There is a lot to like about Brisbane Roar, including the fact they play some of the most attractive football in the A-League. But what is up with their crowds?
A few weeks ago, The Courier Mail’s resident football writer Marco Monteverde said it would be “embarrassing” if fewer than 15,000 fans turned up for Friday’s top-of-the-table clash between the Roar and Western Sydney Wanderers.
Unfortunately for Marco and the Roar fans in attendance, his words became a self-fulfilling catastrophe, with a crowd of just over 13,000 turning out to see a pulsating 3-2 win to the home team.
A Jamie Maclaren brace and a late winner from Dimi Petratos saw the home team fight back from a 2-1 deficit late in the match, so why weren’t the stands heaving with fans?
Well, where do we start?
For one thing, it’s hard enough to generate a decent atmosphere inside a 50,000-capacity stadium, but it’s nigh-on impossible when the ground is barely one-fifth full.
Then there’s the fact that when the fans do come, they’re still sometimes dealt a heavy hand by police and stadium staff.
A much-shared tweet by Copa 90 presenter Eli Mengem on Friday night seemed to confirm as much, with police apparently stepping in and asking a small section of Roar fans to vacate their seats.
Speaking to a long-time Roar fan a couple of weeks ago, he told me that the River City Collective – a splinter group who broke off from The Den years ago – had recently resumed taking their place in the stands.
If it was the RCC asked to vacate their seats – and from the looks of things, it was – you have to wonder why the police asked them to move.
But then you also have to wonder why Brisbane’s dedicated hardcore section The Den has shrunk so significantly in size over the past few years.
Where once it was common to see almost three full bays of active Roar supporters, today we’re lucky if half of Bay 332 at Suncorp Stadium fills with vocal fans, and I’m not sure why that is.
Is it ticket prices? Over-policing? Is it the fact that the club has burnt plenty of bridges under the Bakrie regime?
I actually spent the entire weekend on the Gold Coast, and I can guarantee that a trip to the so-called glitter strip is always a good way to put things into perspective.
I’m still not convinced the disparate population base of the Gold Coast can support a professional sporting team – let alone several – which perhaps explains why only 8,313 fans turned out for the Gold Coast Titans’ opening game of the NRL season.
And having spent much of my weekend watching sport on TV, I perhaps hit on another reason the region struggles to sustain decent crowds.
Like so many in South-East Queensland – including several English fans I regularly talk football with – I’m a transplant to the region and already support a club from another city.
In fact, having hailed originally from Sydney before moving to Brisbane, I’m acutely aware of just how Sydney-centric much of the discussion around certain A-League issues can be.
That’s why I think it’s important to hear from Brisbane Roar fans about what they think their club can do to improve attendances.
It’s not as if the Roar are alone in struggling to attract decent crowds, with yesterday’s clash between the Mariners and Melbourne Victory as notable for the dreary action on the pitch as for the 5,000 diehards who turned out to watch Victory’s routine 2-0 win.
Those diehards deserve some recognition, not least because without them plenty of A-League games would be played with practically no one in the stands.
It’s a shame when small crowds are the focus of attention.
But some teams need to do more to pull their weight at the box office, and that includes three-time champions Brisbane Roar.
Last week the Roar and AFL club Brisbane Lions announced an unprecedented collaboration, whereby members of both clubs are afforded reciprocal admission into each other’s matches. But will it help?
Ian
Guest
Bob your talking garbage.I am a Brisbane fan but Brisbane football families are pathetic. They do not support their local team and are willing to have a winge without putting their hand in their pockets . Brisbane crowds are also very bad losers and very rude. Just look at what they have done to past players and coaches upon their return playing for another club. They boo and make up rude banners like they did for Ang P . The guy wanted to be near his family for God sake and a section of Brisbane fans booed him . Just pathetic . Brisbane crowds should be 30,000 each and every week .
