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So in summary, we can conclude that critics of Australian Football consider it to be both not Australian and too Australian. Glad we cleared that up.
AFL is not indigenous but uniquely Australian
Unfortunately the answer is yes, that is the best he can do. Best ignored.
AFL is not indigenous but uniquely Australian
Not sure I’m with you there Paul. I don’t consider it remotely disrespectful to say that Rugby League is an English game, nor is it boastful to say that Australian Football is uniquely Australian. These are just reasonable statements based upon the historical evidence. The argument that Australian Football’s founding rules were British is based upon the idea that because the game did not materialise out of thin air using a completely unique and previously unthought of set of rules, then it must be considered British. Every single culture in recorded history has featured some form of activity involving the kicking, punching and /or throwing of a ball-type object. So Australian Football was of course influenced by games from the playing fields of Eton and Rugby, which in turn were influenced by the ‘folk football’ of the middle ages which in turn were no doubt also influenced by the games, activities and military training of various Norman, Saxon, Roman and Celtic invaders and settlers. Presumably some tribe in sub-saharan Africa in 15,000BC were the true inventors of the concept – so are we to say that in Rugby and Eton they were doing nothing more than copying African hunter gatherers, and didn’t really create their own games?
AFL is not indigenous but uniquely Australian
I can’t recall reading a single book or article touching on the origins of Australian Football that claims it owes nothing to the various loosely defined ‘codes’ of football being played in British public schools at the time. Victoria was a British colony and the majority of its inhabitants would have considered themselves ‘British’, as such the idea of adopting and then adapting British sporting traditions was hardly an odd one. The question therefore is not so much one of origins as evolution. I suspect if we were able to travel back in time to watch games of Rugby, Soccer and Australian Football in the mid 19th Century we would struggle to tell them apart. By the early 20th century however each of these games (along with American football) had evolved in response to their environments. Australian Football, with its wide open playing fields and various uniquely Australian cultural influences evolved into the game we know today, with long kicking and high marking a feature. Rugby and Soccer of course evolved in different directions.
There is of course something of a debate about how much, if at all, the Aboriginal game of Marn Grook contributed to football’s development. My personal theory is that whilst it did not contribute to the formal codification of the game, it did provide a cultural influence through the style of play of introduced by Aboriginal players.
To me the whole argument is akin to discussing whether or not Australia as a whole has a ‘unique’ culture. Of course we owe much to our British origins, and more recently to different cultural traditions from Europe and Asia. But the fact is we have created something quite unique in its own way – much as we have with Australian Football.
AFL is not indigenous but uniquely Australian
I do have some degree of sympathy for the average Australian soccer fan – to live with this degree of bipolarity must be extremely stressful:
A couple of below average crowds: “We’re doomed, it’s all over, the A-League is finished!”
A good crowd for the Heart v Victory game: “We”ll be number one, the other codes are done for!”
Try finding a nice middle ground guys, it’ll be more relaxing for all of us.
What A-League doom and gloom?
Phew, that’s a relief, no more comments from fussy about sports other than soccer. I’m bookmarking his little speech here about ‘true believers’ and will post the link each time he starts on another of his rants against Australian Football.
Melbourne heap more misery on Sydney FC
I have always been of the view that violence at soccer games (or indeed any sport) is reflective of underlying issues in society as a whole rather than something specifically related to the sport (i.e. the old “they riot because it’s boring” argument). However it does strike me as somewhat convenient that soccer fans are happy to claim positive manifestations of nationalism associated with their sport such as the flag waving, face painted, chanting fans at the WC, but then completely disown negative manifestations of nationalism such as occurred at Genoa.
If rioting racist fans demonstrating the ugly side of nationalism are ‘nothing to do with soccer’ then presumably the positive flip side is equally unrelated?
The ugly spectre of football hooliganism
Not sure about your analysis on this one Michael. Sure it is a gamble for Geelong to work on the assumption they can win a flag in 2011 but what’s the alternative? Commence a rebuilding phase with the possibility of another premiership a few years down the track? All things considered they still have a very good list, plenty of youngsters and a strong culture (although admittedly that may take a bit of a pounding with Ablett, Costa and Thompson on the way out) – makes sense to have another serious crack in 2011.
