The Roar
The Roar


Roar Guru

Joined February 2019







Life Long Brisbane Rugby League supporter, first Redcliffe and now Broncos. also a mad cricket follower and casual everything else follower.



I’m really liking Pat Cummins at the moment. Probably a honeymoon period 😁 . He’s going to make mistakes and I really hope that he is allowed to. It seems anything short of 24/7 perfection in the public eye is a failure these days.

'There will be heated moments': Everything Pat said on 'picking fights', 'daunting' Warner and JL's big change

And Let’s hope he only wins 1 toss 😁

Likely highlights and predictions for the Ashes

31 players turned out for Newcastle across 1908 and 1909. Many of these players may have had ongoing careers in Newcastle, were the details are harder to find. Of note:

William Bailey. Courtesy of the Rugby League Project and Alan Whiticker: “Pioneer Newcastle winger Bill ‘Jerry’ Bailey set a number of records during the fledgling club’s two seasons in the NSWRL – most tries in a match (3t in 1909), most tries in a season (9t in 1909), most points in a match (13pts in 1909) and most tries with the club (18t). A member of the South Newcastle RU Club and a founding father of professional football in the Newcastle district (legend has it that Bailey produced a cigarette packet for rebel players to sign their names to play ‘professional rugby’ in April 1908) Bailey was rewarded with selection for NSW and the 1908–09 Kangaroos. A consistent try-scorer and capable goal-kicker, he scored three tries in three minor tour matches. Following the Newcastle ‘Rebels’’ exit from the Sydney premiership in 1909, Bailey helped form the South Newcastle Rugby League Club where he played until 1917. Later a president of the Newcastle JRL Bailey passed away in 1952.”

Nick Brien (a winger/centre) must have continued playing in Newcastle because he played centre in 1910 in a Newcastle representative side against … a combined Great Britain / Australasia side. You read that right. Freaky! Catpained by Englishman George Ruddick, I noted at least tow famous Australians, in Jim Devereux and Dan Frawley, as well as one of the not so famous Burge brothers (Alby). the Kangaroos/Lions won 24-8.

Stan Carpenter captain Newcastle in that weird game and also represented the district and NSW country to 1914. He played an unofficial ‘test’ in 1909 against NZ Maori, and was granted test status in 2004. He served in Gallipoli.

Halfback Ernie Patfield: “Newcastle halfback represented NSW in one game in 1908 before gaining selection for Australia in the international matches against the NZ Maori team in 1909. Patfield, who was granted belated Australian rep status by the ARL in 2004, played an important role in the formation of the Newcastle ‘Rebels’ club in 1908. It was he who travelled to Sydney to represent the newly-formed club and to collect a grant from the NSWRL to cover expenses for the Rebels team.” (courtesy Rugby League Project)

Pat Walsh “Newcastle forward played 3 RU Tests against the British Lions in 1904 before switching to the professional code during Rugby League’s first season. Playing with the Newcastle ‘Rebels’, Walsh was a late inclusion to tour with the pioneer 1908-09 Kangaroos, primarily because of his international experience. Walsh proved his worth in England, playing in 29 matches including all three Tests against England. His efforts were noticed by the Huddersfield club which enticed him to stay in England for three seasons. Walsh enlisted in the AIF on his return to Australia in 1915 and served with the Australia Light Horse, seeing action in Gallipoli and Palestine. One of the game’s foundation players Walsh passed away in 1953, aged 74.” (courtesy Rugby League Project). Walsh also strangely represented QLD against NSW in one match in 1908.

Winger Ted McGuiness played for Balmain, Glebe and Annandale between 1910 and 1920. He represented NSW against QLD twice in 1910.

Fullback Jim Walsh represented Newcastle and Northern division in 1911, followed by a 10 game stint with Norths in 1912.

Fullback / winger / centre, William Doyle moved to Sydney and played 19 games for Annandale between 1913 and 1916. Not the greatest choice of clubs …

A Nicholson played 1 game for Easts in 1911. P Scotten played 3 games for Wests and Newtown between 1909 and 1913. A Smith played twice for Souths between 1911 and 1913.

The following other players represented Newcastle and Northern Division after the NSWRL club folded. Their last year played is in brackets: Artie Coleman (1911), George Cox (1914), Charlie Croft (1911), George Hardy (1913), R Lawson (1911), W Murray (1911), Joe Shakespeare (1911), Edgar Smith (1910).

So good to see that despite the demise of the Rebels, many players were not lost to the game.

The rugby league club graveyard: The first casualties (Part 1)

Further to my comment wondering whether any players went on to have careers at other clubs, I just went through the Cumberland sides. There were 8 players that went on to represent other clubs: 6 to Wests (which makes sense since both clubs came from Wests Rugby Union) and 2 to Norths.

Forward Ted Bellamy – played a whole 1 first grade game for Wests in 1909.
Fullback Harry Bloomfield, who represented NSW in 1908, played 4 games for Wests in 1909.
Front rower Edward Boland is a ring in. He was a Norths player who filled in for one game for Cumberland as they ran out of players. He played 39 matches for Norths between 1908 and 1916. Scored 1 career try.
Forward Albert Burdus went on to play 18 games for Wests up to 1917 and scored 1 try.
Three quarter Albert Halling played 4 games for Wests in 1909/10.
Forward V Jarvis played 6 games for Wests in 1910.
Syd Marshall was I suspect another Norths ring in. he only played the one game for Cumberland in 1908 but played 13 games for Norths in 1910 and 1911. He played one representative game: Reds vs. Whites in 1910 in front of 35,000 spectators. I have no idea what the purpose of this game was. It did not seem to include the cream of players of the era – Souths fullback Howard Hallett is the only name of real note, so maybe a 2nds trial game?
Finally winger J Spears played 8 matches for Wests in 1909.