Et
Guest
As a born n bred, father of two brisbanite I have never watched, followed or supported soccer (yep soccer).Rugby League, cricket, local or otherwise is all I followed & supported. My 9yr old son was playing football( yes I now call it football) in primary school & one day asked if I'd take him to a game. Not keen on the idea I managed to fob off the request for a considerable amount of time. At the time I guess I considered soccer to be uninteresting, extremly boring & the image of fans to be unruly & violent. After my sons upteenth request I caved & agreed to take him plus a friend to Roar game. Sydney FC at Suncorp on a Sunday arvo. Tickets bought & collected days prior I dreaded the day as it fast approached. On the flip side my son was over the moon even sleeping with his tickets. Game Day- no backing out now we headed off. To this day it's one of the best decisions I've made, I was hooked, we were hooked. Sitting row 2 near halfway I/we were blown away by the skill, pace & sportsmanship the game was played as well as the atmosphere created by the Den. Heading home our thoughts already was when we'd be back again. To me ticket pricing was very affordable compared to other codes or family entertainment venues. Roar had gained 3 new supporters as my daughter was won over by now. Over the next days/weeks & months we attended the remaining games of the season and bought our supporter kit, ×3 a considerable outlay. We knew little about the players & club, researched what we could but overall felt isolated. I could not help but wonder, where is the interaction with the club, around town there's no visual marketing, very little merchandise or hard to find. Do they have a club house that welcomes supporters? As new supporters any info basically was on- line and out dated. The key I beleive is to be constantly visual and interactive year round with the public, schools, shopping centres (through marketing,competions,prom otions)though not americanised. Being visual keeps the club in peoples minds, not only will we get new members but also gives us all a sense of ownership for the club & brand. Anyway that's our story and thoughts & thank you for reading.
Bored Fan
Guest
I've been a Roar fan since I started caring about the A-League, around 2007. The entire time I've felt a huge disconnect between soccer in Aus and the rest of the world. Here, there is just this ridiculous emphasis on pandering to families. I get it, and I completely understand it. But I can't help but look at WSW and think, yeah, some solid passion and some dickheads making things interesting. There's none of that in Brisy. No edge, no loose young lads, no excitement. It's flat out boring. Sure, it might be great for the hardcore soccer fans who all go to bed pretending they're Messi, but for blokes like me - I want some excitement outside the game. I don't get that feel at all from the A-League - go to the games, line up for pricey beer, calm, steady procession up caxton or back home. Just no thrill at all. Just my two cents as a young bloke - which is the demographic you'll find your loudest and most loyal supporters in.
Hammerhead
Guest
MVC has a Greek connection? Horto help me out here!
Andrew
Guest
All the games are live on tv! This is generating arm chair and passive supporters. It is cheaper to stay at home and pay for Foxtel per month than take a family of 4 to one Roar game!
Johnny J-Dog
Guest
The crowd size matches the level of talent on show. Realistically the A-League is of pretty ordinary standard. Attempts on goal are regularly way off target. The A-League is for players on the way up or on the way towards retirement or who are never going to make it overseas. Mind you, I love the fact that in the week leading up to the game you can buy great seats for the Roar, so you take the good with the bad. Imagine the difficulty and cost of getting such good seats in the EPL.
Bfc
Guest
Another code in Bris is facing similar issues...the Reds rugby team once had over 30000 paid up members, but many pointedly refused to renew memberships in an act of protest to what is viewed as mismanagement at Board level. Losing is one thing (that many of us Roar and Reds fans have experienced over many a year...), but being taken 'for a ride' by management is another thing altogether. Most commercial enterprises understand...it is significantly more difficult to win back a "pissed off" customer...
BtoPower3
Guest
Hollandia connection? Maybe, the Mel Victory has a bigger crowd number usually because they have a Greek connection. And perhaps, the Sydney FC has more spectators because they are connected to Italians. So, because Brisbane Roar has no ethnicity connection recently, the club cannot attract a bigger crowd comparatively. In average, people in Logan are not as rich as people in Brisbane. However, the cost of running a match in Logan may be lower. So, a marketing research is needed to see viability.
Hammerhead
Guest
I'm not from Brisbane, but I have to ask a few questions: 1) The Hollandia connection: I've heard because of the ties the Roar have to Hollandia other migrant groups won't support the Roar (do Croatians even support A-League teams - they are the lifeblood of the game in this country. Period!) 2) I've also heard that during the NSL era people wouldn't go and see the Brisbane Strikers play despite being a non-ethnic club because the Strikers played in a competition that included clubs with names like Sydney Croatia and Melbourne Croatia. 3) If there was a second Brisbane team based in Logan would that club get higher average attendances than the Roar?
