Roar's Asian soccer dream hangs by thread

you may be right on the amount of fans compared to their fan base. perhaps they are on 442 and every other forum. and on fox sports.

What do you mean? There doesn't seem to be many MVFC fans on this page. At least it's not relative to the size of their overall fan base. and yes, they're my least favourite team.

True. Victory will always get more than their fair share though. Come on AZ - you know you hate them and agree ;-)

Fallen giants, AZ. When your two top teams from last season fail so spectacularly the next, there is always going to be a lot of discussion.

Hard to disagree with you here. The train wreck could and should have been avoided. As you say, our views are inevitably based on only a partial picture of what happened.

Waz, I recall reading somewhere a comment from MM that when Smith was hired part of the reason was due to his video analysis abilities.

Not directly jb - Waz made a comment about secret video sessions in one of his above posts. I agree Waz does speak deeply, but I can't imagine players having video sessions without Mulvey knowing about it. The Mulvey sacking is going to continue to provide talking points, and as long as Roar management discuss philosophy, Ken Stead, training methods etc...as much as I want the truth, I don't think we will ever find out. I don't think MM was sacked because of video analysis when as you have stated Ron Smith was good in that regard and MM apparently wanted to 'demote' Trani to a video assistant. Which Trani rejected and went to Mel City.

Waz . I"ve known Ron Smith for years and am fully aware of his coaching experience.He is an exceptionally nice guy who I would describe more of a football "educator" rather than a successful head coach of a team.He has coached Perth Glory in the HAL for 11 matches but most of that type of coaching has been brief stints in Malaysia. None of that coaching experience compares with the work he did at the AIS in Canberra where he served a nine year tenure putting many of the "named" Golden Generation through his hands.So you see not everyone assumed he was signed for his direct team coaching. Actually I do not buy into the Stead,Dobson ,Mulvey debate for I do not know and have never discussed football with the first two and only knew MM as a "rookie" player at Brisbane Lions when he tried out for the youth team but I do not hesitate to ask people like yourself what the 'scuttlebutt" is concerning events at the club. Cheers jb.

Ian - was this comment of yours aimed at me.? it would appear that way.I assume ,maybe wrongly, that because Waz speaks deeply and often about Roar,their problems,their players and their fan forums he has some contacts around the club and you will note I did pose him a question,I wanted to know why he said in a comment that perhaps MM was sacked because he threatened to get rid of video analysis in his training schedule.I simply asked him how that could be true when MM had gone into print saying Ron Smith was the best signing he had made for Roar when in fact I happen to know that Ron Smith's forte for some years now has been video analysis,in fact so much so he has developed his own software on the subject. Ron has been around coaching for many years ,not so much in the Head Coach capacity but more as an "assistant to" in fact he is probably better known for his work at the AIS than winning championships with clubs.Ron is a very personable man who would endear himself to most people he meets but I think he would be the first to admit that the technical education of football is more his thing than would be running a team in the cut-throat arena of competition. I did not mention "secret sessions" you must have got that elsewhere. jb

Was just thinking that.. I guess it is called the roar after all

It feels like Brisbane and West Sydney are the two most discussed teams on this forum. Anyone else notice this?

Sorry, what's with the references to Waz's contacts? Can I ask who you are speaking to? As for senior players running secret video sessions without the coach...well, re-read that statement and tell me if that is a sensible. Where did this come from? This is getting ridiculous. I may not be as wordy as some, but I speak with members who volunteer at the club who have one on one talks with Dobson. I haven't heard anything about secret sessions. Perhaps my contacts aren't as far up the food chain. ;-) And the link I received for the member's survey doesn't work. Maybe tomorrow.

Certainly couldn't write anything about rugger and Asia, or South America, most of Europe, all of Africa bar a small white area, North America, pretty much every-where except for a few small countries. Oh well., you can always dream.

Should also add that Mulvey didn't immediately follow Angel, as I recall Rado ran the team down somewhat and then Mulvey was signed, to resurrect the place. I know that Dobson (or management at least) said at the recent fans forum that Mulvey was ignoring Rado and they had to sneak Rado's assessments to the players, but this does not make chronological sense. If it is so, then certainly it must have been way before Mulvey was sacked and the team was dominating the league. The whole thing is fishy. That's fine, if the issue was a personality clash, but why not tell the truth? Why not keep fans informed? The Broncos coach has a. regular weekly press conference, outside of games. Where's the Roar?

