This is a joke. WR should make it harder to play for a country you were bot born in not easier.

This is the only way to stop NZ from stealing other countries talent.

Agrer with a lot of the things you are saying but your comment about Danie Gerber is just wrong.

To my mind the most talented rugby player to ever play the game and the best Springbok of all time.

For me Fourie is clear at 9 over all the others.

Top 5 Springbokke of all time:
Danie Gerber
FDP
Naas Botha
Bakkies & Victor
Frik du Preeze

(Yes I know that is 6 ????)

Also I wasn’t a big fan of Willemse before this year but him at 12 has been great and I forgot to add to my previous comment if Squad size was a problem I’d have him instead of DDA.

Also on Jan Serfontein he was probably the most talented player of his generation and has incredible skills (have heard first hand from players who played with abd shared a training field with him) but we coached him into a smash and bash 12 at the Bulls and Boks. I wouldn’t want to coach him into a plan, I’d want to unleash him. “On defense stick to the plan on attack do whatever you want.”

In Afrikaans we have a saying: “kla met ,, witbrood onder die arm” meaning to complain when you have good fortune.

To me I believe the Springbok team is on the right path to win the WC or to be very close next year but I worry about the next WC.

A vast majority of the team won’t be there for the next one. The entire front row. 3 of the 6 locks I picked. Almost the entire back row. 2 of the 9’s, 1 of the 10’s. 3 of the centres. 2 of the wings and 1 of the 15’s.

We are going to have a huge rebuilding job after this one which is why I believe we should take the guys who can do the job in 2023 as the main team and then have younger players making up the rest of the squad.

This is why I’d take Wessles, Nortje, Jenkins, the Du Preez twins, Louw, Roos and dare I say it Moodie at the expense of Mapimpi.

This is why the All Blacks have had the rub on us since the game turned pro they don’t have better players just better planning.

Okay here we go.

Warning this is going to be a lonnnnngggg one.

Assumptions made for this team, no injuries and no selection influences.

5 Props:

Malherbe, Kitshoff, Ox, Koch with Thomas du Toit as the swing prop.

3 Hookers:

Marx, Bongi and Jan Hendrik Wessels.

Deon Fourie was rightly rewarded for his form but there is no point to take a 36 year old to the WC, we need to start thinking WC 2027 and JHW ticks that box.

6 Locks:

Etzebeth, Lood de Jager, Mostert, Snyman, Jenkins, Nortje.

SImple any one of these 6 starts for any other country in the world with the first 4 arguably being the best 4 locks in the world.
Orie and Moerat are decent but not on the level of these 6.

7 Loose forwards:

Marcell Coetzee, PSDT, Louw, Roos, the Du Preez twins, Kolisi

Kolisi is a wonderful player but Doc Craven said pick the team then pick the captain, he makes the squad but will probably not start.

3 Scrumhalves:

Faf, Reinach, Hendrikse

Not much to say here.

2 Flyhalves:

Pollard, Goosen.

4 Centres:

Jan Serfontein, Am, DDA and Kriel.

I think we all secretly hope that Jan will someday reach the levels we expected. A player that will probably go on the list of talents wasted by SA rugby even though he would still be the starting 12 in this team.

Wings:

Kolbe, KLA and Mapimpi

Fullbacks:

Willie, Damian Willemse.

Sentimental pick:
Frans Steyn, sentimental but still has it on his day and oozes BMT.

Starting Team:

1. Kitshoff
2. Marx
3. Malherbe
4. EE
5. Lood
6. Marcell Coetzee (C)
7. PSDT
8. Louw

9. Faf
10. Pollard
11. KLA
12. Jan Serfontein
13. Am
14. Cheslin Kolbe
15. Willemse/Le Roux

16. Ox
17. Bongi
18. Trevor
19. Mostert
20. Snyman
21. Roos/One of the Twins
22. Reinach
23. Le Roux/Damian Willemse

Gameplan:

We’re going to cause you abject misery with the forwards, play the game in the right areas and then unleash a silky backline when the time is right.

Yeah no…

Boks won the pool match 36-0 Eng didn’t dominate anything.