BtoPower3
Guest
Yes, you are right. However, there are things that can be viewed differently. Seems you are frustrated by the possession philosophy because you wrote "depart Suncorp on my 2.5 hour trip home, feeling absolutely frustrated, win or lose". Win or lose! Win or lose? The Roars have learnt. You can see that in the recent match against WSW, they have reverted to a more defensive strategy. Because of this they did not have a high possession rate. They could have won that match comfortably. However, the defending line, especially the left side, makes mistakes again. Actually, the defending line of BR has been terrible. For the whole season so far, they can only have 6 clean sheets. And since round 15 (match against Victory), they keep losing silly goals at the back. The only clean sheet since round 15 was the match vs the bottom team Mariner. It is difficult to explain to friends about possession. Indeed, you are right. However, possession rate is something that depends on both playing teams. Sometimes, we could hear from Guus Hiddink (many years back in EPL) or Jose Mourinho saying that: "We don't want the ball, we want position..." This kind of strategy is common when a weaker team plays against a stronger team. The weaker team wants counter-attack. So, when one of the two teams in a match is wanting to trade off possession with the space for counter-attack (plus strong defense), the opponent has automatically higher possession rate. For example, in 2010 to 2012, Brisbane Roar had always had matches in which the opposing team wanted to defend and counter-attack. In this kind of situation, it is not necessarily boring. It depends. A friend of yours or any others may find it boring. However, fans knowing the background of the league may not. It is because that these fans are appreciating on how the attacking team to break the dead-locked defense, knowing their exposure to risk of being counter-attacked. The most boring match is one in which both teams want to give up possession. I have seen one in ACL (online) years ago. In that match, when one team got the ball they kept passing at their back while their opponents sat deep at their half. So, when their opponents got the ball they both did the same. The most intensive (not boring) matches are those matches in which teams are fighting for control and possession. I can remember some. After all, it is really difficult to explain to outsiders and kids about possession. Possession is just one of the indicators. A medical doctor cannot tell if a patient is ill or not just by measuring his heart beat rate.
Peter Cotton
Guest
I am a fervent Roar supporter, and have rarely missed attending at The Den in the last 5 years, barring absences for travel, etc. Season ticket holder, blah blah blah! Too often, I depart Suncorp on my 2.5 hour trip home, feeling absolutely frustrated, win or lose. Similar emotions arise at home after watching away matches on Foxtel. How often this year have we enjoyed about 60% possession, and failed to win? It is absolutely mind boggling. This has been occurring for many years, not just 2016. I have posted here before about taking guests to Suncorp to watch this style of play, for my guests to complain to me it was boring. How was I to explain the logic in passing the ball back from 5 metres from our opponent's byline to halfway, or sometimes back to our goalkeeper, so play could be languidly switched to the other flank, whilst the opposition jogged slowly across to cover yet another slow motion advance by the Roar? I was told on this forum that my guests would not understand, would not become followers, together with various other insular responses. In the past week or two, I have read reports about the "exciting and attacking" football played by the Roar, resulting in the signing of Tommy Oar. "Exciting and attacking"? Wow! I must have missed that while yawning in The Den! So, why don't Roar draw bigger crowds? Style! Style of play! It is, with the occasional exception, boring! More than that, when getting flogged, or drawing when one should win, it is idiotic! Examples: Adelaide 3 v 0 Roar - 57.3% possession to Roar! Perth 6 v 3 Roar - 58.4% possession to Roar! Roar 2 v 2 Ncle - 64.6% possession to Roar! Why don't we learn? We won 3-1 against Sydney FC with 49% possession. We defeated WSW 3-2 with 48.2% possession. If Roar continue with the possession philosophy, it needs to be "meaningful" or "effective" possession, not possession simply for the sake of possession. I would prefer we gave the possession philosophy away, and concentrated on playing attacking football. Scoring more goals than the opposition, and drawing bigger crowds by entertaining them rather than boring them!
Wainscoting
Guest
Just on the RCC's expulsion. I was in row 7 and they were escorted out of the stadium justly in my opinion. On that day depicted, one of them climbed onto the Capo stand and very nearly started a fight there, but was allowed to stay. One of them then threw a drink onto security as his back was turned and vehemently denied that he'd done it. He was then ejected with a wry smile as his successful 'revolt' against 'authority' had met success. At first his friends gleefully recorded the events on their phones but were to follow with similar pride very shortly. None of them adorn club gear, instead dressing in black designer clothing to meet the projected image of an ultra. Their supporting our club was ostensible with the true purpose being to disrupt us and create conflict with the rest of the Den. That was the most hostile atmosphere I've encountered at Suncorp and the closest I've ever come to leaving the Den. Plenty of those around me felt the same. Self-reverential toerags the lot of them and good riddance.
