Remember these Wallabies-in-waiting – Tom Banks, Jack Maddocks, and Jordan Petaia

David Lord Columnist

By David Lord, David Lord is a Roar Expert

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    Rarely do three outstanding rookie wingers surface at the same time – Brendan Moon debuted in 1978, David Campese in 1982, and Joe Roff in 1995.

    They became three of the very best Wallabies – Moon a magnificent finisher, Campese arguably the best making tries out of nothing with his signature goose-step something to admire, while Roff used his 191cms-101kgs frame to productive use.

    So what do Tom Banks, Jack Maddocks, and Jordan Petaia offer?

    They share three assets – rugby nous, instant acceleration, and are excellent defenders.

    Banks is 24, and a first choice fullback with the Brumbies. But he’s shown such diversity in talent, there’s no doubt he could play anywhere from 10-15 with equal ease.

    Maddocks is 21, as good a first-grade batsman with Sydney Uni as he is a utility rugby back, but he’s settled for rugby with the Rebels.

    While Petaia is only 18, an Australian Schoolboy last year, and a Queensland Red, who just oozes talent.

    Congratulations to coach Michael Cheika for including them in the 36-strong Wallaby squad for the Rugby Championship, but make sure they are retained when six are dropped later in the week.

    There’s no reason why two of them can’t be on the wings for the opening Bledisloe Cup-Rugby Championship clash with the All Blacks

    Before the naysayers say they are too young or too inexperienced, if they good enough, they are old enough – and all three are well and truly good enough.

    They don’t have to be taught how to pass, catch, support, and defend – it’s built-in as it should be for anyone selected for a gold jersey.

    Let’s stick to the latter – defence.

    The three best-performed Wallaby lineups were the 1984 Grand Slammers, and the 1991-1999 Rugby World Cup champions.

    Not only were they try-scoring outfits, but the kept their opponents almost tryless – the current Wallabies would be well-advised to watch these predecessors.

    The Alan Jones-coached Andrew Slack-led Slammers are still the only Wallaby side to achieve the feat.

    They scored 100 points to 33 in beating England, Ireland, Wales, and Scotland with mercurial Mark Ella scored in all four internationals.

    The telling stat was the 11 tries to one, with Wales the only country to cross the Wallaby white line.

    The Bobby Dwyer coached-Nick Farr-Jones led 1991 World Cup Wallabies ratted up 126 points to 55 in winning all six games.

    Scoring 17 tries to three in the tournament, the Wallabies gave up two tries against Argentina in the opening round, and one against Ireland in the quarters, but kept the All Blacks and England tryless in the semis, and final.

    The Rod Macqueen coached-John Eales led 1999 World Cup champions were even better performers, rattling up 221 points to 73 in their wining six games.

    But they scored 24 tries to just one, with the USA crossing in the group game.

    In all three examples, the Wallabies were just as effective scoring tries as they were stopping their opponents.

    Defence, defence, defence.

    That’s where the current Wallabies suffer, and while they can score many outstanding tries, they give up too many.

    Even the mighty All Blacks haven’t been as effective in winning the last two World Cups as the three Wallaby lineups.

    In 2011 the men-in-black piled on 301 points to 72 in scoring 40 tries to eight.

    In their seven games, Tonga, Japan, France (2), Canada (2), Argentina, and France dotted down in six of them.

    In 2015, the All Backs scored 280 points to 97, and crossed for 40 tries to six in winning all seven games.

    Argentina, Nambia, Georgia, and France crossed, while the Wallabies scored two tries in the final.

    The obvious message is loud and clear, stop opponents scoring tries, and winning becomes easier.

    Michael Cheika doesn’t have to tell Tom Banks, Jack Maddocks, or Jordan Petaia about that, it’s automatic in all three.

    David Lord
    David Lord

    David Lord was deeply involved in two of the biggest sporting stories - World Series Cricket in 1977 and professional rugby in 1983. After managing Jeff Thomson and Viv Richards during WSC, in 1983 David signed 208 of the best rugby players from Australia, New Zealand, Fiji, England, Ireland, Scotland, Wales and France to play an international pro circuit. The concept didn't get off the ground, but it did force the IRB to get cracking and bring in the World Rugby Cup, now one of the world's great sporting spectacles

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    The Crowd Says (88)

    • August 6th 2018 @ 7:57am
      Rhys Bosley said | August 6th 2018 @ 7:57am | ! Report

      I haven’t watched many Brumbies games this year, so what surprised and impressed me with Banks in the trial was how intuitively he stepped up to first receiver to distribute. All the chatter has been about his finishing and defence, but if he is also a genuine playmaking option that is a real asset wherever he plays.

