The Roar
The Roar

Melburnian

Roar Pro

Joined June 2016

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"I disagree with what you say, but will defend with my life your right to say it." - Voltaire.

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Everyone rightly points to the fact the Wales haven’t beaten NZ since 1953, and to be honest on the basis of what I watched over the weekend I can’t see that changing.
However, the ranking system reflects that to get to the top you have to beat sides above you. Wales have beaten the Boks (twice) and Australia (once) in the last 18 months, whilst NZ have lost / drawn with the Boks (twice), lost to Australia (once) and Ireland (once) in the last year.
So on that basis if nothing else, the ABs are not the force they were say in 2016/17. That’s not to say they aren’t very formidable, just they are proving to be human!
Is Wales’ position at #1 sustainable or more than just a talking point? Not really.

The Wrap: Normal order restored in Bledisloe Cup whitewash

Agree Piru, but it does as you say give something to talk about and makes a change from “My match day 15 to beat the insert team name here …” commentary.

Wallabies well poised to double down on All Blacks

Yep, quote a turn around. Mind you if the rankings stay like you suggest going into the RWC, it’ll make it even more humiliating for the NH when the top three world ranking sides go out in the QFs. :laughing:

Wallabies well poised to double down on All Blacks

Terrence, I’m 6’0″, 85kgs but if Kerevi was running at me I’d probably wave him through. :happy:

Barrett: Our attack will click and All Blacks will retain the Bledisloe

Has there ever been a RWC where the And were not hot favourites? Even 2003 When England were #1 in the world.

All Blacks axe stars for Bledisloe decider

Too difficult to explain the system .. . much better if folks got to the link I posted above and read the examples of how it works. The big take away for me is what we all probably know, that the the difference between the AB’s and the chasing pack is now very small. Which is great for the RWC even if the AB’s are still hot favourites.
Like I say, let the performance on he pitch do that talking.

All Blacks axe stars for Bledisloe decider

I don’t think it makes a jot of difference to their chances, the AB’s will still be red hot favourites to take out the RWC, but hat doesn’t mean the ranking aren’t interesting and a good talking point. :happy:

All Blacks axe stars for Bledisloe decider

Doesn’t quite work that way. AB’s would drop so far because they would have been beaten by a much lower ranked team. If the WB’s lost they wouldn’t change position much.
Largely academic because I don’t see it happening anyway and I don’t see how Wales or England, who wold profit from this could realistically claim o be #1 given the length of time since they last beat the AB’s.
https://www.world.rugby/rankings/explanation?lang=en

All Blacks axe stars for Bledisloe decider

So, according to the NZ Herald, if Wales beat England and the Wallabies win by more than 16 points, the All Blacks drop to 6th in the world rankings. Can see it happening myself but what a shock this close the to the RWC. :shocked:

All Blacks axe stars for Bledisloe decider

As some people have commented, perhaps the most influential figure on Saturday will be Jaco Peyper. Following the AB’s defeat in 2016 Chicago, the AB’s lifted their physicality in Dublin. Peyper had the whistle and is far more tolerant than Garces was last week. Also given the AB’s have never lost at Eden Park in the professional era, they won’t want to lose that record and the Bledisloe Cup in the same night. My heart tells me this is the Wallabies year, my head say the AB’s will win.

What we know after the Wallabies' stunning Bledisloe 1 win

Interesting that Ben Te’o and Mike Brown get left out of the England squad – total of 88 caps left at home. So much for the old adage that you need 800+ caps in your team to win a RWC.
Ruaridh McConnochie may be outstanding but is it really the right time to blood a newcomer in the heat of a World Cup? Mr Jones doesn’t do predictable does he!

Ben Te'o stunningly left out as England name World Cup squad

Agreed and excellent point.

Personally I take a view that post 2020, RA should walk away from Super Rugby (Australians hate to lose every year), focus everything on NRC or what ever it evolves into. Let Wallabies play overseas and have someone else pick up the salary bill (French / English / Japanese clubs) and spend the money saved on grass roots. Get the game onto FTA TV, which would work financially if you don’t have to pay huge salaries and get tribalism back into Rugby.

Then work out a way to get regular tours from the big name teams (Ireland, England, NZ, RSA, BIL) and use those to drive cash flows through big stadiums nationally – Optus / MCG or Marvel / Suncorp / whatever stadium NSW hasn’t demolished.

Ten-twelve year plan to rebuild playing & coaching stocks & quality to the level we can tell players that to play for the national team they have to play in country.

My 2c worth.