Still one of the greatest things I have ever done.

Was lucky enough to watch River vs Boca in La Plata in the stadium in 2007. Don’t think I have ever been anywhere that loud and rowdy it was incredible.

Overall my reaction to the team is meh. Don’t think it’s great but I am really excited for Moodie.

He is something special. Really really special now he just needs to find his feet at test level and we need to give him the time he needs as fans.

I also forgot to add.

Even with some gripes about the one or two big calls the ref got wrong (in my opinion) Australia played very well and we would not have won the game anyway.

A few thoughts I have on your response. 🙂

1. I agree there wasn’t a massive issue with the interpretations but there were some that under normal circumstances would not have impacted. As an example of this, I felt the Australian scrum and Slipper in particular (who had an overall great game across the park) were slightly fortunate to not be punished even more heavily.
2. With regards to the competitive market in Australia I believe Australia should distance itself a little from rugby NZ to improve the market share Union enjoys in Aus. No fan likes to see their team lose, NZ rugby teams have had the rub on Aussie teams in SR and the Bledisloe for some time now and maybe RA should create a little distance. Play the NZers every other year instead of the usual 3/4 tests a year and have an internal domestic competition where only the champion plays the champion of NZ. From what I can see Australia Rugby/Sport in general falls in the entertainment bracket and a social fan is not going to spend his money on something that leaves him dejected and feeling like another loss was inevitable.
3. Now we get to the Sprinbokke. I think our problem at this time is more mentality and not style. In 2018 and 2019 the Boks came from nothing so they had to be innovative and create new ways to win. We got weird and wonderful things from this the bomb squad, the risky defence, setting up mauls in open play etc. However, I feel our rugby at a national level has become very reactive now. We have adopted a strategy of it won’t happen again. For example, Noah Lolesio’s (who I rate as a future world-beater) break to set up the try was a wonderfully worked move but it won’t happen again. We react instead of innovating as we did in 2018 and 2019 which has led to a game plan that has advanced at a snail’s pace since then. We are basically Nokia in the late 2000s.
4. Lastly I feel like we are currently playing like one of the South African Super Schools when they play against smaller schools. I was in a High School that was an “emerging” power and every time we played Affies or the like I always felt like we were the better-coached team but they beat us based on just being bigger, faster and more talented. Their forwards would grind you to a cloud of fine dust and then the result would never be in doubt. This will work when you have a huge talent gap but in international rugby, you never will.

Sorry for the long post and the last comment.

I believe the answer to Rugby needing more market share in countries like France, Aus and NZ is to make the international game more competitive by enforcing stricter eligibility laws to create more nations to play against and also weaken some nations to balance the game more evenly.

I’ve been avoiding these comments for a reason.

Some of this is in answer to you. Some of it is for other comments that I can’t find now.

1. Overall I thought the ref did okay. I do think MK should have received red for that tackle and yes he should be suspended. He is a GREAT player but being great to watch does not put him above the rules.
2. White is a player I liked, a bit of s#$%housing is a natural part of what makes a great 9 but he did take it too far, yellow for him, yellow for Faf IMO.
3. Now we get to the darker stuff. South Africans, myself included, don’t like refs. I have said this before we have been on the bad end of too many bad calls and it will take a long time for that dislike to go away. Also never forget the Keith Lawrence thing and the then shocker his son had years later and then you have the basis of a great conspiracy theory.
4. South Africa plays a game that relies heavily on punishing mistakes made by the other team. As a fan it is frustrating when we don’t get rewarded for it. When a ref decides to give the benefit of the doubt to “make the game flow” it takes away from our strengths. We want penalties at every scrum, ruck and maul.
5. I have said this before and it ties into the sighting of MK. Every country has it’s own responsibility to it’s fans. Ours is winning, that’s how we keep people in seats. Australia has others but it is not our job to play rugby in a way that fills stadiums for RA and to agree to rules we dislike like the 20 min red card because of the “spectacle”.
6. A main worry for me as a SA rugby fan is, there seems to be a big gap in how the game is now being officiated between the North and South. We have been playing more with NH refs and in all honesty that tackle from MK wouldn’t even have gone to the TMO. RA and NZ seem to have more lenient refs which leads back to point 4.