      I like that Banks would be in his mid 20s getting his first cap too, I reckon players to whom it all hasn’t landed on their lap at a young age are often more appreciative, hungerier avd more level headed than their younger counterparts. That said I agree with David that if Petiea and Maddocks are good enough they are old enough, but my preference would be for Banks to get a crack at gold first.

      • August 6th 2018 @ 8:08am
        Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 8:08am | ! Report

        Personally, I think that Banks is the best of the trio. He’s really fast, good under the high ball, has a decent boot on him, good defender and, as you say, he knows how to throw a pass. I think he will be the Wallabies’ next longterm fullback.

        Petaia looks like a really special talent to me. I wonder whether he will end up making wing or outside centre his spot?

        In regards to Maddocks I am still confused as to what position he is developing into…

        • August 6th 2018 @ 9:11am
          jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:11am | ! Report

          Hopefully 13, with Kerevi inside him – long term.

          • August 6th 2018 @ 9:21am
            Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:21am | ! Report

            That’s what I think too, James. Could easily be the Wallabies’ centre pairing after the RWC.

            • August 6th 2018 @ 10:06am
              jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:06am | ! Report

              I haven’t actually seen much of him though. But 190cm and 98kg, developing, is impressive. Defending at 13, is he up to it? And can he be a good distributor out wide? How quick is he?

              I’m assuming someone is working on all of this.

        • Roar Guru

          August 6th 2018 @ 9:25am
          Train Without A Station said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:25am | ! Report

          Banks is probably a more experienced and safe Maddocks. But Maddocks probably has a bit more upside.

          • August 6th 2018 @ 9:32am
            Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:32am | ! Report

            No, I don’t think so necessarily.

            Banks is evidently faster, more elusive and more powerful in contact, better positionally.

            Maddocks has a much better long pass (but I see no evidence of faster hands) and a better boot.

            It’s telling that Maddocks says that Larkham, Cheika and Wessels all think that his longterm position is at 10.

            They’re not like for like players.

          • August 6th 2018 @ 10:12am
            jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:12am | ! Report

            I think they’ve both got a lot of upside, but different. Like Fionn said, very different players. Banks is a more compact build, quick and solid. Maddocks is longer, maybe overall better ball skills. He does need to spend time at 10 and if Wessels is one of those who said that, why isn’t he? Maybe next season, which is fair enough. Spend a year or two at 15 before moving forward.

            So post Beale/Folau you boys would be looking for a backline like

            10. Maddocks
            11. Koroibete
            12. Kerevi
            13. Petaia
            14. Hodge/Banks
            15. Banks/Hodge

            And forwards looking good with Tupou, BPA, Fainga’a, Latu, Ala’alatoa, Rodda, Coleman, Arnold, Tui, Naisarani, Valetini etc.

            We need some to take the Super comp by the scruff of the neck and be consistently good.

            • August 6th 2018 @ 10:37am
              Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:37am | ! Report

              I think Andrew Deegan will be challenging for the 10 jersey.

              I expect Daugunu to feature as well to be honest. He’s a beast in attack.

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 10:52am
                Hoy said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:52am | ! Report

                I don’t think the ARU will select from the Force. I just can’t see it.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 11:01am
                Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:01am | ! Report

                To be honest I’d be surprised if he stayed at the Force. I would think surely some super teams would be interested?

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 11:00am
                Train Without A Station said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:00am | ! Report

                I must have watched a completely different game to everybody else.

                From what I saw Deegan, other than a missed kick for touch, kicked quite well, but for every good pass (like the one to Gordon) there was a pass to nobody and a lot of his passes were to/behind the man not in front of the man which meant any good result was based on the recipient winning a one on one battle, not being put into space.

                Unrealistic to expect him to be in-sync with the backline off the preparation they got but I just didn’t see him controlling proceedings the way others supposedly did.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 11:04am
                jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:04am | ! Report

                Great.

                Hoy the Tahs or Brumbies should be chasing Deegan then. The Tahs should pick him as backup midfield to learn from Foley and Beale for a couple of years, two of the best rugby minds we have (among current players).

