Seven hot takes from AFL Round 17

Josh Elliott Editor

By Josh Elliott, Josh Elliott is a Roar Editor

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    Round 17 has come and gone with some results that surprised, and some that will shape September. Here’s my hot takes from the round.

    Majak and Aliir give us reason to cheer
    Who might have thought when the sport of Australian rules football was first invented here more than a century ago that someday two Sudanese refugees would be lighting it up on the big stage.

    Both Majak Daw and Aliir Aliir have taken unique journeys to the AFL and overcome amazing odds in the process of doing so, so to see them line up on each other on Sunday was just by itself a special moment.

    But for their duel to then turn into such an engrossing battle, full of twists and turns and becoming perhaps ultimately the deciding matchup of the game – this was a whole other level of watchability.

    Aliir had a big impact throughout the match in defense, often proving a vital part of the Swans’ ball movement coming out of the backline.

    In fact the only man who seemed capable of giving him trouble was his opposite number in Daw, who started the game well and just got stronger as it went on.

    Not only did Daw wind up bagging four goals, but he just had a number of really smart moments where you got a sense of how much he has learned about the game.

    It was Daw’s fourth goal that put the Roos level with the Swans with just moments remaining, and then a behind put them ahead, but there was a twist left in the tale yet.

    In the final minutes of the game the Swans surged forward and just happened to find Allir there, who ran in and kicked the last goal of the game and the first of his career.

    It proved to be the matchwinner and even broken-hearted North fans like myself will admit it was a pretty special moment. We may well have just seen the game of the year.

    A set of pretty unique circumstances created this particular match up on this particular day, and we may not get to see anything like it again – but fingers crossed we do.

    Majak Daw Aliir Aliir

    (AAP Image/Hamish Blair)

    Ecstacy and agony for Eagles at MCG
    It’s hard to imagine how it could have gone better for the West Coast Eagles at the MCG, but it’s also hard to imagine how it could have gone worse.

    At the end of the year we might be looking back on today as the day West Coast’s premiership bid was rousingly revived, only to be suddenly stopped.

    In this week: Josh J Kennedy, Jack Darling, Mark LeCras. The game was won in the rehab room – they kicked eight goals between them.

    It’s the second week in a row that, following the loss of Lynden Dunn to an ACL injury, the Pies have struggled to contain opposition key forwards.

    A date with Coleman Medal leader Ben Brown next weekend has got to be just a little worrying.

    Unfortunately for the Eagles, those important ins look like they may be followed by an out that’s just as big next week.

    Nic Naitanui went down with a knee injury during the match and while those three little letters that no one ever wants to hear haven’t been confirmed just yet, Adam Simpson said after the game that it ‘doesn’t look great’.

    It was an injury to Naitanui’s right knee that kept him out for the entire 2017 season. This time, the injury is to his left.

    A win like today’s – over a fellow top-four fancy and at the MCG – is exactly the kind of result that would make you think the West Coast Eagles can win the flag.

    An injury like the one Naitanui is feared to have suffered is exactly the kind to make you think that the footy gods just do not favour them in 2018.

    Nic Naitanui

    (Photo by Michael Dodge/Getty Images)

    A Giant resurrection and suddenly the top eight looks settled
    It wasn’t that long ago that I looked at the Giants’ upcoming fixtures and thought it was simply going to be too tough for them to navigate.

    There have been a few nervous moments certainly, but over the past few weeks they’ve managed to pinch some vital wins and put themselves firmly in the top eight.

    Two of the their three big guns in Josh Kelly and Toby Greene are now back, and Jeremy Cameron is not that far away.

    Given Cameron is returning from suspension rather than injury one would expect he’ll hit the game in peak form and feeling like he has a point to prove.

    The Giants being where they are, I feel like the top eight right now might not be too far off what we see at the end of the season.

    Richmond, West Coast, Port Adelaide, Collingwood, Sydney, Melbourne, GWS, Geelong – they’ve probably been the eight best sides of the year and have all shown that they can do some damage.

    North Melbourne and Hawthorn are out on percentage only but neither side feels likely to do anything more than make up the numbers in September.

    The ‘Roos seem to have lost their hard-working defensive edge in the second half of the year. They’ve played in some entertaining games as a result – but lost them.

    Hawthorn started the year looking strong but really have just coasted since.

    Adelaide and Essendon instead might be further back from the pack but probably look like the sides most likely to have something to say about the status quo.

    Both are only a win behind the Cats in eighth at the moment, but their percentage being what it is, will probably need to be a win ahead to leapfrog them on the ladder.

    Tim Taranto

    (Photo by Brett Hemmings/AFL Media/Getty Images)

    Sloane, Lynch loyalty something to Crow about
    The regular departure of talented players from the Adelaide Crows has been one of footy’s more curious mysteries for years now, but it finally seems like the tide may be turning.

    At the end of last year I said that the Crows were facing another contract crunch in 2018, but looking at it now you’d have to say they’ve handled it splendidly.

    Rory Laird? Tick. Matt Crouch? Tick. Jordan Gallucci? Tick. Brodie Smith? Tick. Rory Atkins? Tick. Tom T Lynch? Tick.

    And as of this week – Rory Sloane? Tick.

    I’ll admit that like a lot of folks I had gotten to the point of thinking Sloane was more likely to leave the club than stay.

    Not, I suppose, for any good reason other than the fact that players who do want to stay rarely leave it this late.

    It’s clear that Sloane strongly felt the pull of home, which makes the decision to sign on for such a long-term deal with Adelaide all the more admirable.

    And in the end he and the club were rewarded with what might prove to be a season-saving win on Thursday night.

    Sloane himself had 27 touches and a goal and got a rousing applause from the crowd after he put that one through. A great moment.

    Rory Sloane

    (Photo by Daniel Kalisz/Getty Images)

    Brisbane fans should expect plenty in 2019
    Let me take you back in time three weeks, to one of the ‘quick and nasty’ feelpinions in my hot takes from Round 14.

    “We seem to have all agreed that while Brisbane are a 1-12 side, they’re a pretty good 1-12 side. That’s fair enough but to be honest I’m still disappointed that they only have one win for the year. Just win some games, Brisbane. I’d really like to see that.”

    Evidently Chris Fagan is a regular reader here and thought it was an idea worth trying. Brisbane have won three games in a row since.

    There’s plenty of good things to like about Brisbane’s winning streak.

    For one, two of the games they’ve won have been on two of the longest roadtrips in footy: Brisbane to Perth, and Brisbane to Launceston.

    Something we often say about young teams and we’ve said plenty about Brisbane is that they tend to play much better at home. The Lions stepping up on the road is a sign of increasing maturity.

    Also impressive however was their ability to just comfortably bank a win at home when everyone knew they should. Young teams often don’t mind being the underdogs, but seem to struggle with the idea of favouritism – again, it’s a sign of developing maturity.

    However I’d say arguably the most satisfying aspect of the past three weeks for Brisbane has been to see two of their finest young talents kicking arse and taking names.