That kind of goes to prove my point, South Africa as a whole should sing his praises from Alexander Baai to Kosie Baai but only about half of us do.

I put this down to 2 things:

1. The fact that the largest media houses in SA are based in Cape Town and SA Rugby is also. This provides a slightly biased view in most people’s minds about players from up North as it is what they see on a daily basis. On any given Saturday we can have JDV, Nick Mallet, Schalk Burger, Joel Stransky (who would find a way to not praise Jesus if he played for the Bulls), Bobo and Shimi on duty as experts along with a token Bulls/Sharks or best of the rest ex-player.
To prove this point I always laugh about the 2010 SR final, the Bulls outplayed the Stormers but in the Sunday papers, the Stormers had a higher “score” when you tallied up the individual scores given to players.

2. An old University of Free State prop turned comedian that has made a career out of mocking a more talented player who made him look like a fool when he played against him.

Naas would have still been clear of almost all other players even if he couldn’t kick a ball half as well because he was a genius who never made the wrong decision on the field. People tended to say “Look how many tries our backline scored when Naas passed the ball” instead of realising that when he did not pass or run, it was because it was the right decision to make. The correct approach would have been to say “Look how many tries our backline scored because Naas passed the ball.”

To prove my point I make no secret of my dislike for the WP RFU, in their recent match against bankruptcy I cheered for bankruptcy but that doesn’t change the fact that Schalk Burger was one of the best players we have ever had however ask many a Bulls fan for their opinion on Schalk and you would hear he was overrated.

We need to move past our “hatred” of players because of where they are from or which Union they played for. The simple fact remains when Naas played for you, you won, arguably more than any other player in history, and he should be heroed for that in every corner of our country.

Lastly I also firmly believe that we have wasted and ruined many promising rugby players because of exactly this. Rivalry is good, tribalism is better but we also need a good measure of objectivity when really looking at people who play FOR us.

I take a little bit of umbrage to this comment.

While my colours are firmly nailed to the mast as a staunch NT/Bulls fan, we South Africans have a concerning habit of dismissing and even disparaging players who played for rival unions.

Naas was as close to the perfect 10 as you could get, he could put his backline away and also with him on your side you were always playing in the right areas.

I seem to remember our outside backs scoring more tries per game with Naas at 10 than in any other year and really spicy example springs to mind of a Danie Gerber try started by Naas in his own 22 after a bad pass from Divan Serfontein.

The old argument is that Naas could not tackle but for a player with either Burger Geldenhuys or Rob Louw at 7 for most of his career, I would say it didn’t really matter, also as my grandfather used to say you want your 10 scanning the field not eating “stof” at the bottom of a ruck.

To my mind, Naas is one of the 3 best rugby players ever to play the game arguably narrowly missing out on the top spot to his national teammate Danie Gerber for the top spot.

Danie was a once-in-a-lifetime player and the politics of the time robbed Rugby of seeing its best-ever player play the game.

With Naas I would also suggest that his 9 Currie Cup wins in 11 finals has a lot to do with the undue “hatred” he gets in SA.

Also RE the original post, I would think Imanol Harinordoquy would deserve a mention as a neutral I felt he always had a monster game against NZ and in 2007 I felt the French were arguably better off when Betsen came off to be replaced by him. Overall I also believe he could be mentioned as one of the most underrated rugby players of all time.

A few points and meaning no disrespect to the author.

1. The 20 min red card is the most stupid rule suggestion I have seen recently. How long would it be before our friends from NZ start picking boxers to start tests again? (Cheap shot I know ;)) The problem is it would encourage foul play, pick a player to go out and hurt the best player on the other team and then you can replace him after 20 mins while they have been handicapped for 80 mins.
2. Conversions are vital, forcing someone to score out wide should be rewarded with their side having a harder attempt at goal.
3. I have said this before the best thing for rugby in Australia would be winning. Aus beat us last year and the weekend after was a sell out. Less focus on “entertainment” more on winning and people would start watching again.
4. Can we please please stop messing with the rules of the game.

