Women's AFL vs W-League: All in the timing?

I will never listen to MMM again, get these ads off the articles

You actually believe that? Money follows demand - the demand has been there, the money is finally showing up.

Exactly. If there was the numbers prior to now the cash would have been spent years ago.

just heard the sa state government has contributed $550,000 over last 2 years to aflw crows to promote grow and further the interest of females in the game

No, it highlights the enthusiasm AFL fans have for their sport, and the enthusiasm women have for new opportunities. The media reflects that enthusiasm. I don't know why you find that so difficult to grasp.

The W-League's calendar is scheduled the way it is to maximize the benefits for the players themselves. FIFA requires a country/federation to have a league in order for them to qualify for the World Cup. The W-League goes on during the NWSL (US women's league) off-season, which is great for both American and Australian players (as well as any other international/foreign players) who play in both leagues - this is also an added bonus for fans who follow both leagues. There has been murmurs within the women's soccer circles about having a partnership of sorts between the W-League and NWSL for a while now (though I doubt anything would transpire). There was an interview with Sam Kerr (Perth Glory, Matildas) recently where they asked her if she would consider switching codes, and she mentioned that the pay is better in soccer than footy (which I found surprising, honestly, but it could be because she's one of the top players in the country) and she brought up a good point - for someone with her talent and skill, she can participate in bigger, more international tournaments (World Cup, Olympics, etc). I think there are a lot of fans who enjoy having both AFLW and W-League to watch, which bodes well for female participation in sports in the long run. But at the moment, the AFLW will have to face the reality that code switchers are more likely to be people who couldn't make it in the W-League, or the Matildas. Kind of like how there was a time in China where if you couldn't make it in badminton, you'd pick up tennis instead. The athletes will find their success eventually - the important part right now is to provide the avenue for participation.

Well put northerner. I'd add that its clear within the Rugbies that the opening of greater opportunities for women at the top-tier has led to media reports of boosts in grass-roots participation numbers at junior levels- perhaps in part thanks to the profile-raising success of the Womens Rugby 7s at the Olympics (but I note NITV, ABC and others have been showcasing Rugby and Australian Football for some time). Having worked within junior grassroots sport internationally and throughout five states & territories of Australia its always been clear to me that the majority of girls really embrace the (traditionally rare) chances they get to represent themselves within more physically demanding team sports- especially those considered more 'aggressive/masculine' contact sports.To suggest otherwise would to me show how little direct involvement someone has had with Australian youth over the last two decades.

" I am pointing out that there are women out there saying they want to play football, they did not have opportunities after a certain age, and now they’ve got the opportunity, they’re grabbing it." And, I'm pointing out that women who said they wanted to play Football, Basketball, Water Polo, Field Hockey, Volleyball, etc. etc. Simply got themselves organised, formed teams & started playing organised competitions. The competitions are so good, these competitions develop athletes who succeed against the best players from around the world. We are told huge numbers of girls play Aussie Rules as juniors then they move to other sports? Why? Why didn't those girls & their parents get organised, form teams & start playing their own organised comps? That's what other girls have done for the past 30 years in Football, Basketball, Field Hockey, Water Polo, Volleyball. No one waited for Head Office to create a glossy national comp. No one needed TV ratings & crowds to validate their sport. Only Aussie Rules girls seem to need this validation.

The story about girls having to stop playing in their teens is a gross exaggeration.There would be a couple of thousand of these cases at an absolute stretch. The truth is that girls have only started getting interested in footy in the last year or two, and then so the numbers are tiny. Most of the hype around women's footy is propaganda spread by the AFL and it's cohorts.

Bang on Ben. The propaganda surrounding the women's footy has been astounding. It really highlights the power the AFL has over its media.