    Cam Rayner has been a stand-out, averaging more than 17 disposals and two goals per game over the past three weeks. He could still be a late shout for the Rising Star award.

    Eric Hipwood has kicked 11 goals in three weeks, sixteen in the last five. He’s absolutely justifying the pre-season hype I put on him.

    Obviously it’s too late in the year now for Brisbane to do anything better than just finish off smartly, but I reckon Lions fans should start getting really excited for 2019.

    Don’t say it just yet, but next year the F-word should by no means be considered beyond their capabilities.

    (Oh, and they still have by a long way the highest average winning margin in the league at 52.25 points.)

    Eric Hipwood Brisbane Lions AFL 2017

    (Photo by Chris Hyde/Getty Images)

    Get ready for a great Brownlow night
    Other than the chance for the AFL’s elite to get together and have a few drinks there hasn’t been much reason to stage a whole hullabaloo for Brownlow night the last two years running.

    Patrick Dangerfield and Dustin Martin have entered the past two counts as such absolutely undoubted favourites that any attempt to drum up drama has come off contrived at best.

    In the absence of a genuine favourite, 2018 looks set to be a very different affair, and the count could very well go down to the wire.

    Nat Fyfe was the nominal favourite earlier in the year until suspension ruled him out – and recent injury may now mean he would fall short of the votes required anyway.

    Tom Mitchell seems to be the new pick of the litter with the bookies at least, and there aren’t too many players at Hawthorn who seem likely to steal votes from him.

    But has he really been the AFL’s best in 2018? I don’t think it’s unfair to say that there are plenty of players who have been perhaps less prolific but more impactful.

    Patrick Cripps, Shaun Higgins and Andrew Gaff have all been thrown around as possible contenders, and even Max Gawn seems to be favoured by a few. Jackson Macrae would be right up there too if he hadn’t gotten injured at the wrong time.

    It’s a field comprised almost entirely of dark horses but if I had to pick a personal favourite (Higgins aside), I’d love to see the medal go to Rory Laird.

    He may have missed a couple with injury this year but has collected 30+ touches in 12 of 14 matches this year, and totalled 40+ for the third time in 2018 this week.

    Rory Laird

    (AAP Image/David Mariuz)

    Big decisions to be made as draft order starts to take shape
    Last week’s loss to Brisbane made it very likely indeed, now this week’s has made it all but certain that Carlton will be holding the wooden spoon – and the No.1 draft pick – at the end of the year.

    At the same time, wins to St Kilda and Brisbane have made it seem virtually certain that the Gold Coast Suns will finish in seventeenth.

    This leaves both clubs with a lot to think about as they start to keep one eye – or more than that – on the post-season.

    Carlton face two big decisions – do they keep the first pick in the draft and, if they do, who do they spend it on?

    The Blues’ outgoing footy boss Andrew McKay this week said that Adelaide are ‘desperate’ to get a hold of the top pick in the draft with the goal of acquiring South Australian sensation Jack Lukosius.

    Lukosius has been widely compared to Nick Riewoldt and has some watchers who believe he’s the best prospect the draft has seen in years.

    Adelaide will have three picks in the top 20 this year up for grabs but would probably also have to consider putting a good player or next year’s first selection on the table.

    A mature player would mean Carlton had to think about the deal but it’s hard to see who the Crows would want to let go of, unless the rumours about Mitch McGovern wanting out have some kind of weight to them.

    On the other hand if they keep the pick, the Blues will have to decide between Lukosius and the other chief No.1 contender, Sam Walsh.

    Walsh is a Victorian, renowned for his leadership, and the midfielder won the Larke Medal as the best player of this year’s U18 championships.

    However if the draft was happening right now I suspect it would be Lukosius joining the Blues at the first pick, with Sam Walsh headed to the Suns at No.2.

    Walsh would be the perfect fit for the Suns – they need committed, loyal players to build a fresh culture around, and he can be exactly that. Wherever he goes he shapes as a future captain.

    After that it’s a little murkier, but the Suns could well have pick 3 in this draft if they’re willing to let Tom J Lynch go as a free agent.

    Personally, as much as it’s tempting to push for a trade, I’d do exactly that – pick 3 in this draft is probably Ben King or Izak Rankine, and on the talent shown so far they are not the kind of players the Suns should turn down a chance at.

    Jack Lukosius

    (Photo by Adam Trafford/AFL Media/Getty Images)

    Quick and nasty
    – Congrats to Fremantle on the win but what a bizarre game that was over at Optus Stadium. Hard to figure out what happened, but Port Adelaide would want to hope it was just a one-off aberration.

    – Always an interesting talking point when Richmond loses interstate, but it doesn’t really matter at this point. Aside from Gold Coast at Metricon in a couple of weeks, they’re set to play out the rest of the season at home in Victoria.

    – It didn’t cost them too much this week but Jack Viney being out again for Melbourne could turn into a big problem and quickly – his leadership seems a crucial factor in their form. Even more worrying that it is related to the same toe that’s given him trouble recently.

    – Josh Schache is one of a few young key forwards who has struggled at times in his first years in the competition, but really did a lot this week to suggest he has a big future. Five goals in the last three weeks. The Dogs got him dirt cheap and other Vic clubs may be left to regret letting it happen.

    Josh Elliott
    Josh Elliott

    Josh Elliott may be The Roar's Weekend Editor, but at heart he's just a rusted-on North Melbourne tragic with a penchant for pun headlines - and also abnormal alliteration, assuredly; assuming achievability. He once finished third in a hot chilli pie eating contest. You can follow him on Twitter @JoshElliott_29 and listen to him on The Roar's AFL Podcast.

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    The Crowd Says (237)

    • July 15th 2018 @ 7:26pm
      Aligee said | July 15th 2018 @ 7:26pm | ! Report

      Lot of really great high standard games on the weekend.

      GWS are starting to look threatening IMO. midfield is as good as any.

      The tackle on Gray was ugly and again puts the spotlight on tackling methods, i think the laws will be changed again, particularly about pinning the arms and taking players to ground.

      • Roar Guru

        July 15th 2018 @ 10:13pm
        Dalgety Carrington said | July 15th 2018 @ 10:13pm | ! Report

        One mitigating factor for Nyhuis’ tackle was that he wasn’t actually on his feet when the movement that sent Gray’s head into the ground was applied. It suggests he was more careless/reckless than intentional.

        • Roar Guru

          July 15th 2018 @ 10:22pm
          Paul Dawson said | July 15th 2018 @ 10:22pm | ! Report

          Yes he was. He was on his feet, controlling the direction of his fall, which was a hell of a lot more control over his fall than Gray had

          Agreed it was careless, but it’s no excuse

          Not sure why you continue to excuse players getting deliberate head injuries inflicted on them.

          • July 15th 2018 @ 11:11pm
            Downsey said | July 15th 2018 @ 11:11pm | ! Report

            I don’t think players deliberately try to concuss each other.

            That said, I wouldn’t argue if Nyhuis copped a penalty. They’ve got to be more careful (as much as you can in the heat of the moment), and better to get that message sooner rather than later.

