he has reportedly been sorely lacking. Minny can play the game for now but does the lure of playing with Curry or LeBron mean Love gets more proactive and demands a trade? While Kevin Love is a top 5 player in the league I firmly believe Minny can't lose here as long as they play their cards right and don't get too stubborn. Love doesn't want to be there and the Timberwolves can leverage from that but demanding Wiggins, Bennett and picks or being too greedy with Golden State might end up costing them. On the criticism if his defence, it may actually be perception rather than pure facts. Dirk Nowitzi is a top 15 all time player but has always been suspect defensively, but he looked more than component defensively in 2011 when coached by Rick Carlise and partnered in the front court by Tyson Chandler. Blake Griffins deficiencies were covered in a large part by Doc Rivers and DeAndre Jordan. If Love goes to Golden State, Andrew Bogut could well do what he already does for David Lee.
Shaun Mancini
Roar Pro
If Cleveland sign Wiggins he can't be traded for 30 days, doesn't kill any trade but will slow down this already dragged out Kevin Love saga. I have not found any solid evidence of Cleveland actually coming out saying Wiggins was on the trade table ready to be shipped? Exactly the same as GS saying Klay has never been in any package. So who knows how much of what we are reading is true. All we know so far is that Minnesota want a very good package in return and are not going to settle for anything less right now. I've said this before and i'll say it again - Minnesota can play this game for now. Obviously if the season starts and the trade deadline is getting close and this is still the only 2 offers on the table then they will have to decide what's best If they start the season with Love going to be very interesting to see the reaction he gets in Minny, could be a rather awkward season
mushi
Guest
It's more if in speaking with him he doesn't indicate that he's willing to sign with you then why hand over assets for him?
Red Kev
Roar Guru
"Love doesn’t have a no trade clause" ahh that makes sense now, I assumed (perhaps naively) that the player had to agree to any move since they are the one signing the contract with the new club.
astro
Guest
Well, Love doesn't have a no trade clause, so the Wolves can trade him for whatever offer they want to take (assuming there are offers they'd want). I think they'd be stupid for not moving him well before the trade deadline, but my point is that Love is a fantastic player (the only guy other than Barkely to average better than 25 points and 12 rebounds while shooting at least 30 percent from three), and as such, its hard to imagine the market for him shrinking. Yes, the Wolves loose leverage as they get closer to the deadline, but they could also open up new teams interested in Love with more attractive offers, by waiting...
astro
Guest
Exactly...the Wolves are the Wolves A recent quote from the owner: "My preference is that Kevin will come to (training) camp -- and I'm sure he will -- and play with the team. We are going to look at everything that makes sense that would make our team better, but we are not going to move a superb player like that without getting equal or more value back." In other words, they might just be stupid enough to see him walk at the end of the year...
mushi
Guest
Because as time winds down Astro Minny gets closer and closer to being a forced seller.
mushi
Guest
Not sure why it is an issue – it isn’t like your draftees are local guys that your team had any hand in developing. I think it makes more “feel good” sense to get free agents and trades for people who want to play there than making a team via guys legally compelled to play for you via the draft?
Red Kev
Roar Guru
Surely if it drags out to February, Love would just not sign anything and wait until the end of the season (only a few months because the Wolves aren't going deep in the playoffs) and become an unrestricted free agent - ensure Minny get nothing as a way of letting them know he doesn't appreciate them messing him around when he wanted to leave.
mushi
Guest
He's signed for two but with a player option after one. Even then most of the 'signings" are commitments and then signing. And even the 2 year is a nod and a wink that he'll re-up after the new TV deal. Also Love you are ignoring that if the Cavs have his Bird rights they can pay him more. So as a Cav's GM you are saying you would be legitimately worried that Kevin love will hate playing with LeBron so much that he will take less money to leave? As to trust and this being a business maybe i'm naive but in my work life there is an element of trust in every business engagement as everyone realises that you can't contract all risk away (lawyers typically call it "being commercial").
astro
Guest
What's the hurry for Minny??? They have until February to trade Love, assuming he saying he wants out, and I can't see why the market for him would decrease over that time...if anything, the opposite will happen! Love is a top 10 player, and those guys don't become available via a trade very often (in fact, almost never), so the idea that teams won't be interested is crazy.