No, I am not suggesting "alt facts." I am pointing out that there are women out there saying they want to play football, they did not have opportunities after a certain age, and now they've got the opportunity, they're grabbing it. That seems pretty obvious from interviews with the actual players, and also from the rising levels of interest in younger girls who're getting a start as the sport grows at the grassroots level. It also seems fairly obvious from the fact that the AFL had to move their start date for the League from 2020 to 2017, based on the grass roots push. I reckon the AFL had a few too many people like you, thinking they knew what was best, without actually asking the people concerned what they wanted. They've learned a fast, hard lesson. I don't know why you have this contempt for all sports other than your chosen one but so be it. But when your contempt for other sports stretches to contempt for the right of women to choose to play other sports. I draw a line in the sand. You and your sexist attitudes belong right back in the last century. Fortunately, both the AFL and the FFA have moved on.

Incorrect. The AFL is the competition for mens football. I think you are the ignorant one judging by your posts and my guess is that you are also a lard a$%e.

AFL have been spinning the story that girls are playing Aussie Rules in huge numbers. Are you suggesting that was ALT-facts? Regardless, why weren't girls playing Aussie Rules for the past 20 years? What was stopping them from forming teams? Why do they need AFLW to start playing Aussie Rules. Every sport that is played by females is driven by the demand to play the sport. Only for AFL it seems you have to artificially create demand by creating a competition that is a ratings winner on TV. If the ratings fall for AFLW, I'd expect like all other TV shows, it will be axed.

No. I don't think that. I think that, for a lot of women, the possibility of continuing to play the game ended when they were in their early to mid teens, because there were simply no structures for them to play in. That's because people like you assumed that girls didn't want to play contact sports. No one actually asked the girls. Now, the AFLW asks the question and the response is what one would expect - some girls want to play hard contact sports, just like some guys do. It's not your decision, or mine: if the ladies want to play a hard sport, and the league is prepared to support them, that's a win for everyone.

should clear it up for doc fuss and he should issue a correction to his article

Ok the Roy Morgan Data gives 1) Total Participation for Boys & Girls aged 6-13 Football = 1,244,000 Basketball = 760,000 Cricket = 651,000 Netball = 514,000 Aussie Rules = 474,000 2) Of the total girls who play sport (we are not given a figure for total no. of girls playing sport), Roy Morgan provides figures for the "% of girls playing each of the higher participation sports". So, when we analyse only girls who play sport, these are the % who play each of the higher participation sports Football = 39% Netball = 37% Cricket = 19% Aussie Rules = 9%

@The Doc 1) For Adults (aged 15 & older), the ABS produced data in 2011/12, which seems to be the most current data Source: http://www.abs.gov.au/AUSSTATS/abs@.nsf/Previousproducts/4177.0Main%20Features22011-12?opendocument&tabname=Summary&prodno=4177.0&issue=2011-12&num=&view= Female participation 15yrs & older (000s) Netball = 411 Football (outdoor) = 121 Basketball (indoor & outdoor) = 109 Hockey (indoor & outdoor) = 74 For the sports listed below participation was so low, that the ABS issues a warning about the data "the estimate has a relative standard error of 25% to 50% and should be used with caution." Soccer (indoor) = 28 Aussie Rules = 19 Cricket (outdoor) = 13 Rugby League = 9 Cricket (indoor) = 7 Rugby Union = 5 2) For Kids, Roy Morgan Research published data in 2015 Source: http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/6563-more-girls-now-playing-soccer-than-netball-201511240022 Apologies, the figures I've given are both boys & girls. Will have to do some analysis to give girls only.

It all depends on how you rate "success". With what you have mentioned here, yes, in a way the AFLW could be a success in that right. Here's a quick question for you but. Taking into consideration that there aren't many women playing the game. Do you think that not having an AFLW until now, possibly isn't the reason not many women play the game? And that it's maybe more to do with them not enjoying playing the game?...

so total participation would include females and males or am I missing something

Ben - I expect A League has been tagged as a success because it has attracted a lot of attention both from the media and from the public, because it has raised interest among women in playing the game, because it has opened up opportunities to play a sport they enjoy at the semi-professional level. All of those things count as success in my book. As for ratings, well, you seem to be as one with Nemesis on other issues, so I'm assuming you agree with him that ratings and numbers of spectators are entirely irrelevant to measuring success. Or, perhaps not.