            • Roar Guru

              July 15th 2018 @ 11:13pm
              Paul Dawson said | July 15th 2018 @ 11:13pm | ! Report

              You’re confusing outcome with intent – Nyhuis deliberately tried to slam Gray into the ground, knowing that his head would more than likely hit the turf, and on the hard part outside the boundary.

              That you think even slightly someone like Nyhuis would not cop a penalty for tackling someone like Gray in such a fashion is misguided. Even Dusty would get rubbed out for a week for that one.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 12:20am
                Dalgety Carrington said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:20am | ! Report

                Here’s Paul the mind reader, at it again. Oh Swarmy tell us the lotto numbers.

                Watch the replay (particularly the rear shot) between your red mist and tea leaves. There was a little tangle of feet to start off with and he was actually off his feet for a few steps before Gray went down.

                It’s not an excuse, as I said it was a mitigating factor. He needed to execute the tackle better and he will get weeks. But any suggestion that his only possible intent was to slam his head into the ground is imaginary invention.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 12:21am
                Downsey said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:21am | ! Report

                Ah yep, good point re: o vs i. Only saw it at the match so need to have a closer look when I watch the game again.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 12:43am
                Don Freo said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:43am | ! Report

                If the ump had blown the whistle for dropping the ball when Nyhuis tackled, Nyhuis wouldn’t have had to be any more vigorous. The hysteria about ‘arms pinned’ is crazy. Gray had an arm free; they weren’t pinned. He had a duty of care to himself to not put himself in that position. He had stacks of time to dispose of it.

                Nyhuis will be rubbed out but the concussion Buddy dished out to Joel Hamling with an elbow is by far the worse football action. Why one receives near hysterical responses and the other no attention at all suggests to me that many comments are tainted by prejudice.

                On these concussion issues, Sunny needs to be told what life in a wheelchair is like. Almost every play, now, he is leading with his neck and head. He won’t see out a full career if he continues doing this.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 6:37am
                Paul Dawson said | July 16th 2018 @ 6:37am | ! Report

                Don, I saw what you said on the live blog yesterday. You wrote the book on prejudice when it comes to talking about Fremantle players. I can’t take you seriously when you are excusing nyhuis on Gray but castigating Franklin on hamling. The common factor is the freo guernsey which regrettably has been shown to distort your views to a really unfortunate degree

                Dal – you used to be someone interesting who I enjoyed reading. It’s a real shame what’s happened to you.

                Can you explain how your mind reading is different to what you call mine? I don’t play lotto so don’t have any numbers for you. But I’ll suggest 2 for how many weeks nyhuis will get.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 8:10am
                IAP said | July 16th 2018 @ 8:10am | ! Report

                You Fremantle fans seem incapable of objectivity. If that wasn’t a tackle that intended to hurt a player then that sort of tackle doesn’t exist. Put him down for a week, minimum.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 12:48pm
                Dalgety Carrington said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:48pm | ! Report

                Paul I’d hazard a guess and say your enjoyment is probably linked to whether you agree or not. The shame is for you, I’m unaffected.

                I’m not mind reading, that’s the difference. While you tried the reverso projection on Downsey, it seems that you are taking the outcome and reading the intent. Intent is invisible and our brains love to insert certainty post fact, so we’ll often read more into it, especially if it fits our preconceptions.

                There are more often than not multiple hypotheses and certainly from a sound objective logic approach it pays to entertain a number of different ones. You approach has been to dismiss out of hand any other options than the emotive one you’ve come up with.

                You ever think that Nyhuis might have just been thinking “Gray’s a slippery customer and if I don’t make this tackle stick, I’ll be watching his heels dance away to kick a goal and have let my team down”, so he grapples as tight as he can and does what he can to bring him to ground as quickly as he can? Even if, with your strong preconceptions, you don’t think it’s true, it still has a fair degree of reasonable probability.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 1:04pm
                Paul Dawson said | July 16th 2018 @ 1:04pm | ! Report

                I still maintain the intent was written all over Cameron’s face and body re: Andrews, but I will agree in this instance with nyhuis it’s far more difficult to gauge his intent. Certainly your hypothesis is entirely likely. I regret my choice of the word deliberate earlier, it introduced a degree of certainty into my argument that ultimately I can’t substantiate.

                I don’t have any interest in your emotional state when reading words written by you on this site. I am not sure why you are continually fascinated by mine.

                Comments like

                – Red mist
                – Tea leaves
                – swarmy (sic) – should be swami
                – Hazard a guess
                – Shame for you
                – Emotive one you’ve come up with
                – Mind reader
                – what fits your emotive view, you don’t need to wheel out your petulant stomping act
                – Our brains love to insert what isn’t there to justify our emotions

                If you actually knew me, I’m more sociopath than empath. Emotions are not my strong suit. But you keep going with these lines and I’ll just keep filing them away

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 2:02pm
                Dalgety Carrington said | July 16th 2018 @ 2:02pm | ! Report

                Double-up

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 5:32pm
                Dalgety Carrington said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:32pm | ! Report

                Emotions steer us more than we think they do and even if we don’t feel them on the surface, they’re often at the roots of the way we perceive the world. While sociopaths may not process empathy to varying degrees, there’s desire, anger, comfort. Prejudices and need for control are also classic emotionally driven things, even if we may not recognise ourselves as being emotional when we exercise them.

                Anyways a fair bit of your list there isn’t ostensibly about your emotional drivers. “Tea leaves”, “Swarmy” (I think that might be correct on an autocorrect on Swamy), “mind reader” were all on your assuming intent; “Shame for you” was a comment on you bringing “shame” into it, “Hazard a guess” was me describing what I was doing.

                But feel free to file them away if you want. If I reckon there’s emotional drivers impacting I’ll probably keep calling it, although I’ll note your blunted capacity.

              • Roar Guru

                July 17th 2018 @ 9:02am
                Paul Dawson said | July 17th 2018 @ 9:02am | ! Report

                The word is swami Dal. I’ll note your blunted capacity for admitting fault, and file you away with every other insecure person on this site who feels like it’s a mortal sin if they dare appear the slightest bit wrong in front of a handful of eyeballs they’ll never ever meet or have to account to

          • July 16th 2018 @ 11:11am
            13th Man said | July 16th 2018 @ 11:11am | ! Report

            The way the AFL grades these incidences is all to do with the outcome. Unfortunately for Nyhuis, even though it was quite a good tackle, Gray was concussed and may miss a week hence it will be most definitely a suspension most probably 2 weeks.

            • July 16th 2018 @ 1:20pm
              paul cotton said | July 16th 2018 @ 1:20pm | ! Report

              how on earth was that a good tackle- you are jesting I hope- he smashed the guy onto the turf!!~!!