How the West was won

The Tests against France and Wales weren’t sellouts when held at Ethiad – Wales drew 33,000 in 2012, the BIL drew 53,000 (capacity) a year later. France drew 27,000 in 2014.
Quite why games like BIL, England and Ireland weren’t switched to statiums with higher capacity I don’t know. Especially given AAMI park’s turf was a disaster prior to and during the England test.
The community gossip is simply the the AFL locked up the use of the MCG & Ethiad in some way. I have no idea of the truth of that and maybe there are other reasons – cost, lack of planning …

How the West was won

That’s not entirely true Hoges. AAMI Park (32,000) was sold out for the BIL, England and Ireland in recent years and I have no doubt that it would be filled if the AB’s played there and probably RA could have filled Ethiad (55,000) at the time. Yes I know there were big travelling supporter contingents, but from the look of it, 1/3 of the support at Optus Stadium was AB supporters (locals no doubt but the point remains).

Remember that whilst 60,000 turned up to watch the ABs in Perth, 98,000 filled the MCG to watch the last Bledisloe Cup match played there, so for the right product people will turn up. Regrettably, Fiji, Wales, France, Scotland just haven’t been enough of a draw to get the crowds in. Los Pumas play great Rugby but we see them every year so not entirely surprised we can’t draw a bigger crowd.

The more important question is what needs to change in Australia to get the crowds back in all States to leverage the desire for Rugby.

How the West was won

There is no reason for it to be a one time deal though. I think the previous highest attendance in WA for a Union test was Subiaco Oval in 2005 – capacity crowd of 43,000 and a game I took my kids to.
Supporters turn up to watch top teams and I have no doubt that if the Boks and the Wallabies played at Optus stadium next year the result would be a sell out again. Mind you I also recall the Wallabies paying playing the Boks in Perth is like an away game.

How the West was won

Adz,
Law 9.24 A ball-carrier is permitted to hand off an opponent provided excessive force is not used.
Definition: Hand-off: A permitted action, taken by a ball-carrier to fend off an opponent, using the palm of the hand.

Most guidelines I’ve read interpret the ball carrier using their forearm or elbow as foul play. Sanction is a PK. Making contact with the head would (should) invoke the foul play guidelines on contact to the head, so it is entirely reasonable to think that a referee would red card a ball carrier for an intentional forearm to the head of a tackler.
That said, I’ve never seen this happen in practice.

Barrett red card 'ridiculous': Eddie Jones

Amazing game, RC not withstanding.
AB’s will win at Eden Park next week for the following reasons.
1. ABs never beaten at Eden Park in the professional era and will want to keep that record.
2. They will lift their intensity just as they did in Dublin in 2016 following defeat in Chicago.
3. Jaco Peyper, was not strict on “foul play” that day and he is in charge next Saturday.
Expect normal service to be resumed.

Nine talking points from Wallabies vs All Blacks

ABs lose … must be the refs fault.

Wallabies beat All Blacks after dominant second half in Bledisloe 1

See you didn’t read my comment. AAMI park was sold out for Lions, England and Ireland. Melbourne and touring fans turned up for good matches. Could probably have sold out Ethiad (Marvel).

James O'Connor confirmed to start in Bledisloe 1 as Wallabies make shock change at hooker

Scotland have been playing some attractive Rugby, and don’t take my swipe at them seriously. Anything can happen in knockout stages …

Anyone but the All Blacks

The tackle height is interesting… a lot of injuries are the tackler getting hurt and in some cases in a ‘blue on blue’ incident.

Australia's NRC ground zero for experimental rule changes

Records are made to be broken. USA held the America’s Cup for 132 years until Australia II came along. That’s the beauty of sport. That said I’d be quite happy if NZ missed out on both RC and RWC this year.

Anyone but the All Blacks

Scotland in particular has under achieved since rugby went professional and should not have the say in running things they way they do whilst Italy are down to #14 in the world right now.
What annoys me is that by awarding the RWC2023 to France over South Africa, its now just all about the NH money. Personally, if the AB’s do go on and win in Japan this year I’d like to see the SH teams boycott France in 2023 and run their on RWC. I know it won’t happen but its a bit like World Series Cricket in the 1980’s … break the mould and change the status quo.

Anyone but the All Blacks

Isn’t Sevens already a global sport? I mean Spain, Portugal and Kenya compete reasonably well in Sevens but not in the fifteen a side game.

I agree with your sentiments on the French club system but then that had trashed their national team. There was a time when the 6N was basically decided by the England vs France fixture, thankfully that is no longer the case but French flair is a thing of the past.

Anyone but the All Blacks

Arguably, Aus, NZ, SA do already play 1 game against tier 2 when they go North … Scotland.
I’ll get my coat.

Anyone but the All Blacks