Is time running out for Lyon's premiership?

All depends - if Freo are safely in second after beating the Cats, Hawks and Bluesers by then it could B-mantle mark III that does the longest road trip of the season in the second last game (gee thanks AFL).

Good heavens one thrashing by a team that is on the bottom of the ladder and Fremantle is stuffed. Now if Brisbane manage to do the same than Freo would really be furked!

But you don't know that Peter. You are making assumptions about a coach from one assistant role and one role at St Kilda. And it's not 2 years - I pointed out to you earlier a 2 year extension. He's signed to be there until end of 2017. I've always thought the arguments as to why he left St Kilda were simplistic. It's convenient for everyone to say that he left St Kilda because it was in a rebuild. I wasn't much of an observer of St Kilda at the time but even I knew they'd dicked around with his contract for a long time and there were plenty of rumours about his poor relationship with Pelchen. Whether he'd take on a Dees, GWS or Lions is pretty irrelevant to the discussion. Freo are not in that position. They have a very healthy list in the 24 and under age bracket - as has been said ad nauseum in these responses - who (so far) he has developed very well. Yep they have to replace Pav, Sandi, McPharlin but they've been planning that for ages with McPharlin and Sandi's replacement in the team already (big shoes to fill, undoubtedly) and they've been scouting the league for years for Pav's. I dont' see why Ross' possition is much different to Longmire's; he's going to lose Goodes, LRT and some other shortly but has a young midfield and some young defenders to build the team around (and has drafted in some forwards). Seems pretty similar to me, albeit Freo doesn't have a Buddy.

Hmmm...I would probably put it like this and I expect to cop some flack. But I need to do it to clarify my point. Young side (rebuilding) - Demons, GWS, Bulldogs Developing - Port, Collingwood Established - Swans, Hawks, Freo. Just as an example. Don't all jump up and down because I left your team out, or put them in the wrong category! :-) I really couldn't see Lyon taking on a Dees, GWS, or Bulldogs side that is jam packed with youth, that needs to be developed over a 3-4 year period before they are a finals chance. I think he he is somewhere in that Developing to Establish category of coach. He may very well hang around after his two years are up. Obviously every coach, even in an established side, is going to encounter youth. He is good with them but I don't see him in that full on rebuilding style of coaching role. I think if they shut all the windows, doors, blocked off the fireplace and sealed around all the other gaps (just for you Don Freo), he would look to exit the club and find one with a 3 year premiership window.

Actually, having read back over your comment I don't think I addressed your post directly. You acknowledge that Freo develops players. What I didn't say clearly is that I think Ross has taken great pride in the development of these players, which to me is the sign of someone who is keen to continue to develop talent. He has admitted that he finds Walters' professional development very satisfying and has jokingly called him the coach's pet before. Barlow has jokingly sledged Sutcliffe for having breakfast with the coach every game day. I think there are good signs he engages well generally with the young players as long as they put in the effort.

Too late for that Pumping Dougie...

On the subject of development of players, perhaps that wasn't a role he had to play much previously? I actually think he has credit in the bank on this from his time at Freo. Young Michael Walters, for example, was a very rough diamond with loads of potential but spent to much time at the local fast food joint. I am guessing he had played less than 20 games before Ross got hold of him. Harvey got nowhere with him. Son Son says that he wouldn't be where he is without Ross (which, in my view, is one of the premier small forwards in the league). Clancee Pearce is another of similar vintage whose career has changed dramatically for the better. Again, ready to be discarded Freo unfortunately lost pretty much its entire crop from the 2010 draft (some unexpectedly, like top pick Jadyn Pitt with his heart condition) so you have to look at 2011 and 2012 drafts. From 2011, Sutcliffe has been an outstanding success as a defender given his age, and his bonding with his coach is obvious from all the ribbing he gets from his team mates. Lachie Neale is already a Glendinning Medalist (probably the best of the lot) and the future looks promising for Sheridan and Crozier. In 2012, you've already mentioned Apeness. Taberner is the only other we've seen so far and he's been given a few games too. Injuries have impacted a few others, like Brady Grey (sadly - Ross loves him), Pearce and Tanner Smith but we'll see them next year Ross as I have said on a number of occasions is not responsible for the age range on the list. That can be sheeted home directly to Chris Connolly and Schwab. Not Havey and certainly not Ross. He's just working with what he's got.