              • July 16th 2018 @ 3:07pm
                13th Man said | July 16th 2018 @ 3:07pm | ! Report

                Technique wise it was actually quite good. The arms weren’t pinned. The issue as you say is he was slammed into the turf. Not disputing that and yes i’d say a 2 week suspension is about right. Just pointing out that actually a few years ago he wouldn’t be in any trouble for it.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 4:25pm
                Paul Dawson said | July 16th 2018 @ 4:25pm | ! Report

                And? Thalidomide used to be the most amazing cure for morning sickness too

                Past ignorance of consequences is no justification for present day behaviour

        • Roar Guru

          July 16th 2018 @ 3:30pm
          hairy fat man said | July 16th 2018 @ 3:30pm | ! Report

          two weeks at least

    • Roar Rookie

      July 15th 2018 @ 7:29pm
      Mattician6x6 said | July 15th 2018 @ 7:29pm | ! Report

      Barry crocker there Josh. Yes nic is a loss but I’m pretty certain a lycett/vardy combo is more than adequate to challenge nankervis(short and avg), gawn will likely be in a side in bottom half of eight and is melb only ruck same Ryder, Sinclair, Grundy.
      We have won both our games at the MCG so as that narrative has changed guess you boys got a silver platter filled but hey everyone was super duper correct on wce, their draft strategy, the quality of the list etc and they will be wrong here aswell.
      Its wce premiership to lose this year and everyone is chasing us.

      • July 15th 2018 @ 7:42pm
        truetigerfan said | July 15th 2018 @ 7:42pm | ! Report

        Yeah. Good luck, seriously. Nic Nat a huge out! Who have you beaten at the G? Anyway, a long way to go yet. Will be more twists and turns. I wouldn’t be going the early crow on anyone at this stage.

        • Roar Rookie

          July 15th 2018 @ 8:01pm
          Mattician6x6 said | July 15th 2018 @ 8:01pm | ! Report

          We’ve got you covered, you might have gotten used to smoke being blown up there but cmon who have you beaten? Had a chance to flex your muscles and take the points at optus but what happened? You got flogged, our second ruck is twice the player of your boy nank,we have the best intercept mark and far out you don’t have a chf to keep him honest. Rance got toweled because he doesn’t know how to clamp a quality fwd(or even an avg as we saw vs Jenkins earlier in year).
          Wce are the team to beat you’ve been lapping up caro and Jake niall a tad to much TTF and don’t realise your team is avg and get a favourable draw playing easy beats like Carlton and freo at home lulling you into a false sense of security.
          And the MCG is just a patch of grass and yeo will enjoy slamming dusty into that turf next
          EAGLES EAGLES EAGLES

          • July 15th 2018 @ 8:12pm
            truetigerfan said | July 15th 2018 @ 8:12pm | ! Report

            Wow! 6×6 throwing a petulant frenzy! What was it you said during WC’s favorable draw? Most of your away wins have been against easy beats. Tigers . . . No.1 in defence, No.2 in attack. Gives us a bit of hope, I guess. You’ve really lost it, dude.

            • Roar Rookie

              July 15th 2018 @ 8:53pm
              Mattician6x6 said | July 15th 2018 @ 8:53pm | ! Report

              Ah the old high ground response TTF, always a trusty go to in internet land bravo.
              Wce are the most balanced side in the comp and have won the four times we have been to entered Vic, plus a win at spotless as well so forgive my exuberant confidence that if the gf is wce v Richmond by chance not only do we have your measure but as wce have won 5/7 interstate matches so far I have to say Richmond’s inability to rise under pressure will be exposed.
              Cya in September, don’t worry we’ll travel 😀

            • July 16th 2018 @ 12:31am
              Davico said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:31am | ! Report

              Wow,

              Tiger fan bringing up easy draws and teams struggling away from home!!

              Just…. Can’t… Kettle… Black… MCG… GF.. argh

        • July 15th 2018 @ 9:26pm
          Matto said | July 15th 2018 @ 9:26pm | ! Report

          Funny how NN isn’t rated highly by the vics until he is injured.

          To answer your question, wce beat a top 4 team at the g today. Surprised you missed that.

          The real questions are who has richmond beat away from home? And why isn’t that important in our great and truely fair competition?

          • July 16th 2018 @ 8:12am
            IAP said | July 16th 2018 @ 8:12am | ! Report

            Collingwood have had the softest draw ever written. Everyone knows West Coast are pretenders. They’ll get to the big dance on the back of their home-town umpiring and then they’ll fold like a back poker hand. Remember the last time they played in a grand final?

            • July 16th 2018 @ 8:33am
              Matto said | July 16th 2018 @ 8:33am | ! Report

              What kind of fixtures are soft? Brisbane in Tas? Freo when they have nothing to play for? Friday night against Carl… ok there are some soft fixtures, you still have to win them and only the decent teams do consistently.

              Can remember the last 4 times they played in one. What a great season it will be if we see them in another one.

            • Roar Guru

              July 16th 2018 @ 9:13am
              Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 9:13am | ! Report

              The only gimme games are against Carlton and Suns, look at what Freo did to Port.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 9:48am
                AdelaideDocker said | July 16th 2018 @ 9:48am | ! Report

                Exactly. For all the talk about soft draws v hard draws, Sunday in particular showed us that virtually anyone can defeat virtually anyone else.

                Literally no game is set in stone. This weekend, I wouldn’t entirely be writing off the Saints against Richmond (as insane as that sounds) whilst Brisbane, on current form, are an excellent chance to beat the Crows.

                This is AFL footy, no freaking idea why anybody would take any match for granted.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 11:25am
                IAP said | July 16th 2018 @ 11:25am | ! Report

                Only because Port were crap. I for one am hoping for a Collingwod vs Richmond grand final. The build up would be epic.

              • Roar Rookie

                July 16th 2018 @ 12:41pm
                Mattician6x6 said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:41pm | ! Report

                As quality of match is an after thought to hey the build up would be EPIC it’s little wonder your broken record schtick about wce is as yawn worthy as the gf parade, but as that obviously floats your boat I shouldn’t be shocked.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 2:03pm
                IAP said | July 16th 2018 @ 2:03pm | ! Report

                The grand final is almost invariably crap. We’ve seen one good one in the last 10 years.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 2:37pm
                Paul Dawson said | July 16th 2018 @ 2:37pm | ! Report

                2008 – amazing
                2009 – one of the greats
                2010 – first one – amazing
                2010 – second one – crap
                2011 – great game
                2012 – great game
                2013 – crap
                2014 – crap result but hawthorns footy that day was transcendent, as close to art as football gets
                2015 – crap
                2016 – average
                2017 – crap

              • July 16th 2018 @ 7:19pm
                Don Freo said | July 16th 2018 @ 7:19pm | ! Report

                Yes. That 2014 was good…very close. Must have been the opposition that made it so good. Artistic.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 10:03pm
                Paul Dawson said | July 16th 2018 @ 10:03pm | ! Report

                Well, I can’t expect you to show much gratitude in defeat Don.