                The Brums could surely use him too. Reds have Stewart longer term and the Rebels Toomua for a few years, and then Maddocks. In fact next year, the Rebels would be crazy not to use the chance of having Toomua there to play him at 12 alongside Maddocks at 10, to take the playmaking pressure off for a couple of years. Meakes or English at 13, the other on the bench. Hodge, DHP and Koroibete in the back 3. Naivalu to bench

                Genia starting Ruru off the bench.

                The other Force guy is Louwrens, the Reds surely need him, or the Brums as backup for Powell.

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 11:06am
                Train Without A Station said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:06am | ! Report

                This will ruffle a few feathers but most players at the Force don’t want to be at the Force. Most are playing there because it’s a better chance to push for a Super Rugby opportunity (or overseas) than playing club rugby.

                I’m sure there’s a couple like Tessman who are settled with a family in Perth and near the end of their careers. By the are the minority.

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 11:22am
                piru said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:22am | ! Report

                This will ruffle a few feathers but most players at the Force don’t want to be at the Force. Most are playing there because it’s a better chance to push for a Super Rugby opportunity (or overseas) than playing club rugby.

                I think that’s a fair comment, but a bit overstated TWAS

                Yes, it’s seen as a launching pad for the young and overlooked, but I think they’d rather be at the Force than not factoring at all.

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 11:34am
                Train Without A Station said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:34am | ! Report

                Just mean it as they are only there because there are no other options in Australia other than WTS spots for 2018.

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 11:54am
                Paul D said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:54am | ! Report

                “the Tahs or Brumbies should be chasing Deegan”

                Deegan isn’t new. He’s been at the Tah previously and I think the plaudits he’s getting now are a little over cooked. He was pretty good for NSW Country Eagles, but there were also 2 other playmakers in the backline doing a lot of the work too. He only played 2 games in Ireland before departing. And the games the Force have dominated have been against thrown together teams. They were soundly beat by the more organised squads they faced.

                The Tahs have invested in Mack Mason and Will Harrison as the long term flyhalf planning, and have Hegarty already.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 11:56am
                Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:56am | ! Report

                I’m surprised Hegarty isn’t getting more minutes at 10.

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 12:08pm
                piru said | August 6th 2018 @ 12:08pm | ! Report

                Paul in the games the Force have lost, Deegan has generally been the shining light.

                I think the attraction is that he is a ‘proper’ 10, as opposed to a shoehorned centre or fullback, he seems to make good decisions under pressure and has an enterprising attitude.

                Just occurred to me whilst I was typing that the WSR may be just the place for this kind of development – that of the ‘almost there’ player.
                Athleticism and skills are one thing, but nous and .. I guess ‘craftiness'(?) are best learnt through experience against good opponents. We don’t make a real distinction in rugby between positions, in American Football they separate out ‘skilled’ and ‘unskilled’ positions (unfairly imo) but I think in rugby it could be called ‘nous’ and ‘athletic’ positions. 10 is the ultimate ‘nous’ position – and it’s not something you learn well in a gym or practice drills.

                WSR could be a good step between the NRC and Super rugby in this space – exposure in front of comparatively big crowds against good sides (hopefully less makeshift in nature as of next season) and the chance to develop the bag of tricks and decision making under pressure.

                I had what I thought a good point, but no idea if it’s come across

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 1:21pm
                Train Without A Station said | August 6th 2018 @ 1:21pm | ! Report

                I don’t see why him being a “proper 10” is an attraction.

                Hegarty is a “proper 10”
                Mason is a “proper 10”
                Leali’ifano and Hawea are “proper 10s”
                Debreczeni could be considered a “proper 10”
                Stewart is a “proper 10”

                Players like Hodge being shoehorned into 10 are rarities even in Australian Super Rugby teams, not anywhere near the norm.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 12:08pm
                Dave_S said | August 6th 2018 @ 12:08pm | ! Report

                “I must have watched a completely different game to everybody else”

                TWAS, evidently you did. I watched him reasonably closely, bearing in mind that even top 10s throw the odd poor pass, and he was in an unfamiliar team, the good passes were far more than the poor ones. And they were generally out in front, accurate, flat and well-timed. If he had spent this year in a SR side I have little doubt he’d be the understudy WB 10, or next in line for it. And some brave tackling too, certainly good enough to defend in the front line..