jb. We could so take this thread off topic it's not true. But let's give it a go. What MM hired Ron Smith for is a question for Mike himself, Smith is not without a serious track record in coaching so although a few eyebrows were raised at the "best signing" comment we probably all assumed it was because Ron Smith was that good a coach and not that the player signings made were actually **** which turned out to be the reality. What MM didn't sign Ron Smith for was his video analysis skills - how do we know this? Well I don't for sure however .... .... The Roar management have rather belatedly (I suspect in mild panic actually) started reaching out to the fans in an attempt to communicate and engague - better late than never although I suspect not only has the horse bolted but the barn burnt down shortly after the said mammal left so no need to shut the door. But I digress yet again, so at the recent fan forum the very direct question was asked to Sean Dobson of "without using the P-word, why was Mike Mulvey sacked?" and the answer given as one example of the issues being faced was the departure from video analysis set up by Ange and favoured by the players and other coaches, Mike called it "paralysis by analysis" which is what I outlined above ..... so go figure I guess! Now of course it is possible Sean Dobson was spinning a yarn but, having found himself in a bloody great hole it's not probable that Dobson would lie on such a thing in such a public forum! So without knowing the truth of the matter there's a few tests that might be applied to the situation: Firstly, how probable is it that the Board of Brisbane Roar football club would sack Mulvey over a trivial matter so soon after winning the double? Knowing that it was possible Wanderers, Jets, Mariners could all be looking for a new coach soon would they risk turfing out potentially the leagues best manager? It's not probable imo! Secondly, is it probable that the Bakries would allow such a decision to be made knowing one of their greatest aids to fix an unprofitable business was a successful coach? Again, it's not probable they would be flippant on such a big decision imo You've been around football clubs - spats between players/coaches, coaches/coaches is not knew nor is it normally terminal - I've seen fights break out and teeth lost and yet the next day the competitive nature focusses the mind on the bigger goal. So again is it probable that Ken and Mike fell out so badly a resolution couldn't be reached, at least thru to the seasons end? But because the situation was handled so badly we are left with a vacuum into which conspiracy theories have been poured which generally run along the lines of "Mike Mulvey was innocent, sack Ken and Sean!!" But let's look af an alternative - it is possible Mike was at fault and that Stead/Dobson are innocent bystanders and yet some fans are prepared to throw them under the bus out of shear frustration (and some malice) but without real knowledge of what actually went on - again, I just don't believe the Bakries woke up one morning and said "ooo, let's Fire Mike Mulvey today, that'll be fun" having poured several million into a loss making business I feel sure they would go out if their way to look after the main assets of the company and not (potentially) hand them over on a platter to competitors. The championship winning coach is a great asset so he wasn't sacked because one, even two people had fallen out. So the legacy of the situation is one of suspicion and mistrust and it's really not helping.

Waz -You have me ,as an outsider,confused.You say here that Mike Mulvey planned to reduce or eliminate totally ,video analysis? What is confusing is that Mike Mulvey went into print and claimed Ron Smith was the best signing he had made for the club. Now I have followed Ron Smith's career since the late 70's and if there is one thing in that career on which he has built a reputation it is in --------------- Video Analysis. In fact he spent a year ,1973, at Liverpool assisting Gerard Houllier , and on return to Australia he workd with Graham Arnold and Guus Hiddink in their preparation of Socceroo teams doing ---------Video Analysis Perhapa with your contacts you could find out what did MM sign him for if he was not going to be allowed to use the subject he has obviously "majored " in at the highest of levels. Would be interesting to know. jb

I think you're getting confused with too many Chiefs in the kitchen cooking injuns ... or were the cooking chefs, can't remember?

Too many logs in the fire? Don't you mean not enough (logs), and too many firemen?

Not going to argue directly with your statement as it is your opinion and none us actually know without the benefit of two parallel universes, and I do have sympathy with your point of view. The problem with letting the coach do it "his way" of course is that you're then at the mercy of that coach and have to reinvent wheels when he leaves - Mike had clumsily turfed Trani (ironically by demoting him to video assistant) and had we lost stead and co we would effectively be left without any connection to Anges days. My view is simply that Ange reinvented the Roar and then did the same with Australia, he had a proven methodology that won three championships - Mike was within his rights to challenge that but he had no track record to point to that would give any management faith that Mike had a better system that Ange. It was all handled badly, Mulvey should have slowed down when he got resistance and management could have coached the coach better (and sooner) to avoid firing him - everyone deserved better. alas we are where we are and it ain't pretty

Waz, good points all. My view on Mulvey, however, differs. He had just won the double. I believe the club should have let him coach the way he wanted to. Stead should have stayed out of it, and the players should have been brought into line. As it was, Mulvey was hopelessly undermined. No wonder the season opened so horrendously.