                I still remember the deranged vitriol you were spraying on this place after that 2015 PF result. Have you finished sticking pins in your Matt Stevic voodoo doll yet

    • Roar Guru

      July 15th 2018 @ 7:35pm
      hairy fat man said | July 15th 2018 @ 7:35pm | ! Report

      You have to laugh at those who say Richmond’s inability to win outside of Victoria this season is no big deal. If it was the Giants, Victorian football fans would never stop screaming.

      • July 15th 2018 @ 7:42pm
        truetigerfan said | July 15th 2018 @ 7:42pm | ! Report

        Meh. No big deal.

        • July 15th 2018 @ 8:16pm
          BigAl said | July 15th 2018 @ 8:16pm | ! Report

          Absolutely “Meh. No big deal”
          It doesn’t matter. The “G” is the only thing that matters !
          That was a good performance by the tiges , coming back from 4 goals down in the middle of the third.
          They would have creamed the opposition if this game was at the G – and if THEY were 4 goals up, the game would have degenerated into an absolute rout and . . . BLOWOUT !!

        • Roar Guru

          July 15th 2018 @ 9:30pm
          Paul Dawson said | July 15th 2018 @ 9:30pm | ! Report

          Well, it isn’t a big deal when you can win a flag simply by finishing top 1 or 2 (or 3 or 4 if your opponent is a victorian side) and never leaving the MCG.

      • July 15th 2018 @ 9:25pm
        big four sticks said | July 15th 2018 @ 9:25pm | ! Report

        If these interstate clubs want to be taken seriously, they need to be able to beat top Victorian clubs at the G. Until they can do that on a consistent level they will be just making up the numbers.

        • July 15th 2018 @ 9:29pm
          Matto said | July 15th 2018 @ 9:29pm | ! Report

          Why is that?

      • July 16th 2018 @ 5:58am
        Bolt1493 said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:58am | ! Report

        Yep, Totally agree. Shows the Tigers are an average team who cannot travel but might get lucky 2 years in a row.

        • July 16th 2018 @ 10:26am
          Kris said | July 16th 2018 @ 10:26am | ! Report

          They lost by 2 points for heaven’s sake.

      • Roar Guru

        July 16th 2018 @ 10:39am
        Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 10:39am | ! Report

        Of course the loss to GWS is no big deal Mr Hairy fat man. If they finish top that is, they won’t have to travel, or leave the G so the loss is only relevant if they drop to 3rd which appears very unlikely. In fact, it’s probably a blessing, wake up call and all that. They will come back to the G and continue on their merry way to the GF.

        • Roar Guru

          July 16th 2018 @ 4:03pm
          hairy fat man said | July 16th 2018 @ 4:03pm | ! Report

          It may not affect their Top 2 chances, but in assessing the relative merits of Premiership-winning teams, it must count against them.

    • Roar Guru

      July 15th 2018 @ 7:35pm
      Peter the Scribe said | July 15th 2018 @ 7:35pm | ! Report

      Freo did the Pies a big favour knocking off the Power. How did Power only kick 6 goals against a weakened Fremantle is the question? WCE, if they play like they did in the second half against the Pies , may well give the Tigers a run for their money GF day. For the Pies well perhaps due for a loss. More importantly how fast can we rebound is the question.

      • July 15th 2018 @ 7:59pm
        Macca said | July 15th 2018 @ 7:59pm | ! Report

        When will the Pies beat a top 8 side is the question! 😉

        • July 15th 2018 @ 8:43pm
          peter chrisp said | July 15th 2018 @ 8:43pm | ! Report

          It was great to see Freo knock off Port that was a huge favour an excellent result & agreed with Macca when will we beat a top 8 side? Over the next 3 weeks or so we have North, Sydney & once again Richmond and as all experts were suggesting although we are still in the top 4 have we beaten anyone of significance? Uhh?

        • July 15th 2018 @ 10:51pm
          Topper Headon said | July 15th 2018 @ 10:51pm | ! Report

          Both Melbourne & Adelaide were 2nd on the ladder when beaten by the Pies.

          • Roar Guru

            July 16th 2018 @ 8:06am
            Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 8:06am | ! Report

            Don’t worry Kevin, the parameters change each time to suit their narrative.

        • Roar Guru

          July 16th 2018 @ 8:05am
          Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 8:05am | ! Report

          Define “top side” Macca based on our remaining draw as every time someone labels us playing a top side and we do beat them, you then change your mind and say they weren’t a top side after all. I recall you saying you would rate us if we beat Melbourne and then others saying the Bombers would sort us out?

          • July 16th 2018 @ 9:40am
            Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 9:40am | ! Report

            “I recall you saying you would rate us if we beat Melbourne” You may want to go back and check that Peter because that wasn’t what I said.

            I have been saying for a very long time that Collingwood (before the Melbourne game) wouldn’t be able to be judged until the stretch of games that started on the weekend and goes to the Sydney game in round 20.

            I remember you asking if I would rate you if you beat Melbourne and my response was it would be a step forward but we would have to wait for this month to get an idea.

            ” every time someone labels us playing a top side and we do beat them,” How often has that happened? You lost by 7 goals to Richmond, 6 goals to the Eagles, are yet to play Sydney, are yet to play Port, beat Melbourne, lost by 3 goals to GWS, lost by over 3 goals to Geelong, are yet to play North and lost by 6 goals to Hawthorn, that is one win against the top 10 sides.

            “Define “top side” Sides in the top 10, North, Richmond, Sydney and Port – Obviously beating North carries less weight than beating Richmond given their ladder positions.

            • Roar Guru

              July 16th 2018 @ 10:48am
              Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 10:48am | ! Report

              Ok Macca so IF we smash North by 7 goals next week it still won’t count huh? Fair enough. We don’t really care how we are rated or who we play. It is all about the system which was unraveled nicely by a really good side in WCE. We are still missing several of our best players though and they will return over the next few weeks. As for GWS and the Hawks, that was round one and two, a lifetime ago. Since round 2 we have gone 11-3, I’ll take that after being 13th last year. As you have stated above, we still haven’t played your definition of a good side beside Richmond and WCE. So in other words, you will judge us after we have played Sydney and Port. Yet Macca Port just lost to Freo so if they keep losing you won’t classify them as a good side any more yes?

              • July 16th 2018 @ 11:06am
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 11:06am | ! Report

                Peter – this isn’t that hard. You have beaten 1 side in the top 10 and lost by 6 goals or more to 3 of the 6 that you have played and the closest you got to the other 3 is 16 points.

                If you beat North this week it will be a step forward but they are the lowest of the “good sides” it won’t mean much if you then get belted by 6 goals to Richmond, Sydney and Port. But you have to beat them first.

                I have been consistent for a long time now Peter, your test started on the weekend and so far it hasn’t gone well.

                Surely if Collingwood make the 8 having only beaten Melbourne of the other 8 finalist you would have some concerns?