astro
Guest
The Wolves still have what both teams want, and while that remains, they'll be fine. If anything, the market for Love will only increase once the season begins, and other teams get off to a slow start and get desperate. The bigger question for me is what happens if Wiggins has a slow start. The expectations (and the spotlight) on him will be massive, and if he under-performs, where does that leave the Cavs in negotiations for Love?
mushi
Guest
If the cav's sign wiggins I think they are restricted from trading him for a while which will ice Minny's ability to negotiate. The wolves "compete" now stance is just absurd - they will be locked in to the late lottery as they are going to replace love with inferior players regardless of who they get. But then there is a reason the wolves are the wolves
astro
Guest
Yeah, but mushi, have you seen Kyrie's cross-over??? In all seriousness, Love is a beast, and a perfectly adequate defender for his position. If anything, the current offers aren't good enough! For GS, Lee is being paid $15mil this year and $15mil the next. That's a horrid contract for a guy who REALLY can't play defence, and keep in mind he'll be looking for a equally large contract once that one finishes. Klay Thompson is a really nice player and would be a great fit for Minny, but he'll want the max soon enough, and how far are you getting in the West if Thompson is one of your max guys over the next 4yrs? The Wiggins/Bennett combo is better than the GS offer, but still not ideal for Minny. Minny have made it pretty clear that they want to compete now and not in 5yrs time. Wiggins is not Lebron or Durant...He'll clearly take a while to develop. And by acquiring him and Bennett, Minny essentially have an entire roster of rookies. Wiggins, Bennett, LaVine, Dieng, Shabazz, Shved...That's a LOT of youth! They're going to stink for at least 2-3yrs with that many young guys on the roster, and nothing about Minny says they are looking to go down the Philly path of rebuilding. In the end, I think Love will be traded, but clearly Minny are hoping to either a) play well enough in the first half of the season to convince him to stay, or b) wait for other teams to get desperate enough to make more appealing offers for his services.
mushi
Guest
One thing I do find odd is the “no D” thing on Love. He can’t protect the rim and doesn’t get steals but his teams allow fewer points when he plays d because a lot of defence isn’t about the final stop - plus his rebounding needs to factor into defence. But at the same time we regard Kyrie, one of the league’s worst defenders at any position, a top 15 player even though he his adjusted +/- says you lose most NBA games if you have 5 Kyrie level players at each position.
mushi
Guest
I do like how we still say Bennet is a #1 pick like ti means something. guy was a shock being taken #1 and then pretty much surprised even the harshest critics with is abomination of a rookie year.
Red Kev
Roar Guru
Yeah but Love has indicated that he is willing to sign an extension in a sign & trade deal with the right team. Which is why Cleveland is the more likely option in my opinion, Love wants to play at the business end and the Warriors' fate in the west would hinge on Bogut's knees/ankle/back staying in good shape. That said I am really surprised that Cleveland is willing to give up Wiggins.
Shaun Mancini
Roar Pro
Teams just don't look like they are willing to give up half a roster for a player that has said he is keen to test free agency in a season. He's a great player but i think both Cleveland and Golden State (with 10 other teams) would fancy the chances of winning him during free agency.
Ryan
Guest
Reports this morning indicating that Cavs are not (no longer?) offering Wiggins, and Warriors have pulled Thompson.... Worrying times for Minnesota. Should of pulled the pin when they were getting offered multiple assets. Appears they may of got greedy, outpriced themselves and are now back at square one. If I was a Wolves fan, I would be gutted.... Cavaliers can survive without Love (but likely cant win). Big positive is it still leaves them with plenty of cap space for next year and room to get flexible, pick up needed pieces etc. Potentially get Love next year while keeping Wiggins. Love would probably leave GSW after a few years anyway, so I can understand wanting to keep Thompson; in particular keeping the Curry/Thompson backcourt together. If both sides stand tall on keeping Wiggins and Thompson, which it now appears they will, Wolves are in no mans land....
Shaun Mancini
Roar Pro
Yep Minny are happy to throw Kevin Martin and his terrible contract into this as well. Plenty of things making it hard for both GS and CLE to pull the trigger on this