The influx of players to Wests didn’t appear to help them much. They collected 6 out of the next 8 wooden spoons and their other two seasons were 7th placed finishes (out of 8)

The rugby league club graveyard: The first casualties (Part 1)

Unfortunately in the full professional era the 5 metre rule would be untenable. If defenders only had to retreat 5 metres, it would be carnage. Forwards of today are much heavier but also much faster than their semi-professional predecessors. You would have players being smashed almost as they catch the ball. Even the centres are often 100 kilos these days.

Wrestling fix was a band aid solution that didn't address the cause

Warren Ryan’s use of the bomb brought a rule change all by itself, with the catch on the full no longer being a drop out but a 20 metre tap. Ryan was always a step ahead.

Wrestling fix was a band aid solution that didn't address the cause

In fact that 6 again on the 1st or 2nd tackle when you are between 10 and 30 metres from your own line is actually a disadvantage. The defending team has time to get set, they know you will generally come up the middle, they have time to get on the front foot and sprint up, leading to metres being very hard to find. they also know that 2 x 6 agains in one set is rare, so they can go early every tackle and hammer the team rucking it out. If I was a coach under the current rules I would instruct a hold down on the first tackle after every kick.

Wrestling fix was a band aid solution that didn't address the cause

Kind of like taking 10 wickets in an innings in one of a country’s worst ever beatings.

UPDATED: England name their 12 and how Cummins reacted as Anderson out despite declared 'fit'

Yes. Yes it was 😛

The rugby league club graveyard: The first casualties (Part 1)

Good stuff Paul. Can’t wait for the closing article after the Sydney test to see how many you got right. My prediction? You’ll have more right than wrong.

Likely highlights and predictions for the Ashes

Don’t forget their win in the City Cup! Glebe’s finest hour.

The rugby league club graveyard: The first casualties (Part 1)

Similar story with Ipswich in Brisbane who started in 1909, but left as soon as they started their own very strong competition.

The rugby league club graveyard: The first casualties (Part 1)

Good stuff. I’d like to know if any of the Cumberland or Newcastle players went on to have significant rugby league careers elsewhere.

for those interested, here was an article I did a while back on the BRL clubs, including the many there that only lasted a short while:

History of Brisbane Rugby League: The clubs

The rugby league club graveyard: The first casualties (Part 1)

To be fair the selection for two tests was not aimed at Carey and he wasn’t mentioned.

Five key Ashes matchups: Who will win the games within a game?

I’d have MJ a bit higher, but hard to quibble. Each of these moments brought back a powerful memory, although not always a good one (bl**dy Botham!)

Ashes countdown: Two England miracles, Mitch Johnson's fire and Warnie's magic moment in our top 10

And over 90% of Western Australians in a recent poll approve of their state’s COVID response, so really this is what they want.

'We did everything we could': Cricket Australia confirms Perth loses Ashes Test

Malan did very well on his last tour here, so may not have the demons some others do.

Below average: Brittle batting numbers expose England's soft Ashes underbelly

And there is a recent book on the St George history as well, not sure of the author. You could do something similar to what i did for QLD’s Origin streak and countdown say the top 30 most important contributors to the streak? Otherwise you could just do a report on each finals series?

A forfeit, challengers and Bears premierships: How the rugby league grand final came to be

And my Alphabet teams series was ripped off from a series in the cricket section

A forfeit, challengers and Bears premierships: How the rugby league grand final came to be

Feel free. A 10 part history of the NSWRL will take you a while 😁

A forfeit, challengers and Bears premierships: How the rugby league grand final came to be

Birder is opening … on Day 6 😢

'Most talked-about series in 15 years': My Ashes preview

Look up my profile. I did a 10 part series on the history of the BRL. Maybe your uncle got a mention

A forfeit, challengers and Bears premierships: How the rugby league grand final came to be

The pork knuckle is apparently a good feed, according to my son.

BREAKING: Starc survives, Head edges Khawaja as Australian Ashes XI revealed

All true. We were a Ben Hunt dropped ball away from the 2015 premiership, which might explain the Dragons current slump 😁

A forfeit, challengers and Bears premierships: How the rugby league grand final came to be

There were a few Queenslanders on the tour. The comp didn’t officially start until 1909 but the QRL was established in February 1908. They considered a 1908 comp to be too rushed. Instead There had been exhibition club matches and some rep fixtures. The first was in May 1908 when QLD played 4 matches the NZ All Golds, with Dally Messenger playing for both teams during the series. NZ Maori also toured QLD in June 1908. NSW played QLD in July. Toombul won the 1908 unofficial ‘premiership’

Queenslanders on that first Kangaroo tour we’re: Bill Heidke, Mick Bolewski, Arthur Ankezark, and Bill Hardcastle

A forfeit, challengers and Bears premierships: How the rugby league grand final came to be