            • Roar Guru

              July 16th 2018 @ 11:44am
              Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 11:44am | ! Report

              No real concerns Macca. I predicted last December the Pies would finish 4-6th and play finals to much amusement and scorn from yourself and others. If we do finish 6-8th and get a final, maybe even one final win it will be a great stepping stone for 2019 with some tweaking of the list in the off season we will have every right to be aiming top 4 and a shot at a flag in 2019. We may well have Tom Lynch to help us along the way too and perhaps get a better run with injuries than we have this year. For the Pies to play finals this year if we do indeed make it, with the injuries we have Nathan Buckley is surely coach of the year already.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 12:02pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:02pm | ! Report

                I meant concerns about actually winning a final but apparently that isn’t important.

                You have to remember to that if you make the finals this year you will get a harder draw next year, more games against those sides you were unable to beat this year. You could improve and still go backwards.

            • Roar Guru

              July 16th 2018 @ 12:18pm
              Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:18pm | ! Report

              Would love to win a final Macca and think we would have every chance except against WCE away. I don’t think we are quite ready to make a Prelim yet but would love to be surprised!

              • July 16th 2018 @ 2:25pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 2:25pm | ! Report

                Results to this point of the year would suggest you are no hope against anyone except Melbourne,

            • Roar Guru

              July 16th 2018 @ 2:38pm
              Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 2:38pm | ! Report

              Macca, I am happy contending for the finals right now. It makes footy exciting again, reading the team lists, going to training sessions, looking forward to each game, unfortunately your own side has become so bad all you can do is try and take the joy out of fans who are indeed contending. That is sad Macca and an indictment on the club you so stoically support. You are also already shooting your argument down with your comment “You have to remember to that if you make the finals this year you will get a harder draw next year,”
              Doesn’t work that way Macca. A team finishing high this year might get hit badly with injuries and fall away, someone else will come from the bottom which makes your preemptive remarks already about the 2019 draw as just you trying desperately to find a negative for the Pies. You place too much emphasis on the draw and not enough on results. As for me ATM I have every right to be optimistic about watching the Pies in the finals whereas you have been beaten into a sad caricature version of your earlier season self wherein all you can do is try and shoot down the joy in other sides who are contending.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 4:43pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 4:43pm | ! Report

                Peter – clearly you realise you can’t argue the facts so you have chosen to have a crack at me personally and the blues.

                I am not trying to take your joy away or criticising you for being optimistic, simply pointing out the obvious fact that as yet only 1 of your 11 wins has come against a team higher than 10th on the ladder. The fact you are getting so snippy about it points to you knowing it is true.

                ““You have to remember to that if you make the finals this year you will get a harder draw next year,” It works exactly that way, of course teams go up and down (the blues have had a harder draw than they were “supposed” to have for the last 2 years) but the league deliberately tries to engineer you a tougher draw because you finished higher.

                Because of your finishing position last year you got Brisbane, Fremantle and Carlton twice this year (3 from the bottom 6), 1 from the middle 6 (Essendon) and 1 from the top 6 (Richmond) – next year you will only get 1 double up against a bottom 6 side and possibly 3 against a top 6 side (if you stay in the top 6) – it will take extraordinary luck not to get a harder draw.

                On top of that the fact this year you have got to round 17 with 9 games against the bottom 8 sides and just 5 against the top 8 will be very hard to replicate going forward.

              • Roar Guru

                July 17th 2018 @ 7:48am
                DingoGray said | July 17th 2018 @ 7:48am | ! Report

                So let me get this straight, you’ll absolutely pick the eyes out of Collingwood inability to win games against “good teams” yet still find themselves in the 8 even though they are probably missing 8-12 of their best 22…..

                Yet continually trot out excuse after excuse about your pathetic Blues.
                Ever heard of the saying those who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones?

                I can’t stand Collingwood the Club, but I’m quite envious of where they sit on the ladder considering all factors this year.

              • July 17th 2018 @ 8:53am
                Macca said | July 17th 2018 @ 8:53am | ! Report

                Dingo – a couple of quick questions;
                1) How many top 10 teams have Collingwood beaten this year?
                2) How many of their 11 wins have come against bottom 7 sides?

              • Roar Guru

                July 17th 2018 @ 9:04am
                DingoGray said | July 17th 2018 @ 9:04am | ! Report

                Who cares who they’ve beaten…..

                You can use any selective narrative you like as you always do.

                The facts remain, the Pies have won 11 games ( 10 more than your rabble 7 more than my Lions) with the largest injury impact in the league.

                A club that you were claiming was going to finish lower end of the ladder. Even compared them similar to the Blues.

                So trot out whatever you like about who the Pies have beaten and have not beaten. They have won enough games to put themselves in a position to play finals and provide their fans with hope and excitement….

                While you clutch to and keep trotting out the magnificent work being done at the rabble you support.

              • July 17th 2018 @ 9:25am
                Macca said | July 17th 2018 @ 9:25am | ! Report

                Dingo – The discussion is are the Pies actually a top 3 side – who they have beaten is very relevant to that.

              • Roar Guru

                July 17th 2018 @ 9:41am
                DingoGray said | July 17th 2018 @ 9:41am | ! Report

                Discuss all you like.

                Facts remain, they’ve won 11 games which when you compare to the other 17 teams puts them third on the ladder.

                That makes them a top 3 team, like the fact Carlton has won only one game and makes them the bottom team.

                Last time I looked Finals are determined on Ladder position.

                Who had the easiest draw has absolutely zero to deal with it

              • July 17th 2018 @ 9:57am
                Macca said | July 17th 2018 @ 9:57am | ! Report

                “Discuss all you like.” And yet you complain when I do!!

                Finals aren’t determined on ladder position, who plays in them is, and that is determined at the end of 23 rounds not 17.

                I am looking at the ladder at the end of the season and how Collingwood will go if they do make the finals – unless the start beating sides inside the top 10 things don’t look good on either count.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 5:06pm
                Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:06pm | ! Report

                Macca, I have never claimed we will win the flag this year but at 11-5 can afford to think we are a chance to play finals. The ladder changes all the time but I assume you are talking about the current ladder. So yes we have played Richmond at the G and got spanked in the last qtr, WCE at the G and got spanked in the second half. We haven’t played Sydney or Port so haven’t beaten them or lost yet. We played GWS and ran close to them way back in round 2. Geelong beat us by 20 odd points in a shocking game of footy.

                We have lost the following starting 22 players in 2018 to long term injuries. Treloar, Dunn, Reid, Jamie Elliott, Goldsack, Broomhead, Moore, Wells, Josh Smith, Aish.

                We have had the following players also spend significant time out with injury. Greenwood, Varcoe, Adams, De Goey, Maynard.

                Players we may get back next few weeks enhance my optimism including Goldsack, Aish, Jamie Elliott, Josh Smith, Appleby and Adam Treloar.

                To think we now sit with a strong chance of playing finals after a horror injury run is yes, enough to give me excitement about the rest of 2018 and then 2019.

                You are already trying to look at next years draw to pull the Pies back a peg, steady on Macca we haven’t even qualified for 2018 finals yet.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 5:16pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:16pm | ! Report

                Peter – you claimed this year was a steeping stone to bigger things next year, I simply pointed out next was going to be harder.