j binnie
Guest
Mahler - You may or may not remember when "summer soccer" was first mooted but in the original submission it was envisaged all games would be played under floodlights in the early evening so that all age groups could attend without their normal weekend behaviour patterns being disrupted. After thorough investigations with the meteorology dept.it was actually discovered that in the suggested time frame Brisbane came under threat,not from "searing heat", but from thunder storms!!!!!!!! I don't think the powers that be ar that time got the whole message for that part of the submission was never enforced,probably due to too much opposition from NSL clubs without floodlights. Nowadays there is a different "problem" to be solved and that is how to schedule 5 games spread over a weekend to maximise viewer participation, weather and start times to suit spectators not even considered and we all know why that is,so in the old adage,"ou can't have your cke and eat it at the same time. Cheers jb
marron
Guest
Double post.
marron
Guest
Ireland, Norway, Sweden, South Africa, Argentina (from next season again), Chile, USA... probably more.
Stevo
Guest
Media inertia is a major problem, but that can be partly overcome with better on-field results. Sadly, last week's effort against WSW was a case of the Beauty and the Beast. Some great moves that paid off, and then the 'usual' failures in defense allowed WSW back into the game. Coach must deal with the weekly poor defensive lapses and also recent very poor goalkeeping play/kicking decisions. Just watched the Matilda's efforts against PR Korea last night. What an excellent football on-going showpiece - Roar need to match their commitment and other skills on field EVERY WEEK!
Jack
Guest
If the roar were to play a few games of the season in the much smaller Ballymore Stadium it would be a fun and exciting experience. Yes it is smaller, but the capacity is still larger than the crowds attending Suncorp on matchdays. But only then in smaller stadiums you have the opportunity to have a sell out stadium and bumper crowd with fantastic atmosphere in Brisbane. An example of this is with the Queensland Reds, they always used to play at Ballymore at least once a season- those games for me were the highlight of the year. The atmosphere was amazing and the atmosphere lead to the game being that much better. The Roar could even play games in regional towns and cities such as Toowoomba (where I live) at Clive Berghofer stadium, games at the Sunshine Coast and games in Ipswich and even more remote towns further west. Yes it may be more expensive but at least your bringing the game and team to people who might not be able to make games on a Friday or Saturday night. This would also bring more fans to the club who may be willing to travel further. If kids fall in love with the team and parents are willing to drive down to Brisbane to watch the closest club playing in the top flight in Australia. Because at the moment in regional towns the Roar doesn't feel like 'their' club. The only other club in Toowoomba anyway to support is the SW Queensland Thunder who are the worst NPL side in Queensland only winning one game in around two years. This is no incentive to support them. The best way football as a sport is going to grow in regional areas is if kids fall in love with the local team and the only way this can happen is if these teams not just send representatives out to these regions or play a pre-season fixture with a weakened team. The only way a true and regular fan base in these regional areas who are willing to travel to watch the Roar play, can develop is if a STATE team, actually represents the state. Yes it is Brisbane Roar but there is not another top tier side in Queensland so it is time for the Roar Management to Step up and be the team Queensland needs them to be and not just focus on Brisbane as if no one out of Brisbane supports them. Because we do and only then once the Roar full fills their duty as a club will the fans come and support THEIR side
Martyn50
Guest
So it's to hot in Brisbane and Perth. So why play during the summer? Commonsense would say to play during the cooler months when football sports are normally played. Name one country that plays a football code in the summer?
Jeff Williamson
Roar Pro
I watched that game on TV and really enjoyed it. I live a long way from Brisbane in another state, so I was never going to get the stadium. But certainly more Brisbane people could have been there. The problem this article is talking about applies to a few other clubs in the A-league. It is not just a Brisbane issue. Some clubs have done well - like Melbourne Victory. Some clubs are struggling with crowds - like Wellington Phoenix. Brisbane is not doing badly - it's just not as good as it could be. Mike talked about Gold Coast in his article - that is a place that could easily support an A-league club. It has the population, a decent stadium, and a football community. But the A-league does not seem to get interest in the Gold Coast region. A second Brisbane club has often been talked about as an expansion place for the A-league. But I think that is a long way from happening until Brisbane Roar at least doubles their current attendance.
Bart
Guest
Bahaha nice work "Bob", solved the crowd issue in one pointless comment.