              • August 6th 2018 @ 12:36pm
                Dave_S said | August 6th 2018 @ 12:36pm | ! Report

                “I think the attraction is that he is a ‘proper’ 10, as opposed to a shoehorned centre or fullback, he seems to make good decisions under pressure and has an enterprising attitude.”

                Piru, yes that’s what I saw in the trial game. Previously I’ve only seen a few minutes of him for the Force, and I’m a Reds fan, so I have no reason to have rose-coloured specs when it comes to Deegan. To me he looked immediately settled in this game – as you say, a ‘proper’ 10. I like the way he takes the ball to the line too, very little shovelling.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 12:50pm
                Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 12:50pm | ! Report

                Yeah, I don’t think he is the complete article but he seemed to have all the basic skills that a 10 should have.

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 1:39pm
                piru said | August 6th 2018 @ 1:39pm | ! Report

                I don’t see why him being a “proper 10” is an attraction.

                Hegarty is a “proper 10”
                Mason is a “proper 10”
                Leali’ifano and Hawea are “proper 10s”
                Debreczeni could be considered a “proper 10”
                Stewart is a “proper 10”

                Players like Hodge being shoehorned into 10 are rarities even in Australian Super Rugby teams, not anywhere near the norm.

                Then what’s the problem?

                Where’s your next Larkham or Lynagh?

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:40pm
                Train Without A Station said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:40pm | ! Report

                Then what’s the problem?

                People talking every player up as the next coming without objectively looking at their game. Mack Mason was given the same treatment 12 months ago.

                Where’s your next Larkham or Lynagh?

                Few and far between. Just like they have always been.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 1:49pm
                jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 1:49pm | ! Report

                I have seen nothing in Mason to convince me he’ll make it.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 2:03pm
                Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:03pm | ! Report

                I don’t think Debreczeni was ever really a 10. Seemed to have all the skills but not the game awareness. He looked like a big playmaking fullback to me.

                Lealiifano played inside centre until 2015.

                Stewart might get there, but haven’t seen much evident from him yet. Mason I don’t get at all. Hegarty looks like he could be a good one but isn’t being given the chance.

                Even Foley started as a fullback from memory.

                When was the last dedicated 10 who played 10 all his career?

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:37pm
                Train Without A Station said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:37pm | ! Report

                Leali’ifano played 10 for most of 2012. He was playing there in 2009 and was primarily a 10 as a schoolboy.

                In fact he played 15 at one stage and the Brumbies were calling it a tri-playmaker system with Giteau and Toomua.

                Foley started in Super Rugby as a 15, but had been a 10.

                Debreczeni looks like a 10. He just isn’t quite Super Rugby standard unfortunately. The higher intensity he just can’t handle the same way as NRC.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 3:24pm
                Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 3:24pm | ! Report

                I think think point is that very few Australian 10s have played there consistently. Often they’re moved there for lack of a better option (Foley moved to 10 when Barnes left).

                Deegan looks like a bloke that should just be playing 10

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 3:40pm
                Train Without A Station said | August 6th 2018 @ 3:40pm | ! Report

                That’s because at best there has only been 5 openings though.

                Sometimes a player isn’t perceived as better than the incumbent 10, but still a good enough player for Super Rugby – so the push them elsewhere where there’s an opportunity.

                Like Foley to fullback.

                Would Foley be a better 10 if he wasn’t perceived a good enough player to play out of position at 15?

                Because essentially what people are saying is because Deegan was never considered to try and fit in elsewhere, it makes him a better 10?

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:38pm
                piru said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:38pm | ! Report

                Just mean it as they are only there because there are no other options in Australia other than WTS spots for 2018.

                Oh I understand and agree to an extent.

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 5:57pm
                piru said | August 6th 2018 @ 5:57pm | ! Report

                Where’s your next Larkham or Lynagh?

                Few and far between. Just like they have always been.

                Fox-Mehrtens-Carter-Cruden/Barrett/Mounga

                Surely the run is not a coincidence?

              • Roar Guru

                August 7th 2018 @ 12:26pm
                Train Without A Station said | August 7th 2018 @ 12:26pm | ! Report

                Certainly not but add Lewis, Johns, Cronk, etc. and it’s a bit stronger.

                Due to the relative strength of the codes in the different countries the players you would add to that list would be Johnson, Marshall, Jones, Filipina. Just not as much of a loss when Rugby Union misses out on them.