                “steady on Macca we haven’t even qualified for 2018 finals yet” my point exactly.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 5:31pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:31pm | ! Report

                All those injuries and Fasolo still can’t get a game!!

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 5:35pm
                Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:35pm | ! Report

                Macca, you miss the point. Fasolo can’t get a game with the Pies list. In the Blues list he would be your best forward besides Curnow.

              • July 17th 2018 @ 8:55am
                Macca said | July 17th 2018 @ 8:55am | ! Report

                No Peter, you miss the point – it is why can’t Fasolo get a game in a team that is missing so many best 22 players through injury?

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 5:40pm
                Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:40pm | ! Report

                As an observer in The Roar Macca I have just noted your comments have got more snipey, more negative about other sides as the Blues season from hell gets worse and worse. I understand in a way as there is little you have to look forward to except perhaps the sides you hate falling over like the Pies, Bombers. it is a shame as your comments early on were worth reading but this shooting down of the tall poppy Pies has just become a little sad.

              • July 17th 2018 @ 9:02am
                Macca said | July 17th 2018 @ 9:02am | ! Report

                Peter – I am not the one playing the man rather than the ball, it seems you simply don’t like hearing that the simple facts.

      • Roar Guru

        July 15th 2018 @ 9:31pm
        Paul Dawson said | July 15th 2018 @ 9:31pm | ! Report

        I think the weather had something to do with it.

      • Roar Guru

        July 15th 2018 @ 10:20pm
        AdelaideDocker said | July 15th 2018 @ 10:20pm | ! Report

        You’re welcome. Pity you guys couldn’t take care of our West Australian counterparts, but such is life I guess! 😉

      • July 16th 2018 @ 12:50am
        Don Freo said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:50am | ! Report

        Freo has been weakened, Pete, up forward and in the midfield but its back 6 is as good as any in the league and its two key defenders are the best pairing. Hence the low scores against them.

        • Roar Guru

          July 16th 2018 @ 8:07am
          Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 8:07am | ! Report

          A great performance Don and exposed some vulnerabilities with Port.

        • July 16th 2018 @ 12:02pm
          Downsey said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:02pm | ! Report

          Our backline is excellent. Athletic, tenacious, level-headed, team-minded. Bodies still growing. I’m calling it that they’ll be damn near invincible in a couple of years.

          • July 16th 2018 @ 12:16pm
            Jon Boy said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:16pm | ! Report

            Agree Downsey, Ryan and Hamling have been sensational (never beaten) but Cornes obviously does not watch Freo play. Surely he watched this week playing his old mob.

            • July 16th 2018 @ 3:21pm
              13th Man said | July 16th 2018 @ 3:21pm | ! Report

              Yep Pearce, Hamling, Ryan and Wilson have the makings of one of the best backlines around. Hughes added far more than Kersten did as well.
              Now we need something down the other end! I know i wrote him off but I thought Jones was actually pretty good yesterday. Added more than Apeness for mine. Still slow and limited but attacked the contest hard. Not best 22 if Tabs is fit obviously but actually played quite well. Credit where credits due he’s done better than I thought he would. McCarthy went MIA again however, can’t help but feel we payed massive overs for that guy!

    • July 15th 2018 @ 7:36pm
      Rissole said | July 15th 2018 @ 7:36pm | ! Report

      Good to see Brisbane’s ledger more accurately reflect their effort to date for the season.
      Essendon’s next 4 games are all winable, however, their forward line looked very dysfunctional without Stringer & Fantasia (not to mention Daniher).

    • July 15th 2018 @ 8:22pm
      Macca said | July 15th 2018 @ 8:22pm | ! Report

      If the blue keep pick 1 I think they will back McKay, Curnow and even TDK (who has impressed in the twos) or Kerr to provide the key forwards and look to add midfield depth and go with Walsh.

      Cripps, Dow, Fisher and Walsh would be a decent start for a midfield group.

      I do think a trade is very likely, if the Suns get pick 3 for Lynch I could see the blues trading 1 for 3 and the Eagles for rounder the Suns have (say 16) or 2 and one of the 2 second rounders the Suns have (Essendons and Geelongs), they could do something with Adelaide with their 2 first round picks plus the blues pick 19 or an established player.

      I think the blues plan a would be to have a crack at one of the 2019 free agents and see if a club wants to get more than the AFL will offer but who knows if they can make that happen.

      • July 15th 2018 @ 8:43pm
        sammy said | July 15th 2018 @ 8:43pm | ! Report

        @macca, I wonder if the crows and Carlton could do a trade although SOS does not like us very much and has had his way with Reid 2 years running. It could look something like the 2 x 1st rounders and the carlton 2nd rounder for pick 1 and maybe the Adelaide 2nd rounder coming back…maybe. The club it has been mooted wants Lukosius very much. I think the better strategy personally for my club is to trade into the top 5 to guarantee Rankine and with whaterver picks we still have grab Rozee or Hately..but I am just an interested spectator and have no idea how a deal could be engineered

        • July 15th 2018 @ 8:57pm
          Macca said | July 15th 2018 @ 8:57pm | ! Report

          SOS likes what is best for the blues – I can see a deal being done but the blues will have the whip hand and I think the Crows won’t be th e only ones making an offer.

          • July 15th 2018 @ 9:16pm
            sammy said | July 15th 2018 @ 9:16pm | ! Report

            Probably not (crows being the only ones making an offer) but I suspect the crows might also be thinking that Carlton could be taking Walsh and it might be wise to sound out Gold Coast and Brisbane to see what they might want for their top 1st round pick. Live trading of picks will also make it quite interesting as it is a whole new dynamic that is most likely to be introduced on draft night

          • Roar Guru

            July 15th 2018 @ 10:21pm
            Col from Brissie said | July 15th 2018 @ 10:21pm | ! Report

            Macca, my best case scenario is to deal with the Suns. They will more than likely end up with picks 2 and 3 (compo pick for Lynch). They would be looking to get either a Lukosius or King to replace Lynch. We trade pick 1 for pick 2 and either their other first round pick which is currently 17 or one of Ainsworth or Miller.

            Having pick 1 guarantees they get who they want, either Lukosius or King and we end up with Walsh and another first round pick or player. If they decided to go for Walsh then we end up with Lukosius and a pick or player.

            • July 15th 2018 @ 10:37pm
              Macca said | July 15th 2018 @ 10:37pm | ! Report

              There were rumours the blues were after Scrimshaw and Brodie so pick 2 and one of those ( or the two you suggest) may work.

              The big thing is, Lukosius is hot property but doesn’t exactly fit the blues priorities- I can see there being some interesting bids for pick 1.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 9:57am
                Col from Brissie said | July 16th 2018 @ 9:57am | ! Report

                Macca, Shiel has ruled out leaving GWS this year so any thoughts on trading 1 for him should be put to bed. Save up the dollars and make a big bid for him next year. For me Walsh is the kid the Blues should get.