Geelong may regret their Premiership gamble
Maybe I’m missing something, but wasn’t the whole WC bid thing sorted out months ago? The AFL and NRL have agreed to relinquish their contractual rights to stadia should the bid be successful and have signed up to the government-endorsed compensation scheme – whatever that may be. Neither Andrew Demetriou nor David Gallop have said a word about the bid for ages.
So what exactly is the problem that prompted you to write this article?
Football codes need to work together, not bicker
I’m not sure the adjective ‘Churchillian’ assumes historical knowledge of the man himself. It’s more of a reference to those ‘c’mon lads, we’re English, we beat them in the war!’ type speeches.
Myth of Australianism in sport: the have-a-go bravado
Nice article, very funny but also quite interesting. However I do think you let the English off the hook a little. Generations of English sportsmen took to the field believing that little more than a stiff upper-lip and a rousing Churchillian speech was necessary to ensure victory. I suspect the English soccer team still do – hence their consistent under achievement.
Myth of Australianism in sport: the have-a-go bravado
Many soccer fans appear to be taking a revisionist view of the historical relationship between Melbourne Victory and Docklands Stadium, presenting the contract to play a certain number of games there as another AFL-inspired attempt to harm the sport. The close relationship Ian Collins has with the AFL is often presented as evidence of a broader conspiracy to deny the A-League a decent playing surface or favourable contractual terms.
The fact is however it was the move of MV from Olympic Stadium to Docklands in the early days of the HAL that almost single-handedly gave the competition credibility and momentum. Several crowds of 30K+ represented more than half of the entire attendance in some rounds and the terms offered the club were so good that a number of AFL clubs started talking seriously of legal action against stadium management for what they perceived to be unfair treatment.
By continuing to play at two grounds the club is able to maintain a degree of competitive tension, ensuring that neither is able to take them completely for granted as a tenant.
Let's bid farewell to A-League at Etihad
Once again Melbourne delivers when it comes to sporting crowds.
Melbourne derby is not just another game
Sorry fussy, but your story just doesn’t ring true. You talk often about all these grand finals you’ve been to but your statements about Australian Football lack insight or any apparent knowledge. A bit like me all of a sudden claiming I’m a massive fan of German soccer and listing a few title winners based upon a quick google search. I still call BS.
Craig Foster just doesn't get it
You spent one thousand dollars on an AFL GF ticket only two years ago yet now you completely hate the game because some media commentators don’t like soccer? I call BS.
Craig Foster just doesn't get it
He probably means 75% of the total viewing population at that time.
Do Grand Final ratings justify expansion?
Which overseas figures did you have in mind Lazza? During the last soccer WC the UK TV audience for England V Germany was approx. 18 million. This is obviously more in absolute terms than the AFL or NRL, but is still only about one third of the total population. And that’s for their biggest soccer game in four years.
I think we sports fans tend to consistently underestimate the large mass of people in society who really don’t give a damn about people running around chasing various shaped leather balls.
Do Grand Final ratings justify expansion?
OK, so your argument is that I should contact channels 7 & 10 directly to discuss their advertising revenue streams. Fair enough, glad we cleared that up.
Do Grand Final ratings justify expansion?
How are the A-League ratings going this year Dave?
Do Grand Final ratings justify expansion?
OK Dave, you’re right. AFL players don’t have the opportunity to travel either during or after their careers. Unless you get a contract with an overseas soccer club you’re stuck in Australia until you die.
Craig Foster just doesn't get it
There is an outspoken soccer supporter who regularly claims on this website that the last A-League GF was watched by in excess of 150 million people worldwide. I look forward to you making similar demands for evidence the next time he does so.
Extra time advocates given wakeup call by replay
That’s a fair question and because I’m in a particularly jolly mood this morning I’ll give an honest answer: I think AD, like many AFL fans, is neither going to holler with excitement if Australia wins the WC bid, nor will he sob with anguish if we lose it. If the bid is successfull the AFL suffers some disruption but gets some great new stadia funded by the govt. If unsuccessful then soccer’s plan to use public funds to boost its profile suffers a setback but we have to find other ways to fund the infrastructure for our ongoing expansion.
Now, in return for answering your question honestly, I’d like you to do the same for mine: Why are you bringing this issue up now? For better or worse the deal is done, the AFL and NRL have signed on, the bid is in and now it’s up to the FFA to get it over the line based upon the merits of the bid. No-one from the AFL or NRL has said a word for months about this issue. So what gives?
AFL, NRL and the whole World Cup threat