            • August 6th 2018 @ 3:03pm
              PiratesRugby said | August 6th 2018 @ 3:03pm | ! Report

              That’s a good backline Jameswm but why wait? The problem with the Wallabies’ backline is Foley’s plodding playmaking, Beale’s erratic kicking and their shared poor defence. Let’s release the backline potential by kicking out Foley and saving Beale for impact later in the game. Let’s give these young guns some experience before the RWC. We cannot win the RWC or the Bledisloe with Foley at 10. Just not possible. We haven’t won anything since Cheika took over. He’s still basing his team on the same core players. They failed before and they’ll fail again.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 5:53pm
                jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 5:53pm | ! Report

                So you wouldn’t start Beale or Folau?

                Is it 1 April?

          • Roar Rookie

            August 6th 2018 @ 11:59am
            Paul D said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:59am | ! Report

            Banks is ready now. Maddocks I’m not convinced is.

            Who knows in 2 years though.

    • August 6th 2018 @ 9:15am
      jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:15am | ! Report

      I agree with what David said about defence being important, but it isn’t like that stands out as the strongest suit of all 3.

      I see Maddocks pushing ahead of DHP as a utility back 3 option, but maybe not yet. I’d have had Hodge there but we need him at 13.

      Maddocks can’t go near 10 at test level till he gets decent game time there at Super level. But who better to help the conversion than Larkham.

    • August 6th 2018 @ 9:22am
      Tuc Du Nard said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:22am | ! Report

      I think all three will be long term WBs but the way Banks is playing, just ahead of Maddocks who I think should be a 5/8 but can play anywhere. What two really world class prospects players we have. Banks pace would have to be right up there in whole of SR.
      Who’s quicker? Maddocks is also quick. Just behind Banks. BB?

      • August 6th 2018 @ 9:33am
        Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:33am | ! Report

        You’d need a foot race hey. Banks, to me, looks much faster in terms of acceleration. I wonder who would win over 50-100m, but Banks caught McKenzie after McKenzie had a 10m+ head start.

        • August 6th 2018 @ 10:36am
          Laurence King said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:36am | ! Report

          Hi Fionn, Banks not only has wings on his feet, he is strong in the tackle. Reminds me so much of Latham. Saw Latham once hold of a rampaging prop as he was running right on the sideline to score during some world 15 game or such-like. Bank’s looks like a clone.

          • Roar Guru

            August 6th 2018 @ 11:57am
            Ken Catchpole's Other Leg said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:57am | ! Report

            Yes Laurence, Banks looks a lot like Latham. In style at least. Success at the elite level remains to be proven. But signs are good.
            Love his rundown defence.
            And Maddocks looks promising and talented, if slightly less confident. Needs careful development.

            Signs are good.
            We need these and other prospective backs in squads that include our best current talent, which would include the best 10’s in Australia, one of which has been forced into semiretirement.
            We need to take stock, and utilise all sunk costs to best advantage.

          • August 6th 2018 @ 10:40pm
            Singapore Sling said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:40pm | ! Report

            Banks runs like Latham but looks like Cosmo Kramer

        • August 6th 2018 @ 12:12pm
          Tuc Du Nard said | August 6th 2018 @ 12:12pm | ! Report

          You’d think with technology, trackers etc we’d have that in their profiles by now. Eg Top speed, 20, 40′ 50m times.
          Secrets right now. Would be great to know with match ups etc

          • August 6th 2018 @ 12:40pm
            Dave_S said | August 6th 2018 @ 12:40pm | ! Report

            Yes we have the technology, the State of Origin coverage included speed tracking. Presumably accurate, stats were quoted to the 10th of a kmph, as I recall.

            • August 6th 2018 @ 2:09pm
              Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:09pm | ! Report

              ‘It is believed that Thor is the fastest wallaby over 20 m .. whether it’s true or not is anyones guess’

              I would be very surprised. Who has claimed that?

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:13pm
                Ralph said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:13pm | ! Report

                I heard that was if you dropped him straight down out of a plane ..

                (tongue is in cheek)

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:15pm
                piru said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:15pm | ! Report

                I wouldn’t be surprised over 10m, 20 is maybe pushing it.

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:34pm
                PeterK said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:34pm | ! Report

                intuitively the fastest players off the mark and over short distances should be the lightest / smallest guys due to inertia.

                Even Bolt wasn’t the fastest over 20m.

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:36pm
                piru said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:36pm | ! Report

                intuitively the fastest players off the mark and over short distances should be the lightest / smallest guys due to inertia.