Here’s my ranking of 13’s to settl3 this argument for you.

1. Gerber
2. Sella
3. BoD
4. Jaques Fourie
5. Smith

Going to be honest Mortlock while a very good player and also a great person isn’t up there with the rest of these guys.

Also since Gerber and Sella player amateur era and that somehow makes them ineligible BoD is #1 by default.

“Dear Nic Berry, I am sorry you’re a terrible ref” – RE

As a South African objectively putting on my All Black cap. (This feels weird)

I have said before to me BB is a once in a generation player like Naas, Carter or Wilkenson.

When fit you have to pick him every time. That doesn’t mean RM isn’t excellent, he is and would make an able understudy. The ABs have always been their own worst enemy at WCs by mixing players around and not putting the best bloke in the spot he is best at.

ABs are building a backline that I am honestly terrified of at the moment. Rieko at 13 with the pace he has, Jordie at 15 who doesn’t miss the high ball or the posts and the wings you have the potential to rip teams to pieces.

This brings me to what I believe is the ABs most glaring problem and one that answers need to be found for:

The forwards.
I said it to a buddy of mine while having a beer in 2014 that the ABs forwards are there for the taking and he looked at me like I had a few too many. The current crop of AB forwards are even less potent than the team you had back then. You need to find a 2, 3, 4 and 7 (6 to you) that are less inclined to play like backs and are willing to get stuck in and mix it with the big boys. Create a platform and let a backline guided by BB do their magic.

That is the only reason you are losing to countries like South Africa, Ireland and France because they can crumple your forwards like tinfoil leaving your backs to fight an uphill (and often successful) battle.

So simple really pick Mealamu, Hayman, Thorn and Kaino and you’d have gold in the next WC 😉

Was meant to be a joke but perhaps should have articulated it better.

However, there is a very real dislike of the English in our country.

Growing up I knew people who had actually been in the camps and being a little bit older than myself I am sure Harry and Biltong probably heard of it first-hand from their grandparents.

An interesting anecdote for you, while I was in Primary School I had to give a speech at the 100 year anniversary of our school’s founding and I had a copy of the school’s first head boy’s end of year speech. He spoke about his experiences in the concentration camps and how it was a great achievement that in 4 years the school had been founded when there was almost nothing left of the town.

Granted I don’t believe he actually wrote the speech but was interesting anyway.

LOL The English and the Boer.

We like them so much that we decided to leave our lives behind, pack everything and move into nothing within a few years of them arriving.

Bokke to be fired up this weekend with a serious axe to grind with seemingly everyone, the only regret is that we are missing RG and PSdT to really throw the whole bathroom at what to my eyes looks an inexperienced English pack.

The state of rugby in the world:

Aus – dying
France – crisis to crisis
NZ – morally and financially bankrupt
England – Going great.
Wales, Ireland and Scotland – too small but doing well considering.
Arg – going backwards at a rate of knots.
SA – Thriving on all levels.

Do you really want to pick a fight with one of the 2 countries where the game is kind of okay? Ban us from the WC sure! #1 ranked country and current champs. Sponsors would love that. WR has no teeth. More people watch live schools rugby on weekends than the Premiership pulls to stadiums in the UK. We’d be fine without them. They need to kill this now, keep the ban on Rassie that’s fine, admit Nic Berry was wrong in a) his overall performance b) not speaking to the stakeholders as agreed.

I would suggest that WR takes a bit of time to think if they really want to keep going down this path.

Going to war with SA Rugby over an incompetent ref isn’t a good idea.

Easy fix, tell refs to stop being k**.

Which bit did you find hard to read?

Holding incompetents accountable or an example of how public accountability could be done?

It blows my mind that people can’t see wrong with someone getting half of the calls they have to make wrong. If I did that my KPIs would be blown to pieces and I’d be unemployed.

Such a pity for him.

To the 23 players getting crucified in the public eye and their inclusion being questioned after his abhorrent display. “Oh well that’s Rugby suck it up”

Shocking that Nic Berry can choose to not meet as agreed? I see the threat as valid, do what you are supposed to or I will show the world that you are not.