            • Roar Guru

              July 16th 2018 @ 2:54pm
              Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 2:54pm | ! Report

              One by one the bog fish are getting put to bed. Tom Lynch (Crows), De Goey, Sloane and now Shiel. Gaff’s $$$$ offer just keeps rising. What do the Blues do if all the big fish aren’t interested Col? Back to the draft again?

      • July 15th 2018 @ 9:33pm
        Mark Q said | July 15th 2018 @ 9:33pm | ! Report

        I think Blues will keep pick 1 and take either Lukosius or Walsh (most likely Lukosius). Don’t forget that prior to his ACL Docherty was also slated for midfield time. With Docherty, Williamson, Plowman and Byrne back in the side there will be more stability for the backline, plus extra options for rotations. But imagine Charlie Curnow and Jack Lukosius running around the same forward area? I’d like to see that. But that being the case, we still need more midfield help…

        • July 15th 2018 @ 10:38pm
          Macca said | July 15th 2018 @ 10:38pm | ! Report

          I am looking forward to seeing McKay and Curnow together in front of a decent midfield.

          • Roar Guru

            July 15th 2018 @ 11:11pm
            Paul Dawson said | July 15th 2018 @ 11:11pm | ! Report

            Are they being traded to Richmond?

          • Roar Guru

            July 16th 2018 @ 11:51am
            Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 11:51am | ! Report

            What about Fasolo as well Macca? Fasolo will be up for grabs end of the year I’d say.

            • July 16th 2018 @ 12:06pm
              Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:06pm | ! Report

              No thanks Peter, hasn’t played a full season since 2012, only played more than 12 games twice
              since then, and never kicked 30 goals in a season.

              I also get the impression his attitude wouldn’t fit in with Bolton and a young group but that is only an opinion from far away.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 12:20pm
                Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 12:20pm | ! Report

                Will remind you of this comment if he does join the Blues and kicks 6 in his first outing. I rate Fas pretty highly but yeah probably more likely to join Fremantle I’d say.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 2:24pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 2:24pm | ! Report

                I expect spuds to have their one decent game of the year against the blues.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 2:57pm
                Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 2:57pm | ! Report

                You have changed Macca. Don’t say I blame you for becoming a bit bitter and twisted after the Blues season. What I thought of your character at the start of the year wouldn’t have called a bloke with the issues Fas has a “spud”. He’s not that regardless, he can play good footy it’s just the Pies forward line doesn’t really have a spot for him anymore. He will prove you wrong whoever he joins.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 4:14pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 4:14pm | ! Report

                Peter – what issues are you referring to?

                I referred to him as a “spud” in slight over exaggeration but primarily because “the Pies forward line doesn’t really have a spot for him anymore” despite him being in what should be the prime of his career and only having to beat talented youngsters Stephenson (19), Daicos (19) Sier (20) or honest toiler Greenwood for a spot – if he can’t beat those blokes into the side he isn’t offering anything that would get him into the blues side in front of SPS, Pickett, Garlett or Wright.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 4:26pm
                Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 4:26pm | ! Report

                Fasolo has gone public with his battle with depression despite Mark Slobbo ‘s disgraceful tweet about it. Fact is he has also had injury issues. With the season the Blues are having if Fas and Jarryd Blair played in your side they would both probably be top ten in your B and F, Blair probably top three. I expect Fas to go to Fremantle but the Blues should be looking at Blair.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 4:55pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 4:55pm | ! Report

                Peter – Fasolo announced he was battling depression over a year ago and no mention has been made of it since and he has not stood out of football because of it this year so while I acknowledge it never really goes away it is a stretch to say I can’t call him a spud because of his issues.

                “fact is he has also had injury issues.” Exactly an he has had injury issues all his career only twice getting past a dozen games in a year.

                But according to you we have a bloke who has issues with depression, issues with injury and can’t beat a couple of teenagers into your side – why exactly should the blues take him and what do you think they should give up to get him.

                As for Elliott again he has battled injury for some time and can’t beat a couple of teenagers in.

                Both Elliott and Fasolo were amongst the worst for forward pressure last year (which is why they can’t get a game I believe) – neither would get a game in front of the young blokes at Carlton especially if we do get another couple of midfielders (and DOcherty moves into the middle) and the likes of Dow, Fisher, SPS and Murphy will be spending more time forward

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 5:10pm
                Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:10pm | ! Report

                And that Macca is exactly the Blues problem. You are playing kids because they are kids not because they deserve a game. If your recruiting department had picked up some of these fringe players from good sides they would help nurse your kids along, protect them from the constant losses. To claim Blair, Elliott and Fasolo wouldn’t get a game with the Blues, if true, shows exactly where the Blues are going wrong. By the way, ATM you would get all three of them for nothing as they are all out of contract.

              • July 16th 2018 @ 5:22pm
                Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:22pm | ! Report

                Peter – if we were playing kids because they are kids McKay would have been playing all year and the likes of Mullett, Thomas, O’Shea and Shaw wouldn’t be playing.

                The kids are playing because they deserve a game – my point is that is Fasolo and Elliott, two injury riddled 26 year olds with poor defensive records, can’t get past Collingwoods kids why would we want them?

                Personally I would prefer to play a kid and lose a few more games now but get a bigger pay off later than some 26 year who couldn’t get a game at a side looking likely to finish mid table and crawl to 14th but get no long term benefit.

                Get them for nothing – shows how much they are worth. If they were as good as you say the Pies would be re-signing them surely.

              • Roar Guru

                July 16th 2018 @ 5:48pm
                Peter the Scribe said | July 16th 2018 @ 5:48pm | ! Report

                You think that these kids will just get better with experience is the issue. Meanwhile, game after game they get conditioned to losing so the experience they are getting is experience in being in a losing side 22 weeks of the year. That cannot be a good thing. If your club had thought more like Brisbane you could have got them a few wins on the way and then the good kids get some experience in having a win, the average kids stick in the VFL ultimately delisted. This all out youth strategy has been a bust. Fagan and the Lions have given the Blues the blueprint for the future and they would be best swallowing their pride and following them.

              • July 17th 2018 @ 9:00am
                Macca said | July 17th 2018 @ 9:00am | ! Report

                “If your club had thought more like Brisbane you could have got them a few wins on the way” in 2015 Brisbane won 4 games (Carlton 4), in 2016 Brisbane won 3 games (Carlton 7), in 2017 Brisbane won 5 games (Carlton 6) – how is it exactly that Carlton players will be more conditioned to losing than the lions?

                If you theory held true we wouldn’t see the lions winning the last 3 games.

                And as discussed previously the blue print you want the blues to follow is the exact one they set out to follow 3 years ago.

        • July 16th 2018 @ 10:31am
          Kris said | July 16th 2018 @ 10:31am | ! Report

          Sam Walsh, like Marc Murphy, will probably play 200+ games for one club. Will Lukosius do his two years and ask for a move?

          • July 16th 2018 @ 10:46am
            Macca said | July 16th 2018 @ 10:46am | ! Report

            The way Josh describes Walsh he seems a great fit for the blues even before you get us needing a mid more than a KPF.

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