                Should that not be the players with the best power to weight ratio?

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:49pm
                PeterK said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:49pm | ! Report

                No, the number of fast twitch fibres effects reaction times and how quickly the muscle reacts to the request for action.

                So even if you have less power you get to use the same muscle more often.

                Then there is stride length, efficient running action and so on.

                Obviously complicated.

                So given all the really fast guys would have a lot of fast twitch fibres then out of these I expect the smaller guys to be fastest over a very short distance like 20m.

                Probably because out of these they have the best power to weight

              • August 6th 2018 @ 2:52pm
                Laurence King said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:52pm | ! Report

                I heard somewhere in the dim dark past that elite shot, discuss and hammer throwers could be extremely quick over short distances due to the power requirements of their sport

              • Roar Rookie

                August 7th 2018 @ 10:37am
                piru said | August 7th 2018 @ 10:37am | ! Report

                Yeah I had a brief look at NFL stats, they don’t measure 10 yard times as such, but do record the 10 yard split from recorded 40 yard dash times. The top scorers seem to be defensive ends – roughly comparable to a number 6 or 8 in rugby.

      • Roar Guru

        August 6th 2018 @ 11:30am
        PeterK said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:30am | ! Report

        I have Maddocks caught by quite a few guys , he is not as quick as people think. At top speed he would be about the pace of Folau IMO.

        Koiroebete would be the fastest in oz followed by Banks.

        Dauguna would probably be the fastest off the mark and over 40 metres but is not eligible.

        • August 6th 2018 @ 12:29pm
          Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 12:29pm | ! Report

          Apparently Daugunu is a former soccer player who can kick off of both feet too. Am really excited for him once he becomes eligible. His step, swerve at speed and acceleration is scary good.

          Do we have any idea when he becomes eligible?

          • Roar Guru

            August 6th 2018 @ 2:31pm
            PeterK said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:31pm | ! Report

            from observations of who has caught them from behind, or made impressions i.e narrowed the gap.

        • August 7th 2018 @ 2:00am
          Faith said | August 7th 2018 @ 2:00am | ! Report

          Cameron Clarke?

    • August 6th 2018 @ 9:25am
      bluesfan said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:25am | ! Report

      Personally don’t rank Banks – have seen nothing that has impressed me – just seems a run of the mill type of player – and can’t recall him dominating a game at the Super Level vs. the better sides.

      Maddocks – Looks the goods, really impressive and would love to see him at 10 – however he has one big work on and that is defence – at times at the Rebels he was just bounced off by players. However he does appear to have “something” and hopefully will develop further.

      Petaia – Well I’m surprised by his selection to be honest. Watching the U20’s this year and at his age group level, he didn’t dominate/stand out – in the game vs. NZ, which Oz should have won based upon their strength, he didn’t really do anything – and if can’t stand out in the U20’s – think he might find it tough.

      To be honest at age 18 – would probably be better for his career if he played NRC/7’s for Oz and developed and grew out physically out of the limelight – similar to how NZ developed R.Ioane via 7’s and now how they are doing the same thing with the supposed next big thing for NZ in Etene Nanai (same age as Petaia).

      • August 6th 2018 @ 10:14am
        jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:14am | ! Report

        Who’s to say Petaia won’t be playing NRC? He’s in the Wallaby squad now for experience, and perhaps because Kerevi and Kuridrani are both injured.

        • August 6th 2018 @ 5:20pm
          JohnB said | August 6th 2018 @ 5:20pm | ! Report

          For what little it’s worth, I saw Petaia in one school game last year and was immediately asking his name, confident I’d be hearing it again. He was an absolute stand out in an ok, but only ok, team, playing fullback. Pace, big step, strength, big kick, good hands.

    • August 6th 2018 @ 9:27am
      30mm tags said | August 6th 2018 @ 9:27am | ! Report

      The NRC has been very useful in providing a stage for the likes of Tom Banks to be seen. Banks was a great loss to the Reds ( again). When I first saw him play in the NRC approx 3 yrs ago at Ballymore I thought he wasterrific. Then he gets selected by the Brumbies and we in QLD re-sign very average players.
      Recruiting in Queensland must be looked at really hard and from an outsider’s viewpoint the recruitment staff keep spending someone else’s money and invest in expensive players who bleed the grassroots dry. Its not the highly paid players who are to blame ,it is the dysfunctional and non- accountable recruiting personnel.
      Can we instead hire the staff from the Canterbury Rugby Union to show us how recruiting needs to be done.Poor management is to be answerable . Their pay must be linked to a strategy that is assessable and accountable.I’d suggest that there is inbred incompetence within the organisation.