I did say "amongst other things" Don. From my own experience, seeing players develop is great, winning games is great, the social side of things at a club is great, going to work each day and enjoying what you do is great....but guess what the one thing I wish I had accomplished after getting teams there twice is.... And guess what one of the big reasons for going back to coaching would be for me.

To only see a premiership as success is a very limited view. Only one coach can have that per year but there are always more than one successful coach in a season. You only have to read the comments of very content and optimistic Freo posters to recognise that there must be more than one measure of success. We'd not let him go because he only got us to a GF. Success is improving a team. They can't all be Chris Scott.

You are are wordsmith Don, I love reading your comments. You wear your Freo Heart on your sleeve and I love that. I wasn't saying that Freo as a club don't develop young players, because they definitely do that. I was at the Giants game and saw young Michael Apeness running around (looks the goods). What I was getting at is there are particular coaches that work well with a young side, coaches that work well with a developing side, and those that work well with an established side. My belief is most of Ross's time, even as an assistant, has been with established sides that are right in their premiership window. Sydney, Saints and Fremantle. As I indicated, I think this is the year they have to win, not sure they can, and so the next two years that he are signed on for will be critical because after that he will be working with a developing side. Every chance I could be wrong, just my observation.

I love Ross Lyon Don. As a Sydney born and bread fella now living in WA, you get to see a lot of both the Eagles and Dockers and you get to see a lot more of Ross thanks to Basil and his interviews. He is a great character, great for the game, has and always will be. He is a good coach, has to be because he learnt from one of the best. He would judge success, amongst other things, on winning premierships. Not getting there and failing. I think most people are beating this drum. I think most people are also looking at some of the efforts in games that perhaps they should have won and the effects that those losses have on a side. I would love to see Freo prove everyone wrong and win a flag. Ross Lyon deserves a flag. There are a few chinks in his armour on Grand Final day. I don't know what they are, but you can't argue with the history books and he has yet to coach a premiership side.

You'd hope so! I'm an old bugger with dodgy knees. I might still have Casboult covered. Good come back, though.

a) Suffice to say Fyfe would outpace Rowe or Thompson. b) CHF is really only a concept these days and can be played in any number of ways. You'd say he would be a first or second attacking option when Freo go into their forward 50 more often than not. c) There's no way you can "guarantee" they would beat someone over 50m you've never met and know nothing about their athletic prowess Macca. :P

my sincere apologies for not taking this article and the usual anti-Freo, anti-Ross commentary very seriously

For the sake of football as a spectacle, I hope Lyon remains unsuccessful in his quest for a premiership. I admire his brilliance as a coach and I love him as a bloke, but when you watch games live that he coaches, his team strangles the opposition and makes it very boring and frustrating to watch, even as an independent observer. My son barracks for the Saints and it reached the point where I had to say, "Mate, I can't bring you to watch St Kilda games anymore (while Lyon was coaching), they are just too boring to watch". I'm sure Freo supporters will enjoy the wins as would any supporter who's team wins, but for opposition supporters or neutral observers, I hope Lyon's tactical strategies remain ultimately unsuccessful.

For a window that is perennially open you blokes usre seem to have a lot of trouble climbing through it.

I would guarantee they would beat you over 50m.

Casboult lumbers. Waite lumbers.

Nah...because of WA boys, Coniglio, David Swallow, Jack Martin...Jaeger O'Meara!!! They'll be keen to return because, by then, the whole GWS and Gold Coast teams, every player, will be worth $1m a year. They can slip into Nat's midfield spot. Freo will have the money to pay it and as we have demonstrated, the premiership window...as if there is such a thing...will be perennially open at Freo. How's this for a trade to replace Crowley? We'll trade Hannath and Sylvia to West Coast, they can reunite Wellingham with Mick and we'll rookie list Curnow in case we need him.

Just using them as an example Balathazar, there will always be a Pendlebury or Ablett in the league but why bother discussing the point when there is a smart arse comment ot be made hey.