      • Roar Guru

        August 6th 2018 @ 10:50am
        Hoy said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:50am | ! Report

        Agree on the Reds recruitment issues… And it isn’t just at player levels either… I mean who in their right mind would have backed R Graham twice, having shown nothing to prove he could improve the Reds play at all? Set the Reds back years and years that…

        • August 6th 2018 @ 11:25am
          Richard Pigott said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:25am | ! Report

          I am hoping the nepotistic Reds culture (board) has largely been cleaned out since “graham-gate”. (Disgraceful – from memory Graham arrived at the Reds with a 27% win/loss record from the Force)
          Thorne will hopefully assist in this regard. PS Sorry to highjack the thread..

          • Roar Guru

            August 6th 2018 @ 11:32am
            Hoy said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:32am | ! Report

            I think he arrived with 29% and it got worse when he was here.

      • August 6th 2018 @ 11:21am
        Frank said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:21am | ! Report

        I assume the problem is finances (inability to compete with southern $) – partly due to legacy issues such as QC. Hopefully Reds will continue to improve more in 2019. Win some games and the rest will follow…

    • August 6th 2018 @ 10:59am
      Akari said | August 6th 2018 @ 10:59am | ! Report

      Sorry David, Petaia may be old enough at 18 but is still a boy and IMO plays like one. Maybe next year but more likely the year after.

      As to Maddocks, I haven’t seen anything special from him yet. Should he be playing and trained as a future WBs 10, or should he be playing as a 15, a 11 or a 14? He hasn’t excelled in any of the back 3 positions as the Rebels keeps shifting him around to cover inadequacies from their game plan and playing personnel.

      Banks, on the other hand, is an accomplished 15 and a pretty good winger.

      • August 6th 2018 @ 11:06am
        jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:06am | ! Report

        I’ve seen special stuff from Maddocks. In the right place at the right time, making good decisions, running good angles and with good skills. Mature stuff from a rookie.

        • Roar Guru

          August 6th 2018 @ 11:26am
          PeterK said | August 6th 2018 @ 11:26am | ! Report

          agree, he is a very good support player, and reads the game well.
          Defence is a weakness and lacks genuine pace for an outside back especially at test level.

          Needs some real time at 10 or 12, perhaps next year with Toomua.

          • August 6th 2018 @ 12:19pm
            Tuc Du Nard said | August 6th 2018 @ 12:19pm | ! Report

            Agree. He will eventually be a great 10 but needs to be there at Rebs next year in the meantime on bench for WBs as utility/cover for 11,15 and 10 as 3rd choice behind Beale.

          • August 6th 2018 @ 1:50pm
            jameswm said | August 6th 2018 @ 1:50pm | ! Report

            Not sure I agree on lacking pace PK. He’d be at least as quick as Hodge and quicker than DHP.

            • August 6th 2018 @ 1:56pm
              Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 1:56pm | ! Report

              I think he’s quick but to me the really quick tier of Aussies are Koroibete, Naivalu, Banks and Daugunu.

              I know he isn’t an Aussie but Curwin Bosche has scary acceleration also.

              • Roar Guru

                August 6th 2018 @ 2:29pm
                PeterK said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:29pm | ! Report

                exactly, genuine pace

              • Roar Rookie

                August 6th 2018 @ 4:46pm
                Paul D said | August 6th 2018 @ 4:46pm | ! Report

                Cam Clark would be in that group too for pace. Wessels claims English is one of the fastest in Melbourne also. Given the company he’s in that must make him pretty quick too.

              • August 6th 2018 @ 4:58pm
                Fionn said | August 6th 2018 @ 4:58pm | ! Report

                Good point about Clark – running down Ioane isn’t easy.

                English I am sort of baffled about… I heard Wessels say that too, but I never thought of him as that fast?

            • Roar Guru

              August 6th 2018 @ 2:27pm
              PeterK said | August 6th 2018 @ 2:27pm | ! Report

              sure about as quick as DHP and Hodge, I actually think a bit quicker, as quick as Folau.

              I said he lacks genuine pace which he does.

              In other words best suited to other back positions than wing.

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